Yes, that was beautifully said. The Our Father is my prayer also. The prayer I was taught as a child, the prayer that I say everyday, when I’m in need, when I’m afraid, to give thanks, ect. That was the prayer I prayed in my darkest hour when I was desparate to be saved from the mess I had made of my life. And, oh boy did He answer! The rosary, is a devotional thing for me, helps me to meditate on the life, death, and resurrection of Our Lord. Definitely does not detract from Him but brings us closer. I never knew there was such a fuss made about the rosary. No one is saying you must pray to Mary to be saved. It may not be for everyone. What could be wrong about asking Mary to pray for us. It’s not either the Our Father or the rosary, it’s both/and. I’m just confounded at the amount of distain for the idea of honoring our Mother. As if she was just an insignificant detail in God’s plan for our salvation. I can only assume that one who has distain for honoring her does not truly view her as a mother that you can also go to in times of trouble. Not that you HAVE to, but CAN if you want without worrying you’re committing some grave sin.Thank you for your lovely posts and your testimony.
God bless you.
Yes, God loves sinners, but God hates sin. Each person was created to be sinless. God wants to brings us back to this sinless state. If we persist in sin, God’s Love will not be able to reach us.
Yes it was David’s desire to magnify the Lord, but was his soul able to magnify the Lord?
You have said it clearly as many of such posts regarding this subject. However our detractors continue to mention that why should they pray to somebody else since Jesus is the only mediator between God and man. This is despite the fact that we too pray to Jesus. Praying to Mary as an intercessor is just another option and there are many options in prayers. But sometimes this explanation would fall on deaf ears.
Luke 1:28 “Chaire, Kecharitomene”Patavium…as I mentioned, Mary was ‘full of grace’ or ‘favored’ because out of all the women in Israel, God could have chosen, He picked Mary to fulfill Isaiah’s prophecy & bring our Lord miraculously into the world, proving that it wasn’t a normal human birth, but a Divine one!
However, Stephen was ‘full of grace,’ because the Holy Spirit gave him the power to ‘perform great wonders & signs to the people,’ & wisdom to some of the men who challenged him (Acts 6:8-15).
How they are the same, is that this ‘grace’ (‘charis’) was a ‘free gift’ given to them by God. How they are different, is the ‘form’ that God graced them. God graced Mary who gave birth to our Savior, while God graced Stephen by giving him power & wisdom. How they are also the same is that they were both sinners, which ended with their deaths, & when they were both glorified in Heaven.
Who are these other monks, David?
…But Mary was full of grace (Luke 1:28) and (Luke 1:43 / 2 Sam. 6:9) - How can the Mother / Ark of the Lord come to me? It is a holy privilege. Our Mother wants to come to us and lead us to Jesus.
Understand .The ark was made with human hands and could be touched by fallen human hands if it were the priest .Yes ,one could die if improperly touched. The way I see it is Jesus had flesh ,which was the ark for His Spirit .The only thing that intermingled with Mary was flesh , not Spirit .Mary had her spirit and Jesus had His. The Spirit was in Christ the man/child.unborn. So the analogy doesn’t quite fit…
Hi David, the priest who is to preside though a fallen human must be cleansed and purified, so he is ‘clean’ at that moment. They were so serious about this even at the expense of death. Refer the Good Samaritan story. Mary really had to be ‘cleansed’ when she bore Jesus in her womb. I don’t have to tell you the ritual that the priest would do so that he would be cleansed even in the flesh. So yes, one can use the ark analogy because that was the closest of God’s presence among men.
You are really scratching the bottom of the barrel when you start talking about humans and sentimentality. The reality is God lowered himself to human level, and I guess that includes all the eccentricities that humans have, so that he can be like human in all ways except sin. God expressed himself in human term, in things we can understand and identify with.
Of course there is a cleansing .There has always been a way for “cleansing” since day 1 after the fall . I don’t mind calling Mary “immaculate” -cleansed, for apparently so was Enoch and Abraham and perfect Job etc .As A catholic pointed out , so are we, for we are cleansed,made new and indwelt by God. What I mind is saying the way of cleansing for those above was ditched for something better for Mary. As if Judaism, the old testament counterpart for what you say is the One,Holy, Apostolic Catholic Church, that brought all light to the world, and kept up and carried out the steps necessary to fulfill the original garden Promise-no longer could cleanse, but needed a “special dispensation” of grace. It is like you are rewriting history, forgetting we are of Jewish descent. . Of course Mary was cleansed, had a regenerated, faithful, knowledgeable, believing spirit. No one is saying she was spiritually reprobate, an unbeliever etc .Perhaps that is why it did not matter to declare this special grace for milennia ,for she was always regarded properly and highly.
You are close. So Mary was cleansed. I put a parenthesis on the word cleansed. She has to be cleansed to be worthy to be the Ark where God incarnate who is without sin and who hates sin to reside and to grow into flesh.
It is not consistent with ANY biblical cleansing, old or new testament. BUT, we are close aren’t we ? Thank-you
Also, where does in the bible EXPLICITLY says Mary was born with sin? point to me that in the bible. Please don’t try to say your argument is biblical and ours is not. It is an argument based on citations from the bible, unless you can point to a verse that says Mary Mother of Jesus was born with sin, or has sinned.Who are these other monks, David?
Do you believe an argument without knowing its history?
She needs to be perfect from sin because that is the exception, in fact a condition, for God made man. The rest is true about being humble, low, poor, etc,. I guess that’s where you differ from Catholicism. We believe that God does not compromise with sin and he can never originate from anything sinful because that is not him and not part of him. Sin is what he wants to conquer; it would be a great travesty for him to have his human origin from it. How could he ransoms us from sin if he himself comes from it?
Yes, and for this you must understand What is GRACE?. My opinion is becoming with this thread that if you believe you are saved once, and that’s it, Grace is an unknown concept to you. David believes in imputed righteousness, once saved, always saved. We believe in saved by the Grace of God. Thus, if Virgin Mary was Full of Grace, and the virgin birth was predicted by Isaiah many years ago, then isn’t Mary born sinlessness? That is just one argument in favor. Also consider the Eve argument from Genesis few posts ago, and others brought forth by many in this thread.
Ah, I am sure you must have seen all the Biblical support for the Marian doctrine here. The only thing is you do not agree with them and I am alright with that. By the way, Catholicism is not Sola Scriptura, so its sources of truth is not just the Bible, something which you disagree too, and I am alright with it. Thank you.
