Puppet Master vs Free Will?

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OurGodIsWithUs

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Sometimes it feels as though I’m a puppet, that I don’t have a right to ambitions and can’t hope for good things. All I’m supposed to do is leave it to the will of God. In this case, I might as well be lazy and not work. But then my common sense tells me that I’m running my life into a ditch.

What’s going on?!

Look, I’m not asking for permission to offend God, or profane his name. But I feel that God is going to grasp me by the neck, and shove me down a mediocre path that I don’t like, then say “This is my will.” Later, on my death bed, he’ll say “Good job! You withstood the torture inflicted on you in this life. Now join me in Paradise.”

What kind of life is that? How is our religion any different from Islam? In Islam, followers are slaves of Allah. I’m a slave of Christ. I don’t have free-will.

EDIT: Let me make my question a bit more clear, “What is God’s will for us all?”

Moreover, if I, out of my own will, decide to live a holy life, and do things to advance his kingdom by spreading goodness, wouldn’t that mean more to God, than forcing me down a path?

If a few people came to me of their own accord, and said “We love you.” It would touch my heart. On the other hand, capturing people, and forcing them to say “We love you!” means nothing. It’s as cheap as the dirt on the ground.

😦

EDIT: I’m good. 😄
 
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OurGodIsWithUs said:
I’m a slave of Christ. I don’t have free-will.
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Wrong. You decide what to do with your life. You do have free will.

“Moreover, if I, out of my own will, decide to live a holy life, and do things to advance his kingdom by spreading goodness, wouldn’t that mean more to God, than forcing me down a path?”

God never forces us. We choose to follow his will or ours.
 
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OurGodIsWithUs said:
I’m a slave of Christ. I don’t have free-will.
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I’m always so confused why when people talk about Islam in English, they use the Arabic word for God , trust me Christians in the Middle East use it too. Now, we are not slaves of God, we are sons of God , Children of the Father. My father, God Rest his soul, could tell me what to do, and if I disobeyed him he could punish me, but the fact that I was punished implies that there was free will. Why would it be different with God? I don’t understand this Free Will denial that is so prevalent these days. Man must have free will, because if man does not have free will he doesn’t have any choice in whether or not he can serve God, and if he does not have a choice in that, well how is he a child of God? A child can disobey their father. There is more I can go into, but voice-to-text is a pain. I’m going to go ahead and say, that denying Free Will is a blasphemy. I stick by that statement.
 
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That makes me feel guilty. I don’t want to abandon Him! He’s my Father. :cry:

I just want my will to please him. I want to make him happy, and I want him to help me on my path.
 
Non-Christian pov:

You are not entirely at the mercy of external (or even internal causes). You have free will, but, in my view, it is very minute. It is something that comes with being a spiritual being. You are not like a nail, who has to be driven into a plank of wood with a hammer. You have the capacity for control. Not complete control, because there are obviously many things which condition you and move you. Many, many factors. But, in the midst of that, you have a degree of freedom which you are to exercise.
As a matter of fact, free will is less about a one-time decision and more like a cultivation of mind. The more positive influences you internalize, the more virtuous you become, the freer you become. And you don’t become freer by making more choices but by making better choices.

IF you still don’t believe in free will, maybe the following illustration will convince you.

Let’s say you have to give a big speech in front of your class or colleagues or something. It’s an important speech and you want to come across as professional and just not make a fool of yourself. Now let’s say that in the middle of your speech a strange desire overcomes you. You suddenly feel the urge to say a dirty, ludicrous sort of word. You know that if you say this word, you’ll never want to show your face again. You have two separate emotions occurring within you: honor and a guilty pleasure. I will bet that, if you are a sane individual, who is determined not to be a fool or a clown, you will 10 times out of 10 assert your right to control your tongue, and resist the urge to say the dirty word. It may be difficult, and you might cave, but you will assert your free will in that instance and not resign yourself to… “oh, it’s just material causation going on, I have nothing to do with it” - the practical fact of the matter belies it, for you are definitely asserting your control and in fact would hate to lose your control. You have a degree of control because you have some free will. That is just a fact, whether you accept it or deny it.
 
Hmm, I like this. Certainly so. External factors shape our lives, so I can come to terms with the fact that I am not omnipotent. Everyone seems to focus on whether I have free will or not, whereas I seek to understand what God’s will really is.

Thank you! 🙂
 
Well, I have real life experience about this. I wrote a post in Sacred Scripture about it. I am disabled, stopped working at thirty. I would like to work one day again. I’m celibate, not married, gave up all bad things at twenty-seven. So, am I slave to Christ?

Well, no. I worked in Finance then Accounting and I can tell you that while my life now is mediocre, I’m grateful God intervened in my life. Once again, I was on the fast track. I went to an elite school, two, and all I met on the fast track were wicked self-interested people. Again, in those corporate environments it’s more than, “you are either with us or against us,” it is, “do as we say, believe what we believe in, live the way we live,” and, and, and, “you better party like us.” So, I would say these people are slaves to ambitions, money, consumerism, hedonism, hierarchies…etc…

Again, these people aren’t liberal or conservative; they are self-interested and whatever suits them best at the moment. It’s short-term gain without thought to long-term consequences to your fellow man, and you better not speak up or suggest it should be any other way. I see a lot of this mentality in all facets of Media, from Music to Cable News to Talk Radio. I would not want that life or anything that a non-mediocre life would offer.

Again, my life is not over. In a few years I may decide to work as a paralegal for a non-profit. Right now I’m coping with my illness. With Christ comes freedom and the perspective to know there are better ways to live. Although I don’t believe in reincarnation, if God said, "Retentant you have to live just one more life. Either choose a wealthy life with all the success before you, or choose a working class life potentially working as a plumber or electrician. I would choose the latter not the former. Having glimpsed into the former, I neither condemn it nor idealize it; I don’t look down on them nor do I look up to them. I just know the life of the mediocre is the best life there is.

Again, coping with life is a lesson in patience. Creative outlets with no expectation of money in return while working is the best way to live. My creative outlet is piano, poetry, and writing in general. I never expect to make a dime on any of it; once money gets involved so does the Devil and his minions. I just started learning Piano and I’m having a blast. Writing Poetry and writing in general along with reading are things I’ve done all my life. I know to write a book that gets published or a work of poetry that get’s published it would have to be blasphemous like Harry Potter and Fifty Shades of Grey. Again, once money gets involved so comes trouble.

So, pray the Rosary. Read Paul’s Thessalonians and Colossians, then read Romans. Look inward and be grateful to be part of the Christian World where life is simple and you are in communion with your fellow man.

Again, we are free. What we learn as Christians is how to adjust to freedom and how to make good use of it.
 
Yeah… I’m truly sorry about your illness. May God heal you. 🙂

Glad to know you’re leaning piano! I’ve been playing for 12 years. A few pieces to aspire to, and fuel your interest: Opus 12 Revolutionary, Opus 53 both by F. Chopin. Let me know if you want to connect! 🙂 They are hard. But not for long. With persistent practice, you can play anything!

I agree about the money - it makes friends turn into foes. While I don’t intend to gossip, a few persons in our extended family look down on us for not being owning a BMW etc. We own one car, and it’s 12 years old. But that’s all we need. My mom asked them why, and they said “People will look down on you if you don’t own at least one more car.” Well, I’m not going to blow money for the sake of the world either.

Many rich people I’ve met don’t like “commoners.” One gentleman treated me with kindness, and he’s a franchise owner, who owns 9 locations of Jersey Mike’s Subs.

I promise myself that I won’t be like them when I get older. Yes, there will be times when I will be tested. I will figure it out then.

Are parties evil? Or is it the drinking that goes along?

I want to say that your answer made the most sense to me, without attacking me, you taught me. Thank you, God bless you for that. May he keep you safe from Coronavirus and bless you and your family.
 
OurGodIsWithUs said:
Sometimes it feels as though I’m a puppet

Let me make my question a bit more clear, “What is God’s will for us all?”

Moreover, if I, out of my own will, decide to live a holy life, and do things to advance his kingdom by spreading goodness, wouldn’t that mean more to God, than forcing me down a path?
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‘Feeling’ that you’re a puppet could be what’s behind any attempt to mentally seek a reason - which in turn could lead one to think that they’ve no free will.

And… How come you’ve not already ‘decided to lead a Holy Life’?

Are you a Christian?

God’s Will is for all to Obey His Command to Love One Another

_
 
Ah, I should have read your post more carefully.

Yes, I believe in God’s will too and think we should conform our wills to the supreme will, but I think it is the Supreme Will’s will that we will our happiness as well. I mean, there are a lot of things to consider: what your station is in life, your prospects, how best you might contribute to society (it could be your calling is as a creative artist, for instance - or maybe just a humble street-sweeper - everyone’s calling is unique.)

I know this one Protestant video that might help you (I don’t agree 100% but it’s interesting):

 
The ‘magic’ of Christianity is that when we do ordinary things of life, like washing the dishes, mundane tasks that need to be done every day, we can unite our actions to the infinite merit of Christ on the cross, and say ‘Jesus, out of love for you, I unite this task with you for the salvation of souls and for my own sins’. Then the ordinary takes on the supernatural, and becomes a force for good in this world. That is incredibly good news.
 
I am, baptized Catholic. As a college student, there is little I can do to lead a holy life besides, pray, go to mass, and avoid sin and the near occasions of it.
 
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Being a “slave of Christ” is a conscious exercise of free will. Rather than imprisoning, it frees you. If you still feel trapped, it is something else hindering your faith life.
 
OurGodIsWithUs said:
I am, baptized Catholic. As a college student, there is little I can do to lead a holy life besides, pray, go to mass, and avoid sin and the near occasions of it.
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You might try something that I did this lenten season. I wrote a letter to God.
Let me explain. I got my laptop, opened a new doc, wrote “Letter to God” at the top of the page, and proceeded to wirte notes. One every few days or so. Some really short, and some a coule of pages long. It became a conversation of sorts.
I asked questions, raised concerns, complained, prayed, wrote about sins, problems, thanked Him, etc. I wrote as if He was actually going to read it.
 
What a coincidence! I do from time to time! When I feel lonely or sad I write to Jesus.
 
Hey Our, how are you. I can’t tell you how much I’ve struggled with this concept. It think it is such a legitimate and pertinent question. I was moving toward a higher paying career for a while. There are many who go into it for good reasons, but honestly, the hypocrisy started to get to me. I had such a difficult time interacting with many of my colleagues after a while. There was just always another excuse, another accommodation to justify more sin, to treat others poorly. I often felt Lazarus was stopping by frequently and those of us who would take the time to even give him a little help were “silly little snowflakes”.

I’m not sure if I made the right decision to back away from it, but my life has been more charitable I think, and simpler, since. I feel like I got some answers to prayer. One time I had a break and had a spiritual direction book. Picked it up and it said “my name…put down the … books”. Very reluctantly I did. My mental health improved quite a bit after that. Did I read into it…maybe. But I made the best choice I knew how.

Imho prayer is vital. Without it we are on an ocean with no compass. Sometimes I, like you wonder how much control God wants vs how much leeway we have. But I’ve noticed that when we drill into the Ten Commandments…don’t cover your neighbors wife… don’t cover your neighbors goods… thou shaltt not have any strange Gods before Me… well that pretty much sums it up doesn’t it lol.

Sorry I’m rambling a bit, but if you can find the answer let me know pls. There is a book by Fr. Timothy Gallagher about discernment. You might find that helpful. Best regards.
 
OurGodIsWithUs said:
EDIT: Let me make my question a bit more clear, “What is God’s will for us all?”
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That we use the gift of free will He gave us in order to choose Him. Like you said, forcing us to tell Him “I love you” means nothing… giving us the freedom to do so and then hearing it back, means everything in the world…
 
How does this work? I’ve heard it many times, but never gave it much thought…
 
It is the key to being a saint and a powerhouse for God.

The scripture of the little boy who shares his few bread and fish and Christ feeds the 5 thousand is our story. Give your every day tasks to Christ and ask him to change hearts. A tremendously powerful prayer. His grace sanctifies the ordinary. There is a lay movement that teaches the ordinary Catholic to bring the power of God into their daily tasks… Opus Dei - Finding God in daily life

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If you have trouble thinking of it during the day, be sure to do a morning offering of your day before you get out of bed.

The prayer within the rosary is a good one…
The Fatima Prayer: “O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell, and lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of Your Mercy”.
(Our Lady at Fatima, 13th July 1917)
 
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