Protestants: What would Christianity look like if the Catholic Church were to disappear tomorrow?

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concretecamper said:
The operative word in “ONE”. I guess the fathers if they wanted to could have said “practically one” or used some other diminished meaning of the word One…but they didn’t. It is up to us to faithfully follow their definition of One.
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Therein lies the rub: we cannot be one in the sense of sharing the eucharist until we are one in the sense of doctrinal agreement.
 
Peter_J said:
Therein lies the rub: we cannot be one in the sense of sharing the eucharist until we are one in the sense of doctrinal agreement.
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Agreed. All the more reason why we poor, miserable sinners need to continue to do our best to seek true, lasting agreement and unity in Christ. Division has existed since the beginning of the church, and is a result of our fault - our own fault - our own most grievous fault. :sad_yes:
 
steido01 said:
Agreed. All the more reason why we poor, miserable sinners need to continue to do our best to seek true, lasting agreement and unity in Christ. Division has existed since the beginning of the church, and is a result of our fault - our own fault - our own most grievous fault. :sad_yes:
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Why lament division? It could be solved tomorrow.
 
JustaServant said:
Asked this question four years ago during NCRs “wild west” days. 😃
I’d like the get the newbies answers now.

Would it be powerful or insignificant?
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I am not Protestant but can I play Please:crying:

I know you are kind and will let me.😃

Okay if the Catholic Church would be gone Christianity would be Paradise. Heaven would have come down to earth and Jesus more or less wiped out all evil and it would be such a day of celebration.

Our loved ones that are deemed worthy by Christ will rise from the grave. Oh just to see Mamma and Pappas face to see their children again huh!!

Its pretty much what we are all waiting for to be honest.
 
concretecamper said:
Please define “various apostolic Churches” ?
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I think the Catholic Church answers this, doesn’t it? Aren’t Churches that have valid orders (in Rome’s view), and therefore valid sacraments apostolic?

ISTM that Padre Pio’s statement is not in conformity to Catholic teaching, at least as I understand it. Jharek is saying that whether or not the Catholic Church, those in communion with the Bishop of Rome, are here, the Sacrifice of the Mass continues in Orthodoxy, and even in the PNCC and other communions.

Jon
 
Well if they are truly Catholic, I reckon they would. But they would never “cease to exist”. God Bless, Memaw
 
Memaw said:
Well if they are truly Catholic, I reckon they would. But they would never “cease to exist”. God Bless, Memaw
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I don’t know whether you consider them to be truly Catholic or not, but the Assyrian Church of the East, the Oriental Orthodox Churches, and the Eastern Orthodox Churches all have valid sacraments, including valid celebrations of the Eucharist.
 
concretecamper said:
The operative word in “ONE”. I guess the fathers if they wanted to could have said “practically one” or used some other diminished meaning of the word One…but they didn’t. It is up to us to faithfully follow their definition of One.
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I agree. Christ established One Church. If the Catholic Church (whose first Pope just happens to be the Apostle Peter) isn’t it, then we need to find out which one is, and we need to join it.

(My problem with the claim of the Eastern Orthodox Church is that there are so many of them - churches, I mean - and also that they are not, in fact, Universal … 🤷)
 
jmcrae said:
I agree. Christ established One Church. If the Catholic Church (whose first Pope just happens to be the Apostle Peter) isn’t it, then we need to find out which one is, and we need to join it.

(My problem with the claim of the Eastern Orthodox Church is that there are so many of them - churches, I mean - and also that they are not, in fact, Universal … 🤷)
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Well, there are 23 Catholic Churches, so I’m not sure why you have a problem with multiple Eastern Orthodox Churches. Furthermore, the fact that the Catholic Church is more widespread than the Eastern Orthodox Church (the usual basis for the argument that the Catholic Church is universal, while the Eastern Orthodox is not) is not proof that the Catholic Church is universal, while the Eastern Orthodox is not. If that were the case, then there was a time in history when the Assyrian Church of the East probably had a better claim to being universal than the Catholic Church did.
 
RyanBlack said:
Well, there are 23 Catholic Churches, so I’m not sure why you have a problem with multiple Eastern Orthodox Churches. Furthermore, the fact that the Catholic Church is more widespread than the Eastern Orthodox Church (the usual basis for the argument that the Catholic Church is universal, while the Eastern Orthodox is not) is not proof that the Catholic Church is universal, while the Eastern Orthodox is not. If that were the case, then there was a time in history when the Assyrian Church of the East probably had a better claim to being universal than the Catholic Church did.
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Our 23 Churches are all in full communion with Peter’s Successor.

Theirs are not - and in many cases they can’t inter-commune. Ours can. 🙂
 
(name removed by moderator):
Quote:

Originally Posted by concretecamper

Please define “various apostolic Churches” ?

Ryan and Jon’s answers fairly neatly summarise what I meant. However a practical of an actual apostolic Church would be the Russian Orthodox Church which a large number of my family members belong to and which has validly ordained clergy and valid Eucharist.
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Fair enough.

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jmcrae said:
Our 23 Churches are all in full communion with Peter’s Successor.

Theirs are not - and in many cases they can’t inter-commune. Ours can. 🙂
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Many cases? What constitutes many? I’ve heard from very reliable sources that there was a time in the not-so-distant past when Eastern Catholics were not permitted to receive communion in Roman Catholic parishes, and vice versa. Does that mean that the Catholic Church was not universal at that time, or that the existence of different particular churches was problematic during that time? The criticism that there are multiple Eastern Orthodox Churches–which you just raised–simply makes no sense coming from Catholics, since we have a communion of 23 churches, while the Eastern Orthodox are also a communion of multiple churches.
 
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JonNC:
Quote:

Originally Posted by concretecamper

Please define “various apostolic Churches” ?

I think the Catholic Church answers this, doesn’t it? Aren’t Churches that have valid orders (in Rome’s view), and therefore valid sacraments apostolic?

ISTM that Padre Pio’s statement is not in conformity to Catholic teaching, at least as I understand it. Jharek is saying that whether or not the Catholic Church, those in communion with the Bishop of Rome, are here, the Sacrifice of the Mass continues in Orthodoxy, and even in the PNCC and other communions.

Jon
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St. Pio’s quote stands on itself. His quote was limited to the Mass…“it is easier for the earth to exist without the sun than without the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass”…the no catholic church no mass comment was my comment to the original posters question.

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RyanBlack said:
Originally Posted by Memaw View Post
Well if they are truly Catholic, I reckon they would. But they would never “cease to exist”. God Bless, Memaw
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Yeah, calling them “Catholic” could get a little confusing on this forum.
RyanBlack said:
but the Assyrian Church of the East, the Oriental Orthodox Churches, and the Eastern Orthodox Churches all have valid sacraments, including valid celebrations of the Eucharist.
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The PNCC and NCC (Polish National Catholic Church and Nordic Catholic Church) could also be added to that list. (Course, they are both very small.)
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