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CHRISTINE77
Guest
I don’t kneel to images. I kneel when the priest transforms the body and blood of Christ. I genuflect when I am in the presence of the holy altar. This is to show respect to our Lord Jesus Christ who is God.
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ETE
Guest
I believe you have a sense of understanding a simple argument.ETE;4018584:
. Augustus Hopkins String, D.D. Three Volumes in One, Philadelphia. The Judson Press Chicago. Kansas City, Los Angeles, Seattle. Copyright by Augustus Hopkins Strong. 1907You mean Christians after 110AD? History tells us that it started on that date when JESUS IS GOD doctrine appears.
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
p. 305
“The earliest time known at which Jesus was deified was after the New Testament writers. In The letters of Ignatius, at the beginning of the second century.”
He is talking about these people:
When you follow the** bishops** you follow the Apostles, when you follow the Apostles, you follow Christ, when you follow Christ, you follow the Father who sent Him.
As what Jesus said, He who listens to you listens to me, and he who listens to me, listens to the Father who sent me. As the Father has sent me, so I send you.
A doctrine that came out in the early second century through the letters of bishop Ignatius that zero in the terms. JESUS IS GOD, GOD THE SON, GOD APPEAR IN THE FLESH…is nowhere to be found in the letters of the gospel nor in Pauline letters which is the earlier than Ignatius letters.
And what did Paul said and forewarned that will come after him?
SAVAGE WOLVES!
Acts 20:29 "For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock.
Take note: Savage wolves or false teachers will bring in DESTRUCTIVE UNTRUE DOCTRINES…
2 Peter 2:1 False prophets appeared in the past among the people, and in the same way false teachers will appear among you. They will bring in destructive, untrue doctrines, and will deny the Master who redeemed them, and so they will bring upon themselves sudden destruction.
So what needs to be done? Comparison of doctrines of both parties, the Apostles and those after the Apostles is it not?
THE APOSTLES never ever introduced JESUS IS GOD, instead the Father.
Ignatius after the Apostles introduced JESUS IS GOD, a different gospel from Jesus and the Apostles…
It is night and day in comparison that even a seven year old kid can distinguish the one who brought the DESTRUCTIVE UNTRUE DOCTRINES is it not?
I have no argument that those bishops notably Ignatius of Antioch are but the next generations of those who took over the leadership of the church…and you mentioned Tertulian…"That doctrines is evidently true which was first delivered: on the contrary, that is false which is of a later date. This maxim stands immovable against the attempts of all late heresies. Let such then produce the origin of their churches: let them show the succesion of their Bishops from the
Apostles, or their disciples… If this is so, it is plain, as we have said, that heretics are not to be allowed to appeal to Scripture, since they have no claim to it. Hence it is proper to address them as follows:- Who are you?Whence do you come? What business have you strangers with my property? By what right are you Marcion** (Manalo)** felling my trees? By what authority are you, Valentin,** (Manalo) **turning the course of my stream? Under what pretence are you, Appeles, (Manalo) removing my landmarks? The estate is mine: I have the ancient, the prior possession of it. I have the title deeds delivered to me by the original proprietors. I am the heir of the Apostles; they have made their will in my favour; while they disinherited and cast you off, as strangers and enemies."
Tertullian, 260-220 A.D.
de Praes, Haeres, xxxvi, xxx
But what I am after is, WHO will be the next generation of leaders and preachers based on the Apostles testimonies? Is it not the false teachers and savage wolves?
Acts 20:29 "For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock.
2 Peter 2:1 False prophets appeared in the past among the people, and in the same way false teachers will appear among you. They will bring in destructive, untrue doctrines, and will deny the Master who redeemed them, and so they will bring upon themselves sudden destruction.
In your defense, you told me that those savage wolves has been wiped out is it not? Therefore "apostasy never happened or the falling away from the faith handed down by Jesus and his Apostles to the Christians are well intact…right?
If it is, then how come there was no trace of a straight forward declaration that JESUS IS GOD nor GOD THE SON from the gospel nor in Pauline letters the way Ignatius worded his?
Instead, they zero in the FATHER as THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD? And that doctrine came from Jesus himself.
John 17:1 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You,… "And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
Can’t you see the contradiction and the fulfillment of who is the savage wolves and the false teachers?
Not to mentioned, you cannot tell me who orchestrated the IMAGE WORSHIP which the bible prohibited.
And we both know that IMAGE WORSHIP is DESTRUCTIVE UNTRUE DOCTRINE which the bible warned us that if one practiced such blasphemy…he/she will NOT be saved.
Revelation 21:8 But I will tell you what will happen to cowards and to everyone who is unfaithful or dirty-minded or who murders or is sexually immoral or uses witchcraft or worships idols or tells lies. They will be thrown into that lake of fire and burning sulphur. This is the second death.
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CHRISTINE77
Guest
Also ETE, Catholics don’t worship images. We worship the LIVING God who is the Holy Trinity. We worship the Living Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
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Ghoti
Guest
OK, have you got any evidence besides this one particular catechism, published in the Philippines?
I did a quick Google for the key phrases: All I got were links to this forum, and some other forums all to do with INC.
My search of other catechisms gives me the following:
CATECHISM OF SAINT PIUS X
I did a quick Google for the key phrases: All I got were links to this forum, and some other forums all to do with INC.
My search of other catechisms gives me the following:
CATECHISM OF SAINT PIUS X
18 Q. Does the First Commandment forbid us to honour and invoke the Angels and Saints?
A. No, it is not forbidden to honour and invoke the Angels and Saints; on the contrary, we should do so, because it is a good and useful practice highly commended by the Church; for they are God’s friends and our intercessors with Him.
9 Q. Since Jesus Christ is our only mediator with God, why have recourse also to the intercession of the Blessed Virgin and the Saints?
A. Jesus Christ is our Mediator with God, because being true God and true man He alone in virtue of His own merits has reconciled us to God and obtains us all graces. But in virtue of the merits of Jesus Christ, and through the charity which unites them to God and us, the Blessed Virgin and the Saints help us by their intercession to obtain the graces we ask. And this is one of the great benefits of the Communion of Saints.
20 Q. May we also honour the sacred images of Jesus Christ and of the Saints?
A. Yes, because the honour we give the sacred images of Jesus Christ and of the Saints is referred to their very persons.
21 Q. May the relics of the Saints be honoured?
A. Yes, we should honour the relics of the Saints, because their bodies were living members of Jesus Christ and temples of the Holy Ghost, and will rise gloriously to eternal life.
The Second Edition English Translation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church22 Q. What is the difference between the honour we give to God and the honour we give to the Saints?
A. Between the honour we give to God and the honour we give to the Saints there is this difference, that we adore God because of his infinite excellence, whereas we do not adore the Saints, but honour and venerate them as God’s friends and our intercessors with Him. The honour we give to God is called Latria, that is, the worship of adoration; the honour we give to the Saints is called Dulia, that is, the veneration of the servants of God; while the special honour we give to the Blessed Virgin is called Hyperdulia, that is, a special veneration of the Mother of God.
- IV. “YOU SHALL NOT MAKE FOR YOURSELF A GRAVEN IMAGE . . .”
2129 The divine injunction included the prohibition of every representation of God by the hand of man. Deuteronomy explains: "Since you saw no form on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb out of the midst of the fire, beware lest you act corruptly by making a graven image for yourselves, in the form of any figure. . . . "66 It is the absolutely transcendent God who revealed himself to Israel. “He is the all,” but at the same time "he is greater than all his works."67 He is "the author of beauty."68
2130 Nevertheless, already in the Old Testament, God ordained or permitted the making of images that pointed symbolically toward salvation by the incarnate Word: so it was with the bronze serpent, the ark of the covenant, and the cherubim.69
2131 Basing itself on the mystery of the incarnate Word, the seventh ecumenical council at Nicaea (787) justified against the iconoclasts the veneration of icons - of Christ, but also of the Mother of God, the angels, and all the saints. By becoming incarnate, the Son of God introduced a new “economy” of images.
2132 The Christian veneration of images is not contrary to the first commandment which proscribes idols. Indeed, “the honor rendered to an image passes to its prototype,” and "whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it."70 The honor paid to sacred images is a “respectful veneration,” not the adoration due to God alone:
Code:Religious worship is not directed to images in themselves, considered as mere things, but under their distinctive aspect as images leading us on to God incarnate. The movement toward the image does not terminate in it as image, but tends toward that whose image it is.71
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ETE
Guest
But from where you are kneeling, an IMAGE is in front of you right?I don’t kneel to images. I kneel when the priest transforms the body and blood of Christ. I genuflect when I am in the presence of the holy altar. This is to show respect to our Lord Jesus Christ who is God.
Do you not give honor and veneration to the IMAGES that you presumed represent god?
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CHRISTINE77
Guest
Honor and veneration are completely different from worship.
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ETE
Guest
Please cite the verseINC member,
Have you not read a passage in the Bible where worshipping the angel is ALLOWED?
Are you not informed that there are three kinds of worship?
And where is the THREE FORMS of worship in the bible?
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ETE
Guest
Are you sure? Your Catechism book said it is, anyways, when the Catholics bows down and serve images…what are they doing?Honor and veneration are completely different from worship.
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CHRISTINE77
Guest
I can’t speak for all Catholics, but to me the statues and images in the church are more for the glory of the house of God, to make it beautiful and remind people of the saints and angels, (not necessarily to worship them). The crucifix, which is intrinsic to Catholicism, is to remind us of the sacrifice of our Lord. It’s a visceral experience. To me, the house of God should be beautiful.
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Ghoti
Guest
The “Penny Catechism”
A CATECHISM OF CHRISTIAN DOCTRINE
- What are the chief sins against Religion?
Code:The chief sins against Religion are the worship of false gods or idols, and the giving to any creature whatsoever the honor which belongs to God alone.
Code:181. Does the first Commandment forbid the making of images?
Code:The first Commandment does not forbid the making of images, but the making of idols; that is, it forbids us to make idols to be adored or honored as gods.
Code:184. Is it forbidden to give divine honor or worship to the Angels and Saints?
Code:It is forbidden to give divine honor or worship to the Angels and Saints, for this belongs to God alone.
Code:185. What kind of honor or worship should we give to the Angels and Saints?
Code:We should pay to the Angels and Saints an inferior honor or worship, for this is due to them as the servants and special friends of God.
Code:186. What honor should we give to relics, crucifixes, and holy pictures?
Code:We should give to relics, crucifixes, and holy pictures a relative honor, as they relate to Christ and his Saints, and are memorials of them.
Code:187. Do we pray to relics and images?
More…Code:We do not pray to relics or images, for they can neither see, nor hear, nor help us.
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Ghoti
Guest
The Baltimore Catechism
Lesson 31: THE FIRST COMMANDMENT – ON THE HONOR AND INVOCATION OF SAINTS
331 Q. Does the First Commandment forbid the honoring of the saints?
A. The First Commandment does not forbid the honoring of the saints, but rather approves of it; because by honoring the saints. who are the chosen friends of God, we honor God Himself.
Think of the many helps God gives us to save our souls: an angel to be always with us upon earth; a saint always praying for us in Heaven, and besides these all the graces, the Sacraments, the Masses, the prayers, etc. If then we lose our soul, surely we cannot say, God did not give us sufficient help. “Invocation” means calling upon them to help us. Everyone is pleased when his friends are honored. Who is not glad to hear his parents praised or see them respected? By praying to the saints, instead of dishonoring God–as Protestants say we do–we really honor Him more than by praying directly to Himself We show that we believe in His great dignity, His awful majesty and our own nothingness. If a poor person wanted to obtain a favor from the President of the United States, would he go directly to the President himself? No. He would find someone who had influence with the President, and ask him to obtain the favor. Why, the very persons that say we should not use the influence of saints do themselves use the influence of others to obtain favors. They never go to an enemy of the one from whom they desire the favor, but to some of his friends, knowing that a person will often grant a favor for a friend’s sake that he would not grant for the sake of others. Now we do exactly the same when we pray to the saints. they are the special friends of God. They fasted, prayed, preached, labored, or suffered death for His honor and glory. He showed them great favors while they were upon earth. He performed miracles at their request. Will He deny them now, when they are always present with Him in Heaven – where they could not possibly sin? He loves to grant them favors; and, as they do not need any for themselves, He grants them for others through their intercession. Again men are honored by the praises of their fellowman. A great general is honored by having all his countrymen praise him; so, too, God wants His saints honored, for their great spiritual deeds, by the praise of the children of the Church. God is not annoyed by being asked for favors. Nothing can trouble Him, for all is done by an act of His will. He loses nothing by giving, for He is infinite. By praying to the saints for help we confess that we are too unworthy to present ourselves to God and address Him–to come before His awful Majesty, and that we will wait here in the humble attitude of prayer while you, holy saints, His dearest friends, go into His presence and ask for us the favors and graces we require.
332. Q. Does the First Commandment forbid us to pray to the saints?
A. The First Commandment does not forbid us to pray to the saints.
We do not pray to them as to God. We never say to them, “Give us this or that,” but always, “Obtain it for us” In all the litanies you cannot find one petition where we say, even to the Blessed Virgin: “Have mercy on us,” but, “Pray for us,” or, “Intercede for us.”
333. Q. What do we mean by praying to the saints?
A. By praying to the saints we mean the asking of their help and prayers.
334. Q. How do we know that the saints hear us?
A. We know that the saints hear us, because they are with God, who makes our prayers known to them.
335. Q. Why do we believe that the saints will help us?
A. We believe that the saints will help us because both they and we are members of the same Church, and they love us as their brethren.
336. Q. How are the saints and we members of the same Church?
A. The saints and we are members of the same Church, because the Church in Heaven and the Church on earth are one and the same Church, and all its members are in communion with one another.
337. Q. What is the communion of the members of the Church called?
A. The communion of the members of the Church is called the communion of saints.
338. Q. What does the communion of saints mean?
A. The communion of saints means the union which exists between the members of the Church on earth with one another and with the blessed in Heaven and with the suffering souls in Purgatory.
339. Q. What benefits are derived from the communion of saints?
A. The following benefits are derived from the communion of saints: the faithful on earth assist one another by their prayers and good works, and they are aided by the intercession of the saints in Heaven, while both the saints in Heaven and the faithful on earth help the souls in Purgatory.
340. Q. Does the First Commandment forbid us to honor relics?
A. The First Commandment does not forbid us to honor relics, because relics are the bodies of the saints or objects directly connected with them or with Our Lord.
More…“Relic” means a thing left. Relics are pieces of the body – bones, etc. Pieces of saints’ clothing, writing, etc., are also called relics. Pieces of the True Cross, the nails that pierced Christ’s hands, etc., are relics of Our Lord’s Passion. We have no relic of Our Lord’s Body because He took it into Heaven with Him when He ascended. All relics of the saints must be examined at Rome, by those whom the Holy Father has appointed for that work. They must be marked and accompanied by the testimony of the Cardinals, or others who examined them, to show that they are true relics. It would be superstitious to use anything as a relic unless we were sure of its being genuine.
G
Ghoti
Guest
- Q. Does the First Commandment forbid the making of images?
A. The First Commandment does forbid the making of images if they are made to be adored as gods, but it does not forbid the making of them to put us in mind of Jesus Christ, His Blessed Mother, and the saints.
Protestants and others say that Catholics break the First Commandment by having images in their churches, because the First Commandment says: “Thou shalt not make graven images or the likeness of anything upon the earth,” etc. Now, if that is exactly what the Commandment means, then they break it also, because they make the images of generals, statesmen, writers, etc., and place them in their parks. They also take photographs of their relatives and friends and hang them on the walls of their homes. They do this, they say, and we believe them, to show their respect and veneration for the persons represented, and not to worship their images. Now we do no more. We simply place in our churches the images of saints to show our respect and veneration for the persons they represent, and not to worship the images themselves. So if we break the First Commandment, they who make any picture or statue break it also. Can our accusers not see that they and every citizen do the very thing for which they reproach us? On Decoration Day they place flowers around the statue of Washington and other great men. Does anyone believe that they are trying to honor the piece of metal or stone, or that the metal or stone statue knows that it is being honored? Certainly not. They do so to honor Washington or whomsoever the statue represents; and for the same reason Catholics place flowers and lights around the statues and images of saints. Every child knows that the wood in the statue might as well have been a pillar in the Church, and that its selection for a statue was merely accidental, and hence he knows that the statue cannot hear or see him, and so he prays not to the statue but to the person it represents. Again if you can offer a person insult by dishonoring his image, may we not honor him by treating it with respect? What greater insult, for instance, could be offered to your deceased father and yourself than to burn him in effigy, or contemptuously trample his picture under foot in your presence? Thus they who treat the images of Christ or His saints with disrespect dishonor Christ and His saints.
Again we may learn our religion by our sight as well as by our hearing, and may be led by these visible objects to a knowledge of the invisible things they represent. Let us take an example. A poor ignorant man enters a Catholic church, and sees hanging there a picture of St. Vincent de Paul. He can learn the life of the saint from that picture almost as well as if he read it in a book. He sees the saint dressed in a cassock, and that tells him St. Vincent was a priest. He sees him surrounded by little ragged children and holding some of them in his arms; that tells him the saint took care of poor children and orphans, and founded homes and asylums for them. He sees on the saint’s table a human skull, and that tells him St. Vincent frequently meditated upon death and what follows it. He sees beside the skull a little lash or whip, and that tells him the saint was a man who practiced penance and mortification. Thus you have another reason why the true Church is very properly called Catholic; because its teaching suits all classes of persons. The ignorant can know what it teaches as well as the learned; for if they cannot read they can listen to its priests, watch its ceremonies, and study its pictures, by all of which it teaches. The Protestant religion, on the contrary, is not adapted to the needs of every class, for it teaches that all must find their doctrines in the Bible, and understand them according to their lights, giving their own interpretation to the passages of the sacred text; and thus we come to have a variety of Protestant denominations, all claiming the Bible for their guide, though following different paths. If every Protestant has the right to take his own meaning out of the Holy Scripture, what right have Protestant ministers to preach the meaning they have found, and compel others to accept it? The Bible alone is not sufficient. It must be explained by the Church that teaches us also the traditions that have come down to us from the Apostles. If the Bible alone were the rule of our faith, what would become of all those who could not read the Bible? What would become of those who lived before the Apostles wrote the New Testament? for they did not write in the first years of their ministry, neither did they commit to writing all the truths they taught, because Our Lord did not command them to write, but to preach; and He Himself never wrote any of His doctrines. Again Catholics are accused of superstition for keeping the relics of saints. Yet when General Grant died and was buried in New York, many citizens of every denomination, anxious to have a relic of the great man they loved and admired, secured, even at a cost, small pieces of wood from his house, of cloth from his funeral car, a few leaves or a little sand from his tomb. Now, if it was not superstition to keep these relics, why should it be superstition to keep the relics of the saints?
Even God Himself honored the relics of saints, for He has often performed or granted miracles through their use. We read in the Bible (4 Kings 13:21) – and it is the word of God – that once some persons who were burying a dead man, seeing their enemies coming upon them, hastily cast the body into a tomb and fled. It was the tomb of the holy prophet Eliseus, and when the dead body touched the bones of this great servant of God, the dead man came to life and stood erect. Here is at least one miracle that God performed through the relics of a saint.
God does not forbid the mere making of images, but only the making of them as gods. He gave the Commandments to Moses and afterwards told him to make images; namely, angels of gold for the temple. (Ex. 25:18). Now, God does not change His mind or contradict Himself as men do. Whatever He does is done forever. Therefore if He commanded Moses by the First Commandment not to make any images, He could not tell him later to make some. It is not the mere making, therefore, that God forbids, but the adoring. What He insists upon is: “You shall not adore or serve the images you make.” This is very clear if we consider the history of the Israelites, to whom God first gave the law. They were the only nation in the whole world that knew and worshipped the true God, and often, as I told you, they fell into idolatry and really worshipped images. When Moses delayed on the mountain with God, and they thought he was not coming back, they made a golden calf and adored it as a god. (Ex. 32).
The Israelites fell into idolatry chiefly by associating with persons not of the true religion. Let us learn from their sins never to run the risk of weakening or losing our faith by making bosom friends and steady companions of those not of the true religion or of no religion at all. You are not, however, to treat any person with contempt or to despise anyone, but to look upon all as the children of God, and pray for those not of the true religion, that they may be converted and saved.
342. Q. Is it right to show respect to the pictures and images of Christ and His saints?
A. It is right to show respect to the pictures and images of Christ and His saints, because they are the representations and memorials of them.
343. Q. Is it allowed to pray to the crucifix or to the images and relics of the saints?
A. It is not allowed to pray to the crucifix or images and relics of the saints, for they have no life, nor power to help us, nor sense to hear us.
344. Q. Why do we pray before the crucifix and the images and relics of the saints?
And looking at the other paragraphs in the Catechism you display, even the author makes a distinction between the worship we reserve for God and the “indirect worship” of Him through the saints; between the *latria *(hence the English suffix “-latry”) of God and the *dulia * of the saints (*hyperdulia *for the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Theotokos). All I can say is that his use of the word “worship” in this particular instance is imprecise.A. We pray before the crucifix and the images and relics of the saints because they enliven our devotion by exciting pious affections and desires, and by reminding us of Christ and of the saints, that we may imitate their virtues.
Why not look at the Catechism in Latin, so you don’t have to worry about problematic translation?
And if by now you can’t see the difference between *latria *and dulia, I suggest you move on. This horse is well and truly dead, and the flies are getting thick.
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ETE
Guest
Based on this invented doctrines of the Catholic Church to justify the IMAGES WORSHIP of the RCC…OK, have you got any evidence besides this one particular catechism, published in the Philippines?
I did a quick Google for the key phrases: All I got were links to this forum, and some other forums all to do with INC.
My search of other catechisms gives me the following:
CATECHISM OF SAINT PIUS X
The Second Edition English Translation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church
2132 The Christian veneration of images is not contrary to the first commandment which proscribes idols. Indeed, “the honor rendered to an image passes to its prototype,” and "whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it."70 The honor paid to sacred images is a “respectful veneration,” not the adoration due to God alone:
Would you also agree that if your wife will have sex with another man in your behalf, then that is not an act of adultery nor fornication, anyways…the man he is with and having sex with is the prototype of you…what she is doing is in honor, respect and veneration of you…right?
That is what your church invented for you to agree with and to have faith with right?
“the honor rendered to an image passes to its prototype,” and "whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it.?
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ETE
Guest
The bottom line is, did God allows it? Did he not prohibit the making of CARVED IMAGES for worship? INDIRECT nor DIRECT?And looking at the other paragraphs in the Catechism you display, even the author makes a distinction between the worship we reserve for God and the “indirect worship” of Him through the saints; between the *latria *(hence the English suffix “-latry”) of God and the *dulia * of the saints (*hyperdulia *for the Blessed Virgin Mary, the Theotokos). All I can say is that his use of the word “worship” in this particular instance is imprecise.
Why not look at the Catechism in Latin, so you don’t have to worry about problematic translation?
And if by now you can’t see the difference between *latria *and dulia, I suggest you move on. This horse is well and truly dead, and the flies are getting thick.
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ETE
Guest
Tell what are these standing stone people bows down and worship? Are they not idols?
- Does the first Commandment forbid the making of
images?
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CHRISTINE77
Guest
Great posts Ghoti!
ETE: you seem to be hung up on sex with another man’s wife.
REMEMBER
The Ninth Commandment
“You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife”.
ETE: you seem to be hung up on sex with another man’s wife.
REMEMBER
The Ninth Commandment
“You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife”.
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ETE
Guest
Well, Catholic subject may not know it…but the Catholic doctrine is clear and precise, Catholic should WORSHIP IMAGES, if not, in the inquisition era…death is the penalty for such heretics.Also ETE, Catholics don’t worship images. We worship the LIVING God who is the Holy Trinity. We worship the Living Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
CATHECHISM OF CHRISTIAN DOCTRINE
No. 3 in conformity with the decrees of the Plenary Council and the code of 1918.
Nihil obstat: A.G Casas, Censor Librorum, Imprimatur: Rufino J. Santos, D.D., Archbishop of Manila. De La Salle College. Brothers of the Christian Schools, Manila Philippines, 1955.
p.95
13. “Is the worship of the saints confined to their persons?
No; it extends also to their relics and images”
p. 95
“15. Ought we to worship holy images?
“We should have, particularly in our churches, images of Our Lord, as also the Virgin Mary and the saints, and we should pay them due honor and venerations.”
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CHRISTINE77
Guest
I have no idea what those people are doing. I don’t know where you got this picture. It’s all out of context. It could just be a farce. It doesn’t prove anything at all.
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ETE
Guest
But you can covet with another god made of stone to represent the prototype, right?Great posts Ghoti!
ETE: you seem to be hung up on sex with another man’s wife.
REMEMBER
The Ninth Commandment
“You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife”.
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ETE
Guest
You are not a full pledge Catholic then, and it seems to me that you have no doctrinal idea and practices that your organization implement to all their subjects.I have no idea what those people are doing. I don’t know where you got this picture. It’s all out of context. It could just be a farce. It doesn’t prove anything at all.
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