Purgatory question

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teentruthseeker

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Why, if Jesus died on the cross for our sins to take away our sins, why would we go to Purgatory?
 
Nothing unclean may enter heaven. God does not engage in lies or pretense. Nothing unclean may enter into heaven. Snow covered dung does not make it. It is still dung. God does not lie to Himself and tell Himself we are righteous when we are not. We do not become someone or something else when we die in order that we may enter heaven. Most of us still have some propensity toward sin, some preference for ourselves rather than God (all sin is really an offense against the first commandment).

Purgatory is that place, process, event, or whatever that prepares those whose sins have been forgiven to enter into heaven cleansed of all attachment to anything that is not heavenly.

Try this:

Let’s take a good honest look at ourselves - warts, imperfections, faults, peccadilloes, and all. If heaven were populated with people like you or me, how long would it be heavenly? In my case, not very long. How about your case?

Purgatory is the anteroom for heaven - open only to those who are saved. It is the washroom to cleanse us of all the grime and gunk that clings to us (and that we cling) to so that we don’t muddy heaven with our attachments to un-heavenly things. Nothing unclean may enter heaven. Snow covered dung does not and God won’t lie about who is and who is not unclean and pretend we are when we aren’t.

I’ve known a lot of people who boldly claimed that they were saved. If heaven were filled with them - yuck! :nope:
 
teentruthseeker said:
Why, if Jesus died on the cross for our sins to take away our sins, why would we go to Purgatory?
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May I add to your post- the thief on the cross? Lu.23 42-43
The thief said to Jesus , “Remember me when you come into your kingdom.” Jesus answered, him, “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise.”

Isn’t God Great!! I bless Jesus Christ and
God bless you,😃

jean8
 
quasimodo said:
Nothing unclean may enter heaven. God does not engage in lies or pretense. Nothing unclean may enter into heaven. Snow covered dung does not make it. It is still dung. God does not lie to Himself and tell Himself we are righteous when we are not. We do not become someone or something else when we die in order that we may enter heaven. Most of us still have some propensity toward sin, some preference for ourselves rather than God (all sin is really an offense against the first commandment).

Purgatory is that place, process, event, or whatever that prepares those whose sins have been forgiven to enter into heaven cleansed of all attachment to anything that is not heavenly.

Try this:

Let’s take a good honest look at ourselves - warts, imperfections, faults, peccadilloes, and all. If heaven were populated with people like you or me, how long would it be heavenly? In my case, not very long. How about your case?

Purgatory is the anteroom for heaven - open only to those who are saved. It is the washroom to cleanse us of all the grime and gunk that clings to us (and that we cling) to so that we don’t muddy heaven with our attachments to un-heavenly things. Nothing unclean may enter heaven. Snow covered dung does not and God won’t lie about who is and who is not unclean and pretend we are when we aren’t.

I’ve known a lot of people who boldly claimed that they were saved. If heaven were filled with them - yuck! :nope:
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quasi,
Yes, you are correct, nothing unclean will enter heaven.
Do you know why-- Jesus Christ, our Savior, took all of our sins to Calvary’s Cross. He said from the cross, “It is finished.” Jn.19:30

Purgatory?? what scripture?

God bless you,
jean8
 
jean8 said:
quasi,
Yes, you are correct, nothing unclean will enter heaven.
Do you know why-- Jesus Christ, our Savior, took all of our sins to Calvary’s Cross. He said from the cross, “It is finished.” Jn.19:30
Click to expand...
This reeks of bending the Scripture to fit your need.

What is finished?
Purgatory?? what scripture?
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Read Maccabees one more time.

Also, I asked earlier, and no answers yet.

God forgave David for Bath-sheba-gate. But was that the end of the story?

God bless you,
jean8
 
jean8 said:
quasi,
Yes, you are correct, nothing unclean will enter heaven.
Do you know why-- Jesus Christ, our Savior, took all of our sins to Calvary’s Cross. He said from the cross, “It is finished.” Jn.19:30

Purgatory?? what scripture?
Click to expand...
The goal of Jesus’ ministry was to allow us to be one with and in the Father (John 17:21ff). We know that to enter into that unity, to see the Lord, we must be sanctified and cleasned (Heb. 12:14, Rev. 21:27): God’s will is perfect, so our wills must also be perfect (Mt. 5:48). But while we are in the flesh, we must resist the temptation to sin (Rom. 7:14-25).

Therefore, while we are in the flesh, our wills are imperfect (because we are capable of sin), and if our wills are imperfect, we are not sanctified and cleansed, nor are we capable of completely partaking in God’s divine love.

This leads to one of two conclusions. Either
  1. No one will ever enter into heaven for lack of sanctification, or
  2. There must be a final sanctification between physical death and entry into heaven that cleanses one’s soul in a way that was impossible while that one was still alive.
All the principles are in Scripture. Just have to connect the dots.
 
GJx86 said:
The goal of Jesus’ ministry was to allow us to be one with and in the Father (John 17:21ff). We know that to enter into that unity, to see the Lord, we must be sanctified and cleasned (Heb. 12:14, Rev. 21:27): God’s will is perfect, so our wills must also be perfect (Mt. 5:48). But while we are in the flesh, we must resist the temptation to sin (Rom. 7:14-25).

Therefore, while we are in the flesh, our wills are imperfect (because we are capable of sin), and if our wills are imperfect, we are not sanctified and cleansed, nor are we capable of completely partaking in God’s divine love.

This leads to one of two conclusions. Either
  1. No one will ever enter into heaven for lack of sanctification, or
  2. There must be a final sanctification between physical death and entry into heaven that cleanses one’s soul in a way that was impossible while that one was still alive.
All the principles are in Scripture. Just have to connect the dots.
Click to expand...
thank you that really helped!!😃
 
NotWorthy said:
This reeks of bending the Scripture to fit your need.

What is finished?

Read Maccabees one more time.

Also, I asked earlier, and no answers yet.

God forgave David for Bath-sheba-gate. But was that the end of the story?

God bless you,
jean8
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i dont know what happened with david and bathsheba?? 😊 can you tell me??
 
teentruthseeker said:
i dont know what happened with david and bathsheba?? 😊 can you tell me??
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Bathsheba was the wife of Uriah the Hittite. She became pregnant by King David (2 Samuel 11:4-5) while she was still married to Uriah. To cover his iniquity, David tried to convince Uriah to come back to his wife, so that the pregnancy would appear to be his (2 Samuel 11:7-8, etc.), but Uriah refused to lay with his wife. As a result, David ordered him killed (2 Samuel 11:15) so that he could take Bathsheba as his own wife, after which having a son wouldn’t seem unusual – but this, obviously, isn’t the sort of thing God commends (2 Samuel 11:27).

In 2 Samuel 12:13-14, Nathan, a prophet of the Lord, tells David that David’s repentance before God has brought him forgiveness (v. 13), but that he will nonetheless be punished through the loss of his son (v. 14).

This shows that the temporal punishment for sin is separate from whether God considers us forgiven. This is another argument for a final sanctification: If someone is forgiven by God (i.e., in a state of grace), but dies with temporal punishment due to him for his sins, then he must “pay off” that punishment before entering heaven, since no one can suffer in heaven.

Hope that helps.
 
GJx86 said:
If someone is forgiven by God (i.e., in a state of grace), but dies with temporal punishment due to him for his sins, then he must “pay off” that punishment before entering heaven, since no one can suffer in heaven.

Hope that helps.
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thank you it does:D
 
teentruthseeker said:
ummm… maccabees isnt in the protestant bible, its added in some bibles as like extra books but its just in catholic ones
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Correction.

Maccabees was in the Christian Bible for 1600 years - as long as their has been a canon defined for the Christian Church, Macabees has been in it.

Then 500 years ago, certain Christian faiths chose to take Macabees out of their canon.

In other words, it’s not my fault they took Maccabees’s out of the Bible then ask for Scriptural Proof. You asked for Scripture, I provided it.
 
i dont know what happened with david and bathsheba?? 😊 can you tell me??In 2nd Samuel (I think it is), God, through Nathan, told David that He forgives David for his indiscretion with Bathsheba - David even went so far as to have Bathsheba’s husband killed in battle to cover up the fact that David got Bathsheba pregnant.

Anyway, God forgave David completely. Then He told David that the child produced from their union was still to die.

IOW, there was a temperal punishment for David’s sins even after God forgave him.
 
In Baptism, our souls are cleansed from the stain of Original Sin and of all past personal sins by the Blood of the Lamb (Jesus Christ) by means water. In Purgatory, our souls are cleansed from any stain of personal, post-baptismal sins remaining after death by the Blood of the Lamb (Jesus Christ) by means of purgatorial fires. Though the means is different, water in Baptism and fire in Purgatory, yet the effective cause of our cleansing in both cases is the same, the Blood of the Lamb (Jesus Christ).
 
jean8 said:
quasi,
Yes, you are correct, nothing unclean will enter heaven.
Do you know why-- Jesus Christ, our Savior, took all of our sins to Calvary’s Cross. He said from the cross, “It is finished.” Jn.19:30

Purgatory?? what scripture?

God bless you,
jean8
Click to expand...
It is finished - true but what does that mean? What does Col 1:24 mean if “it is finished” means what you apparently think it means?
 
GJx86 said:
if our wills are imperfect, we are not sanctified and cleansed, nor are we capable of completely partaking in God’s divine love.

This leads to one of two conclusions. Either
  1. No one will ever enter into heaven for lack of sanctification, or
  2. There must be a final sanctification between physical death and entry into heaven that cleanses one’s soul in a way that was impossible while that one was still alive.
All the principles are in Scripture. Just have to connect the dots.
Click to expand...
I have used a similar proof from Scripture:
*1. A person while on earth is prone to sin.
2. In heaven, a person is no longer prone to sin.
3. There will therefore be a purification at death to transform a soul.
*Think of temporal punishment for sin as repairing damage for sin. The sin is forgiven. The damage must then be repaired. Some of the damage of sin includes a tendency or habit for sin. We can have no damage or stain on our soul if we are to be fully united to God in heaven. 👍
 
NotWorthy said:
Correction.

Maccabees was in the Christian Bible for 1600 years - as long as their has been a canon defined for the Christian Church, Macabees has been in it.

Then 500 years ago, certain Christian faiths chose to take Macabees out of their canon.

In other words, it’s not my fault they took Maccabees’s out of the Bible then ask for Scriptural Proof. You asked for Scripture, I provided it.
Click to expand...
👍
 
A practical way to look at it is the following:

Say you and your buddy Rufus are having breakfast together. While talking, he says something that offends you, which results in you throwing his orange juice on the ground. After a few moments you realize how ridiculous your action was and apologize to Rufus. He forgives you and you carry on your friendship. However, the spilt orange juice on the ground isn’t going to clean up itself and must be accounted for. Purgatory.
 
teentruthseeker said:
ummm… maccabees isnt in the protestant bible, its added in some bibles as like extra books but its just in catholic ones
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Maccabees isn’t in the protestant bible because it was TAKEN out not because it was added later to catholic bibles.The council that convened under King James decided it was not worth including.
 
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