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Simeon_Hovey
Guest
Once again ekklhsian is the word used in Ephesians and it is a sectarian call to meeting, ekklhsian is a verb.
Simeon
Simeon
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soflochristmas
Guest
Even the devil recognizes Christ Jesus.
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NotTooSmart
Guest
So, do you think her testimony is “demonic” too? Fascinating.
Maybe it is a bad translation but my Bible version says in 1 Cor. 12:3 that “nobody speaking by the Spirit of God says Jesus is accursed, and no one can say Jesus is Lord, except by the Holy Spirit.”
So when somebody here has a testimony that lifts up Jesus as Lord and relates how they came to Christ, I think I should believe him/her and not ascribe it to satan don’t you think. Specifically when Jesus has this little inconvenient verse about blaspheming the Holy Spirit in the context of ascribing the works of God to the works of satan.
po18guy
Well-known member
I will respond in a general manner regarding a person who is in this same situation, to comply with forum rules.
To one who has seen miracles occur in the presence of Christ in the Eucharist, walking away from Him is indeed a tragedy and is sorrowfully close to what happened in John 6:66. I do not expect you to understand any of this, but to those who have come to believe in Jesus Christ in the Holy Eucharist, rejection of Him is rejection of the true Gospel in favor of a lessor one which is acceptable in merely human terms.
Jesus established one Church in unity, not thousands of bickering, disagreeing communities. The work of demons is to weaken Christ’s Body on earth, His Church, so that evil may gain ground upon good. That is exactly what I see happening in such situations.
If you take satisfaction in dividing the Body of Christ, or if you believe that Christians should be divided, be careful in celebrating, as the demons celebrate right beside you.
How many times must a person make a “decision for Christ”? One, two, five, ten? That would have already occurred during a solemn rite in the Catholic Church. So, this is like being baptized numerous times until it “feels right” Would that not be an affront to God? Now, THAT is the interesting part.
The evil one is pleased by all such occurrences, as it further divides and weakens Christ’s Body. Yes.
Such a person either knowingly walked away from Christ, or failed to believe in His true presence in the Eucharist. It is quite possible that such a person was not properly instructed in the faith. That is the major problem in the Church today. It is tragic and needs immediate correction. No matter the reason, it is a weakening of Christ’s Sacred Body.
Demons are real. Demons exist. We all fight them. So, where do you think they are, and what are they doing? Their purpose is to gain souls for their master. Luring souls away from the fulness of Christ, to a lesser form of worship or to agnosticism or atheism is what they do. To a Catholic, or another who actually knows Catholicism, this is exactly what has occurred here.
To one who has seen miracles occur in the presence of Christ in the Eucharist, walking away from Him is indeed a tragedy and is sorrowfully close to what happened in John 6:66. I do not expect you to understand any of this, but to those who have come to believe in Jesus Christ in the Holy Eucharist, rejection of Him is rejection of the true Gospel in favor of a lessor one which is acceptable in merely human terms.
Jesus established one Church in unity, not thousands of bickering, disagreeing communities. The work of demons is to weaken Christ’s Body on earth, His Church, so that evil may gain ground upon good. That is exactly what I see happening in such situations.
If you take satisfaction in dividing the Body of Christ, or if you believe that Christians should be divided, be careful in celebrating, as the demons celebrate right beside you.
po18guy
Well-known member
Could you tie this in to the doctrine of sola scriptura, please?
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NotTooSmart
Guest
Hmm. I just read the testimony again.
Although it is somewhat in the language of Christianese, the testimony was one of walking away from Jesus and encountering Jesus again. That sounds like something the Holy Spirit would do to me.
The only problem to you is that God chose not to do it you way, and instead did decided to do it in an inferior Protestant church. And you are having a cow because of this and ascribing it to satan.
Fascinating response though.
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Janet1983
Guest
But you do realize what you are telling me with these words?
Yes believing in God is not a sign of being saved, because the devils also believe, and tremble… (See James 2:19)
The difference is that Jesus Christ is my Lord and my Saviour. He is the centre of my life. It’s all about Him.
What do I have and what can I do? Nothing. I can do nothing without Him. He saved me from who I was and made me a new creature in Him. (see 2 Corinthians 5:17)
I do not deserve this… What I deserve looks different from what I have through His mercy and His grace.
What do I deserve? Nothing but eternal torments. Nothing more.
I was a vile God-hating criminal. I broke every law God has ever given. I don’t deserve anything but hell. I sinned against an infinitely holy God. I insulted the most glorious being in the entire universe and I didn’t do it just once. I did it over and over again. I didn’t do anything but sinning! I didn’t do anything else! I deserve hell and I deserve only that. If God would execute perfect justice there would be no moderation, no mercy.
But he saved me! I don’t have anything apart from Him! He saved me! He bought me with His blood. He paid the price and He saved me!
All I do and all I have is for His glory alone. His glory, not mine.
What else can there be said? He saved me! He took this wretched creature that I was and He saved me!
Everything I have I owe to Him, so why should I hold anything back? He saved me and that is more than I could ever have expected or earned.
I give everything. Everything to God I freely give.
po18guy
Well-known member
Our Savior Jesus Christ founded a Church that had four qualities. If a community lacks one or more of these qualities, can it be true? It can be close, but it will lack something of the truth. I don’t want some truth. I don’t want most of the truth. I seek it all, no matter how difficult its teaching is. The true Church is One (unified), Holy (set apart from this world), Catholic (universal - in all nations) and Apostolic (having the successors to the Twelve). To settle for less is, well, less.
You came to a Catholic forum. You are going to get industrial strength Catholicism.
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NotTooSmart
Guest
And apparantly this One True Church has given you such a superiority complex so that when Jesus decides to do something like take the role the Good Shepherd and search and seek for someone that is lost, you…just like the Pharisees…can not accept what Jesus is doing because Jesus is doing is outside of the box that you have created for Him by doing it within an obviously inferior Protestant church…
So instead you ascribe it to satan.
Fascinating response. Learning a lot here.
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Tanner9188
Guest
Same thing Jesus was accused of when He presented what the Father had revealed; so I’m in good company.
However, you need to search and seek. I have said this before, but most people never really deal with their sin issue with God; as described in the first two beatitudes. Therefore; they have a sense of security with their religion and religious activities and piety; but have a superficial, religious-activity-based, sense of “feeling” close to God and God to them. God condemned the pharisees and their subscribers, sentenced to hell forever, for that very reason.
The word of God is true and does what it says; so when God says the following in Romans below; I can honestly testify to the truth; I can’t articulate it very well. His Word will transform ones life; I am living proof and I thank Him every single day.
I don’t see a way to improve on the way God has said; so here is how you will know (below), but I will add; it is a matter of obedience for Him to bless one with the assurance; it is not automatic it; is gradual, at least for me.
Romans 8:10-16
“10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. 12 So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh-- 13 for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14 For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. 15 For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God,…”
All true Christians are of one mind, the mind of Christ, exactly as the Scripture says, and the bride of Christ is yet to be revealed.
The churches on earth are of the local level, just like in the NT. Collectively, they are one church. There are tares among the wheat; there are different soils and etc. There is no visible “church of unity”; not when it is occupied by sinful humans; that should be intuitive given the nature of men. You have been mislead IMO about the unity of the church, it is always referred to in Scripture, unity, at a spiritual level; not the physical level because it is yet to be revealed. That is what Scripture shows and that is what reality shows.
You give the Catholic Church too much attention and glory IMO; it is God, not the Catholic Church or any other church, that gave man His word. Would you like to argue that point? God gets His word to His people regardless of any obstacle.
It is even tougher when you realize your religion teaches you things that are incorrect on almost every point. For example concerning feeding of the sheep, which is what? Preaching and teaching the Word; particularly the gospel…right?
Matthew 10:5-15 -
5 These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: "Do not go in {the} way of {the} Gentiles, and do not enter {any} city of the Samaritans; 6 but rather **go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 "And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
This is “feeding the sheep”; giving the gospel. He is not a respecter of persons, nor shows partiality. **
CONTINUED ON NEXT POST
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Tanner9188
Guest
FROM PREV. POST - CONTINUED
prev post:
De 10:17 -
"For the LORD your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God who does not show partiality nor take a bribe.
2Ch 19:7 -
“Now then let the fear of the LORD be upon you; be very careful what you do, for the LORD our God will have no part in unrighteousness or partiality or the taking of a bribe.”
This you should really pay attention to IMO. (Above)
Job 34:19 -
Who shows no partiality to princes Nor regards the rich above the poor, For they all are the work of His hands?
Acts 10:34 -
Opening his mouth, Peter said: "I most certainly understand {now} that **God is not one to show partiality, **
Ephesians 6:9 -
And masters, do the same things to them, and give up threatening, knowing that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no partiality with Him.
Peter is not to be put on the pedestal as the Roman System has done; it is an assault on the character of God; among other things as Scripture clearly demonstrates.
God bless you; I pray you see.
First; I appreciate your concern, but I am on the narrow path after finding and agonizing through that narrow gate. Second, you are my concern for I am certain of yours and others destiny if they do not change the road they have chosen, but that is theirs/yours responsibility; mine is to put the Word out. Thirdly, false teaching and teachers were around before Jesus died. Finally, you cannot show one new or false belief I support and rebuke it from Scripture; yet I can show you a half a dozen old and newer beliefs you have and either show you from Scripture; like I have today and in the past or have you fail to prove them based on Scripture; this is not a show of muscle; it is a matter of eternal destination, a very serious matter.
prev post:
You just agreed that God is not a respecter of persons, He shows no partiality; then you go on to say He plays favorites; you said “valued Peter, James and John above the others”. You are seeing God from the human goggles; we would see that as playing favorites because it is our nature; He does not view men that way. It is not His nature to play favorites; it is contrary to His nature. This is another reason why Peter has no special preference with God, but God preferred to use Peter according to His purpose and His plan; just like He does with all true disciples.Tanner9188:
po18guy:
De 10:17 -
"For the LORD your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God who does not show partiality nor take a bribe.
2Ch 19:7 -
“Now then let the fear of the LORD be upon you; be very careful what you do, for the LORD our God will have no part in unrighteousness or partiality or the taking of a bribe.”
This you should really pay attention to IMO. (Above)
Job 34:19 -
Who shows no partiality to princes Nor regards the rich above the poor, For they all are the work of His hands?
Acts 10:34 -
Opening his mouth, Peter said: "I most certainly understand {now} that **God is not one to show partiality, **
Ephesians 6:9 -
And masters, do the same things to them, and give up threatening, knowing that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no partiality with Him.
Peter is not to be put on the pedestal as the Roman System has done; it is an assault on the character of God; among other things as Scripture clearly demonstrates.
God bless you; I pray you see.
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Bengoshi
Guest
Your question can be answered by simple common sense. By its definition, Bible-believing churches are those which consider the Bible to be the authoritative, inerrant, and infallible Word of God. You can know that by just asking the believer.
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Tanner9188
Guest
Remember what I said about the spirituality versus the physicality of flesh. To believe in a real presence of eating flesh; is to forgo the true sense of the message and quite frankly it is receiving the Lords Supper in an unworthy manner according to Scripture. This is but one of a few reasons why it is non-Biblical; another would be the administers of the Lords Supper; a non-existent priesthood from the Biblical perspective.
John 6:63 is the very words of Jesus concerning the manner (spiritual) He spoke. This is not the only time Jesus contrasted to clarify, as not to confuse, the flesh with the spirit. He did the same thing when speaking with Nicodemus and a few times Paul makes similar analogies in Romans 8.
Joh 6:63 -
"It is the **Spirit who gives life;***the flesh profits nothing; the ******words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.
**
**This is the point of the whole message.
***stay away from the fleshy part
**** in case you did not get it the first time, let me repeat it
Click here and look at this simple word search
searchgodsword.org/desk/?l=en&query=flesh+and+spirit§ion=0&translation=nas&sr=1&Enter=Perform+Search
Do This in Remembrance of Me! Remember what Lord? The work on the cross My child; I shed my flesh and blood for you. Thank you Lord; I will remember when I break the bread and drink the cup of the vine. Good and faithful servant.
Matthew 26:26-30 -
26 While they were eating, Jesus took {some} bread, and after a blessing, He broke {it} and gave {it} to the disciples, and said, “Take, eat; this is My body.” 27 And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He gave {it} to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you; 28 for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins. 29 "But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom."
In Acts as the church was growing and they were going house to house “breaking bread”.
Jesus say this is my blood, then turns right around and says “I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until…in My Father’s Kingdom”
If this were remotely close how you Catholics believe the literal eating, then it would truly violate His own law against such a thing as the OT clearly forbids and especially the drinking of the blood. Also, Jesus could have easily demonstrated literally at that time, but He did not and has no intention for any of us; He is using physical object to make a spiritual point. Like in the following texts: I am the Light of the world, I am the door of the sheep, I am the root and the descendant of David
Hopefully see the truth and will avoid the errors.
Ge 9:4 -
"Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, {that is,} its blood
Le 17:14 -
"For {as for the} life of all flesh, its blood is {identified} with its life. Therefore I said to the sons of Israel, ‘You are not to eat the blood of any flesh, for the life of all flesh is its blood; whoever eats it shall be cut off.’
De 12:23 -
"Only be sure not to eat the blood, for the blood is the life, and you shall not eat the life with the flesh.
Finally; if Jesus allowed this (above); He has violated His own standard and that is not possible.
God bless you and bath you in truth.
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Tanner9188
Guest
**Hey; that’s okay because my Bible states that Jesus was told He has a demon for putting His trust in the Father; like Janet has done; so she is in great company; whereas those same people that made those false accusation follow the Pharisees and their subscribers and condemned them all.
So let’s pray for all the demon accusers for their salvation…Amen.**
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soflochristmas
Guest
No…I didn’t say that. The point I was making was that just to say you believe in Christ is not an adquate testimony to the nature of the person making the proclamation.
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soflochristmas
Guest
But it isn’t “all about Him” and He isn’t the “center” of your life if you don’t listen to him.
“He who hears you (the Church, apostles and their successor bishops) hears me (Christ), and he who rejects you rejects me.”
Luke 10:16
It’s really all about YOU.
po18guy
Well-known member
Au Contraire! Please do not mistake confidence for arrogance. I remain the worst sinner here. I boast only in our Lord, Who resides in His fulness, in the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church - the Church He founded so that we might find the narrow path that leads to eternity in paradise.
To you, a separated brother in Christ, I call you only to first examine your own beliefs, putting them to the historic test. Then, to examine, with a loving and open heart, the Church which traces back to Christ Himself. We are held together by men whose hands-on ordination is traceable back to the twelve Apostles. Your faith has truth in it - absolutely. But, I tell you that there is more to the truth.
I beseech you to keep seeking the truth, until you find Christ in His fulness and know that there is no other community in which you may find a greater depth of faith, or a fuller measure of our Lord. That’s all.
If you are so disposed, here is a testimony of God’s revelation to an Evangelical and his wife: chnetwork.org/Conversionstories/Johngiles.pdf
May Christ’s peace be with you.
R
Robbinson
Guest
po18guy
Well-known member
Don’t add to scripture and please don’t add to my post. I said that such a calling away of a follower of Christ from the fulness of Christ - dividing His Body in the process, is demonically sourced.
Can you propose a Godly way to divide Christ’s Body?
The testimony given is truth, as it actually occurred. I am merely pointing to its source. And you think I’m having a cow. Ok…
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ufamtobie
Guest
Kcmekim,
Yes, the Catholic Church knows that Jesus Christ is the Head of the Church. But you don’t understand or I should say you have not been given the grace to understand that Jesus Christ left his Church in the care of men.
John 20: 21-23) He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. 22 When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. 23 Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.
Kcmekim, open your eyes and heart to the will of Jesus Christ, this is his will, that the Apostles and their successors will be the ones who will guide his Church on earth while Jesus the true head of the Church is away in heaven. John 20: 21-23 proves it.
Ufam Tobie
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