Purgatory?

[andzy]

I do not believe in a purification process as it would either greatly diminish or completely nullify the sacrifice of the Christ made for sinners. Even Mary said, “I rejoice in God my Savior” which proves that even she needed the saving grace of our Lord’s ultimate sacrifice. Pretty powerful stuff!

On the contrary! The lack of purification diminishes Christ’s sacrifice, because then it means that we can take His sacrifice for granted, indulge in sin (everyone of us sins more or less all the time, you know) and drag all that impurity in Heaven (thus saying: God, move your holiness over and make way for my sin). Compare that with Mt. 23:25-28. It’s like somebody committing adultery and still entering marriage bed without reconciling with the spouse (in a way without purifying the relationship) - that person in effect defiles his/her marriage by bringing the sin into something that’s holy.
But purification gives more glory to God, for then truly nothing impure is allowed to be in His presence and nothing impure will defile Heaven, and we are finally holy as He is Holy. I don’t know about others, but I know for sure that I’m far from having Christ’s holiness, both currently and when I die. So purification, actually, also gives me great assurance that Christ’s promise can be fulfilled for me personally, too.
Remember, such purification is not saving somebody from sin (the person is saved for sure), but making sure that the person would be able to spend the rest of the eternity in the presence of the Holy and Pure One.
P.S. Of course, Mary needed Savior. No doubt about that. Praise the Lord for His grace and faithfulness!

 

[Sir_Knight]

Easy. She has NEVER claimed direct access to the omniscience of God. Quite the opposite. Infallibility is a negative protection. If I were infallible in math, I could still quite easily flunk math. I would just be unable to write down any answers on the test if I couldn’t do them. Neither Pope, nor council, nor catechism claims to have all the answers, just the fullness of what HAS been revealed to us. Your objection implies the expectation that God should be entirely understandable to your intellect. What a puny God THAT would be. The mysteries inherent to catholicism are evidence that it is NOT man-made. If it WERE man-made, it would be a much tidier package, no?

Excellent answer :clapping:

 

[Marina14]

He could do so. However, we can only hope for this possibility. There is no guarantee that he will provide this sanctifying grace. What we do know is that a lack of sanctifying grace keeps one out of heaven. And baring any other certainties, we should focus on what he do know and thus limbo is a true and authentic belief in Catholicism.

So when a pregnant mother receives Jesus in Holy Communion, her child, although he/she receives everything else of the mother - all food, drink, emotions, smoking, drugs, etc., does not receive any of God’s Abundant Living Giving Graces from the mother’s reception of Jesus in the Most Holy Eucharist?

That doesn’t quite make sense.

An alternative conclusion based on a lack of belief in limbo is that we should stop being pro-life/anti-abortion because the little babies killed by abortion go straight to heaven and don’t miss out either by going to limbo or possibly becoming serious sinners on earth. At least with a belief in limbo one would still have some incentive to save little baby lives. See, it works both ways.

Okay fine so the sword cuts both ways. You’re right.

This belief in Limbo must be so disheartening for Catholics who miscarry or who lose their babies in childbirth before an emergency baptisim can be preformed.

1. Lose you child & then
2. Know that your child is eternally condemned to live in Hell separated eternally from God’s Love and from you.

As Eastern Orthodox at least we, if ever in that situation, believe & trust in God’s mercy knowing that God loves our children more than we ever could. We have hope that our children will be well taken care of by the Theotokos, Saints and Angels until we die.

What is life without Hope of the Mercy of Jesus?

God bless,

Adam

P.S. I feel kind of funny arguing limbo as an Orthodox Christian. Lol. However, I think a good case can be made the idea that limbo corresponds well with traditional Roman Catholic doctrine, even if it is foreign to Orthodoxy.
Yes you are funny for arguing for Limbo…so knock it off you clown! Just kidding. It’s good to look at other religions so you know more firmly why you chose your own religion. Or who knows, perhaps off of this one issue you will one day end up in the Catholic Church.

 

[AllSaints1631]

On the contrary! The lack of purification diminishes Christ’s sacrifice, because then it means that we can take His sacrifice for granted, indulge in sin (everyone of us sins more or less all the time, you know) and drag all that impurity in Heaven (thus saying: God, move your holiness over and make way for my sin). Compare that with Mt. 23:25-28. It’s like somebody committing adultery and still entering marriage bed without reconciling with the spouse (in a way without purifying the relationship) - that person in effect defiles his/her marriage by bringing the sin into something that’s holy.
But purification gives more glory to God, for then truly nothing impure is allowed to be in His presence and nothing impure will defile Heaven, and we are finally holy as He is Holy. I don’t know about others, but I know for sure that I’m far from having Christ’s holiness, both currently and when I die. So purification, actually, also gives me great assurance that Christ’s promise can be fulfilled for me personally, too.
Remember, such purification is not saving somebody from sin (the person is saved for sure), but making sure that the person would be able to spend the rest of the eternity in the presence of the Holy and Pure One.
P.S. Of course, Mary needed Savior. No doubt about that. Praise the Lord for His grace and faithfulness!

I don’t agree. Why did Jesus suffer and die? To take away the sin of the world of course. When we live into the Christian life as Jesus preached in the Scriptures and keep his commandments as he also spoke of, we then are his people. His sacrifice applies to us. If we live in Christ, then we also die in Christ (hence our Baptism). We are forgiven of our sins. No guilt or residual effect carries over. If we believe that it does, we diminish his sacrifice and we also show that we lack faith in him and in his promise. Think of the woman (the prostitute) that washed his feet with her hair and the criminal crucified beside him. They both committed themselves to him and both were saved. He told the man who sinned awfully his whole life that he would be in paradise today with him. This doesn’t indicate a purification process needed and in fact it refutes it vehimately. He also told the prostitute that it was her faith that saved her. Aagin, no residual effects and no purification on top of Jesus’ promise needed.

P.S. I totally agree with your PS.

 

[peary]

I see little difference between the Latin position as stated in the CCC and the Eastern understanding of Original Sin other than terms and how the IC applies. As you are well aware, the consequences of the sin of Adam and Eve are death and corruption. Of course, no one accually deserves heaven, but the argument goes two ways. An infant has neither done anything to gain heaven, nor to lose it. Unless you believe in some inherent guilt of the infant’s soul, there is no reason for condemnation. Also, notice how Limbo is still in hell…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

LIMBO was NEVER associated with Hell. Limbo is viewed as a state where the soul of an unbaptized infant, although never experiencing the Beatific Vision, will nevertheless experience natural happiness through eternity. Augustine was the one who believed, in his own opinion, that the unbaptized infant would go to hell due to original sin, but that is not what the Church has ever taught.

 

[Marina14]

I don’t agree. Why did Jesus suffer and die? To take away the sin of the world of course. When we live into the Christian life as Jesus preached in the Scriptures and keep his commandments as he also spoke of, we then are his people. His sacrifice applies to us. If we live in Christ, then we also die in Christ (hence our Baptism). We are forgiven of our sins. No guilt or residual effect carries over. If we believe that it does, we diminish his sacrifice and we also show that we lack faith in him and in his promise. Think of the woman (the prostitute) that washed his feet with her hair and the criminal crucified beside him. They both committed themselves to him and both were saved. He told the man who sinned awfully his whole life that he would be in paradise today with him. This doesn’t indicate a purification process needed and in fact it refutes it vehimately. He also told the prostitute that it was her faith that saved her. Aagin, no residual effects and no purification on top of Jesus’ promise needed.

P.S. I totally agree with your PS.

As an Orthodox Christian I don’t believe exactly what the Catholic Church teaches about Purgatory, but we Orthodox do believe that we need to overcome in this life via struggling within God’s free gift of Grace all our sins and tendencies towards sin.

I believe the Catholics do agree that Jesus did die on the Cross to free us from all sin, but that they realize that we are all given free will and that free will can in our way of accepting total forgiveness.

Orthodox see sin more as a disease - it can be cured fully, but once cured, just as in the body, the individual has to choose to stop eating bad foods, stop smoking, etc. they need to take their vitamins so to speak, to completely turn around and amend their lives so this disease doesn’t come back. Some people just take the cure without amending their lives and the disease comes back and can kill you or it may not kill you, but your still sick again.

Likewise, when we die if we have not completely purified our souls/bodies from sin after receiving the “cure” of Jesus’ death of on the Cross, then we end up unworthy to enter into Heaven as we have made themselves spiritual sick again.

Now Orthodox view is this person cannot enter Heaven.

The Catholic view is that this person can enter Heaven, but only after being fully healed of the soul’s illness (purged) through fire/purgatory.

The Catholic view is more Merciful.

What’s your view…Is it that free will taken out of the perspective and the person once receiving the “cure” is unable to choose to sin or be in anyway effected by sin?

To make this disease analogy a little more understandable: My friend Linda has been using drugs on & off since she was a teenager. For the last year and 1/2 she’s been homeless protituting herself for drugs. A week ago she resurfaced sober ready to amend her life. She struggled and got the drugs out of her system. She went to Church and went to Confession. She was physically healed of the drugs and was spiritual healed as well. Yet, still having free will, yesterday, she chose to do drugs again and is back on the streets. When sin becomes a habit, a passion, it is difficult to completely uproot from our bodies/souls…it time for us to overcome these habits/passions. Until we die, we continue to have choices in life - our choices effect our current life and our eternal life. **Jesus did everything He could possibly do to reunite us with Himself - yet we continue to have all these choices with which we can choose against Him at any time **(God forbid! Well, NO, God gives us freedom = He cannot forbid us from leaving Him.) I hope this helps you in your understanding.

 

[Marina14]

LIMBO was NEVER associated with Hell. Limbo is viewed as a state where the soul of an unbaptized infant, although never experiencing the Beatific Vision, will nevertheless experience natural happiness through eternity. Augustine was the one who believed, in his own opinion, that the unbaptized infant would go to hell due to original sin, but that is not what the Church has ever taught.

Sorry the Catholic Church disagrees with you. Limbo has always been associated with Hell. **Per the Catholic Church, Limbo is IN Hell **- what they call the “outskirts” of Hell. They teach (Check out the CD or book by Fr. Collins from St. Joseph Communciations which addresses the Church’s continued teaching of: Purgatory, Predestination and Limbo - he is part of EWTN) that an unborn baby or an unbaptized infant who has committed no sin of it’s own is condemned to spend all eternity without God’s Love in Hell although it is in a special part of Hell which is supposed to be as nice as it can get in a natural way without God.

Remember there are only two places to end up for all eternity after Judgement Day: Heaven and Hell. Limbo according to the Catholic Church is in Hell, not Heaven.

 

[Alexius]

LIMBO was NEVER associated with Hell. Limbo is viewed as a state where the soul of an unbaptized infant, although never experiencing the Beatific Vision, will nevertheless experience natural happiness through eternity. Augustine was the one who believed, in his own opinion, that the unbaptized infant would go to hell due to original sin, but that is not what the Church has ever taught.

You may see like that if you like, but never say never…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

 

[Alexius]

Likewise, when we die if we have not completely purified our souls/bodies from sin after receiving the “cure” of Jesus’ death of on the Cross, then we end up unworthy to enter into Heaven as we have made themselves spiritual sick again.

Now Orthodox view is this person cannot enter Heaven.

The Catholic view is that this person can enter Heaven, but only after being fully healed of the soul’s illness (purged) through fire/purgatory.

The Catholic view is more Merciful.

Actually, though there are differing views as to what sin is and what happens in the afterlife, the Latin and Orthodox views are much closer than you think…the major difference is to how to view what the West calls Purgatory. Then again, you’re the Orthodox, so you already know all this… Btw, we in the Eastern “lung” of the Catholic Church have the same views as you do, well sort of…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

 

[andzy]

I don’t agree. Why did Jesus suffer and die? To take away the sin of the world of course. When we live into the Christian life as Jesus preached in the Scriptures and keep his commandments as he also spoke of, we then are his people. His sacrifice applies to us. If we live in Christ, then we also die in Christ (hence our Baptism). We are forgiven of our sins. No guilt or residual effect carries over.

Amen! But the problem is this “When” and “If”. We don’t always live as Jesus preached. And that’s when our guilt still doesn’t carry over, but we take new sins on, and thus new blame. Marina14 gave a good analogy.

Think of the woman (the prostitute) that washed his feet with her hair and the criminal crucified beside him. They both committed themselves to him and both were saved. He told the man who sinned awfully his whole life that he would be in paradise today with him. This doesn’t indicate a purification process needed and in fact it refutes it vehimately. He also told the prostitute that it was her faith that saved her. Aagin, no residual effects and no purification on top of Jesus’ promise needed.

I think you’ve mixed two issues (many Protestants do that, too): cleansing of all sins accumulated before Baptism, and cleansing of sins after Baptism. At Baptism all sins are cleansed, and the person isn’t ever held accountable for them (other than sins’ consequences, of course, but that’s a totally different matter). The sins that Purgatory is concerned with are sins committed afterwards. We still choose to offend God and defile ourselves. God certainly cannot tolerate sin in His presence, and as we’ve seen, we cannot also be like tombstones: white from outside only, but rotten from inside.

My question to you is: what do you think God does with sins we’ve defiled ourselves with as Christians (after Baptism, or altar call, or whatever your tradition considers to be starting point of becoming a Christian)? Is it that God just ignores our sin in Heaven, or does He somehow cleanse us from it? If it is the former, then I say you’re contradicting the Scripture and the Tradition. If it’s the latter, then I say you, like C.S.Lewis, also believe in cleansing process or Purgatory (only disagree with how it’s done).

 

[AllSaints1631]

[SIGN]

Amen! But the problem is this “When” and “If”. We don’t always live as Jesus preached. And that’s when our guilt still doesn’t carry over, but we take new sins on, and thus new blame. Marina14 gave a good analogy.[/SIGN]
I think that equates to every person who ever lived. This is exactly why Christ had to sacrifice for us. It would be impossible to live as Jesus preached 100% of the time. Even mary couldn’t do it.
[SIGN]I think you’ve mixed two issues (many Protestants do that, too): cleansing of all sins accumulated before Baptism, and cleansing of sins after Baptism. At Baptism all sins are cleansed, and the person isn’t ever held accountable for them (other than sins’ consequences, of course, but that’s a totally different matter). The sins that Purgatory is concerned with are sins committed afterwards. We still choose to offend God and defile ourselves. God certainly cannot tolerate sin in His presence, and as we’ve seen, we cannot also be like tombstones: white from outside only, but rotten from inside./[/SIGN]SIGN][/SIGN]Again, this is where Jesus sacrificed for his people. He did for us what we cannot do for ourselves. All have fallen short of the grace of God.
[SIGN]My question to you is: what do you think God does with sins we’ve defiled ourselves with as Christians (after Baptism, or altar call, or whatever your tradition considers to be starting point of becoming a Christian)? Is it that God just ignores our sin in Heaven, or does He somehow cleanse us from it? If it is the former, then I say you’re contradicting the Scripture and the Tradition. If it’s the latter, then I say you, like C.S.Lewis, also believe in cleansing process or Purgatory (only disagree with how it’s done).

[/SIGN]There is pleanty of Scripture to support that what Jesus did for us was not only necessary but also complete. Do we fall short? You bet we do. Do we need to repent of our sin. Heaven’s yes we do! What does this all mean? God knows our heart. We are all sinners but some of us do care about it. We repent, we make a better effort to live by Jesus’ words and unfortunately we do sin again. We all do. Those of us who don’t care about it are not the ones Jesus died for. Those folks are in serious trouble if they don’t delve into who God is.

 

[peary]

[SIGN][/SIGN]There is pleanty of Scripture to support that what Jesus did for us was not only necessary but also complete. Do we fall short? You bet we do. Do we need to repent of our sin. Heaven’s yes we do! What does this all mean? God knows our heart. We are all sinners but some of us do care about it. We repent, we make a better effort to live by Jesus’ words and unfortunately we do sin again. We all do. Those of us who don’t care about it are not the ones Jesus died for. Those folks are in serious trouble if they don’t delve into who God is.

Your theology is unbiblical.

 

[AllSaints1631]

Your theology is unbiblical.

this isn’t my theology. Can you show me how this isn’t Scriptural?

 

[peary]

this isn’t my theology. Can you show me how this isn’t Scriptural?

Are you saying, then, that once saved, always saved? Because if you are, that is unbiblical.

 

[DLC]

The Bible tells that it is appointed unto man once to die. Heb. 9:27
Where is purgatory taught in the Bible?
DLC

 

[Mannyfit75]

The Bible tells that it is appointed unto man once to die. Heb. 9:27
Where is purgatory taught in the Bible?
DLC

We will be judged for all of our actions. Those who are saved, as well as those who are not, will be so judged. All have to give an account for everything that we do. For a sampling, four different Bible authors assert this:

Mt. 12:31-36: 31: Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32: And whoever says a word against the Son of man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come. 33: "Either make the tree good, and its fruit good; or make the tree bad, and its fruit bad; for the tree is known by its fruit. 34: You brood of vipers! how can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35: The good man out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil man out of his evil treasure brings forth evil. 36: I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter.

2 Cor. 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive good or evil, according to what he has done in the body.

Revelation 20:12-13 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Also another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done. 13 And the sea gave up the dead in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead in them, and all were judged by what they had done.

1 Peter 1:15-1715 but as he who called you is holy, be holy yourselves in all your conduct; 16 since it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.” 17 And if you invoke as Father him who judges each one impartially according to his deeds, conduct yourselves with fear throughout the time of your exile.

We see four different passages with four different authors showing that we will get judged for all our works. Jesus tells us that we will get judged for all that we say, even idle words. This is in the context of the good bringing forth good fruit, and the bad bringing forth bad fruit (vv. 31-35). Now, according to Jesus himself, some of those who are good, still will have to give an account even for their idle words (which can be bad). Second, Paul says that we will have to give an account for all the deeds that we do, either good or bad. Thus, it shows that even those who are in Christ will be judged for their sins. Third, in the Book of Revelation, there is a great white throne judgment, when all will be judged. All will be judged according to their works. Those who have bad works, and are not written in the Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:15). However, all will be judged on all their works. Finally, we see in 1 Peter 1, that the Father judges each one, according to his deeds. Thus, for believers, it is not just that we get judged for good deeds, but we get judged for all our deeds. These passages do not give us any idea that since we have an imputed righteousness of Christ, we won’t be judged for the bad works, which are sins. On the contrary, even believers will be judged for sins we commit. This destroys the theory of imputed righteousness of Christ as serving as the basis for the idea of there being no need for purgatory

 

[Mannyfit75]

Now, we remember that in the background to 1 Cor. 3, we see that Paul is talking about some doing bad works which are sins (the very verses brought up earlier,). In fact, much of the Corinthians letter is Paul complaining about the sins of the Corinthians. Thus, he is not merely speaking about greater rewards in heaven for good works, and just less rewards if you have bad works. Because bad works are sins, and according to the passage, must be judged by God. You can not separate this background from verses 14-15 and verses 16-17. Here, Paul is speaking about the day of judgment which tests each man’s work. And here, he is not speaking about merely giving rewards to Christians, but judgment for sins. Now, in v. 14 what do we see? Those who have built on the foundation of Jesus Christ, and have co-labored successfully get their reward. And what is the reward? Entrance into heaven. But also rewards for their faithfulness. Now what do we see in v. 15? His works are burnt up. What works? Sins, which are bad works. He suffers loss, the word, with the background can be interpreted ‘punished.’ What is the difference between the people in v. 14 and the people in v. 15. The people in v. 14, who were so obedient (with gold, stone and silver) that they did not have to suffer loss, or punishment, and went straight to heaven. Why do I say that? Look further in v. 15. it says he will be saved, as through fire. Now, not being a Catholic Scholar who knows Greek, let us look at the word sometimes translated ‘suffer loss’. Robert Sungenis writes this:

The Catholic exegesis of 1 Cor 3:15 is further supported by Paul’s use of the Greek word zemiothesetai (translated as “suffer loss” in many translations). Its verbal root zemioo, has a wider meaning than merely suffering loss. It can also refer to punishment. Hence, there is a component of punishment associated with the word that is not brought out in most translations. Interestingly enough, in the Septuagint, zemioo is used only in reference to punishment. Since Catholic doctrine understands purgatory as a place to expiate temporal punishment for sin, then the lexical meaning of zemiothesetai which refers to suffering punishment fits in very well with classical Catholic teaching on 1 Cor 3:15. The Christian will suffer punishment for his bad works. It should also be noted that the Greek word “houtos” (“yet so”) in 1 Cor 3:15 is an adverb modifying the verb “sotheesetai” (“shall be saved”) and points to how the man is saved, i.e., by fire. “Houtos” can best be translated as “likewise,” “similarly,” “just as,” “in the same way,” “even so,” “in the same manner,” etc. These words are comparative. In context, compare the fire of verse 13 with the fire of verse 15. Hence, Paul is saying that in the same way that God’s fire will purge any dross or foreign material from the work accomplished (verse 13), similarly, the fire will purge the man himself of any imperfections (verse 15). The Scriptures use two images of God’s fire. One is a refining fire which makes good material better by purging out impurities (e.g., Malachi 3:2-3; 1 Peter 1:7); the other is a consuming fire that totally destroys the object in view (e.g., 2 Thessalonians 1:8; Hebrews 12:29). Those who suffer temporal punishment for sin, either in this life or in purgatory, do so under God’s refining fire. On the other hand, those destined for eternal damnation suffer God’s destroying fire. Catholic theology holds that these respective judgments occur for the individual immediately after death. It is referred to as the “particular” judgment. At the final judgment, one’s eternal destiny is finally sealed

 

[Mannyfit75]

Another passage which gives an indication of purgatory is Matt. 5:25-26. For a larger context, let us look at it.

Mt. 5:22-26 22

**But I say to you that every one who is angry with his brother shall be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother shall be liable to the council, and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ shall be liable to the hell of fire. 23 So if you are offering your gift at the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, 24 leave your gift there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift. 25 Make friends quickly with your accuser, while you are going with him to court, lest your accuser hand you over to the judge, and the judge to the guard, and you be put in prison; 26 truly, I say to you, you will never get out till you have paid the last penny. **
Now, first Jesus is speaking about the possibility of mortally sinning by being angry with your brother. If one is angry, he is liable to judgment. So, we see the background to the passage is that it is speaking about how one will be judged by God, and subject to hell. In addition, He also says that we must be reconciled with our brother. Now, we see that in order to have eternal life, we must love our brother. We can only achieve eternal life if we have love. If we do not love our brother, Jesus says we will be liable to going to hell (this is affirmed also in 1 John 3:14-15, where it says one who hates his brother will not have eternal life). However, if there is a dispute with a brother, that is not to the same extent as mentioned in v. 22, Jesus next speaks of a different judgment place from that of v. 22 the fires of hell). Now, Jesus commands that one is to make friends quickly with the accuser. Thus, if these type of sins are not taken care of, one will have to face a judge. Now of course who is the judge except God? Thus, this is specifically about judgment before God. And then Jesus says, ‘you will be put in prison’, no one will get out of that prison, until one has ‘paid the last penny’. Since the context is judgment, here, Jesus thus refers to an intermediate state in v. 25-26, that is not hell. This is a place where one would be released from prison. Now, if he was speaking about hell, we know that there is no relief at all. Jesus condemns those to eternal condemnation with eternal punishment (Mt. 25:41, 46, cf., Mt. 5:22). There is no release from prison in hell. One can never ‘get out’ of hell. In heaven there is no punishment at all or any need to ‘get out.’ Thus, the place where one can ‘get out’ of prison, is purgatory. Here is where Jesus says that the last payment takes place. Only then can he then get to heaven. This helps us remember the passage in 1 Corinthians 3, where believers had to burn off the wood, hay and straw, before they could get to heaven.

 

[peary]

The Bible tells that it is appointed unto man once to die. Heb. 9:27
Where is purgatory taught in the Bible?
DLC

uh, an individual can only experience a process of purgation after death IF the person dies. Thought you’d like that clarified.

 

[AllSaints1631]

Are you saying, then, that once saved, always saved? Because if you are, that is unbiblical.

I don’t believe in once saved always saved because yes I do agree that this is not supported by Scripture. I do believe however that Scripture does speak to being saved completely by the sacrifice of Christ or as the Bible says, washed by the blood of the Lamb. This does pertain to those who not just profess to believe in Jesus but also live as he preached (The People of God).