Protestants who believe Mary, the Mother of God sinned

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BrianH said:
And why does that common sense not apply to her parents?
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Oh Brian H.

Have you not read Scripture?

Have you not read (Luke 1: 49) Because he that is mighty, hath done great things to me; and holy is his name.

Brian H, the above Bible verse states that Virgin Mary filled with the Holy Spirt says: “Because He that is mighty hath Done GREAT THINGS TO ME”

Hmmmm! Virgin Mary, did not say that the Almighty has done “a” great thing to Her, no, She said that the Almighty has Done Great Thingsssssss(S) To Her!.

One of those Many, Many 70x7x Great Thingsss(S) Done to Virgin Mary is that She was born WithOut Stain or Blemish!

Brian H. What does “Great Thingssss,” mean to you?

Brian H. What does “To Me” mean to you?

Brain H. and one of the Many Great Thingssss(S) Done To Virgin Mary is that she was created Very Special, Very Unique, Very Holy, Full of Grace, and Born WithOut Sin in order for Her to be the Mother Of God Himself! Amen

Or Brian H. Do You believe that the Almighty (God) does not have the Power to do these Great Thingssss(S) To Virgin Mary? … I, Do Believe! For Vigin Mary was filled with the Holy Spirit when She said these things, that You Brian H. dont’ Believe.

Brain H. You don’t know yet these Thingsss(S) because it has not yet, I repeat Yet, been given to you, from above, Pray for It! Then you to will become Like Elizabeth who said Blessed is She and the Baby John who leapt in her womb only Because they Heared Virgin Mary’s Voice.

Also, I ask you Brian H. who was the One who filled Elizabeth and obviously the Baby John and the Catholic Church to be so, so welcoming to Virgin Mary? I tell you who, none other than the Holy Spirit Himself. Amen It was actually the Holy Spirit in them doing all the Praises. Amen

Brian, so be like the Holy Spirit and praise Virgin Mary and be welcoming Virgin Mary into your heart and believe that the Mighty God can do these Thingsss(S) To Mary. Amen

UfamTobie
 
Publisher said:
The arguement that Mary had to be sinless in order for Jesus to be sinless has no real sway as an arguement…for me anyway. Mary’s parents weren’t sinless were they? God according to Catholic belief preserved Mary from the stain of original sin…even if Mary was a “sinner”…could God not have preserved Jesus in her womb from the “stain of sin”?

To claim one and not the other makes no sense to me.
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The reason for Mary’s IC was not that she had to be without sin so Jeus could be born without sin. The reason is that she had to be without any sort of sin because she was chosen by God to carry His Son in her womb. No one impure can carry Jesus… in the womb or partaking in Holy Communion. We have to be in a state of sanctifying grace to recieve Jesus just as Mary has to be in that state to recieve Him.
 
Publisher said:
If I believed Mary was sinless and followed your tradition…you may have a point…but to me we’re discussing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. The doctine of the IC and PV have no deep attraction for me…when we’re talking about how and why “sin” is trasmitted inutero…to me it’s the same kind of arguement…why does it matter?

I know for Catholics, Orthodox and some Protestants questions such as this are part of their sotierology…for me…it’s an “interesting oddity” of some of the doctrines that have found their way into the blanket called “Christianity.”
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Sin is not transmitted IN UTERO nor it has anything to do with DNA, the CCC explains it better than any of us could.
CCC 404: “How did the sin of Adam become the sin of all his descendants? The whole human race is in Adam “as one body of one man”.293 By this “unity of the human race” all men are implicated in Adam’s sin, as all are implicated in Christ’s justice. Still, the transmission of original sin is a mystery that we cannot fully understand. But we do know by Revelation that Adam had received original holiness and justice not for himself alone, but for all human nature. By yielding to the tempter, Adam and Eve committed a personal sin, but this sin affected the human nature that they would then transmit in a fallen state.294 It is a sin which will be transmitted by propagation to all mankind, that is, by the transmission of a human nature deprived of original holiness and justice. And that is why original sin is called “sin” only in an analogical sense: it is a sin “contracted” and not “committed” - a state and not an act.”
 
rev_kevin said:
There were only 3 that were without sin
Adam because sin had not yet been commited
Eve for the same reason as Adam
Jesus he is the son of God. He is God
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Rev. Kevin, You contradict yourself here about Virgin Mary’s DNA and then again you mention above “Very Possible, but no solid proof that Mary never sinned” it is you who have the contradiction/speculations and no faith.

Rev Kevin, Read(Luke 1: 49) **Because he that is mighty, hath done Great Things to me **and holy is his name.

Rev, Rev. Virgin Mary filled with the Holy Spirit, said the Mighty, has Done Great Thingsss(S) To Me. …Virgin Mary did not say while filled with the Holy Spirit, that the Mighty hath done (a) great thing to me but He hath Done Great Thingssssss(S) TO ME…

Rev. and one of those Many, Many, Many Great Thingsss(S) DONE TO HER was that she was Created Without sin Just Like Eve was but Eve sinned and Virgin Mary Never Sinned.

Rev. Kevin, Remember God is not a Chauvinist, God, created Eve without sin and another Woman without sin aka Virgin Mary! Amen God did not forget about The New EVE as you did above in your first paragraph. Amen.

Ufamtobie
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AmateurPianist said:
The problem is that I can use this exact same reasoning for any assertion whether it be true or false. Let me use this with another theological proposition.

Let me ask a question of those who are so skeptical. Why is it so hard to accept the fact that these healings performed by Benny Hinn are real? To me you are putting limits on Gods infinite powers. You’re rationalizing and justifying your beliefs from a human perspective without taking into account Gods plan and will. Peace.
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Quite the contrary, It has been proven that Hinn uses deception in his “Healing Sessions” It is theatrics and its for profit. If Hinn actually had a true gift from God to heal as he pretends to, it would not be a circus act. He would be in the hospitals, and better yet in Haiti or Calcutta. As a side note, during our parishes RCIA class we were discussing the gifts of the Holy Spirit. One of them being speaking in tongues. Every “performance” that Hinn does he is always seen speaking in tongues at will. A person can not channel, control, force, or conjure up this gift at will. Only the Holy Spirit controls it and gives it as a gift by His will not mans or Hinns. I understand the question you are trying to put forth, however it is not accurate and is not comparable with the original subject. I apologize if this seem offensive, it is not my intent. Peace
 
gurneyhalleck1 said:
If neither party is willing to agree on sources then there can be no valuable, beneficial, intelligent debate or discussion, just a cat chasing its tail and an understanding of the other party’s position, nothing more… I wouldn’t just appeal to them with the only source they like, the Bible. I would encourage them to take a look at who actually put that Bible together, who decided the theology of the Holy Trinity and made it official, who fought back the heresies and sinful teachings that tried to invade orthodoxy for over a millenium before Luther and Calvin and company arrived.
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It’s possibly true about the most we can hope for is an understanding of each other. But if you are trying to defend a Catholic belief to some Protestants it might be beneficial if you could use their source which is one source we can pretty much agree upon as a source.

Fought back and handled heresies? You mean like St Joan of Arc?
 
Have we concluded whether St Anne was sinless? Or if it doesn’t matter, are we then just saying it mattered for Mary to be sinless because otherwise God would have needed to make Himself sinless too had He lived within a sinner’s womb?
 
ufamtobie said:
Rev. Kevin, You contradict yourself here about Virgin Mary’s DNA and then again you mention above “Very Possible, but no solid proof that Mary never sinned” it is you who have the contradiction/speculations and no faith.

Rev Kevin, Read(Luke 1: 49) **Because he that is mighty, hath done Great Things to me **and holy is his name.

Rev, Rev. Virgin Mary filled with the Holy Spirit, said the Mighty, has Done Great Thingsss(S) To Me. …Virgin Mary did not say while filled with the Holy Spirit, that the Mighty hath done (a) great thing to me but He hath Done Great Thingssssss(S) TO ME…

Rev. and one of those Many, Many, Many Great Thingsss(S) DONE TO HER was that she was Created Without sin Just Like Eve was but Eve sinned and Virgin Mary Never Sinned.

Rev. Kevin, Remember God is not a Chauvinist, God, created Eve without sin and another Woman without sin aka Virgin Mary! Amen God did not forget about The New EVE as you did above in your first paragraph. Amen.

Ufamtobie
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  1. Didn’t forget to add her because she was human and born with sin. Show me proof that she wasn’t born with sin.
    2.Do not call me a chauvinist because I don’t agree with you. Name calling is not a nice thing to do and I know you are a good Christian who will never do that to someone so don"t I don’t take it kindly.
  2. Now you are calling me doubting Thomas you must like the name calling probably because it makes you feel like big bad person. Well to tell you the truth it makes you look like a child because that is what children do. Here you are incorrect on 2 points. Fist I said solid proof 3 times not 2 times so lets get it right next time. Second you said that I said very possible that Mary never sinned. That is a mis-quote. This is what I said, " To say Mary never sinned WHILE CARRYING JESUS is very possible BUT NO SOLID PROOF." Don’t change my words to fit your agenda and to make me look like I contradicted myself when I did not. Then in the same sentense you question my faith because I don’t see things the way you do. I have faith so do not question it.
    Where is the contradiction with the DNA please point it out to me.
  3. God has done great things TO a lot of people.
  4. Yes the TO means more than one great thing but it don’t mean that she was without sin. If of show me evidence of that.
  5. You will have to show me evidence of that.
  6. I never said God was a chauvinist you did and thats not nice to say things that someone didn’t say it called lying and is a sin.
 
Mary would have sinned a lot. She is a human being not God. It is not a concern to us that Mary was not perfect because God is the one who is perfect. Our hope is in God. Simple.
 
Seeker100 said:
Mary would have sinned a lot. She is a human being not God. It is not a concern to us that Mary was not perfect because God is the one who is perfect. Our hope is in God. Simple.
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Knowing that sin separates us from God, and, the woman who touched Jesus’ robe was healed just by touching something that touched Jesus, would it have been possible for Mary to have sinned while pregnant and what effect would that have had on the baby? Or, what affect, for that matter?
 
adstrinity said:
Knowing that sin separates us from God, and, the woman who touched Jesus’ robe was healed just by touching something that touched Jesus, would it have been possible for Mary to have sinned while pregnant and what effect would that have had on the baby? Or, what affect, for that matter?
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It would have no effect on the baby. The baby is God!
 
Seeker100 said:
It would have no effect on the baby. The baby is God!
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So, the Baby, who must rely on His Mother for life & nutrition would not feel Her sin in any way, providing the Mother COULD sin with Him in the womb? Also keep in mind, God takes sin to heart. The sin would not hurt this Baby?
 
adstrinity said:
So, the Baby, who must rely on His Mother for life & nutrition would not feel Her sin in any way, providing the Mother COULD sin with Him in the womb? Also keep in mind, God takes sin to heart. The sin would not hurt this Baby?
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God feels everyone’s sin. All our sins grieve God very much. That is why we must work with Him to stop sinning. Being born to an unperfect human being is part of God’s work.
 
Seeker100 said:
God feels everyone’s sin. All our sins grieve God very much. That is why we must work with Him to stop sinning. Being born to an unperfect human being is part of God’s work.
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Being born to one is one thing, but, if She could sin, during Her pregnancy, how would that relate on the Baby? Or, was She not able to sin while pregnant?
 
HEY ALL OF YOU…
MARY WAS SINLESS. DURING ALL HER LIFE.
GOD DECIDED THIS!!! :whacky:
 
Seeker100 said:
It would not do anything to the baby.
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The wages of sin is death. You’re telling me the Baby wouldn’t feel, physically, His Mother’s sin? OR, could you conceed that it would be possible (as others have done, but, don’t feel is important) for Her not to have sinned while pregnant?
 
adstrinity said:
The wages of sin is death. You’re telling me the Baby wouldn’t feel, physically, His Mother’s sin? OR, could you conceed that it would be possible (as others have done, but, don’t feel is important) for Her not to have sinned while pregnant?
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Baby would not feel a thing. Mary’s sin has nothing to do with Jesus as He is sinless.
 
rev_kevin said:
How do you know and what evidence do you have of this?
Please don’t yell.
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I don’t need any evidence except what the Archangel Gabriel said to Mary… FULL OF GRACE… and then the fact that… NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR GOD, and also the fact that God cannot dwell in anyone impure so his Mother had to be completely pure… that is… IMMACULATE.
Blessings
 
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