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benedictus2
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I don’t think God is unhappy at all at the way we are going on this thread. He is probably chuckling to Himself thinking ahhhh, children.
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rolltidefan
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Benedictus2…Thanks for your comment. Again, I never said there was anything wrong with debating. Just keep your attitude meter in check. And basically as far as I am concerned, I can understand why people turn their backs on religion, because they log onto sites, such as this, to find loving answers and are then turned off by our way (protestants and Catholics alike) of representing things we believe in. They learn that, well they are basically just as good as we are and have about as much love as we have. As I said before, I am married to a Catholic and thank God we can get along or else this is what I would live with all the time!!! lol So in other words, no matter what type sin (mortal or etc.), I think God has a problem with it, as I believe he has given us an example of how to live and show his love.
Btw…yeah he is probably about ready to slap a few of his children!!! lol Kind of like when my two are fighting and fussing…It gets a little OLD after a while.
Btw…yeah he is probably about ready to slap a few of his children!!! lol Kind of like when my two are fighting and fussing…It gets a little OLD after a while.
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Highwayhound
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SIN…did someone mention sin?
Where is a good Catholic priest when you need a round or two of confessions?
God bless
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benedictus2
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I disagree. God does not believe in corporal punishment. We all engage in verbal fisticuffs and at the end of the day :crying:He picks us all up to soothe and kiss bruised egos, still angry minds and say gently ::hug1: “there, there, I did say you shouldn’t fight with your sisters and brothers”.
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Ginger2
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I doubt God chuckles when people are mean-spirited to one another, He surely must grieve for our sakes.I don’t think God is unhappy at all at the way we are going on this thread. He is probably chuckling to Himself thinking ahhhh, children.
But perhaps we cause Him to smile when those people have the heart to reconcile.
As rolltidefan said, it happens on both sides.
I would pray that God soften the hearts of those who are too stubborn and prideful to admit they have been the less bit uncharitable, mistaken or bare the slightest responsibility for their words.
They only deceive themselves.
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Ginger2
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Oh, I remember now! :newidea:There was a time before Vatican II when you had to go to Confession before presenting yourself for Confession but it was realized that with regard to venial sins one could just confess in one’s heart.
These verses do not support the Catholic view of judging who is worthy and unworthy by withholding the Eucharist from non-Catholics.You know Ginger I think that one can be guided by common sense. We should realize that we need to be pure when we receive Holy Communion. We should be prepared. The scripture passage in Coriantians is pretty clear about that. Read the whole thing and also the passages preceding and following the verses I quoted.
1 Cor 11:20-29
When you meet in one place, then, it is not to eat the Lord’s supper,
for in eating, each one goes ahead with his own supper, and one goes hungry while another gets drunk.
Do you not have houses in which you can eat and drink? Or do you show contempt for the church of God and make those who have nothing feel ashamed? What can I say to you? Shall I praise you? In this matter I do not praise you.
For I received from the Lord what I also handed on to you, that the Lord Jesus, on the night he was handed over, took bread,
and, after he had given thanks, broke it and said, “This is my body that is for you. Do this in remembrance of me.”
In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.”
For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the death of the Lord until he comes.
Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. A person should examine himself, and so eat the bread and drink the cup.
**For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, **eats and drinks judgment 14 on himself.
These verses tell exactly what was happening at this church concerning the Lord’s Supper. People were coming to feast and not thinking about the meaning of this Tradition handed to us from Jesus.
They were coming to get drunk and not discerning the “body”
They were not thinking about what Christ Jesus has done for them. They were not following Jesus’ directions and remembering.
We must discern the meaning of the bread and the wine and remember Christ crucified for us until Jesus returns. That is what these verse plainly tell us.
That is what Jesus told us: And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me.” (Luke 22:19 )
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OneTrueCathApos
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What religion are your kids? Were they baptized? Do you attend church together every week as a family, and which church? Just curious.
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Peter_J
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Great post, rolltidefan.
I view participation in an online discussion forum like digging in mine. There are a lot of good posts, but they’re mixed in with a bunch of bad posts. (Or perhaps I should say it’s like the wheat and the tares.)
Blessings,
P.S. I’ll be curious to see whether one of my fellow Catholics responds to this post with “Yes, you’re right! There are a lot of good posts made by Catholics, but they’re mixed in with a bunch of bad posts made by Protestants.”
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tran0031
Guest
Dear brothers and sisters in Christ,
Firstly let me have a short introduce about myself. I am a Vietnamese, young Christian. I was a borned-Catholic and my whole family are all Catholics.
Regard to a topic whether a Catholic Priest can forgive sins I would like to raise some of my concerns.
The priests are also human-being, they also have their own sins and need to confess their sins to God.
One other important point I would like to bring out is the confidential issues. Whether the priest wil keep the things that we confess to him.
Let me tell you about the true story in Vietnam history. At the time when French still reigned over my country Catholic priests also came. And there were many people believed in Lord Jesus Christ. Many of them were patriots and they planned to have a revolution to liberate the hometown. But one of the geurilla felt guilty of going to kill people and went to confess his “future” sins.
After hearing that the priest went to tell the French officer and the revolution was prevented before it happened.
In 1John 1:9 said “If we confess our sins he is faithful and trust and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousnes.”
it is quite clear about the direct call upon to God for forgiveness.
I was a Catholic and made many confession with the priests, truly deeply in my heart I didn’t feel a release until I come before God and make my confession before Him with tear. That time is the true joy in my heart, the time of changing my sinful ways.
As brother Ginger2 mentioned before, all God’s words are not contradict with each other but raher mutually support one another.
In Matthew 6: 12"Forgive us our debts as we also have forgiven our debtors"
which refers that we can forgive other people’s sins which they sin against us but not the sins they commited to God.
Only God can forgive sins and only Jesus Christ is the mediator no one else , nor saints, nor priests. This is the truth that everyone has acknowledged. So why we don’t just come directly to God to make a confession , He knows everything before we open our mouths, don’t He?
Man is fallable, even you don’t know whether the priest is pure in heart enough to claim for forgiveness(which he doesn’t have the right to do so)
The verse John 20:23 refers to the sins others commit against the apostles alone not the sins they commited against God as it needs to be consistent to what Bible said.
Firstly let me have a short introduce about myself. I am a Vietnamese, young Christian. I was a borned-Catholic and my whole family are all Catholics.
Regard to a topic whether a Catholic Priest can forgive sins I would like to raise some of my concerns.
The priests are also human-being, they also have their own sins and need to confess their sins to God.
One other important point I would like to bring out is the confidential issues. Whether the priest wil keep the things that we confess to him.
Let me tell you about the true story in Vietnam history. At the time when French still reigned over my country Catholic priests also came. And there were many people believed in Lord Jesus Christ. Many of them were patriots and they planned to have a revolution to liberate the hometown. But one of the geurilla felt guilty of going to kill people and went to confess his “future” sins.
After hearing that the priest went to tell the French officer and the revolution was prevented before it happened.
In 1John 1:9 said “If we confess our sins he is faithful and trust and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousnes.”
it is quite clear about the direct call upon to God for forgiveness.
I was a Catholic and made many confession with the priests, truly deeply in my heart I didn’t feel a release until I come before God and make my confession before Him with tear. That time is the true joy in my heart, the time of changing my sinful ways.
As brother Ginger2 mentioned before, all God’s words are not contradict with each other but raher mutually support one another.
In Matthew 6: 12"Forgive us our debts as we also have forgiven our debtors"
which refers that we can forgive other people’s sins which they sin against us but not the sins they commited to God.
Only God can forgive sins and only Jesus Christ is the mediator no one else , nor saints, nor priests. This is the truth that everyone has acknowledged. So why we don’t just come directly to God to make a confession , He knows everything before we open our mouths, don’t He?
Man is fallable, even you don’t know whether the priest is pure in heart enough to claim for forgiveness(which he doesn’t have the right to do so)
The verse John 20:23 refers to the sins others commit against the apostles alone not the sins they commited against God as it needs to be consistent to what Bible said.
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Ginger2
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tran0031,
Your testimony of feeling a release from your sins was beautiful. Thank you for sharing.
I am moved to tears when I hear how God has shown His love and mercy to us. Thank you.
Your testimony of feeling a release from your sins was beautiful. Thank you for sharing.
I am moved to tears when I hear how God has shown His love and mercy to us. Thank you.
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rolltidefan
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Well to answer your question is going to bring up a whole other topic. lol I don’t care to answer you at all, I just don’t want negative words said against my husband or my family for that matter. So just please respect that. I don’t care if you say what you think or believe, just say it without being degrading. That would be much appreciated.
My children are protestant. We attend a Church of God, if you are interested in what particular one. That is what I was raised. My children have been baptized, but they did that obviously not as babies. We do attend church together every week as a family and he attends with us. Now, I know most people on here will probably ask, why don’t you attend with him. My children are from a previous marriage, so we attend the church that I believe in. It is not a matter of disrepecting him or the Catholic belief. I respect any Christian religion with the most high regards. As I want mine respected. When my husband got with me, he knew that I would not convert and he knew that I would not be married in the Catholic church. Due mostly to the fact that I don’t believe in the annulment process (I respect it for the ones that believe in it and have gone through it), but it is not what I believe is necessary. I was not going to go through it myself and bring up things that had already healed for myself, my kids and also my exhusband or anyone else involved. My husband knew all this, but still made the decision to marry me. THANK GOD HE DID! lol I cannot imagine my life without him. I tell him that at anytime I will attend a mass with him. It is not something I have forbidden him to be a part of. As that would be wrong of me. My main goal is that we just all know Jesus Christ as our personal Lord and Savior, and we are all going for the same thing. I know he and I both are at peace with that and have the same goals in mind. I would be glad to answer anything else you would like to know though. If I left anything out.
Thank you very much. It is good to meet you and I agree with you 100%!!! lolGreat post, rolltidefan.
I view participation in an online discussion forum like digging in mine. There are a lot of good posts, but they’re mixed in with a bunch of bad posts. (Or perhaps I should say it’s like the wheat and the tares.)
Blessings,
P.S. I’ll be curious to see whether one of my fellow Catholics responds to this post with “Yes, you’re right! There are a lot of good posts made by Catholics, but they’re mixed in with a bunch of bad posts made by Protestants.”
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Peter_J
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^^ I strongly suspect this is going to open up a new can-of-worms. Perhaps you should even start a new thread and re-post everything you just said, so that other posters can respond to it there, instead of here.
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rolltidefan
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The reason it got posted here is because OTCA asked me a question about my religion, children and family. Other than that, I don’t have a question to ask and would have not brought it in this thread, but was asked a question, so I don’t see a need to post somewhere else. I already know what will be said, so I don’t see the need to go asking for a black eye with another thread!!!^^ I strongly suspect this is going to open up a new can-of-worms. Perhaps you should even start a new thread and re-post everything you just said, so that other posters can respond to it there, instead of here.
lolBut yeah, I knew when he asked it, it would open a new can of worms. Which is why I said what I did about respecting me and my family. I know better than to start such a thread!!!
Been here long enough to have learned that.
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OneTrueCathApos
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Well, I think you have a wonderful family and it’s nice that you attend church at all. Of course I could sit here and write you the third degree about why your husband doesn’t have any say in this, perhaps he is not a practicing Catholic or just doesn’t care. It is not my business, only God judges not I. God Bless you and your family.The reason it got posted here is because OTCA asked me a question about my religion, children and family. Other than that, I don’t have a question to ask and would have not brought it in this thread, but was asked a question, so I don’t see a need to post somewhere else. I already know what will be said, so I don’t see the need to go asking for a black eye with another thread!!!
But yeah, I knew when he asked it, it would open a new can of worms. Which is why I said what I did about respecting me and my family. I know better than to start such a thread!!!
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rolltidefan
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Thank you so much OTCA. I appreciate your comments. You have shown a lot of Christ like love and concern for my family. I do appreciate that. And of course I know that you could write me the third degree!! lolWell, I think you have a wonderful family and it’s nice that you attend church at all. Of course I could sit here and write you the third degree about why your husband doesn’t have any say in this, perhaps he is not a practicing Catholic or just doesn’t care. It is not my business, only God judges not I. God Bless you and your family.
I know how it is felt upon about my marriage and I respect you and your faiths reasoning on that.But I do 100% agree with you, we will all stand before our God to be judged one day. And I do a lot of thinking about that, because I know for me, there has been a lot of wrongs in my life that I have had to make right, but I know we serve a merciful God, who is a forgiving God, if we ask him to. I am just hoping that same mercy is shown to me and thank God we are not judged by man, we would all probably be in trouble. I am not sure where my husband stands right now in the schemes of “religion” goes. He is a christian and shows that with his family everyday with his actions. But anyway, I pray that your family will be richly blessed…It has been nice metting you.
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benedictus2
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I wasn’t trying to reconcile scripture and tradition. That was not the post I was replying to if you go back to it. I was replying to your post regarding having been raised in the 60s and 70s and the point I am making is that because of the dissent and the general upheaval in the world during this time, somehow proper Cathechism has been elbowed out by new fandangled experiments at theology and liturgy.
Scott Hahn in his conversion story could not believe that so many Catholics are so ignorant of their faith and he thinks we may have been the result of an experiment gone wrong and I tend to agree with him.
Thank goodness that there is now a return towards more orthodox teaching.
I am not quite sure where you get the idea that the passing of the Holy Spirits stops there. What makes the disciples any more special than those they anointed? Because they saw Jesus? But Jesus said those who believe though not having seen are blessed.
Just think about it, Christ establishes a Church, tells his disciples that whose sins they forgive … and then limits it to those who have seen him and perhaps those whom those who have seen have anointed and stop it there? What would be the purpose of that?
He tells His disciple to go and baptize in the Trinitarian way but by your reasoning this command stops with them.
If you take this even further, all commands Jesus made therefore stop with the disciples or perhaps the direct followers of the disciples.
So the command to love one another, the beatitudes, the parables, probably does not apply to us?
Well, that is because YOU say it cannot be passed on. That is YOU saying it.
In effect you are really setting yourself up as the magisterium which really boils down to obeying the unholy trinity of I,Me and Myself.
Now why would your opinion carry more weight than the martyrs, saints, theologians and doctors of the Church?
And if you say that it is not your interpretation but some baptist/Methodist/Anglican/etc interpretation, the question then becomes why would their interpretation be any more correct than 1500 years of tradition before them? Those who actually lived closer to the time of the apostles?
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benedictus2
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I doubt very much that any one here does not take responsibility for their words. It takes a while to type a post so what ever is written has gone through the thought process. Whatever has been posted is meant to be posted. Calling a spade a dirty shovel is not being uncharitable. It is stating facts.
That is why it annoys men when people keep posting opinions and assume they are facts.
There was a poster on another thread by the name of Craig Kennedy who instead of saying the Catholic Church is such and such and believes such and such, he asks" Does the Catholic Church teach such and such and if so why?
His questions and responses were intelligient and rational and when he does not get it he says so.
As a result the discussion on that thread was much better.
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Ginger2
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Yes! The sixties were terrible. I once thought they were the height of stupidity among American youth - that was until the new millennium.
Are you suggesting the Catholic Church participated someway in the nonsense of sixties mentality? I am not aware of that in the parish I attended…
For one thing, yes. For another they spoke with authority for God.
Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead
But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I did not receive it from a man, nor was I taught it, but it was revealed to me by Jesus the Messiah. (Gal 1:1,11-12 )Just like the prophets of the OT. The Apostles spoke for God.
Paul testifies that while the Holy Spirit remains with us always, the gifts will cease.
Charity never faileth: but whether [there be] prophecies, they shall fail; whether [there be] tongues, they shall cease; whether [there be] knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that (1Cr 13:8-10 )
Even Paul’s gift seemed to fade away…
Paul could not heal Trophimus (2 Tim. 4:20).
Instead of healing Timothy, Paul gave him medical advice (1 Tim. 5:23)
The Holy Spirit is with all Christians until Jesus returns. That is clear in Scriptures. But the special powers given to the Apostles alone have ceased.
Also, God gives to who He will, …
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as [he did] unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
…we are not at the mercy of the RC, we are at the mercy of God.
Luk 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid [him] not: for he that is not against us is for us.
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benedictus2
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Some areas/members did participate to one extent or another in that, mostly through some misinterpretation of VII but that is for another thread.
This is where the misunderstanding arises. The gifts of the Holy Spirit is not the one being spoken of in John 20.
Also, the gifts continue to this day. The gifts of of knowledge, fortitude, wisdom, etc continue to be poured on us.
On another category, the gift of tongues, prohecy etc are still given to some.
But this is not to be equated with the bestowing of the Holy Sprit for the forgiveness of sins.
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Ginger2
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You’ve got to be kidding. I have been told I am “not telling the truth” “I don’t believe you, Ginger2” and other such insinuations. And then I am told I am not being called a liar because the word “liar” was not used.
If you claim I am not telling the truth, what am I doing then? I said I was raised Catholic. If I was not raised Catholic, am not not lying by stating I was.
When a Catholic says to me, “I asked for the truth not a lie” how is that not calling me a liar? And if you claim that I myself have said I am a liar and not anyone else…is that taking responsibility for one’s words? Is saying I am “Just not honest” not calling me a liar?
And how is directly calling me “a liar” when I am telling the truth and then not apologizing for it, taking responsibility for your words?
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