Question about marrying someone of another faith

[jbjwstar]

Brenda V.:

As for the Priest “looking down on you”, he might have something to say about the two of you living together prior to marriage. He should because it is an immoral situation and he needs to point that out to you (yes, you probably already know this but he has an obligation to make sure you both understand this ). I don’t think he will have too much of a problem with the your being a JW as that can be dealt with through dispensation etc. Please if this is what both you and your boyfriend know you are to do then don’t let a cranky Priest discourage you from getting Married in the Church.

My prayers will be with both of you as you start the process

Brenda V.

Wow, thanks Brenda. As I said, I didn’t want to start any trouble on here. I just get really nervous with new situations and especially authority figures (you should have seen me crying at my committee meeting when I was disfellowshipped) like priests and such and I want to know what to expect.

As for the living together – yea, we’re not happy with it either. Circumstances led up to it that were probably within our control, but now they definitely aren’t. we’re not looking to get married just so we won’t be “being bad” anymore, but it is a smaller reason. I do believe I am living in sin and that is NOT a good feeling.

What’s dispensation?

And thank you. I will not let a “cranky priest” (that is just such a funny image in my head) discourage me.

Really, thank you all so much for the info. It really is a help. When my boyfriend came here for lunch I told him about this forum I’d joined and started giving him some info that even he didn’t know. I was quite pleased with myself. So thanks.

 

[Shiann]

jbjwstar:

What’s dispensation?

An exemption from Church law granted in a particular case by a Church authority.

In this case, dispensation would refer to your boyfriend marrying in the Catholic Church. He must recieve this dispensation, or permission, to marry a non-Catholic, with the vow to remain Catholic, and raise all children Catholic. And you, in turn, must vow not to undermine his vow in any way- in order for the dispensation to be granted, and you to be married in the Catholic Church.

The particulars will be given by the priest when you speak with him.

 

[jbjwstar]

Ah. I see. Thanks.

 

[AmberDale]

jb- hey I didn’t read all the thread so I hope I’m not repeating things.

I was a non-Catholic and non-baptized when I married my husband, who was born and raised Catholic. He had to vow to do everything in his power to raise the kids Catholic. I have no problem with you marrying your boyfriend. May God be with you. Please keep an open-mind about his faith. As you said before you are excommunicated from your church right now. Don’t you think that’s just wrong? I’m not trying to be mean, I love you as a sister.
Anyway, keep an openmind. Ask him sincere questions. Research his faith. You’ll want to know what your kids will be learning anyway. Give him the power to raise the kids Catholic. Go to mass with him.
Who knows, maybe one day the Holy Spirit will lead you to the Church. He did for me, and I did the above things.

Above all pray. Every marriage has problems at some point. Especially those marriages of different religious beliefs. It’s hard, very hard. But by the grace of God it can work. Have faith and maybe you will find that the reason you are in love with a Catholic will some day bring you into the full Truth of Jesus.

 

[jbjwstar]

AmberDale:

jb- hey I didn’t read all the thread so I hope I’m not repeating things.

I was a non-Catholic and non-baptized when I married my husband, who was born and raised Catholic. He had to vow to do everything in his power to raise the kids Catholic. I have no problem with you marrying your boyfriend. May God be with you. Please keep an open-mind about his faith. As you said before you are excommunicated from your church right now. Don’t you think that’s just wrong? I’m not trying to be mean, I love you as a sister.
Anyway, keep an openmind. Ask him sincere questions. Research his faith. You’ll want to know what your kids will be learning anyway. Give him the power to raise the kids Catholic. Go to mass with him.
Who knows, maybe one day the Holy Spirit will lead you to the Church. He did for me, and I did the above things.

Above all pray. Every marriage has problems at some point. Especially those marriages of different religious beliefs. It’s hard, very hard. But by the grace of God it can work. Have faith and maybe you will find that the reason you are in love with a Catholic will some day bring you into the full Truth of Jesus.

No, you’re not repeating anything. Actually I hadn’t had the “convert to Catholic” post yet. I was waiting for it though.

I have to say, and I will keep this brief because I am NOT here to preach my religion on a Catholic forum, that I do not feel it was wrong that I was df’d. We believe the same things are wrong that you guys do - I should not be living with someone before I’m married to them. People should not, for the most part, get divorced. Etc. etc. Do I LIKE being df’d? Of course not. I also don’t know if I entirely agree with the entire concept. But it is a rule and I knew that when I was baptized.

See, JWs get baptized at a later age when we are old enough to decide for ourselves if want to be in the religion or not.

So I knew what I was getting into. What I’m doing with my life right now is absolutely morally wrong. I know that. But I want to fix it. And once I do then I can be reinstated into my religion.

As for the rest of what you said, I whole-heartedly agree with you. Marriage to someone of another faith is difficult. But so is marriage in general. I’m prepared for it. And I have no problem promising, or letting my husband promise, to take our future children to church. They’ll be expected to go to my meetings as well. It’s all about compromise. So thanks for the advice!

 

[jbjwstar]

Not to stir up anything, but I thought that this entire post was just a quote of mine and that she had put one tiny little paragraph down at the bottom so I only quoted and responded to that paragraph. I still have a couple questions about this:

jbjwstar:

I don’t know if I entirely understand your comment saying that nobody here can help. I mean, aren’t you all giving me general info and helping in that way? A couple people I’ve run into already here seem kind of negative and I don’t know if it’s just coming off that way because it’s hard to gauge people’s tone online or if I’m just not that welcome because I’m a JW or something.

puzzleannie:

the general rule for this forum is that it is a Catholic forum, so we discuss Catholic beliefs, laws and doctrine. we can tell you what that is, but we cannot help you with a personal situation that has to be dealt with where you are. It would be like asking a perfect stranger you meet at walmart to give you legal advice.

Actually, that hardly seems a legitimate comparison. I know next to nothing about the Catholic faith as you have pointed out. You all know a lot because you are in it. So asking a question here hardly seems as ludicrous as you are making it out to be. Also, I didn’t stumble upon this forum by myself. It was recommended to me by an acquaintance who is catholic and thought I could get some answers here.
And I also think I should point out that the name of the forum is “Catholic Answers Forums”. That kind of invites in people of different faiths who have questions about Catholics, wouldn’t you say?

jbjwstar:

I’ve never heard about the rule regarding a catholic not dating a divorced person. I’ve seen quite a few people on here post that they are on their second or third marriage. So what gives?

puzzleannie:

WHAT others do or don’t do is beside the point, a Catholic may not date someone who is not free to marry. the problem here is what your boyfriend believes and how much he wishes to follow the teachings of his faith

Actually, it’s very far from besides the point. Everything you do as a religious person is an example to others. The whole world is watching. This forum is a small sample of the Catholics in the world. So when someone tells me about a rule I’ve never heard of about dating a divorced person and I see several people on the same board say that they are on their second or third marriage and I question that, I hardly think that I am out of line for wondering.

I really wish someone would clear up that whole divorce thing for me. I know I am not the only one on here who has been divorced. I’ve seen quite a few people mention it. So as I tried to ask before; what is the deal with that particular rule?

 

[ElizabethAnne]

JB,

You seem to imply in your posts that your boyfriend wants to get married in the Catholic Church, but you haven’t said so outright. It has just made me curious. Does he want to be married in the Church? If so, why? Is he currently active in the Church? What are his thoughts on other options if a Catholic wedding is difficult to obtain?

You seem comfortable with other options, and I just wondered if he would be. I hope you have the opportunity to speak with a priest and get a clear picture of what will be required to get married in the Catholic Church.

God bless.

 

[Catholic90]

jbjwstar:

Marriage to someone of another faith is difficult. But so is marriage in general. I’m prepared for it. And I have no problem promising, or letting my husband promise, to take our future children to church. They’ll be expected to go to my meetings as well. It’s all about compromise. So thanks for the advice!

Your husband isn’t just promising to take your future children to mass. He is promising to RAISE them as Catholics – baptized in the trinity, 1st communion, confession, etc, etc.

As far as compromise – you are right, marriage is a big compromise. However, you can’t compromise your children’s faith. They are either raised Catholic (as your husband will promise) or they aren’t. There is no middle ground. (This coming from a convert to the Catholic faith).

Coming from a convert, TAKE A RCIA class!! This obligates you to nothing, but will increase your understanding of your future husband’s faith. After all, your children will be learning this, so I would think you would want to know all you can about it. Peace.

 

[jbjwstar]

ElizabethAnne:

JB,

You seem to imply in your posts that your boyfriend wants to get married in the Catholic Church, but you haven’t said so outright. It has just made me curious. Does he want to be married in the Church? If so, why? Is he currently active in the Church? What are his thoughts on other options if a Catholic wedding is difficult to obtain?

You seem comfortable with other options, and I just wondered if he would be. I hope you have the opportunity to speak with a priest and get a clear picture of what will be required to get married in the Catholic Church.

God bless.

Okay, well, the deal with my boyfriend is this: he was raised Catholic by two Catholic parents (his dad converted from. . .Protestant I believe, to marry his mom). Then his dad came back from Vietnam and their faith faltered. My boyfriend is still very much a spiritual person. But as for an “active” member of the church. . .he’s been to more meetings at the Kingdom Hall with me than he has been to his own church.

It’s not because of me either. I’ve even said he should take a couple Sundays off so that we could go to mass together. It’s just hard with his work schedule.

But he is very religious. He prays every day and fully believes in the Catholic teachings. He’s been to the church often enough that the priest knows him by name.

But he is open to other marriage options if the church does not work out for us. We’ve discussed everything. My religion is out because I’m disfellowshipped right now so they would not let me use a KH to get married in. but we’ve discussed a minister, a JP, etc. The only thing that bothers him about a JP is that at his cousin’s wedding the JP skirted around God entirely. Didn’t mention Him once. But I told him that was probably because the bride and groom requested it since they weren’t religious. You can have a religious ceremony with a JP right?

So I hope that answers your questions. We’re both very open to many options.

 

[jbjwstar]

Catholic90:

Your husband isn’t just promising to take your future children to mass. He is promising to RAISE them as Catholics – baptized in the trinity, 1st communion, confession, etc, etc.

As far as compromise – you are right, marriage is a big compromise. However, you can’t compromise your children’s faith. They are either raised Catholic (as your husband will promise) or they aren’t. There is no middle ground. (This coming from a convert to the Catholic faith).

Coming from a convert, TAKE A RCIA class!! This obligates you to nothing, but will increase your understanding of your future husband’s faith. After all, your children will be learning this, so I would think you would want to know all you can about it. Peace.

I thank you for the advice, but I’m honestly just trying to find a way to get married in the church (if possible) and not get much more involved than that. I’ll go with my boyfriend/husband if he wants me to, but I’m not looking to convert or really delve into another religion when I’m perfectly happy in my own. Maybe someday I would take the RCIA classes, but I’m not prepared for that at this point.

My saying “take them” to church was a bad choice of words. I know that you are promising to raise them Catholic. Will they be “kicked out” for attending meetings at KH with their mom? If so, that would be another similarity between JWs and Catholics. My going to church wouldn’t be looked upon lightly.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

jbjwstar:

I really wish someone would clear up that whole divorce thing for me. I know I am not the only one on here who has been divorced. I’ve seen quite a few people mention it. So as I tried to ask before; what is the deal with that particular rule?

I am sure somone will jump in with “official” Church teaching, but I will try my best.

A marriage is considered valid by the Catholic Church until proven otherwise by an annulment. An annulment is not a “Catholic divorce”. It is a declaration that the marriage was not valid from the beginning, therefore never was a marriage.

A good, faithful, practicing Catholic could not, in good conscience, date someone who is divorced (with no annulment) because in the eyes of God that is adultry.

Now, most good faithful practicing Catholics are not well educated about this type of thing. They usually learn through experience (like your boyfriend) and the process ends up being a bit backwards.

What I mean by that is instead of

*meeting you, requesting that you file for an annulment, get the annulment approved, and then dating and getting married to you

it happens like this:

*meet, date, fall in love, find out about the Church’s laws regarding marriage, get upset because an annlment is needed and they take a long time (sometimes), get an annulment finally and get married

OR

*annulment is not granted so boyfriend renounces his Faith and gets married in a civil ceremony and puts his eternal soul in danger

I hope that clears it up a little bit for you. Also, there is the Chatechism of the Catholic Church online…it would be a very good place for you to look up “official” Church teachings.

If you don’t want to be subjected to the opinions of the general public here, you could try asking in the Ask An Apologist forum too.

Malia

 

[Shiann]

jbjwstar:

Not to stir up anything, but I thought that this entire post was just a quote of mine and that she had put one tiny little paragraph down at the bottom so I only quoted and responded to that paragraph. I still have a couple questions about this:

Actually, that hardly seems a legitimate comparison. I know next to nothing about the Catholic faith as you have pointed out. You all know a lot because you are in it. So asking a question here hardly seems as ludicrous as you are making it out to be. Also, I didn’t stumble upon this forum by myself. It was recommended to me by an acquaintance who is catholic and thought I could get some answers here.
And I also think I should point out that the name of the forum is “Catholic Answers Forums”. That kind of invites in people of different faiths who have questions about Catholics, wouldn’t you say?

But this is still a forum. You have a situation that is VERY complex from a Catholic perspective. You have variables in play here that makes it really difficult for people, who don’t know you or know the particulars of your situation, to make discernments for you. The common denominator IS that you need to seek advice from a religious representative in your boyfriend’s diocese for more specific help.

Actually, it’s very far from besides the point. Everything you do as a religious person is an example to others. The whole world is watching. This forum is a small sample of the Catholics in the world. So when someone tells me about a rule I’ve never heard of about dating a divorced person and I see several people on the same board say that they are on their second or third marriage and I question that, I hardly think that I am out of line for wondering.

Actually the point is that you cannot determine morality on the majority or on anyone’s actions. The Catholic Church has a very specific, defined Faith. Because there are people who claim to be Catholic, but who do not live up to the Faith- does not mean the Faith is defined any differently.

You are most correct in saying that we are all representatives of our Faith- but I’m sure there are JW’s who do not abide by the letter of your faith’s teaching. Do I go by what your church officials have to say, or do I rely on the actions of those dissenting JW’s to answer my questions or to define your church’s beliefs.

There are people who have been divorced, and have had their marriage annuled by the Church to marry another. There are also some Catholic’s who have married without the annulment. The later is against Church teaching.

I really wish someone would clear up that whole divorce thing for me. I know I am not the only one on here who has been divorced. I’ve seen quite a few people mention it. So as I tried to ask before; what is the deal with that particular rule?

In your case, the Church must determine if you have a valid marriage. If you do you will not be able to marry a Catholic. If you have not been validly, your marriage can be annuled by the Church- then you will be free to marry in the Church.

Regardless of the outcome- you must contact someone locally who can descern the particulars in your case, and offer you the BEST answer.

God speed.

 

[jbjwstar]

Thank you, Malia. It’s not that I don’t want to be subjected to opinions. I just don’t want those “opinions” to be judgmental of me or my life. At least not unnecessarily.

Okay, so even though the state considers me divorced I need to have it “annulled” by the church? Does that involved the state at all or is it simply a church matter? I know that I could not get an annulment by normal standards. We didn’t have children, but we were married for 2 and a half years and neither one of was too young to get married or something like that. So it would probably just be a church thing, right? Since you can’t get divorced AND have the marriage annulled?

I didn’t know a civil ceremony puts his eternal soul in danger. Why is that exactly? I know some people would rather get married outside of a church because they want to have a theme wedding or they want certain music that isn’t allowed. I know theme weddings are frowned upon in the church as is using anything that isn’t a church hymn. So are those Catholics who got married elsewhere all going to hell?

I myself don’t believe in Hell, at least not in the way you all do, so I’m not particularly concerned. But I am curious about that. And I’d also like to know about the whole annulment verses divorce thing still a bit too. I’ll try researching it online.

 

[jbjwstar]

Thank you, Shiann, as well. You posted while I was busy writing my previous reply.

I will definitely check into it with our local priest. If there’s one thing I’ve learned today it’s that. : ) thank you!

 

[Shiann]

Feanaro's Wife:

I am sure somone will jump in with “official” Church teaching, but I will try my best…
Malia

BRAVO!

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

if you are up for some reading and learning, here is what the Catholic Church has to say about marriage.

vatican.va/archive/catechism/p2s2c3a7.htm

Malia

 

[Shiann]

jbjwstar:

Thank you, Malia. It’s not that I don’t want to be subjected to opinions. I just don’t want those “opinions” to be judgmental of me or my life. At least not unnecessarily.

That’s what we want to avoid too.

Okay, so even though the state considers me divorced I need to have it “annulled” by the church?

If you want to marry in the Catholic Church- yes.

Does that involved the state at all or is it simply a church matter?

It does not involve the state. That was your civil divorce.

I know that I could not get an annulment by normal standards. We didn’t have children, but we were married for 2 and a half years and neither one of was too young to get married or something like that. So it would probably just be a church thing, right? Since you can’t get divorced AND have the marriage annulled?

A church annulment is not the same as a civil annulment. See Malia’s definition- it was right on.

I didn’t know a civil ceremony puts his eternal soul in danger. Why is that exactly?

Short answer- because all sacraments are to be performed in a HOLY place- Church by a Catholic priest. If these terms (and others) are not met without proper dispensation- you are living in an adulterous situation. That is the danger to his mortal soul.

I know some people would rather get married outside of a church because they want to have a theme wedding or they want certain music that isn’t allowed. I know theme weddings are frowned upon in the church as is using anything that isn’t a church hymn. So are those Catholics who got married elsewhere all going to hell?

Not if they got proper dispensation from the Church. And I might add that there aren’t many Catholic weddings that occur outside a Catholic Church. This is greatly frowned upon.

I myself don’t believe in Hell, at least not in the way you all do, so I’m not particularly concerned. But I am curious about that. And I’d also like to know about the whole annulment verses divorce thing still a bit too. I’ll try researching it online.

You can also research the term “Canon Law” and read through the entries on marriage.

 

[jbjwstar]

Shiann:

That’s what we want to avoid too.

If you want to marry in the Catholic Church- yes.

It does not involve the state. That was your civil divorce.

A church annulment is not the same as a civil annulment. See Malia’s definition- it was right on.
.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. The annullment thing is sooo much clearer now. Yay! Ooh, and I get to leave work. I’m going to go home and share some of this with my boyfriend and see what he says.
The apologists forum said that me and my “friend” should part ways since we are of different faiths. ::sigh:: The rest of it answered my questions about marriage in the church though so that was good. have a great night everyone!

 

[Catholic90]

jbjwstar:

I myself don’t believe in Hell, at least not in the way you all do, so I’m not particularly concerned.

You may not, but your boyfriend does (or should – it’s part of the Catholic teachings). It’s his soul.

I’m walking down a railroad track. There is a rattling and a bright light coming down the line. My friend warns me and tells me it’s a train and I should get off the tracks. But I tell her I don’t BELIEVE it’s a train…so I’m not concerned…

I don’t understand you. You say you want to get married in the Catholic church. But you don’t want to learn about the faith. You don’t want to understand something that is obviously important to your boyfriend. If you truly loved him, I would think you would want to thoroughly understand everything he believes in – ESPECIALLY something as important as his faith!! Faith is what will carry you through the tough times.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

jbjwstar:

Thank you, Malia. It’s not that I don’t want to be subjected to opinions. I just don’t want those “opinions” to be judgmental of me or my life. At least not unnecessarily.

I just meant that if you want “official” answers without all of the extra opinions then maybe the AAA forum would help you.

And there is a difference between being judgemental of a person or their actions. We are called to judge wrong actions, but still love the person. Most of us here just want you and your boyfriend to do right by God. Because he is a Catholic we have an extra obligation to help him stay on track. Just as I’m sure the JW’s help eachother follow the rules.

Okay, so even though the state considers me divorced I need to have it “annulled” by the church? Does that involved the state at all or is it simply a church matter?

It is strictly a Catholic Church matter. A divorce is a legal matter while an annulment is a religious one.

I know that I could not get an annulment by normal standards.

Don’t be so sure. Annulments are very complicated matters and require their own set of lawyers to wade through the Church teachings. A priest would be able to better direct you on this matter.

We didn’t have children, but we were married for 2 and a half years and neither one of was too young to get married or something like that. So it would probably just be a church thing, right? Since you can’t get divorced AND have the marriage annulled?

I am a bit confused. The only way to know if your marriage was valid in the eyes of the Catholic church is to apply for an annulment.

Your civil divorce took care of only the lagalities of marriage.

You would need an annulment to be free to marry your boyfriend in the Catholic church

I didn’t know a civil ceremony puts his eternal soul in danger. Why is that exactly?

Unfortunately I am not the person to explain this to you. I am almost a Catholic, but still have much to learn.

I “know” alot about the faith, but struggle to explain it. The best I can do is that if your boyfriend were to marry outside of the Church he would be disobeying the rules. If he were to marry someone who was still married under the eyes of God, he would be committing a potential mortal sin which puts him in jeopardy of eternal seperation from God(Hell).

I know some people would rather get married outside of a church because they want to have a theme wedding or they want certain music that isn’t allowed. I know theme weddings are frowned upon in the church as is using anything that isn’t a church hymn. So are those Catholics who got married elsewhere all going to hell?

Marriage is a Sacrament. It is sacred.

The theme weddings and such are not sinful of themselves. What is sinful is disobeying the church and doing things your own way instead.

To be Catholic means to be in full agreement with all of the teachings on faith and morality. Contrary to popular society, it is not a “pick and choose” what to believe religion.

There is nothing wrong with having a theme celebration after you have already been joined in Holy Matrimony according to the specific formula of the Church.

As for hell, none of us here on earth can judge the state of another’s soul. But we can tell you when it is in danger. By deliberately ignoring the faith, one is putting their soul in danger.

I myself don’t believe in Hell, at least not in the way you all do, so I’m not particularly concerned. But I am curious about that. And I’d also like to know about the whole annulment verses divorce thing still a bit too. I’ll try researching it online.

You may be suprised at what the true Catholic belief about hell really is. I was.

I hope I have been able to help you in some way.

And I trust that if I am wrong in any of this, that a more experienced Catholic with correct me

I also just want to note that I personally don’t agree with interfaith marriages. My concern lies mostly with the future children of such unions. But that is a whole other topic:yup:

Malia