puzzled??

[adf417]

James allow me to clarify a bit for those non-Catholics, and some Catholics, reading this post…

Without being judgmental, do not forget that the Catholic Church believes many things that some of the Protestant denominations permit to be grave offenses against God that would deprive them the right to enter heaven. For example, some Protestant churches approve of homosexuality, even to the point of allowing practicing homosexuals to be clergy in their denomination. For purposes of this discussion, I am not indicating which one is right and which one is wrong, but I bring this up to point the impossibility for two churches with these grave differences to be in full communion with each other. There are many other such issues of difference. Many Protestant churches consider masturbation to be natural and not sinful, but the Catholic faith considers it a grave sin against chastity. For Catholics, divorce is a grave sin, except in the sense of annulment, that is, a determination that a valid marriage never existed in the first place. For Catholics, abortion for any reason, including incest and rape, is a grave sin. For Catholics, the use of contraceptives to prevent conception is a serious sin. There are probably many more examples. How can Catholics be in full communion with those Protestant sects that permit what it considers grave offenses against God? And are there not things that Catholics do that Protestants believe are gravely wrong? I don’t know what they would be, but to be fair, both sides must be considered.

Someone else already mentioned the Holy Eucharist, which is a substantive difference between the Catholic Church and most other Protestant churches.

When all the serious differences are ironed out, then Catholic and Protestant will be one.

The consciences of both sides may be clear, but that does not reconcile their differences. Proverbs has it, “There is a way which seemeth just to a man: but the ends thereof lead to death.” It is important that we all come into agreement on matters considered grave by one or the other side.

The “For Catholics…” statements above should read more like “The Catholic Church teaches…” as there sadly are many Catholics that do not follow the teachings of their own Holy Mother Church.

I point this out mainly because of the title of this thread. I see many non-Catholics being puzzled over the practices of some Catholics not being in line with the teachings of the Catholic Church and to further the point being that the contrary practices of said Catholics do not in any way make the teachings of the Church unorthodox. It only shows the practices of said Catholics un-orthopraxy.

All this said I hope the OP, and others, can begin to see the differences in truth behind the teaching vs. untruth behind the practices as we are all sinners and sometimes our practices are not to be followed but in all times the teachings of the Catholic Church should be.

Peace!!!

 

[PRmerger]

James allow me to clarify a bit for those non-Catholics, and some Catholics, reading this post…

The “For Catholics…” statements above should read more like “The Catholic Church teaches…” as there sadly are many Catholics that do not follow the teachings of their own Holy Mother Church.

I point this out mainly because of the title of this thread. I see many non-Catholics being puzzled over the practices of some Catholics not being in line with the teachings of the Catholic Church and to further the point being that the contrary practices of said Catholics do not in any way make the teachings of the Church unorthodox. It only shows the practices of said Catholics un-orthopraxy.

All this said I hope the OP, and others, can begin to see the differences in truth behind the teaching vs. untruth behind the practices as we are all sinners and sometimes our practices are not to be followed but in all times the teachings of the Catholic Church should be.

Peace!!!

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

I know this seems perhaps a little odd to even ask but as Protestants and Catholics are both Christian and worship the same God…how can we not be united but instead divided by practises rather than just having faith in the fact that our hearts and prayers are given to our one same Lord?

Please don’t reply with criticism.

Jesus told his apostles (Church) “he who hear you, hear me (Jesus)”. This hearing from the Lord comes directly from the apostles themselves unchanged through their apostolic successors revealed (handed down) from the magisterium of the Catholic Church since the resurrection.

St.James 2:19 “You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe and tremble!”

The faith that has been handed down from Jesus and His apostles has been rejected by protestantism, when the reformers rejected the authority from those who “heard from the Lord”.

Protestantism moved away from their apostolic succession and invented their own authority from their own interpretations of the scriptures. Protestantism moved away from the sacramental economy instituted by Jesus Christ Himself, and invented a doctrine from men, that only “faith” saves you, which is in direct conflict with the book of James.

The practices of our faith is how our faith is expressed and lived. The faith expression’s are not the same. Although some protestant denominations can mirror Catholic practices, the protestant expression of their faith lacks the validity of the apostolicity.

It should be noted however, that faith and how that faith is expressed cannot be separated or divided, the faith and the expression (practices) are one and the same being lived out. “Faith alone without works is dead.” (James 2:17)

Apart from the practices we succumb to your common denominator “Faith” in Jesus Christ. St.James records that even the demons have faith in God and tremble. The protestant reformers professed a “faith alone” doctrine. Which is a new doctrine never taught by Jesus or the apostles. Jesus did not speak or reveal directly to the protestant reformers any new divine revelations, than what Jesus already revealed to His apostles.

Protestantism and non-catholic christians who continue to splinter into evangelical groups, remain in an infant stage of faith in Jesus Christ. For these former groups to begin to “eat the meat of the gospel’s” and get off the milk, requires the “works of faith” that is expressed from both the sacred scriptures and the apostolic sacred Traditions, taught by those who heard and were taught directly from Jesus Himself, so that every age who can “hear them, will hear Jesus”.

The differences of faith does not make us mortal enemies, on the contrary, faith begins the road to “working out your salvation with fear and trembling”.

“If they are not against us, they are for us”. This implies those who are trying to duplicate the works of the Church and who are seeking to do the things of God, who are not yet in full communion with the apostles. When “Love” for one another is what joins us to God as one then comes faith and the expression of faith.

Love is the answer to your question, not faith. When we return to our first Love who is Jesus Christ True and Real Presence, we are never opposed to one another.

Peace be with you

 

[JamesCaruso]

James allow me to clarify a bit for those non-Catholics, and some Catholics, reading this post…

The “For Catholics…” statements above should read more like “The Catholic Church teaches…” as there sadly are many Catholics that do not follow the teachings of their own Holy Mother Church.

I point this out mainly because of the title of this thread. I see many non-Catholics being puzzled over the practices of some Catholics not being in line with the teachings of the Catholic Church and to further the point being that the contrary practices of said Catholics do not in any way make the teachings of the Church unorthodox. It only shows the practices of said Catholics un-orthopraxy.

All this said I hope the OP, and others, can begin to see the differences in truth behind the teaching vs. untruth behind the practices as we are all sinners and sometimes our practices are not to be followed but in all times the teachings of the Catholic Church should be.

Peace!!!

Good point.

 

[chaunceygardner]

To the closing statement in my post (#7) where I said “I will stick with the way of Jesus in the Gospels over the ways of men”, this poster said:

This right here is the biggest example of division.

Each individual person thinking they are the only ones that know and understand what Jesus said and commanded…

My comment in its full context was about how people choose AGAINST the way of Jesus in the Gospels, yet still call themselves Christian. I did not say, nor imply, that I or any one else was the only individual who knows and understands Jesus correctly. I will readily accept that there are many Catholics, Protestants and Orthodox who know and understand, AND actually live according to, the Gospel of Jesus. Perhaps even some non-Christians (as we Christians define that term) who do so as well.

If you got the impression that I was advocating for one individual (and divisive) understanding of the Gospels over any others, I apologize. That was not my intent or meaning. It was actually to point out that it is the works of men, who muddle up the teachings of Jesus, that are a great cause of division. In fact, in many of my posts I strongly and consistently urge everyone to read the Gospels, learn what Jesus is telling us, meditate on his words, and then respond accordingly. Hopefully, the understanding that we attain and the response we make will be about the same for all of us.

Also, I truly believe one cannot be a Christan by oneself. It is a contradiction of the Gospel to think that one can be a Christian without relating to, and interacting with, others, whether those others are Christians or not. Mother Teresa is a superb example of the highest level of Christian understanding that was lived out through loving and caring for anyone in need, most of whom were not Christians.

 

[Joy2day]

Well it is human nature - to fight over differences & create divisions - the work of the devil really. What about all the divisions & infighting/arguements going on within the catholic church itself? Parishioners who are ‘progressive’ vs those who are conservative. Everyone thinks they’ve got the market. Even within the church, you have priests against one another & against parishioners - maybe thats why people dont socialise so much in the church - cause the less said the better in the spirit of tolerance?

 

[PRmerger]

Well it is human nature - to fight over differences & create divisions - the work of the devil really. What about all the divisions & infighting/arguements going on within the catholic church itself? Parishioners who are ‘progressive’ vs those who are conservative. Everyone thinks they’ve got the market. Even within the church, you have priests against one another & against parishioners - maybe thats why people dont socialise so much in the church - cause the less said the better in the spirit of tolerance?

It should never be tolerance at the expense of truth. Truth, proclaimed in charity, trumps everything.

 

[JamesCaruso]

It should never be tolerance at the expense of truth. Truth, proclaimed in charity, trumps everything.

Well put. It really is that simple.

 

[PRmerger]

Well put. It really is that simple.

:curtsey: