Purgatory for Communion in the Hand?

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You know BC, if I was in your rite, i would be right there with you and thereby avoid the rack for which I am destined.

I would have to caution you, however,against that use of “will never have,” unless you have some crystal ball or personal revelation that can see from now until eternity.
 
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pnewton:
You know BC, if I was in your rite, i would be right there with you and thereby avoid the rack for which I am destined.

I would have to caution you, however,against that use of “will never have,” unless you have some crystal ball or personal revelation that can see from now until eternity.
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Nothing is holding you back from attending a Byzantine Liturgy. No one is holding a gun to your head forceing you to take communion in the hand.

As for the crystal ball crack. There will never be communion in the hand in the Byzantine Rite becasue we recieve the Eucharist by intinction. Always have an always will. The only way to change this would be to abandon tradition and change the rite, which will not happen.

That being said I would caution against taking the word of a “visionary” over the Teaching of the Church for a couple of reasons.
  1. No message from a private revelation is binding upon the Church. This has always been and will always be the Teaching of the Church, read your Catechism.
  2. No true message can go against Church Teachings.
  3. This is really a matter of discipline. Deacons have always given communion, it is their job to take it to the sick.
  4. In the early Church communion in the hand was the norm.
I have sent an email to the Chancery Office of the Archdiocese of Sydney to see what the Archbishop as to say about this “seer”.
 
At the bottom of this is more of that scary “I’m righter than my Priest, my Bishop, and/or my Holy Father: I know what errors the Church Indefectable is being allowed to use to expose my mortal soul to danger as a test.”

So, the only way to be a “real” Catholic is to NOT do what Church says to do, but DO what the Church used to say to do?

And who decides? And when did we become Protestants? Might be good to re-read St. Paul…

May Our Mother Protect Us All!

Saba
 
Well, I for one, KNOW I am NOT going to Purgatory.

Nope. I’ll be going to hell because not only have I received communion in the hand for years (although for the last few months I have curiously stopped doing it) BUT I am a WOMAN who is an extraordinary minister of Holy Communion. And I do it regardless of what time of the month it is.
 
“Take this all of you and eat…”

Jesus told his disciples, who were just as stupid and sinful as the rest of us at that time, to* take* his eucharist. I have a feeling if he was so concerned with us only taking communion by the tounge, then he would have made it a point then. But he didn’t, because it isn’t that big of a deal.

**
God is going to punish the world severely soon and it will be worse than Sodom and Gomorrah. We all fear for you. The time is approaching fast. There is nothing left but prayer and conversion for you people on Earth’.
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Oh man, this made me laugh. So God is going to punish the world for taking communion by the hand. Wow. Now, Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed for grave sexual sin. Now we are going to be destroyed for a simple change in liturgical practice? Ha! This woman is not credible.

When we take personal thoughts and we knowingly put them before God’s Church, we have become protestants. (that’s the defination of protestantism, after all)**
 
Well Redkim I guess I’ll be seeing you in hell too as I also have received communion in the hand. I am also a EMHC and the best one I ever heard was when a woman objected to me distributing the Precious Blood while I was pregnant. The pastor asked her if she minded receiving from a certain man (my husband) . She said no to which he promptly replied I think he had a part to play in her being pregnant.
:whistle:
 
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jeffreedy789:
how does touching the host with our unconsecrated, sinful hands desecrate it more than touching it with our unconsecrated, sinful tongues?
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That’s a very good question, Jeff. When it comes to sinful and unconsecrated, our hands are no more so than our tongues, lips, or ears. In fact, both physiologically and spiritually, our tongues and lips are often the most unholy parts we posess!

What is unclean, unholy, in need of redemption, is our soul. IF we believe the doctrine of the Real Presence, we believe that the elements of the Eucharist are the actual incorruptible inviolable immortal Body (and Blood) of our Lord Jesus. THAT being the case, just how presumptuous is it of us to think that there is ANYTHING our pitifully weak hands can do to really harm that Body by simply holding them open to receive that True Body??? How much power and strength dare we ascribe to ourselves??

WE will not in any way harm that Sacred Body/Blood. That can never happen again. We CAN harm our own souls with disrespect, sacrilege, and the like. But THAT harm will come from within. As scripture tells us about the food we eat, it is not what we put into our bodies that will be evil, but that which is inside us. Similarly, our hands can be touched by the Sacred Body, as could our lips and mouth, and we can be nourished by it or condemned. But that nourishment or condemnation will not be decided by what part of our bodies that Holy Body touches. Our nourishment or condemnation will be rooted in what is in our soul when we are touched by that Sacred Body and Blood - wherever we are touched by it.

Respect and reverence are internal qualities of our soul - not limited to a physical part of our body.

Now whether WE as individuals feel WE are being respectful or reverent enough by receiving our Lord on our hands or on our tongue, is a valid question we must decide for ourselves. If our soul’s reverence and respect is enhanced by receiving on the tongue, then it is the way for us to receive. And the converse is just as true. The Magisterium of the Church teaches it. You want to argue it? For yourself, you may decide. You have no authority to decide for others. (I mean the generic “you”, Jeff - not you personally :-))
 
Greetings,

Sinful thoughts, oh such sinful thoughts.

I was thinking we could form a group of visionaries. We have a lot of folks around who are not happy with certain teachings of the Church. We could maybe provide a vision for them?

Nah? Oh Rats!
Oh man, I receive Communion on the hand, am a female Minister of the Eucharist, call the ministry by the wrong name, and now thinking of profitting as a visionary. That is not even to mention I am Charismatic, love holding hands, raising hands, clapping hands. Oh My Gosh!

I promise though, I won’t go see Ellen deGeneres play God. Does that help at all?

Yikes!!!
 
I guess maids and butlers always receive on the tongue, because it’s awfully dusty down there.
 
Paul W. I was thinking the same thing, but that’s probably all the ashes from our burning…
 
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ByzCath:
As for the crystal ball crack.
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I truly am sorry for that. I do not know where my head was. I think that picture (the rack) put me in too much of a frivilous and medival frame of mind.

When I ever get a chance, I would like to experience different liturgies, including yours.

The original point I so ineloquently tried to make is that disciplinary matters are subject to change. If you were to take elements of the Latin Rite Mass as it exists today, I do not think anyone two hundred or five hundred years ago could have predicted the changes. The Church may still be here celebrating Mass 500 years from now. Who knows what may happen. Only that which has been dogmatically defined can be counted on.
 
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pnewton:
I truly am sorry for that. I do not know where my head was. I think that picture (the rack) put me in too much of a frivilous and medival frame of mind.
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Apology accepted and I am sorry if I was to short with you in my reply.
When I ever get a chance, I would like to experience different liturgies, including yours.

The original point I so ineloquently tried to make is that disciplinary matters are subject to change. If you were to take elements of the Latin Rite Mass as it exists today, I do not think anyone two hundred or five hundred years ago could have predicted the changes. The Church may still be here celebrating Mass 500 years from now. Who knows what may happen. Only that which has been dogmatically defined can be counted on.
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But our tradition is to recieve the Eucharist by intinction, so it could never be given in the hand. In the Byzantine (Rutheniant) Church the Eucharist is levaned bread that is placed in the chalice and distrubited to the faithful via a golden spoon.

Very hard to do it by hand.
 
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TheGrowingGrape:
Also, the Baltimore Catechism FORBADE this practice. It was once a GRAVE sin for a layperson to touch the host with his fingers. I’ll look it up for you and post that soon.
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Spare yourself the search, I am quite familiar with the Baltimore Catechism.
 
Also, the Baltimore Catechism FORBADE this practice. It was once a GRAVE sin for a layperson to touch the host with his fingers. I’ll look it up for you and post that soon
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*The Catechism is a book and a book has no power to forbid or grant anything. *
*Where there Catechisms prior to the Baltimore Catechism? *
*What did they say? *
ST. CYRIL OF JERUSALEM.
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(Cateches. Mystagog. v.(1)) When thou goest to receive communion go not with thy wrists extended, nor with thy fingers separated, but placing thy left hand as a throne for thy right, which is to receive so great a King, and in the hollow of the palm receive the body of Christ
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, saying, Amen. ["][4]]("The Red Herring of Communion in the Hand[4)
It was not a practice from the beginning to receive on the tongue and this came later for several reasons.
  • *Catholic Encyclopedia *and its article on communion patens:
The word paten comes from a Latin form patina or patena, evidently imitated from the Greek patane. It seems from the beginning to have been used to denote a flat open vessel of the nature of a plate or dish. Such vessels in the first centuries were used in the service of the altar, and probably served to collect the offerings of bread made by the faithful and also to distribute the consecrated fragments which, after the loaf had been broken by the celebrant, were brought down to the communicants, WHO IN THEIR OWN HANDS RECEIVED EACH A PORTION FROM THE PATINA​

​
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… When towards the ninth century the zeal of the faithful regarding the frequent reception of Holy Communion very much declined, the system of consecrating the bread offered by the faithful and of distributing Communion from the patinæ seems gradually to have changed, and the use of the large and proportionately deep patinæ ministeriales fell into abeyance. It was probably about the same time that the custom grew up for the priest himself to use a paten at the altar to contain the sacred Host, and obviate the danger of scattered particles after the Fraction. This paten, however, was of much smaller size and resembled those with which we are now familiar. ["][6]]("The Red Herring of Communion in the Hand[6)
Doctrine evolves and customs change in keeping with what the authority of the Church determines, not what we always prefer.

​
*
 
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deogratias:
*Doctrine evolves and customs change in keeping with what the authority of the Church determines, not what we always prefer. *

Wrong, Read the Syllabus of Errors by Venerable Pius IX.

Point 5.
Divine Revelation is imperfect, and therefore subject to a continual and indefinite progress, corresponding with the advancement of human reason.

Doctrine is Divine Revelation. What God says is always true, because He is Infinite Truth.

Also from Lamentabili Sane by Saint Pius X:
POINT 59.
Christ did not teach a determined body of doctrine applicable to all times and all men, but rather inaugurated a religious movement adapted or to be adpated to different times and places.

Point 64.
Scientific progress demands that the concepts of Christian doctrine concerning God,creation,revelation,the Person of the Incarnate Word, and Redemption be re-adjusted.

Venerable Pope Pius IX, pray for us
Pope Saint Pius X, pray for us
Maria, Mother of GOd, destroyer of heresies by your intercession may the heresies be destroyed

ICXC NIKA
 
Well I got back an answer from the Chancery Office of the Archdiocese of Sydney.

Here is what they said…
Dear David,
thanks for your enquiry. We are not aware of this seer or her particular claims; but all claims from those who allege private revelations should be treated most cautiously.
sincerely,
(Dr) Michael Casey
PRIVATE SECRETARY TO CARDINAL PELL
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So as we can see, this self proclaimed “seer” is not even known of by her own archbishop. So then we know the Church has not approved of this person or her “messages”.

Add to that that these “messages” go against the Teachings of the Church, I think it is safe to say that we should ignore this.
 
Add to that that these “messages” go against the Teachings of the Church, I think it is safe to say that we should ignore this
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Thanks for your efforts to verify this. And I think it would be safe to say that most of us already have decided to ignore this. Anytime an alledged apparation says our Lady tells them to go against the teaching or authority of the Church, I am suspect.
 
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