Protestants: Could you please do us all a favor??

[Memaw]

Got it. I was simply saying that Protestants have encountered similar assumptions from forum Catholics about what we must believe/what we’re thinking/what our motivations are, and sometimes run into similar resistance when trying to explain the contrary. I’m sure it’s irritating to encounter the same from Protestants.

Yeah, I’m not surprised to hear that classes vary by instructor. Luck of the draw, one guesses.

I had taught CCD for 20 years and no 2 teachers are alike, but all should be teaching the same truths, Even the RCIA classes should be using a good instruction book as well as the Catechism of the Catholic Church. There are plenty of great books to read to help one understand the Catholic Church. Catholic Answers has plenty of them available if you are interested enough to check with them. I love reading, “Surprised By Truth” vol. I, II & III by Patric Madrid. God Bless, Memaw

 

[Memaw]

There are 22 rites that make up the one Catholic Church, (according to Fr. Mitch Pacwa.) The only thing that differs in the rites are local customes, languages etc. All Doctrine is the same and they are all equaly Catholic. God Bless

They are all under the authority of the Pope and are part of the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC and APOSTOLIC, Church founded by Jesus Christ, 2000 years ago. If they are not under the authority of the Pope, then they are not a part of the Catholic Church. God Bless, Memaw

 

[The_Question]

They are all under the authority of the Pope and are part of the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC and APOSTOLIC, Church founded by Jesus Christ, 2000 years ago. If they are not under the authority of the Pope, then they are not a part of the Catholic Church. God Bless, Memaw

All I can say is thank God I am not a part of the RCC! Just look at the joy and power and life in the music of non RCC’s and put it up next to the sad sounds that emanate from the RCC and you will get one of many hints as to where the true life and power is. Turn your radio on and listen to the Christian music you love. Guess how much was produced by Roman Catholics??? There is a very crucial reason why that is the case. Life versus religion. Grace versus law. So…to answer your question at the title of this thread…looks like we have done you a HUGE favor–we’ve given you a great big, joyous hint as to where salvation is…where life is. Take the hint while you still have time on this earth. There is no second chance.

 

[Thorwald]

Could you please attend an RCIA class (finish it) before attempting to argue Catholic versus Protestant theology…

Yes, i suppose Catholics should study various Protestant theologies also… but i feel most Catholics on the forums have (more or less) done that…

I’m sorry, but it really rankles me when Protestants think they know Catholic theology and they so positively DO NOT!!

another source of information about the true Catholic faith can be found here at Catholic Answers…

I just don’t think it is right to attack something you do not understand…

Would I have to see special peoples’ (Our Lord, Mary, saints, etc.) faces on toast, peanut butter, cheese, etc., or watch blood coming out of the eyes of statues (of the same), or purchase a set of beads and mumble the same memorized words while ‘fondling’ them, etc., if I followed your instructions, …or… will this allow me to be exempt from these things?

 

[Louie1983]

It’s not only Protestants that do this. I would suggest that some of our Catholic brethren who have come here lately to argue against the Church’s Teachings attend more in-depth catechesis before spilling opinions.

Agree with you here…

 

[Louie1983]

Would I have to see special peoples’ (Our Lord, Mary, saints, etc.) faces on toast, peanut butter, cheese, etc., or watch blood coming out of the eyes of statues (of the same), or purchase a set of beads and mumble the same memorized words while ‘fondling’ them, etc., if I followed your instructions, …or… will this allow me to be exempt from these things?

Your just proving his point further, the things you have described is absolute rubbish and shows lack of knowledge on your part.

Got news for you, if you don’t say the rosary it doesn’t mean your not Catholic or that you are sinning. It’s just a prayer recommended for everyone to say to increase their faith. And by the way, yes you repeat the prayers but you are actually focusing on key areas of the bible and of Christ’s life (passion and death, resurrection, his birth etc).

All you have to do be Catholic is 1) be baptised, 2) accept and believe all the teachings of the church.

And i cann assure you, it doesn;t say anywhere that you have to see special people or witness miracles (bleeding statues etc) to be Catholic. Seriously

How bout understanding what the church teaches rather then listen to hearsay?

 

[Memaw]

Your just proving his point further, the things you have described is absolute rubbish and shows lack of knowledge on your part.

Got news for you, if you don’t say the rosary it doesn’t mean your not Catholic or that you are sinning. It’s just a prayer recommended for everyone to say to increase their faith. And by the way, yes you repeat the prayers but you are actually focusing on key areas of the bible and of Christ’s life (passion and death, resurrection, his birth etc).

All you have to do be Catholic is 1) be baptised, 2) accept and believe all the teachings of the church.

And i cann assure you, it doesn;t say anywhere that you have to see special people or witness miracles (bleeding statues etc) to be Catholic. Seriously

How bout understanding what the church teaches rather then listen to hearsay?

Its the news media and or many protestants and ignorant Catholics that pay attention to all this sensationalism, not the Catholic that knows and understands their faith.
God Bless, Memaw

 

[Memaw]

All I can say is thank God I am not a part of the RCC! Just look at the joy and power and life in the music of non RCC’s and put it up next to the sad sounds that emanate from the RCC and you will get one of many hints as to where the true life and power is. Turn your radio on and listen to the Christian music you love. Guess how much was produced by Roman Catholics??? There is a very crucial reason why that is the case. Life versus religion. Grace versus law. So…to answer your question at the title of this thread…looks like we have done you a HUGE favor–we’ve given you a great big, joyous hint as to where salvation is…where life is. Take the hint while you still have time on this earth. There is no second chance.

And I thank God I am a part of the Church Jesus Himself founded while still on this earth, 2,000 years ago. The One, Holy, Catholic And Apostolic Church, that has and will stand the test of time till the end of the world. ( How old is your denomination???) Jesus didn’t found a music, HE founded a Church, true beliefs that he said HE would be with till the end of Time. HE promised the Holy Spirit would be with HIS Church and protect it from teaching error. HE gave us the Seven Sacraments and most especially Himself in the Holy Eucharist. HE said “Come follow ME”, He didn’t say follow anyone to interprets the Scripture to suit himself, or anyone who wrote a song, or anyone who decides to do their own thing. HE prayed that ALL be ONE in HIM. And look how those who wanted to “do their own thing” have divided themselves. But the Holy Catholic Church stands strong, still teaching the TRUTHS that Jesus gave us, still administering the same Seven Sacraments Jesus gave us. How can your music or ‘power’ even compare to that??? And for that fact, if you would learn the truth about the Catholic Church, it has done more to protect and preserve true art and music more than another.

You would do yourself a great favor if you would stop believing all the nonsense you have heard about the Catholic Church and learn from HER what she really believes and teaches. I suggest you watch EWTN Catholic Cable Network, and especially on Monday evenings at 7 pm CST. The program called “Journey Home.” Marcus Grodi interviews many protestant ministers that have become Catholic after learning the TRUTH about the Catholic Faith. Jesus said, “I AM the WAY, the TRUTH and the LIFE, Come follow ME.” And we do!!! GOD Bless, Memaw

 

[Thorwald]

Its the news media and or many protestants and ignorant Catholics that pay attention to all this sensationalism, not the Catholic that knows and understands their faith.
God Bless, Memaw

Then why doesn’t the Pope refute these things, so that all know the truth? Why let the media ‘continue in their lies’? When the Pope does not respond, the general public begins believing, that ‘all Catholics are nuts’. It serves no purpose, to remain silent. Silence often says that all are in agreement with what others are saying.

 

[sambos671]

Then why doesn’t the Pope refute these things, so that all know the truth? Why let the media ‘continue in their lies’? When the Pope does not respond, the general public begins believing, that ‘all Catholics are nuts’. It serves no purpose, to remain silent. Silence often says that all are in agreement with what others are saying.

Who says the Pope hasn’t refuted these things?

 

[Thorwald]

Who says the Pope hasn’t refuted these things?

I have never heard the Pope refute any of these superstitious ‘sightings/occurences’ through public media. I am not trying to be arrogant. I actually believed, that all Catholics believe these things to be true. This is one of the reasons, that I ‘shy away’ from Catholicism. I actually believed, myself, that all Catholics are ‘nuts’. Perhaps it is time, to clear the air. How many others (ie. general public) have no idea as to what Catholics believe or not believe? How many non-Catholics have this same kind of ‘understanding’ of the Catholic ‘beliefs’ that I have? Do you not understand, that these superstitious sightings and occurrences ‘paint’ your faith with a single brush, that being, that Catholicism is a ‘cult’? It destroys the integrity of your faith.

 

[sambos671]

I have never heard the Pope refute any of these superstitious ‘sightings/occurences’ through public media. I am not trying to be arrogant. I actually believed, that all Catholics believe these things to be true. This is one of the reasons, that I ‘shy away’ from Catholicism. I actually believed, myself, that all Catholics are ‘nuts’. Perhaps it is time, to clear the air. How many others (ie. general public) have no idea as to what Catholics believe or not believe? How many non-Catholics have this same kind of ‘understanding’ of the Catholic ‘beliefs’ that I have? Do you not understand, that these superstitious sightings and occurrences ‘paint’ your faith with a single brush, that being, that Catholicism is a ‘cult’? It destroys the integrity of your faith.

I remember as a Child that my mother painted all Protestants as a cult and liken them to Mormons. Certainly there is that perseption. However, that perseption doesn’t change or affect the integrity of the faith as the faith has been well document over 2 millenia. If you want to know what the Catholic Church teaches go to mass. Read the Catachism. Ask a preist. Certainly, there are those professing Catholics who not only do not know their own faith but participate in the nonsence you speak of. Just as there are protestants who wear “end of the world” signs on their bodies and shout scriptures at people. Or Protestant churches (the Kansas Baptist church I’m thinking of) that protest good american soldiers funerals telling their loved ones that God’s judgement is on them because the US supports homosexuals. Would it then be fair for me to paint all protestants with the same brush as these weirdos? Why then would you do the same for Catholics?

 

[Bill_Pick]

Could you please attend an RCIA class (finish it) before attempting to argue Catholic versus Protestant theology…

Yes, i suppose Catholics should study various Protestant theologies also… but i feel most Catholics on the forums have (more or less) done that…

I’m sorry, but it really rankles me when Protestants think they know Catholic theology and they so positively DO NOT!!

another source of information about the true Catholic faith can be found here at Catholic Answers…

I just don’t think it is right to attack something you do not understand…

Good luck,I have a daughter who is not Cathloic and if you give her a bible verse to show you as right she will just tell you its out of context. Its like talking to a wall Pray you have better luck then Me.

 

[Bill_Pick]

I realize it’s a tall order to request of a protestant.

Just to make clear what I am talking about. A protestant will claim that Catholics believe X. Catholics will say, “No, we believe Y.” That same protestant will say, “No, you believe X.” And then insist on Catholics believing X in spite of the fact that we tell them no, we do NOT believe in X.

That is what I am talking about. Rather than responding with, “No, you believe X.” It’d be nice if they said, “Oh, ok. So you believe Y. I thought you believed X but you’re saying you believe Y. Got it.”

That’s not to say that the protestant has to believe Y. THIS is what I am talking about.

I find this interesting. I’m sure RCIA really depends on who is teaching it. I’ve attended some RCIA classes and usually towards the end there is a Q&A session where people can ask questions to get answers. That would be the opportunity to ask individual questions and clear up issues.

It is unfortunate you did not experience that in the RCIA class(es) you attended.

Just to make a point How many times has a Cathloic told a non-cathloic "Ctahloics DO NOT WORHISP MARY AND THEY WILL ALWAYS SAY cATHLOIC DO OR WHAT ABOUT cATHLOICS CALLING THE PRIEST FATHER.

 

[Peter_J]

I have never heard the Pope refute any of these superstitious ‘sightings/occurences’ through public media. I am not trying to be arrogant. I actually believed, that all Catholics believe these things to be true. This is one of the reasons, that I ‘shy away’ from Catholicism. I actually believed, myself, that all Catholics are ‘nuts’. Perhaps it is time, to clear the air. How many others (ie. general public) have no idea as to what Catholics believe or not believe? How many non-Catholics have this same kind of ‘understanding’ of the Catholic ‘beliefs’ that I have? Do you not understand, that these superstitious sightings and occurrences ‘paint’ your faith with a single brush, that being, that Catholicism is a ‘cult’? It destroys the integrity of your faith.

Sometimes it’s better to just make a general statement of “Don’t believe everything you read.” I’ll tell you, if I tried to go around this forum – just this one forum, never mind all the other Catholic discussion forums and Catholics blog that are out there – saying “That statement doesn’t represent Catholicism … That statement doesn’t represent Catholicism … That statement doesn’t represent Catholicism … Neither does that one”, I’d go nuts. So what do I do? What do I do?? Well I’ll tell you what I do, I tell everyone “Just because one Catholic says X, it doesn’t mean that all Catholics believe X” …

and then I hope for the best.

 

[Thorwald]

I remember as a Child that my mother painted all Protestants as a cult and liken them to Mormons. Certainly there is that perseption. However, that perseption doesn’t change or affect the integrity of the faith as the faith has been well document over 2 millenia. If you want to know what the Catholic Church teaches go to mass. Read the Catachism. Ask a preist. Certainly, there are those professing Catholics who not only do not know their own faith but participate in the nonsence you speak of. Just as there are protestants who wear “end of the world” signs on their bodies and shout scriptures at people. Or Protestant churches (the Kansas Baptist church I’m thinking of) that protest good american soldiers funerals telling their loved ones that God’s judgement is on them because the US supports homosexuals. Would it then be fair for me to paint all protestants with the same brush as these weirdos? Why then would you do the same for Catholics?

I hear you! There are, however a lot of other doctrines and beliefs carried out by the Catholic church, that I have trouble believing in. The ‘miracles thing’, is just one more ‘thing’.

How can I accept Catholicism, if I believe from my heart, that any ‘statues’, used within a church, are a sign of IDOLATRY? Why are statues necessary at all, in order to follow God’s Word? Another ‘item’, is the naming of men, ‘FATHER’ or ‘HOLY FATHER’, when scripture tells me to call no man FATHER (ie. spiritual Father). Another, is the glorification of MARY. All Christians know the story of Jesus Christ’s birth. We have to realize, that Mary was the mother of CHRIST (The Son of Man…lower than the angels). She is not the mother of Jesus, as Lord of Hosts (begotten above the angels). Christ, Himself, always glorifies His Father, The Lord God Almighty. He told us, that we don’t know how to pray, and thus, gave us The Lord’s Prayer. There is no mention of Mary in this prayer. Why would I assume that Mary has any specific ‘powers’ in order to make intercession for us, when Jesus Christ, Himself, has not given us special instructions to deal with this topic?

 

[sambos671]

I hear you! There are, however a lot of other doctrines and beliefs carried out by the Catholic church, that I have trouble believing in. The ‘miracles thing’, is just one more ‘thing’.

How can I accept Catholicism, if I believe from my heart, that any ‘statues’, used within a church, are a sign of IDOLATRY? Why are statues necessary at all, in order to follow God’s Word? Another ‘item’, is the naming of men, ‘FATHER’ or ‘HOLY FATHER’, when scripture tells me to call no man FATHER (ie. spiritual Father). Another, is the glorification of MARY. All Christians know the story of Jesus Christ’s birth. We have to realize, that Mary was the mother of CHRIST (The Son of Man…lower than the angels). She is not the mother of Jesus, as Lord of Hosts (begotten above the angels). Christ, Himself, always glorifies His Father, The Lord God Almighty. He told us, that we don’t know how to pray, and thus, gave us The Lord’s Prayer. There is no mention of Mary in this prayer. Why would I assume that Mary has any specific ‘powers’ in order to make intercession for us, when Jesus Christ, Himself, has not given us special instructions to deal with this topic?

These things have been regurgitated so long you think the explination would get out to everyone by now! But being in a Charitable mood I’ll pass on my meager knowledge to you and let you judge for yourself.
Statues: I saw a nice statue of Abraham Lincoln at the monument area in Washington DC. Its a spectacular thing. Huge! Now I don’t know one person from any country or religion that claim that us Americans worship the statue of Lincoln or Lincoln himself. Why do we have a statue of him at our nation’s capital? Because he is an admired man and people respect him and his values. Simple no worship going on there. The statues and pictures in the church represent people and scenes in the bible. They lead us to remember certain passages in scripture help us think about those specific events. As far as the Saints they are people who lived faithful lives that inspire us to live like them. There is nothing about worship. This discussion was flushed out in the 6th ecuminical council. Just like picuters they help us to remember.
Calling Priest Father: Jesus statement was Hyperboli. Do you think he would prevent you from calling your biological father; father or Dad? Its a study of hermenutics. Of course Jesus wouldn’t stop you from doing that. Also having lived in third world countries there is a tradition in some that I have visited that you call the tribal elder “father” this is a term of respect. We call the founding men of the United States the Founding Fathers. See? We haven’t transgresed Jesus statement here.
Now your statement about Mary falls very close to a Nestorius view of Mary. The question I have for you is this: Is Jesus the Man separate than Jesus the Divine? How does the incarnation work? See in the discussion of Mary you must understand that everything a Catholic believes about Mary Stems from what a Catholic believes about Jesus. So Like Nestorius you think that Mary is Christokos. Well, what are the theological implications of that? Did Mary Just give birth to a simple Mortal that was possessed by the Word? Did Mary give birth to Jesus who is the same eternal Word from the begining as well as the man? In your mind, does Jesus have two natures? Is he fully divine and fully human at the same time? Or is his humanity apart from his divinity kind of live an avatar? See how this view become mired in all sorts of issues? The Catholic Church settled this issue long ago and agreed that Mary is Theotokos. Tell what are the implications of that with regard to Jesus? No one thinks Mary has powers other than that she has recieved the promise we hope for! And being a part of the body of Christ she prays for us as even I pray for you. You do not worship me yet I pray for you. You can speak to me and let me know what you want me to pray specifically for. It is God who heals. It is God who works in the hearts of men. Yet we are encouraged to pray diligently for each other? Is it because we have power? No. Its because God is allowing us to participate in his work that he initiated and completes. We’re just blessed to come along for the ride. Mary works in much the same way. We hope for the ressurection of the body. The promise that Jesus gave his followers. So again what we believe about Mary has everything to do with what we believe about Jesus. As far as the lord’s prayer and the hail mary its a nonsequitur. The words to Mary (save the 2nd part) is taken strait from scriptures. Between greetings of Gabriel and Elizabeth. And remember that anything that is set aside or apart for a specific use is “holy” Mary is Holy and she is the Theotokos.

 

[Memaw]

Then why doesn’t the Pope refute these things, so that all know the truth? Why let the media ‘continue in their lies’? When the Pope does not respond, the general public begins believing, that ‘all Catholics are nuts’. It serves no purpose, to remain silent. Silence often says that all are in agreement with what others are saying.

You gotta be kiddin me, since when can anyone stop the media !!! The Pope has better things to do than chase all these silly things down. Besides by the time he even hears about them, if he ever does, they are old and forgotten. How many goofy things do you ever hear about from other countries. I would think that most people with good common sense would know better than to believe them no matter what denomination they belong to. God Bless, Memaw

 

[distracted]

Would I have to see special peoples’ (Our Lord, Mary, saints, etc.) faces on toast, peanut butter, cheese, etc., or watch blood coming out of the eyes of statues (of the same), or purchase a set of beads and mumble the same memorized words while ‘fondling’ them, etc., if I followed your instructions, …or… will this allow me to be exempt from these things?

your mockery of the rosary can only be excused because i know you are ignorant…

the rosary is waht made me a Christian… or i should say a whole-hearted one, one who was able to withstand temptation… made me know Jesus and the Holy Spirit and the way of holiness… without which it is impossible to please God…

and the rosary led to other things in my life… that i am SO thankful to God for

 

[Peter_J]

Just to make a point How many times has a Catholic told a non-catholic "Catholics DO NOT WORHISP MARY

Tons of times. The problem is, since Vatican II a lot of Catholics don’t realize that you have to use all-caps if you want to convince anyone. (Or, if you really want to convince them, make it bold face and underlined as well. )