Putting Catholic faith into action on climate change

[4elise]

Well, Catholic Answers addresses issues of evangelization. Which the NCCB should be doing, but isn’t.

Here is what I could find: usccb.org/evangelization/

All of the right-to-life groups are mostly run by lay people … I can think of one … Priests for Life … but that is run basically outside of the Church/ NCCB.

I was able to find a lot of information on this on their web site: usccb.org/prolife/

So, why do we need the NCCB? All they “seem” to do is to sow confusion among Catholics.

I got intimately involved in detail with the NCCB’s work for peace and their documents did not mention the word prayer, but seemed to go on endlessly parroting Marxist / Socialist / Communist ideology. I was REALLY deeply involved. And the infighting was fierce.

I found information on the Peace Prayer usccb.org/comm/archives/2002/02-018.shtml

I really want to preface this by saying that I strongly believe in the work of the laity on issues facing the world - and believe so much good is being done around the word by Catholic lay people.

But I am confused when you ask ‘why do we need the NCCB?’ ----

It is my understanding that this is one of the things that sets us apart from other Christians - the Catholic Church is a church with a hierarchy

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p4.htm
*886 "The individual bishops are the visible source and foundation of unity in their own particular Churches."408 As such, they "exercise their pastoral office over the portion of the People of God assigned to them,"409 assisted by priests and deacons. But, as a member of the episcopal college, each bishop shares in the concern for all the Churches.410 The bishops exercise this care first “by ruling well their own Churches as portions of the universal Church,” and so contributing "to the welfare of the whole Mystical Body, which, from another point of view, is a corporate body of Churches."411 They extend it especially to the poor,412 to those persecuted for the faith, as well as to missionaries who are working throughout the world. *

As they offer us guidance on issues on how we can actively live our faith I think it is something I will always try to consider in issues like this and others.

 

[Al_Masetti]

cei.org/news-release/2009/06/25/cei-releases-global-warming-study-censored-epa

An EPA report … that there is no man-made global warming … censored … hidden … author fired.

 

[4elise]

There is no more NCCB. The organization changed its name to the USCCB–United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. And the USCCB does indeed trend toward the left when it comes to political issues. The would probably trend even more to the left had not the abortion issue caused them to consider the fact that abortion rights are primarily favored by the left wing in politics.

As to the partnering orgainization in the Catholic Coalition on Climate Change, I’m not familiar with all of them, but the LCWR (Leadership Conference of Women Religious) and the Conference of Major Superiors of Men, do tend to have a left wing bias, both in religious and social matters.

Hi JimG ---- as this has gone a bit off topic - but I think really important too - and again I preface this with saying that it is all offered very respectfully to everyone –

What I read often categorizes the position of the USCCB (and other Catholic groups as you say) as having a left wing bias - Others outside (and some inside) the Church point to the what you and I know is the beautiful teaching on the sanctity of life (seamless garment) as being right wing …

So this question is asked again with all due respect — is it possible that the Church is neither left or right - but just ‘right’ as in correct? And that our own political positions tend to have us view the teaching on one issue or another as left of us or right of US?? What if we take it as a whole?

It is so very counter cultural to refuse to jump into the boxes that the media makes out - this one is a liberal - this one is a conservative… I so love the teaching of our Lord and the leadership He has provided us the Church that I feel I have to have one foot in each of these boxes - both very right wing and both very left wing (or both neither right and neither left) I want to be in a different box - those who are simply Catholic.

 

[Al_Masetti]

The rest of the world is backtracking on global warming

online.wsj.com/article/SB124597505076157449.html

BRIEF excerpt:

The number of skeptics, far from shrinking, is swelling. Oklahoma Sen. Jim Inhofe now counts more than 700 scientists who disagree with the U.N. – 13 times the number who authored the U.N.‘s 2007 climate summary for policymakers. Joanne Simpson, the world’s first woman to receive a Ph.D. in meteorology, expressed relief upon her retirement last year that she was finally free to speak “frankly” of her nonbelief. Dr. Kiminori Itoh, a Japanese environmental physical chemist who contributed to a U.N. climate report, dubs man-made warming “the worst scientific scandal in history.” Norway’s Ivar Giaever, Nobel Prize winner for physics, decries it as the “new religion.” A group of 54 noted physicists, led by Princeton’s Will Happer, is demanding the American Physical Society revise its position that the science is settled. (Both Nature and Science magazines have refused to run the physicists’ open letter.)

The collapse of the “consensus” has been driven by reality. The inconvenient truth is that the earth’s temperatures have flat-lined since 2001, despite growing concentrations of C02. Peer-reviewed research has debunked doomsday scenarios about the polar ice caps, hurricanes, malaria, extinctions, rising oceans. A global financial crisis has politicians taking a harder look at the science that would require them to hamstring their economies to rein in carbon.

 

[4elise]

cei.org/news-release/2009/06/25/cei-releases-global-warming-study-censored-epa

An EPA report … that there is no man-made global warming … censored … hidden … author fired.

Since this is from Competitive Enterprise Institute (cei.org) which in their own words “A non-profit public policy organization dedicated to the principles of free enterprise and limited government.” - I imagine there is a bias as you say

 

[4elise]

The rest of the world is backtracking on global warming

online.wsj.com/article/SB124597505076157449.html

While this is in WSJ - it is in the Opinion Section

 

[JimG]

Hi JimG ---- as this has gone a bit off topic - but I think really important too - and again I preface this with saying that it is all offered very respectfully to everyone –

What I read often categorizes the position of the USCCB (and other Catholic groups as you say) as having a left wing bias - Others outside (and some inside) the Church point to the what you and I know is the beautiful teaching on the sanctity of life (seamless garment) as being right wing …

So this question is asked again with all due respect — is it possible that the Church is neither left or right - but just ‘right’ as in correct? And that our own political positions tend to have us view the teaching on one issue or another as left of us or right of US?? What if we take it as a whole?

It is so very counter cultural to refuse to jump into the boxes that the media makes out - this one is a liberal - this one is a conservative… I so love the teaching of our Lord and the leadership He has provided us the Church that I feel I have to have one foot in each of these boxes - both very right wing and both very left wing (or both neither right and neither left) I want to be in a different box - those who are simply Catholic.

I certainly agree that the Church is neither right nor left wing. Many Church teachings–particularly on social justice issues–may strike people as being left of center politically. Other issues, such as on abortion, euthanasia, sexuality, and ESCR, may appear to be right of center politically.

But to the extent that the Church teaches faith and morals, these teachings are moral teachings, not political teachings.

At the same time, there is no escaping that fact that politically, Catholics can and do extend from one end of the political spectrum to the other. And Catholic organizations, such as the USCCB, LCWR, Knights of Columbus, Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights, and the Catholic Coalition on Climate Change, can and do have political leanings in addition to their religious affiliation.

And Catholics can and do disagree among themselves on matters secular and political.

Bishops are a part of the magisterium of the Church; the USCCB is not.

So when a Catholic organization speaks with regard to concrete actions recommended on such a subject as climate change, it obviously speaks not on matters of doctrine, but on matters of prudential judgment. And on that, Catholics are free to disagree.

 

[4elise]

Bishops are a part of the magisterium of the Church; the USCCB is not.

So when a Catholic organization speaks with regard to concrete actions recommended on such a subject as climate change, it obviously speaks not on matters of doctrine, but on matters of prudential judgment. And on that, Catholics are free to disagree.

Thank you very much for this ---- can you help me understand the difference that you are drawing between Bishops and the USCCB?

I understood that the USCCB is the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops - by putting this ‘stamp’ to anything aren’t they also putting the full weight of the Bishops behind something they speak out for?

Should Catholic not look to them for leadership on such issues?

From their web site:
*The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) is an assembly of the hierarchy of the United States and the U.S. Virgin Islands who jointly exercise certain pastoral functions on behalf of the Christian faithful of the United States. The purpose of the Conference is to promote the greater good which the Church offers humankind, especially through forms and programs of the apostolate fittingly adapted to the circumstances of time and place. This purpose is drawn from the universal law of the Church and applies to the episcopal conferences which are established all over the world for the same purpose. *

 

[4elise]

I certainly agree that the Church is neither right nor left wing. Many Church teachings–particularly on social justice issues–may strike people as being left of center politically. Other issues, such as on abortion, euthanasia, sexuality, and ESCR, may appear to be right of center politically.

But to the extent that the Church teaches faith and morals, these teachings are moral teachings, not political teachings.

And from what I understand - the Bishops seem to be saying that Climate Change IS a moral issue?
usccb.org/sdwp/globalpoverty/ccgp_issues_climatechange.shtml

 

[po18guy]

Thank you - I have no doubt that there are opposing viewpoints that are secular - and that among Catholic individuals there are people of good faith who have come to a different conclusion… what I wondered here… if there are climate change deniers among Catholic organizations?

Probably not. No one can reasonably deny that the climate is changing - that is its very nature. The proximate cause of such change is the question.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

More on this concenssus here. Oh and I find it hilarious that people think all the scientists and what not in these organizations are obviously just in it for the money. But clearly the small handful of scientists that donlt think humans have anything to do with global warming clearly have no motivation for money at all. Right…yeah I believe that. cce.890m.com/scientific-consensus/

But yeah plain and simple these money arguments are just silly. I think deniers make them simply because they really donlt have anything else to go on.

Every human being needs money to live. There is nothing silly about considering the source of any ‘consensus.’

And moral pollution is far worse than ‘climate change.’ People no longer fear the consequences of sin, yet fear throwing out a paper towel.

 

[po18guy]

But I am confused when you ask ‘why do we need the NCCB?’ ----

It is my understanding that this is one of the things that sets us apart from other Christians - the Catholic Church is a church with a hierarchy.

As they offer us guidance on issues on how we can actively live our faith I think it is something I will always try to consider in issues like this and others.

We are not members of the USCCB church. We are Catholics, right? The USCCB is neither necessary nor required by the Church. Is it not a group that is independent of the Vatican, and whose only ecclesial authority is advisory in nature? Good Catholics should abide by the teaching and pronouncements of the universal Church, correct? I do notice that the climate-related statements originating in the Vatican are decidedly more measured and reasoned, and less strident in nature. That is exactly as it should and must be.

When the USCCB can agree that it is not prudent to honor the most pro-abortion president in history, I will consider giving them some credibility. They could not reach consensus (or did not even try) on that important issue. The organization needs to be cleaned up or disbanded IMO. I pray for the American Bishops, as they most certainly need prayer.

 

[po18guy]

cidse.org/Area_of_work/?id=53 - one of the Catholic international partners…

Yes, they are. Notice that they still value the failed Kyoto treaty? Not only that, but they want to go beyond Kyoto. Hmmmm… the treaty that did nothing to the grossest polluters in the world, and penalized only the developed nations which already have the best record of reducing and cleaning up pollution. Said developed nations also being the most charitable in the world, by the way.

I have come to the conclusion that, like saving souls, helping the poor is accomplished one soul at a time. And that is where I put my money.

 

[JimG]

Thank you very much for this ---- can you help me understand the difference that you are drawing between Bishops and the USCCB?

The USCCB is a national Episcopal conference— a rather recent innovation in the history of the Church. Each bishop, as the successor to the Apostles, is individually responsible for the shepherding of the souls in his diocese. A bishop through his ordination possesses the fullness of the priesthood.

Episcopal conferences have no similar magisterial responsibility, nor hierarchical connection. Episcopal conferences have bishops as members, and members vote upon various resolutions, none of which are binding as a matter of faith and morals. Episcopal conferences also have lay members and committees which study various issues, and whose statements may or may not be voted on by the full body of bishops.

I would compare it to a parish pastoral council, which is there to assist the pastor, but does not replace him as chief shepherd of his own parishioners.

 

[JimG]

And from what I understand - the Bishops seem to be saying that Climate Change IS a moral issue?
usccb.org/sdwp/globalpoverty/ccgp_issues_climatechange.shtml

“In 2001, the United States bishops adopted a statement on climate change, Global Climate Change: A Plea for Dialogue, Prudence and the Common Good, and declared that, “At its core, global climate change is not about economic theory or political platforms, nor about partisan advantage or interest group pressures. It is about the future of God’s creation and the one human family. It is about protecting both the ‘human environment’ and the natural environment.””
Such a statement sounds great, but it is hard to make sense of on a concrete level. If climate change causes us to suggest particular economic plans such as cap and trade, or restrictions on the use of oil and gas, then of course it is about economic theory and political platforms. As such it cannot help but be a matter for debate and prudential judgment. There is nothing in moral theology textbooks which will address climatology directly. It is rather like saying, “at its core, meteorology is a moral issue.” Meteorologists would disagree. So would moral theologians.

 

[Corki]

Thank you very much for this ---- can you help me understand the difference that you are drawing between Bishops and the USCCB?

I understood that the USCCB is the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops - by putting this ‘stamp’ to anything aren’t they also putting the full weight of the Bishops behind something they speak out for?

Should Catholic not look to them for leadership on such issues?

From their web site:
*The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) is an assembly of the hierarchy of the United States and the U.S. Virgin Islands who jointly exercise certain pastoral functions on behalf of the Christian faithful of the United States. The purpose of the Conference is to promote the greater good which the Church offers humankind, especially through forms and programs of the apostolate fittingly adapted to the circumstances of time and place. This purpose is drawn from the universal law of the Church and applies to the episcopal conferences which are established all over the world for the same purpose. *

The quote you posted is inteed true. But you have made an erroneos assumption as to how the USCCB operates. The link regarding climate change has no information on anything that has been put out by the USCCB. It does show some sypathetic ideas being expressed by a couple of the USCCB’s committees. Nothing the committees put out has any force or “stamp” from the USCCB. Sometimes the Bishops are involved in the items put out by the committees. At other times, the bulletins and letters put out by the committees are produced by staff members employed for that purpose. The fact that something is released by the office of a USCCB committee does not mean that the “full weight of the Bishops” is behind it. Chances are that the Bishops who are not on that particular committee haven’t even seen it.

An extreme but very clear example is the USCCB movie review page. People will often say “but the Bishops said” about some movie. But the person who produces the ratings and reviews is a movie critic paid to express his/her opinions. There have been times that the Bishop who heads that committee didn’t know what would be said about a particular movie and had to override the review (ie BrokeBack Mountain).

The USCCB is a national Episcopal conference— a rather recent innovation in the history of the Church. Each bishop, as the successor to the Apostles, is individually responsible for the shepherding of the souls in his diocese. A bishop through his ordination possesses the fullness of the priesthood.

Episcopal conferences have no similar magisterial responsibility, nor hierarchical connection. Episcopal conferences have bishops as members, and members vote upon various resolutions, none of which are binding as a matter of faith and morals. Episcopal conferences also have lay members and committees which study various issues, and whose statements may or may not be voted on by the full body of bishops.

I would compare it to a parish pastoral council, which is there to assist the pastor, but does not replace him as chief shepherd of his own parishioners.

Exactly. The only time you can say that something “comes from the USCCB” is if it has been presented and voted upon (and passed) at one of the semi-annual meetings of the Bishops Conference. And even then, the statements are not binding on individual Catholics. They aren’t even binding on the Bishops themselves unless they were unanimous votes. An individual Bishop could make a different decision for the Catholics in his diocese.

 

[4elise]

The quote you posted is inteed true. But you have made an erroneos assumption as to how the USCCB operates.

The only time you can say that something “comes from the USCCB” is if it has been presented and voted upon (and passed) at one of the semi-annual meetings of the Bishops Conference. And even then, the statements are not binding on individual Catholics. They aren’t even binding on the Bishops themselves unless they were unanimous votes. An individual Bishop could make a different decision for the Catholics in his diocese.

Given this then - do I understand that you are saying if one bishop says that global climate change is a moral issue, and encourages the people to make changes that reflect this - it is then only a ‘suggestion’ and ‘only for the people in their diocese’?

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=3360

Where would one find information on what has been voted up and passed by the Bishop’s conference? Are topics like this even discussed or considered?

 

[4elise]

“In 2001, the United States bishops adopted a statement on climate change, Global Climate Change: A Plea for Dialogue, Prudence and the Common Good, and declared that, “At its core, global climate change is not about economic theory or political platforms, nor about partisan advantage or interest group pressures. It is about the future of God’s creation and the one human family. It is about protecting both the ‘human environment’ and the natural environment.””
Such a statement sounds great, but it is hard to make sense of on a concrete level. If climate change causes us to suggest particular economic plans such as cap and trade, or restrictions on the use of oil and gas, then of course it is about economic theory and political platforms. As such it cannot help but be a matter for debate and prudential judgment. There is nothing in moral theology textbooks which will address climatology directly. It is rather like saying, “at its core, meteorology is a moral issue.” Meteorologists would disagree. So would moral theologians.

I wouldn’t expect to see anything in a moral theology textbook about climatology - but exactly what I understand is the statements of the Catholic Coalition on Climate Change - that we need to keep the needs of the poor at the heart of the discussion … that is where i believe the morality exists.

 

[Corki]

Given this then - do I understand that you are saying if one bishop says that global climate change is a moral issue, and encourages the people to make changes that reflect this - it is then only a ‘suggestion’ and ‘only for the people in their diocese’?

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=3360

Where would one find information on what has been voted up and passed by the Bishop’s conference? Are topics like this even discussed or considered?

As for finding out information on what was considered in the Bishop’s conferences, EWTN does pretty extensive coverage and the USCCB issues press releases during and after the conferences. As you can see, in 2001, the Bishops did adopt a statement on Climate Change. The Bishops from the G8 nations in the article you cited did not direct anyone as to how they should act. In the embedded link, it reads:

This is what the presidents of bishop’s conferences from the Group of Eight nations have asked of the leaders of the worlds most industrialised countries, in a message which particularly emphasizes the importance of maintaining the commitments they made to assist developing countries, to continue peacekeeping efforts and not to allow further changes in climate.

They are addressing world leaders in this statement, not the faithful of any diocese.

It is unlikely that the Bishops would take a side on such a hotly debated issue that is in the realm of science more than in the realm of morality. The CCC is clear that protecting our environment is our moral duty. But it would be hard to sustain an argument that a specific means to do so is the only moral alternative for a Catholic to take.

Most of the “world” items that come out of the USCCB are statements and letters of support. When the USCCB votes on something that is to be instuctional, or very rarely a mandate, it is almost always (I can’t remember an exception but there might be some) directly related to the Church. We see these kind of items fairly often such as the vote on the translation of the Mass or on clergy issues or on the USCCB Catechism for Adults.

As for an individual Bishop, he has no authority outside his diocese unless he has a specific charge given him by the Vatican. Even an Archbishop has very little authority over the suffragen diocese under his Archdiocese. If he was encouraging the faithful in his diocese to make changes, that falls under the regular teaching authority of the Bishop and all should heed it. But the Bishops don’t have the authority to tell people, even in thier own diocese that they have to drive hybrid cars or freeze to death in order to not use their coal burning furnaces. Bishops are also allowed to express thier opinions on various topics. The Church encourages dialoge and a diversity of opinions. Just because a Bishop expresses a belief in a scientific study or an opinion about how to proceed, doesn’t mean everyone has to end dialogue and jump on the Bishop’s bandwagon.

 

[4elise]

When the USCCB votes on something that is to be instuctional, or very rarely a mandate, it is almost always (I can’t remember an exception but there might be some) directly related to the Church. We see these kind of items fairly often such as the vote on the translation of the Mass or on clergy issues or on the USCCB Catechism for Adults.

As for an individual Bishop, he has no authority outside his diocese unless he has a specific charge given him by the Vatican. Even an Archbishop has very little authority over the suffragen diocese under his Archdiocese. If he was encouraging the faithful in his diocese to make changes, that falls under the regular teaching authority of the Bishop and all should heed it. But the Bishops don’t have the authority to tell people, even in thier own diocese that they have to drive hybrid cars or freeze to death in order to not use their coal burning furnaces. Bishops are also allowed to express thier opinions on various topics. The Church encourages dialoge and a diversity of opinions. Just because a Bishop expresses a belief in a scientific study or an opinion about how to proceed, doesn’t mean everyone has to end dialogue and jump on the Bishop’s bandwagon.

First - I want to express my sincere appreciation for the tone of this discussion -
For answering my questions so thoughtfully.

As you say a Bishop may not direct such extreme actions “they have to drive hybrid cars or freeze to death in order to not use their coal burning furnaces” - because obviously that fails to consider the common good and would impact people who do not have the resources to comply.

For clarity do I understand that you are saying that one bishop (perhaps as a member or chair of one committee from the USCCB) would be able to express an opinion on climate change, and then have that committee join forces with an organization like the Catholic Coalition for Climate Change - and then list the USCCB as a sponsoring organization without the knowledge and acceptance of all or a majority of the bishops? If this is the case they really need to reform this because it is very misleading.

Because t by doing so there is an implication of support -

Also - I still haven’t seen a ‘Catholic’ organization that doesn’t embrace the need to speak for the poor in the discussions on climate change —

There are secular or ecuminical organizations that may have a strong Catholic presence, but since the member list of the Catholic Coalition on Climate Change includes such a great number of leadership groups it would lead me to believe that this is where the Church is providing leadership. Climate change is real, there are man made factors - and we should all be striving to do something about it - AND keep the most vulnerable at the heart of the discussion.