Purgatory......

[1beleevr]

Do you then believe you are perfect?

You do not pray for the dead?

]

We all know that only One is perfect!:thumbsup:In fact it is foolish to seek perfection in this life Your flesh and mine will never submit to the will of God; and as long as you are in this world, your flesh is in constant battle with God! So why is it that we “preach” perfection, encourage others, including our wives/husbands, and children to seek perfection? Can man even come close to the rewards waiting for you in your Father’s mansions? And why would we pray for the dead?

 

[1beleevr]

Only the saved go to purgatory. Hope to see you there.

]

Likewise, we hope to see you there, our brother in Christ!(I mean if purgatory exists, that is)

 

[1beleevr]

God chooses to reveal Himself through the Church… Any and all Churches.
He does not personally reveal himself… He comes to us “through” the buildings
priests, the Bishops, the Sacraments and yes even the Pope…

When God revealed his “law” to man, God personally used fire and wrote
the ten commandments on the two tablet of stone… but when it came
to the New Testament he used the Holy Spirit to “inspire” men to convey his
messages to us…

Catholics do not stop at Salvation through a intellectual “belief” in the Name of
Jesus… we understand that Salvation is a process we are to engage in towards
our “sanctification” to become Christ through the Sacraments… We do not beleive
that our only christian responsibility is to just go around saying we are saved…

We are to receive our christian growth through the gifts of the Holy spirit through
the Sacraments of the church… and in order to do this, we must see the help
of the church and her Priests… We consider the church and the priests as
our spiritual growth fathers… and not the father of our life which is how God
becomes our father… he is the father of our souls… and the church is the father
of our sanctification…

Jesus choose 12 men to create a church… to receive, proclaim and to protect
his truths He wishes to reveal to the world until the end of time.

Notice very carefully I wrote 12 “men”…

I imagine you have a church building, you have men for ministers, you have
a group of men/women who will pray for you… who will provide a “place” for
lost people to be able to come and find the Truth of God…

Or are you saying that there isn’t any need for people to be involved in the
Kingdom of God here on earth… That God will just reveal his truths through
some magic communication without sharing those chores with the Church
(believers) on earth?

Then why did Jesus say… “He who hears you… hears me?”

There is far more in God calling you than to just save your soul…
He has some work for you to do in His work on earth… He wants
you to live your faith to the point that lost people will find Him
in you and to bring them to this truth… I feel the best place
for those lost souls is to come to a church where they can
find fathers for their salvation which includes helping them to
connect with the Grace of God for the gifts and fruits of the
Holy Spirit… there is far more going on with your salvation then
to just pluck you out of this world and put you in Heaven…

You yourself have received the power to be one of the Sons or Daughters
of the Kingdom… and you are called to be part of God’s work here on earth…

]

The cool thing is, that regardless of denomination, all Christians can and should do the work of the Lord(feeding the homeless, witnessing to others, reaching out to those in prison,etc) while on this earth! And when we get to Heaven, it will be of no consequence which religion/denomination you espoused here on earth! We will all be saints, worshipping our King:thumbsup:

 

[1beleevr]

And your point is , He may have never said Car are air plane. May have never said Baptist.but we have a lot of them any way…I know He never said Protestant but we have a lot of them also
So I do not know what you are trying to say.Did He ever say Bible I dont think so but may be you know

]

This post makes absoluely no sense

 

[1beleevr]

Sure All is welcome! I could have my husband even come pick you up on his motorcycle But not for awhile where we are. A snowmobile maybe

But the RCC is open to the World. Once you get to know us, you will actually LOVE US. Ask Tweety I am even beginning to grow on her. We’re buds now. Me and Tweet like you and I lb see that we have alot in common too. And thats a good thing.

Let me know about the bike ride

]

That would be a long commute to attend mass with you; not that I wouldn’t enjoy your company, I would! But, would you reciprocate and attend a noncatholic service, being reverent and respectful as well?

 

[BlueSapphire]

John 21:25

But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.

Jesus appeared to the Saints on Earth and related to them messages - Purgatory to be among them.

St. Catherine of Genoa, St. Faustina… to name but a few.

Padre Pio was visited many times by the Souls In Purgatory.

 

[rinnie]

]

That would be a long commute to attend mass with you; not that I wouldn’t enjoy your company, I would! But, would you reciprocate and attend a noncatholic service, being reverent and respectful as well?

I would my love and thanks for asking. You gotta remember lB I married a protestant. My MIL is still protestant. And my very best friend is protestant. The only thing I could not do is receive communion. It is not allowed by my faith. But pray with you guys:thumbsup: Heck yeah I am in!

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

]

We all know that only One is perfect!:thumbsup:In fact [SIGN]it is foolish to seek perfection in this life:[/SIGN]rolleyes: Your flesh and mine will never submit to the will of God; and as long as you are in this world, your flesh is in constant battle with God! So why is it that we “preach” perfection, encourage others, including our wives/husbands, and children to seek perfection? Can man even come close to the rewards waiting for you in your Father’s mansions? And why would we pray for the dead?

Actually my buddy that not exactly true. We must try. Its actually commamded of us.

Matt. 5:48 So be perfect just as your heavenly Father is perfect. And actually its not really that hard to follow that commandment. It means we must be merciful as Christ was. But while I agree with you its very hard to try to follow Christ and pretty much impossible at times I would not agree with you that it is foolish to seek it. We should all strive for it!

 

[Bill_Pick]

]

We all know that only One is perfect!:thumbsup:In fact it is foolish to seek perfection in this life Your flesh and mine will never submit to the will of God; and as long as you are in this world, your flesh is in constant battle with God! So why is it that we “preach” perfection, encourage others, including our wives/husbands, and children to seek perfection? Can man even come close to the rewards waiting for you in your Father’s mansions? And why would we pray for the dead?

o
Lets read the Bible and see what it has to say" God is not the GOD of the dead but a God of the living : MT 12’26-27
Does that answer your question about praying for the dead

 

[tweetymom]

Sure All is welcome! I could have my husband even come pick you up on his motorcycle But not for awhile where we are. A snowmobile maybe

But the RCC is open to the World. Once you get to know us, you will actually LOVE US. Ask Tweety I am even beginning to grow on her. We’re buds now. Me and Tweet like you and I lb see that we have alot in common too. And thats a good thing.

Let me know about the bike ride

rinnie, you have grown on me as a sister in Christ, and I love you with the love of the Lord. But just like my blood sisters and brothers, I do not agree with you about purgatory and a few other thing, but I still love you. God Bless.

 

[rinnie]

rinnie, you have grown on me as a sister in Christ, and I love you with the love of the Lord. But just like my blood sisters and brothers, I do not agree with you about purgatory and a few other thing, but I still love you. God Bless.

But tweets isn’t that what it is really all about here. To help eachother grow in the faith of God, but more important Love one another and respect one another through the process. I have grown myself so much since I have started on this Forum years ago. And that is no matter how we can be separated from one another, if either race, religion, money etc. There is one way to reunite us back together and that is Love which translates into God.

And I respect that Purgatory is a block for us now, and thats okay. But hopefully in some small way I could have at least opened your eyes to the possibility of it.

And purgatory to us is a wonderful place, Its like a 16 year old going to take a driver test. You passed and you are legal. But you are not nearly perfected in that driving yet.

Thats the joy we see in Purgatory, you passed, and remember that joy from passing that drivers test, but now you have to be perfected in Christ! But it will come Tweety, but when God is ready to reveal it to you. Just keep reading, and studying, and doing the best you can. Thats all anyone can ask of you or I.

 

[tweetymom]

But tweets isn’t that what it is really all about here. To help eachother grow in the faith of God, but more important Love one another and respect one another through the process. I have grown myself so much since I have started on this Forum years ago. And that is no matter how we can be separated from one another, if either race, religion, money etc. There is one way to reunite us back together and that is Love which translates into God.

And I respect that Purgatory is a block for us now, and thats okay. But hopefully in some small way I could have at least opened your eyes to the possibility of it.

And purgatory to us is a wonderful place, Its like a 16 year old going to take a driver test. You passed and you are legal. But you are not nearly perfected in that driving yet.

Thats the joy we see in Purgatory, you passed, and remember that joy from passing that drivers test, but now you have to be perfected in Christ! But it will come Tweety, but when God is ready to reveal it to you. Just keep reading, and studying, and doing the best you can. Thats all anyone can ask of you or I.

thank you for your post.Purgatory will always be a block to me.

 

[Vile_Servant]

to Catholics who believe in Purgatory, please pray often for the Holy Souls to secure their release and a mitigation of their suffering. Your generous alms will not be forgotten nor fail to be outdone by the Holy Souls and by God. Thanks!

“Eternal Father, I offer you the most precious blood of your Divine Son, Jesus, in union with all the masses said throughout the world today, for the Holy Souls in Purgatory”
-Prayer of St Gertrude the Great

 

[Cursilista]

My belief in purgatory

After Jesus had died, he went to a place, where the souls of all the previously departed, were housed. He purified them and he freed them to be able to go to heaven. I believe that place still exist. The bible speaks of cleansing us through fire after death, even Paul speaks of this cleansing. I believe that heaven is a holy place and that we must be purified before we can enter into a holy place. I also believe that our human knowledge of God and Heaven is insuffient for us to be in full communion with god and be fully with him in heaven. I believe that purgatory exist to first cleanse us spiritually, to atone for our sins, and to be taught more of the nature of god, before we are allowed to be in his full presence.

In the bible it states in many places that we will receive the awards we are each due and we must answer for the sins we have commited. I believe that purgatory is that place or state of being where these things occur. Once we have proper knowledge , atoned for our transgressions and have been purified, are we allowed to be fully with God or at least closer to God.

While a lot of non catholics dont believe in the concept of purgatory, It would be of interest to me to know where exactly would we be atoning for sins and where does the purification take place. It is a common belief between both tremds of thought that we will be face to face with jesus and have to answer for our human life. Where is this to take place?

Once saved, always saved is a concept that i can somewhat accept and thats where purgatory comes into play. You see if you accept Jesus as your lord and savior but continue to sin, which we all do, how are we able to enter heaven with such a sinful spirit. The saved part is we are not thrown into the desperation of total absence from god known as hell. We are given sort of a second chance as long as our free will accepts the purification and knowledge that Jesus gives us in the purgatory state. Remember , even the angels have free will, otherwise satan and a 3rd of all the angels would not have rebeled against god and left heaven.

My fathers house has many rooms said jesus. i believe Some rooms are further from god or closer to god than others. Our earthly existence is but a blink of the eye, compared with eternity. We are judged greatly by our existence on earth, but we are given a time to learn and be cleansed before we are given one of those rooms. Based on both our earthly existence and our willingness to learn will determine which room will we receive. Now it could be that we are given a room to begin with and our purification and learning are done from there, but the room may not be as close to god as we would like. The further away from god the less the graces we recieve. Lacking the graces we desire could be considered a purgatorial state where with continual purification and learning we can better our posistion , or our room, in heaven.

I dont have all the answers, none of us do. I believe in a loving God who continusly give us second chances to please him. I believe that after you die, there is a spirit life. I believe that if we want to be close to god we have to be made holy and pure. I believe that eternity is a long time and during that time our soul, spirit, life force is formed and molded to be perfect by god. I believe that we still have a free will to choose how close to god we want to be.

I believe that our soul, spirit , whatever you want to call it, is alive in a different world, a spirit existence. When jesus was in the garden, before the night he was to be taken away, Two live spirits appeared to him. Moses and Isaih, (i beleive i got it right). This is proof positive that men of human origin exist in a spirit form after death. They were sent by God to give jesus encouragement. Proof positive that they can interact or intercede with mankind. Therefore, we believe that we are not asking dead plp for intercession on our behalf but spirits who are alive and in gods presence.

When we pray for our dearly departed, we are sending up our prays to God on their behalf to give them encouragement to continue to learn, be purified, and to get closer to God. God hears our prayers on their behalf and gives them graces to further their progression towards him. Likewise when we ask a saint or mary or jesus to help us out with problems we face here in our earthly lives, we are asking them to request gods graces be given to us to overcome our earthly obstacles.

God Bless

 

[Bill_Pick]

thank you for your post.Purgatory will always be a block to me.

44
for if he were not expecting the fallen to rise again, it would have been useless and foolish to pray for them in death.
45
But if he did this with a view to the splendid reward that awaits those who had gone to rest in godliness, it was a holy and pious thought.
46
Thus he made atonement for the dead that they might be freed from this sin.
From the Bible

 

[rinnie]

thank you for your post.Purgatory will always be a block to me.

Thats okay! I understand:hug1:

 

[Bill_Pick]

rinnie, This is what 2mac 12-44 said 44
for if he were not expecting the fallen to rise again, it would have been useless and foolish to pray for them in death.

 

[rinnie]

rinnie, This is what 2mac 12-44 said 44
for if he were not expecting the fallen to rise again, it would have been useless and foolish to pray for them in death.

Bill, I am 100% sure of purgatory. But we as brothers and sisters of Christ can not force others to see what is so clear to us. Do you see what I am saying. Like lb and tweety are telling us they just don’t see it yet. But someday they will read all of the scripture and it will just click. But all we can do now is rely on the grace of God to reveal to them someday what we see.

You hear it everyday on here Bill, someone saying that they were never Catholic, and then one day the teaching’s of the Church just came alive to them.

But we must love and respect them and thank God for what we can agree on together. We proved our point to the best of our knowledge. We did our best, and hopefully made some new friends.

 

[1beleevr]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

Actually my buddy that not exactly true. We must try. Its actually commamded of us.

Matt. 5:48 So be perfect just as your heavenly Father is perfect. And actually its not really that hard to follow that commandment. It means we must be merciful as Christ was. But while I agree with you its very hard to try to follow Christ and pretty much impossible at times I would not agree with you that it is foolish to seek it. We should all strive for it!

]

I guess we would be even on the church visits, because I couldn’t take communion at your church, either And what I was getting at, is we try to be perfect physically(you know, keep those plastic surgeons in business!), but are dirty on the inside(our souls)! Jesus chided the Pharisees for always worrying about the outside of the cup, and ignoring the inside! Our flessh will never be perfect, but our spirits can! This is what God desires, your heart and soul, not your body! So, why do we worry about what others think of us?

 

[Bill_Pick]

Bill, I am 100% sure of purgatory. But we as brothers and sisters of Christ can not force others to see what is so clear to us. Do you see what I am saying. Like lb and tweety are telling us they just don’t see it yet. But someday they will read all of the scripture and it will just click. But all we can do now is rely on the grace of God to reveal to them someday what we see.

You hear it everyday on here Bill, someone saying that they were never Catholic, and then one day the teaching’s of the Church just came alive to them.

But we must love and respect them and thank God for what we can agree on together. We proved our point to the best of our knowledge. We did our best, and hopefully made some new friends.

I have two daughter and both are Baptist,I can tell one that Jeseus Christ is God and she will tell me I,m wrong.But I keep praying,just keep up the good fight