Protestants, can a Catholic Priest forgive sins?

[Leonius]

My answer is NO. The veil in the temple has been rent. I have direct access to the Father through the only Priest I need, Jesus Christ.

John 14:6. Acts 4:12. Do you know what the tearing of the veil in the temple symbolizes? Dircect access to God for all who come through Christ. No more need of a high priest to go into the holy of holies once a year with a sacrifice. Jesus is that once for all permanent sacrifice.

“Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.” John 14:6

Neither is there salvation in any other. For there is no other name under heaven given to men, whereby we must be saved. Acts 4:12

Neither of these passages say you have direct access to the Father. In fact the passage in John says the opposite that you must go through Christ to the Father, you actually contradicted yourself in your first statement, if you have to go through Christ that is not direct access.

The passage in acts is not relevant as no one is claiming anything contrary to it.

Here are the words of absolution used by a Catholic Priest:

“God, the Father of mercies, through the death and resurrection of his Son has reconciled the world to himself and sent the Holy Spirit among us for the forgiveness of sins; through the ministry of the Church may God give you pardon and peace, and I absolve you from your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.”

Now can you tell me where in the scriptures the tearing of the temple veil is said to symbolise what you say it does and where Christ taught that He is abolishing the need for priests?

 

[ac_claire]

I’m sorry. I’m doing by best not to be disrespectful here but an opinion was asked and should I not be honest in my answer? Remember, I’m not Catholic. I disagree with your opinion, no offense. I am going to the Father on His conditions, not mine. I belong to Christ by faith in Him. I don’t see what you see in the NT Scriptures. I don’t believe there is any priesthood other than the priesthood of all believers. I don’t see anywhere that I have to go to another sinful human to get forgiveness of sins. Christ is my Priest. I go to the Father through Him. The temple veil has been torn from top to bottom, there is no longer any need for a priesthood standing between the people and God. I don’t agree at all with any of these things. I don’t want to get in trouble so I hope you take none of this the wrong way.

OK but Windgirl, why do you believe the way you do? Scripture is written as it is and can be interpreted in a thousand different ways. I wonder why you choose to believe your own personal interpretation of scriptures when they contradict the original interpretations that the apostles in the early NT Church held and passed down intact for the last 2000 years. There has always been an ordained priesthood and it’s not for the purpose of having any man stand “between the people and God.” It’s because Jesus wanted it to be so, and so it has always been.

There is authority in 2000 years of tradition traced back to the apostles and Christ himself. I just wonder how anyone can put their own opinions up against that history and somehow believe that their own opinions carry more weight and can be trusted more. What is that if it’s not pride?

 

[WindGirl]

Well, I’d rather believe what I believe God is showing me in His word than what someone else says it says. No matter what their claims for themselves. Psalm 118:8.

 

[Leonius]

I’m sorry. I’m doing by best not to be disrespectful here but an opinion was asked and should I not be honest in my answer? Remember, I’m not Catholic. I disagree with your opinion, no offense. I am going to the Father on His conditions, not mine. I belong to Christ by faith in Him. I don’t see what you see in the NT Scriptures. I don’t believe there is any priesthood other than the priesthood of all believers. I don’t see anywhere that I have to go to another sinful human to get forgiveness of sins. Christ is my Priest. I go to the Father through Him. The temple veil has been torn from top to bottom, there is no longer any need for a priesthood standing between the people and God. I don’t agree at all with any of these things. I don’t want to get in trouble so I hope you take none of this the wrong way.

“Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not rely on your own understanding.”
Proverbs 3:5

What you say does not come from God and is not in the Scriptures, what you say are the teachings of men who seek to usurp the authority of God’s chosen priesthood. You should read Numbers 16 in the scriptures you wil find the idea of the “priesthood of believers” is contained in that chapter promoted by Core(Korah) whom God destroyed for it.

Now go and read 1 Corinthians 12 you will see in the true Church all do not have the same role, all are not priests.

 

[ac_claire]

Well, I’d rather believe what I believe God is showing me in His word than what someone else says it says. No matter what their claims for themselves. Psalm 118:8.

Who is the “someone else” you speak of who you trust your own judgement over?

 

[Leonius]

Well, I’d rather believe what I believe God is showing me in His word than what someone else says it says. No matter what their claims for themselves. Psalm 118:8.

King David who wrote Psalm 118 obeyed God’s Priests.

Proverbs 12:15
Proverbs 13:10
Deuteronomy 17:12
Matthew 18:17
Luke 10:16
Hebrews 13:17

 

[SyCarl]

King David who wrote Psalm 118 obeyed God’s Priests.

Proverbs 12:15
Proverbs 13:10
Deuteronomy 17:12
Matthew 18:17
Luke 10:16
Hebrews 13:17

The Old Testament priesthood no longer applied. It has been replaced by the high priesthood of Christ.

Now if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the people received the Law), what further need was there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be designated according to the order of Aaron? For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also.
(Hebrews 7:11-12 NASB)

Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.
(Hebrews 8:1-2 NASB)

We do not need an earthly priesthood to enter the holy place for us because we have Jesus.

Therefore, brethren, since we have confidence to enter the holy place by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which He inaugurated for us through the veil, that is, His flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
(Hebrews 10:19-22 NASB)

We do not need a priest as a mediator because we have the one mediator.

For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony given at the proper time.
(1 Timothy 2:5-6 NASB)

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.
(1 John 2:1-2 NASB)

We do not require an earthly priesthood to offer sacrifices for sin, since there is no longer an offering for sin.

For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. And the Holy Spirit also testifies to us; for after saying, “THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS UPON THEIR HEART, AND ON THEIR MIND I WILL WRITE THEM,” He then says, “AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE.” Now where there is forgiveness of these things, there is no longer any offering for sin.
(Hebrews 10:14-18 NASB)

The Old Testament promised a kingdom of priests.

‘Now then, if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be My own possession among all the peoples, for all the earth is Mine; and you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you shall speak to the sons of Israel."
(Exodus 19:5-6 NASB)

This promise has been fulfilled in the New Covenant where we are all priests.

But you are A CHOSEN RACE, A royal PRIESTHOOD, A HOLY NATION, A PEOPLE FOR God’s OWN POSSESSION, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; for you once were NOT A PEOPLE, but now you are THE PEOPLE OF GOD; you had NOT RECEIVED MERCY, but now you have RECEIVED MERCY.
(1 Peter 2:9-10 NASB)

There is no reference to in the New Testament to any priesthood except the High Priesthood of Jesus and the kingdom of priests.

 

[WindGirl]

Thanks, SyCarl.

 

[Leonius]

Thanks, SyCarl.

Do not just thank him study what he has said compare the passages he quotes and compare them to what he has said they say, they do not match, if they did there would be no need for his comments the passages would speak for themselves. Look at how he contradicts himself, first he says we do not need a priesthood as Christ is the one priest, then he says we are all priests, he takes upon himself a honour which God has not bestowed on him seeking to usurp those who have truly received authority from God.

You see you are listening to men, men with no authority, men who teach falsehood, they appeal to you through your pride, as did the snake in the garden with Eve.

“Why are only some priests? Are we not all Holy ones? We are all priests” Remember the words of Core in Numbers 16!

 

[Ginger2]

But the Bible is not meant for a specific class of people as doctors and mechanics.

Gal 3:22 But the Scripture has captured everything by means of sin’s net, so that what was promised by the faithfulness of the Messiah might be granted to those who believe.

The Scriptures or the law is intended to condemn everyone, because no one can live up to it perfectly. So there is only one way to be saved - and that is thru Jesus’ sacrifice on the cross.

But, while everyone has opportunity to accept Christ Jesus, the gift is only given to those who believe.

Romans 1:16-17 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes,

Over and over again Jesus tells his disciples some things are hidden from those who do not believe.

2 Cor 4:
3 if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not

Also, having perfect knowledge about all things concerning God is not a requirement to salvation.

But just about every tom,**** and harry of a Protestant has claimed that and came up with differing interpretations which has now resulted in thousands of churches. Even if there were only 3 different Protestant churches that would still be 2 churches too many and would still bring up the question as to which one of them was guided by the Holy Spirit.

Do I have to repeat myself. All true Christians share the same basic beliefs that are contained in the Holy Scriptures and summarized in the Apostle’s Creed. Anyone who does not believe these basic doctrines is christian in name only.

True. But how do you know, it is really God who is asking you? You are totally discounting the fact that the devil can mimmick God sometimes and has in fact led astray many by this very tactic.

It’s in the Scriptures! We are warned not to believe every spirit as even satan masquerades as an angel of light, but to test the Spirits so as not to be deceived.

Those who started cults and declared that they are allowed to have multiple wives even as young as 10 and later on get their congregation to drink poison claimed they were guided by God. And they were basing that on the Bible.

The Bible covers that too. 2 Ti 4:3

The Bible is true for those who love the Lord. For those who reject God…Romans 1

 

[Ginger2]

For all of you protestants and catholics, only those who walk in light will be called people of Christ. You are wasting precious time
debating those points. Remember that while you are arguing about your believes there are Non-christian that need to be reached. …

Very good point.

 

[Ginger2]

For all:

Let us suppose for a moment that I give you a emerald ring.

Does this ring die, when I die? Or am I free to give it to another?

Can we not admit, at least intellectually, that whatever Jesus gave to Peter and the other apostles he intended to be carried on throughout the ages? Jesus would certainly have known that Peter would die. Was the gift only temporal? Jesus does not say that either.

Blessings,

Lisa

A poor analogy.
What God gives us is not really ours to do with as we please. Everything we have belongs to God. We can give or spend money where we want, but we will be rewarded or punished for making wise or foolish decisions. (Matthew 25 )

Isaac wanted to give His blessing to his eldest son, Esau. But God allowed Jacob to trick his father and receive the blessing instead.

Isaac may have wanted to give Esau his “emerald ring”, But, God chose Jacob.

 

[Ginger2]

Neither of these passages say you have direct access to the Father.

Ephesians 2:18 “through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.”

In fact the passage in John says the opposite that you must go through Christ to the Father, you actually contradicted yourself in your first statement, if you have to go through Christ that is not direct access.

Jesus is God. Did you forget?

 

[Ginger2]

Hebrews 7:28*For the law appoints men in their weakness as high priests, but the word of the oath, which came later than the law, appoints a Son who has been made perfect forever.

 

[SyCarl]

Do not just thank him study what he has said compare the passages he quotes and compare them to what he has said they say, they do not match, if they did there would be no need for his comments the passages would speak for themselves. Look at how he contradicts himself, first he says we do not need a priesthood as Christ is the one priest, then he says we are all priests, he takes upon himself a honour which God has not bestowed on him seeking to usurp those who have truly received authority from God.

You see you are listening to men, men with no authority, men who teach falsehood, they appeal to you through your pride, as did the snake in the garden with Eve.

“Why are only some priests? Are we not all Holy ones? We are all priests” Remember the words of Core in Numbers 16!

I do not contradict myself. If you read what I wrote about an earthly priesthood, I said we did not need it for various purpose such as mediation, sacrifice or to enter the holy place. We do not need a priesthood for those purposes.

I am taking nothing on myself other than what the Bible tells us. Do you deny that Christians are a royal priesthood? Is Peter lying when he tells us we are? Where does he limit it to one particular group?

 

[llblarosa]

1. Have you ever considered that what you believe is shaped by a variety of factors, which may not have anything to do with God?
2. How can you so willingly reject what Catholic scholars (you should read a book about how the bible came to us) have done for 2,000 years? St. Augustine, for example, was a very smart man. I would like to know what makes you think you are as qualified. Catholic scholars have painstakingly copied scripture by hand, and if mistakes were made, the entire copy was thrown out. These were studied and disciplined men. What is our scholarship today compared to theirs?
3. If you feel so firm in your position, you should read Born Fundamentalist, Born Again Catholic or especially By What Authority and Upon This Rock. If your beliefs are firm, then you should have no trouble refuting it. I would challenge you, however, to pray before reading, and tell God sincerely that you will go where he leads you, because you desire above all to know His truths. If your faith is true, you will have no trouble.

Blessings,

Lisa

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

**Protestant questions:
Can’t I talk to God directly, not a priest, to get forgiveness?
Not according to the bible. Read John 20:21-23, 2Cor 2:10 and 2Cor 5:18.

If God knows everything we do, then how come we have to go to confession?
You may know your friend broke your ipod, but wouldn’t it be aggravating if he knew you knew, but still didn’t say, “I’m sorry”?

Doesn’t God forgive no matter what?
If we think of sin as merely breaking rules, it is hard to understand why God can’t just “look the other way”. But sin is real; it hurts us and makes us distant from him–and unable to enter heaven. We can only be restored if we confess.

Confession just gives people the idea that it’s all right to sin as long as you’re sorry later.
If a man is confessing drunkenness while he has plans with his buddies to go bar hopping and get drunk again the coming weekend, he can’t be forgiven. He has to have decided to stop.
Confession stops sins; it doesn’t start them.**

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

HOW AND WHY TO RETURN TO CONFESSION:

1.) The presence of sin can easily lead to depression and anxiety.
2.) You shower to show respect for those around you. Cleansing your soul makes you better to be around too!
3.) Mortal sin, unconfessed, “causes exclusion from Christ’s Kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices forever, with no turning back” (Catechism of the CC, no. 1861)
4.) As they leave the confessional, people smile a smile of freedom.
5.) Because love means having to say you are sorry to the one you love.
6.) You will grow in humility, sincerity and self-knowledge.
7.) Blessed Mother Teresa went. Frequently.
8.) (My favorite)…HOPING TO CONVERT ON YOUR DEATHBED? THAT’S NOT VERY LIKELY. MOST LIKELY, YOU WILL DIE AS YOU LIVED.
9.) It is itself a serious sin to go to communion if you have serious sin on your soul and have not asked for forgiveness in confession.
10.) Don’t be scared to death of confession. Be scared of death without confession.
11.) Be strong. Face your sins; deal with them and move on.
12.) Make sure there are no unpleasant surprises at your particular judgment or at the Final Judgment.
13.) The priest will listen to your sins and will never tell a soul on pain of losing his soul. Priests even learn to forget what they hear.

Christ has forgiven and forgotten your sins, and the angels and saints are having a party to celebrate.

 

[ac_claire]

I do not contradict myself. If you read what I wrote about an earthly priesthood, I said we did not need it for various purpose such as mediation, sacrifice or to enter the holy place. We do not need a priesthood for those purposes.

I am taking nothing on myself other than what the Bible tells us. Do you deny that Christians are a royal priesthood? Is Peter lying when he tells us we are? Where does he limit it to one particular group?

Of course we are a holy people, a royal priesthood. The ordained priesthood talked about in this threads and in the scriptures Leonius and others cited is something entirely different.

 

[Ginger2]

1. How can you so willingly reject what Catholic scholars (you should read a book about how the bible came to us) have done for 2,000 years?

Lisa

Lisa, I was in a thread discussing where the Bible came from and whether or not the Catholics had uninspired books added…

The Catholics couldn’t or wouldn’t respond to the information I provided from Catholic sources. They had no answers to counter the facts I presented. All of a sudden the thread mysteriously disappeared.

I have asked about it, but they will not tell me why they deleted the thread.

Your Bible has extra books that do not belong in it. The are not God’s Word. Those uninspired books are used to support doctrines that are not supported in any inspired books.

The Catholic Church did not give us the Bible.

God gave the Jews the OT. We got it from them.

There is no dispute concerning the NT.