Prove it!

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dizzy_dave

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What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?
 
Wow!! A tall order.
I think you would first have to ask the person to give their primary reason for rejecting the catholic church before you could answer that one.
This could differ from baptist to baptist
 
If there was a quick and easy way, there would not be large numbers of intelligent and pious Christians on both sides. Why do you want a quick and easy proof? Why are you insulting those who have agonized over the issue by assuming that there is a shortcut?

Witness to your faith. Explain it as best you know how. If you think you understand the history and philosophy and theology well enough, have a shot at proving it (though I think that’s a tall order for any religious point of view). But don’t look for quick and easy answers. Nor, of course, should your Baptist friends (though they probably do).

In Christ,

Edwin
 
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Contarini:
If there was a quick and easy way, there would not be large numbers of intelligent and pious Christians on both sides. Why do you want a quick and easy proof? Why are you insulting those who have agonized over the issue by assuming that there is a shortcut?

Witness to your faith. Explain it as best you know how. If you think you understand the history and philosophy and theology well enough, have a shot at proving it (though I think that’s a tall order for any religious point of view). But don’t look for quick and easy answers. Nor, of course, should your Baptist friends (though they probably do).

In Christ,

Edwin
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I agree with Edwin, there is no such quick and easy way, but History and the Church Fathers will tell a very telling tale.
 
Well, I’m just going to have to echo what others have said—ther is no quick and easy way. Obviously, Matthew 16:18 and 16:19 are significant, but it’s not as if the Baptists you are speaking to are going to suddenly say, “Oh! Why of course! How could I have been so blind?” when you point those verses out to them. I would suggest reading the tract on “Peter and the Papacy” at Catholic.com, which goes over this in more detail. But you are still going to have a hard time getting through the walls of anti-Catholicism that is often found in Baptist denominations. You can study the Church Fathers, but they might not accept the Fathers as a source—which is mighty convenient, as the Fathers show an early Church that is Catholic.

It might be that praying for them, and living a life that models Christian joy and virtue, may be most successful in the end, though you must know your own faith in order to defend it.
 
So true. Even when faced with overwhelming evidence, they will not believe.

Your life as a witness would prove to be more convincing.
 
I was a Baptist and I never dreamed I’d ever become a Catholic…

There were many reasons, pro and con that had an impact on my decision. Basically, it all boiled down to example.
The Catholics who really lived their faith were the ones who were the greatest witnesses, not the ALL knowing ones… :twocents:
 
something i’ve discovered in my journey, and i’m sure i’m not the first, is that the burden of proof actually sits with protestants. they are the ones (and i have been one of them) denying 1500 years of history. i would say, don’t allow them to put you on the defense. for every question you answer and defend about the catholic church, they should have to defend a position.
 
There is an old joke that says, you can tell a Baptist anything you want, but unless you were submerged, he won’t hear you.

What specific argument is he/she making?
 
Davis, you forgot this one.

Boop Boop Bee-Doo - Betty Boop.
 
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dizzy_dave:
What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?
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With caution. Baptists know the Bible a lot better than Catholics do and they’ve interpreted it in their own way. I dated a Baptist for a while and he could quote the Bible like no other person I’ve ever met. So…unless you really know what you are doing,** be very careful. You might even want to have a priest present. Baptists believe that “once saved, always saved” and “sola scriptura”.**

Blessings,
Shannin
 
Who was the first person in the Baptist church after Jesus Christ? (Assuming here he’s claiming that the Baptists are the only true church)

When did that happen?

When was his church founded?
 
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bengal_fan:
something i’ve discovered in my journey, and i’m sure i’m not the first, is that the burden of proof actually sits with protestants. they are the ones (and i have been one of them) denying 1500 years of history. i would say, don’t allow them to put you on the defense. for every question you answer and defend about the catholic church, they should have to defend a position.
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That is a tremendous point, BF. The position that the Catholic Church is NOT the original church is the novel one. It’s up to that person to prove why it’s NOT the true church.

Unfortunately though, it’s not as simple as that and often protestants are not really denying history so much as they are defending the flawed history that they’ve been taught. I believe it’s the Baptists who have their own alternate history (referred to as the “trail of blood” or something like that) which portrays their church as the true church. Once you start examining primary sources though that theory pretty much crumbles.

Ultimately, there is no quick and easy way to convince a Baptist that the Catholic Church is the true Church. If there were, then there would be no Baptists. 🙂 Until they resolve to examine things objectively all we can really do is answer questions…we can’t make anyone believe anything.
 
Notice the tack that the devil took in trying to tempt Jesus. Lives fall but few ascend on the strength of quickie head games, including those played with a Bible. If you are going to convince anyone who has a problem with Catholicism, the battle in the mind needs to be deep and thorough.

In the end, I agree with the earlier post, though: you don’t win minds unless you win hearts, so example–that is, a life lived in honest, determined, and humble pursuit of sanctity–is the best way. Not everyone is cut out to be a theologian, but everyone is called to become a saint.
 
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dizzy_dave:
What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?
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Fastest. A miracle. For example, St. Paul on the road to Damascus. I hope someday in heaven I might be privileged to meet those saints who fasted and prayed while Saul was persecuting the Church. And St. Stephen prayed while Saul was looking on watching him being stoned to death. See Acts 7:56-8:2. It cost the blood of saints to pay for Saul’s transfusion.

Quickest, easiest. Really, dizzy_dave you ask too much sometimes. Whatever you want costs something. And it is true that Jesus paid the price. But sometimes a transfusion of Faith, Hope and Love is also needed.

Go to catholic.org/
Look at Featured Columnist / Archbishop Sheen Today! - Barbara Kralis
Read Bishop Sheen’s “Lourdes”.

Dr. Leseur was an atheist. His wife (a good Catholic girl) prayed to God: “In l905, I asked almighty God to send me sufficient sufferings to purchase your soul. On the day that I die, the price will have been paid. Greater love than this no woman has than she who lay down her life for her husband.”

When she was dying in 1914, Elisabeth said to her atheist husband, “Felix, when I am dead, you will become a Catholic and a Dominican priest.”

Elisabeth Leseur’s canonization is being investigated at this time. Father Leseur, the ex-atheist, became a Dominican Priest and died in 1950.

Even as a non-Catholic I knew that real worth-while things take time and effort.

Examples:
  • You can’t just go to Wal-Mart or somewhere else and get a good wife.
  • Even if you have the money, you cannot find the ideal location and build your dream home in only a day.
Nor can you expect to suddenly be ready to become a member of the Catholic Church. It took me many years to get to where I am today (I just turned in my RCIA / RCIC application today).

I agree with Annunciata, I am presently a Baptist going into RCIA / RCIC. The evidence of good lives – Roman Catholic witnesses who lived good lives are the clincher. Bible-based arguments didn’t do it for me.

:blessyou:
 
Tell them to read the early Church fathers and then ask them where the Bible came from?
 
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dizzy_dave:
What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?
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There is no quick and easy way or all Baptists would be Catholic. 🙂 Many Baptists are now saying that the Baptist church is the NT church, so simply praying might be a good place to start.
 
While I agree with the other posts, there seem to be some general things to be done, especially before moving on to the Church Fathers.
  1. Show Jesus founded a church. Not some loose collection of believers who would just hang out whenever and wherever. (A body is an organized entity and not a loose collection.)
  2. Show that this chruch was visible and organized even in Scripture. The Body of Christ is visible and organized and if the Chruch is the Body of Christ it will not just be an invisible collection of “believers.”
  3. Show that this church, being the Body of Christ, will not cease to exist or become corrupt and go into hiding until Luther resurrects it but will exist throughout time (“Gates of hell…”).
Then,
  1. Show that Church is the Catholic Church.
I have often found Protestants, especially Baptists, who deny both and if they deny them, I don’t know what will work until you can establish 1, 2, and 3.

Just a thought.
 
I have one.

Ask a baptist if they know who the first Christian was, and the first apostle. I believe she accepted Jesus as her saviour and God before He was conceived. That’s right, she is also the mother of God, something a lot of protestants for some reason have a hard time with.
She not only cared and nurtured our Lord up until His minestry, but she just so happened to live with the living God in the form of us men in her house, mmmm, let me think, wonder what He revealed to her, as a son to His mother, let’s think some more. What kind of bond you thing our Lord developed with his mother. Geez whiz!
I brought that up because our heavenly mother Mary for some reason would hit a sour note when talking to baptist or protestant friends of mine. I am off on a tangent here. But get my point I hope.

Blessed be the name of Jesus forever
 
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