Question for LDS folks.

[SteveVH]

It is funny that people care so much

When the stakes are eternal life, why is it funny that people would care so much?

you say you know but you don’t know, you might have faith in your beliefs and have found something that resonates with you, but you don’t know.

This actually sounds as if you are speaking of yourself. I don’t feel that way at all about my faith.

Did you have an angel come down and spell it all out for you? You missed the point, it’s all subjective, because you don’t know. I don’t know, I’m not going to sit and tell you who’s right and who’s wrong, it’s funny when people think that’s okay as if it makes them better somehow, faith is what it is, it’s not my place to judge, it’s not your place to judge. Why do people care so much? Why do you care? I don’t care what you believe in, I think it’s awesome that you have your faith. I don’t sit and waste time casting judgements on other faiths, I just find it interesting that people like you do and got to wonder for what purpose, how could that possibly make your life any better? It’s crazy man, it makes no sense.

Doesn’t sound as if you’re real convinced in the truth of the LDS church. So what keeps you hanging around if you don’t know who’s right and who’s wrong? I agree that it isn’t our right to judge any person, but I think what is being judged here is the soundness of LDS doctrine in light of history, reason and revealed truth. We have a responsibility to judge the soundness of any belief that is being proposed as the means of salvation.

 

[TexanKnight]

It is funny that people care so much, you say you know but you don’t know, you might have faith in your beliefs and have found something that resonates with you, but you don’t know. Did you have an angel come down and spell it all out for you? You missed the point, it’s all subjective, because you don’t know. I don’t know, I’m not going to sit and tell you who’s right and who’s wrong, it’s funny when people think that’s okay as if it makes them better somehow, faith is what it is, it’s not my place to judge, it’s not your place to judge. Why do people care so much? Why do you care? I don’t care what you believe in, I think it’s awesome that you have your faith. I don’t sit and waste time casting judgements on other faiths, I just find it interesting that people like you do and got to wonder for what purpose, how could that possibly make your life any better? It’s crazy man, it makes no sense.

Paragraphs and punctuation are your friends…

I never said I don’t know. You do not need to lie to prove a point. You asked if I know EVERYTHING and I said no. Big difference. I know, for example, that Joseph was a false prophet. I do not know, for example, why you still fall for it.

And if you truly don’t care, why come to a debate board?

Your prophet said god was once a sinful man. He was wrong. He went against God.

 

[Porknpie]

, it’s all subjective … I don’t know.

Bryce, it’s not subjective…the Truth is found in the Catholic Church…not JS.

[BIBLEDRB]1 Timothy 3:15[/BIBLEDRB]

And the Holy Spirit has been with the Church…always…and until the end of time…guiding it to all Truth.

No apostasy,no great apostasy.

[BIBLEDRB]John 14:16[/BIBLEDRB]

 

[bryce33]

Never said it was or it wasn’t, and holy ****, you’re getting on my case over punctuation? Seriously? I’m hammering this out on my phone, talk about nitpicky. To be honest, I commented because I was reading what some of the over zealous intellectual nut jobs were writing and wanted to throw in my two cents. The person who started the thread directed his question to someone who was LDS, and I answered it. The lot of you care too much, for the hostile responses all I got to say is get over yourselves and quit taking this stuff dealing with my faith so seriously and so literal. We believe what we believe and you believe what you believe, perfect. You think trying to tell me what I believe is going to change anything? Do you think I’m out to convert you and I’m going to use my dark Jedi powers on you or something? Do you think anything you say is going to make a difference? So your Catholic, great. If I was born Catholic I’m sure I’d feel differently and have a different perspective on things. So a bunch of you are ex-Mormons, well cool, I know a lot of Catholics who are now Mormons. I just find it funny in forms like these where people feel like they need to prove other people wrong. It’s not a debate, and there are plenty of subjective things religious and otherwise that we deal with every day because we are human, because we’re different, because no one has a perfect understanding of all things, and because everyone can contribute a different perspective. Hey, I might not be a part of your little intellectual club here, but judging by your responses what you think you know and how it really is are two different things. In the end, it’s not going to change how you or I feel so can’t we just agree to disagree? There’s a bunch of haters out there, can’t we all just get along?

 

[bryce33]

SteveVH,

It’s funny that people care so much as to what other people believe, in a hostile way. Not one person in my circle of friends is LDS, and I find it refreshing that we can all contribute to each others’ views and deepen our perspectives on life without judging each other or having it be confrontational. Whether it be Muslim, or Buddhist, or Atheist, all of my friends respect each other and know that we have nothing to prove to each other. That’s the point I’m making, obviously it matters to me what I believe, but it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter to you. People go off in these forums like they’ve some expert on our faith, spouting off **** like it’ll make all the difference in the world. They’re hellbent on ramming their version of the truth down your throat like that’s any way to show respect to one and one’s faith. You know, I could be off praying to trees or worshiping turtles and for you it shouldn’t matter. The right thing, the human thing, the Christian thing would be to respect all people of all faiths and to not put them down to try and make yourself look better. What good does it do? Do people think it makes the look smarter, can they sleep better at night knowing they really showed that dumb Mormon how wrong he was? However you feel about your faith in God and your relationship with God is cool. I would never do or say anything to you that would attempt to demean or diminish the special relationship you have with God. Your prayers are personal and meaningful and I would never presume to to more or question that relationship that you have. These forums are vicious, are all non-Catholics treated this way or just Mormons? Again, I find it funny that people who profess to be Christian would attack what other people believe. God made all of us, do you think that’s how he wants it, are we not all of us God’s children? There’s some haters here. I get it, some are ex-Mormons, it didn’t work out for some reason or another, but why the venom? Crazy, it makes no sense.

 

[mtolympus]

If God is eternal and yet He had parents, how could He have no beginning and no end?

I don’t know. There is no revelation or LDS church doctrine to answer this question. All we know concerning the law of eternal progression is that: “Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.” (D&C 93:29)

We really don’t need more than this. Our salvation is only dependent on our relationship with God our Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost.

Thank you for reviewing for me your doctrine of the Trinity and how three persons can be one God. Now here is a hypothetical question:

If three persons can be one God, could 100 persons or 1,000,000+ persons be one God?

 

[TexanKnight]

Never said it was or it wasn’t, and holy ****, you’re getting on my case over punctuation?

Not really getting on your case, so there was no need to use foul language. It is simply not as easy to read when you do not use paragraphs.

Seriously? I’m hammering this out on my phone, talk about nitpicky.

Last night, I, too, was using my iphone. Making paragraphs is not difficult

To be honest, I commented because I was reading what some of the over zealous intellectual nut jobs were writing and wanted to throw in my two cents.

Ah…first the bad language and now the name calling? Yes…you certainly are Mormon

The person who started the thread directed his question to someone who was LDS, and I answered it. The lot of you care too much, for the hostile responses all I got to say is get over yourselves and quit taking this stuff dealing with my faith so seriously and so literal.

First, the only person who has sounded is you, with your name calling, etc. Second, this is a debate board. And guess what people do on a debate board? We debate. Third, this is a religious debate board…so guess what we debate? Wait for it…religion! And yes…when an alleged prophet talks, we SHOULD take it literally. THAT is the LDS problem…your alleged prophets talk and the rest of you have to decide what the heck he means so none of you believe the same thing. This is the best argument yet as to why there are no more prophets.

We believe what we believe and you believe what you believe, perfect. You think trying to tell me what I believe is going to change anything?

Stranger things have happened. Sometimes, people actually read stuff and THINK

Do you think I’m out to convert you and I’m going to use my dark Jedi powers on you or something?

I was LDS…there are no powers at all

Do you think anything you say is going to make a difference?

Maybe

So your Catholic, great.

Yes, it is.

If I was born Catholic I’m sure I’d feel differently and have a different perspective on things.

I was not born Catholic.

So a bunch of you are ex-Mormons, well cool, I know a lot of Catholics who are now Mormons.

Yes…there are some who lose their way and end up in a false Church. We pray for them as we pray for you

I just find it funny in forms like these where people feel like they need to prove other people wrong.

It is not a need. It just happens. And we have already proven the LDS Church wrong.

It’s not a debate, and there are plenty of subjective things religious and otherwise that we deal with every day because we are human,

True. But this IS a debate board. And this IS a religious debate board and you ARE a Mormon on a Catholic website. Please tell me you knew this stuff already

Hey, I might not be a part of your little intellectual club here,

But you could be. It is called coming home to the truth

but judging by your responses what you think you know and how it really is are two different things.

If that helps you sleep better at night…but we have already debunked that notion

In the end, it’s not going to change how you or I feel so can’t we just agree to disagree?

If I agree to heresy, then I am part of heresy. I will always speak out against it.

There’s a bunch of haters out there, can’t we all just get along?

Disagreeing does not make us enemies. I have many dear friends who are LDS. And we debate all the time. Though, they never use foul language and call me names…go figure.

 

[TexanKnight]

SteveVH,

It’s funny that people care so much as to what other people believe, in a hostile way. Not one person in my circle of friends is LDS, and I find it refreshing that we can all contribute to each others’ views and deepen our perspectives on life without judging each other or having it be confrontational. Whether it be Muslim, or Buddhist, or Atheist, all of my friends respect each other and know that we have nothing to prove to each other. That’s the point I’m making, obviously it matters to me what I believe, but it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter to you. People go off in these forums like they’ve some expert on our faith, spouting off **** like it’ll make all the difference in the world. They’re hellbent on ramming their version of the truth down your throat like that’s any way to show respect to one and one’s faith. You know, I could be off praying to trees or worshiping turtles and for you it shouldn’t matter. The right thing, the human thing, the Christian thing would be to respect all people of all faiths and to not put them down to try and make yourself look better. What good does it do? Do people think it makes the look smarter, can they sleep better at night knowing they really showed that dumb Mormon how wrong he was? However you feel about your faith in God and your relationship with God is cool. I would never do or say anything to you that would attempt to demean or diminish the special relationship you have with God. Your prayers are personal and meaningful and I would never presume to to more or question that relationship that you have. These forums are vicious, are all non-Catholics treated this way or just Mormons? Again, I find it funny that people who profess to be Christian would attack what other people believe. God made all of us, do you think that’s how he wants it, are we not all of us God’s children? There’s some haters here. I get it, some are ex-Mormons, it didn’t work out for some reason or another, but why the venom? Crazy, it makes no sense.

If these forums bother you, why be here? And if you want to see people REALLY treated poorly, go to LDS boards and see how Catholics are treated. You are given the royal treatment here compared to how Mormons treat Catholics on LDS boards. So, guess what? I do not go to those boards.

And please: stop calling what we say “venom”. There is no venom here…just truth. If you are to the point of calling truth venom, you need to look at where you are.

 

[TexanKnight]

I don’t know. There is no revelation or LDS church doctrine to answer this question. All we know concerning the law of eternal progression is that: “Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.” (D&C 93:29)

We really don’t need more than this. Our salvation is only dependent on our relationship with God our Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost.

Maybe so…but if it not important, why did your prophets teach it? And our relationship with God is only valuable if it is the TRUE God, not some ex-sinful man who worked his way to godhood

Thank you for reviewing for me your doctrine of the Trinity and how three persons can be one God. Now here is a hypothetical question:

If three persons can be one God, could 100 persons or 1,000,000+ persons be one God?

Ah…the red-herring argument. Not relevant since Triune means three…

 

[zaffiroborant]

SteveVH,

It’s funny that people care so much as to what other people believe, in a hostile way. Not one person in my circle of friends is LDS, and I find it refreshing that we can all contribute to each others’ views and deepen our perspectives on life without judging each other or having it be confrontational. Whether it be Muslim, or Buddhist, or Atheist, all of my friends respect each other and know that we have nothing to prove to each other. That’s the point I’m making, obviously it matters to me what I believe, but it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter to you. People go off in these forums** like they’ve some expert on our faith**, spouting off **** like it’ll make all the difference in the world. They’re hellbent on ramming their version of the truth down your throat like that’s any way to show respect to one and one’s faith. You know, I could be off praying to trees or worshiping turtles and for you it shouldn’t matter. The right thing, the human thing, the Christian thing would be to respect all people of all faiths and to not put them down to try and make yourself look better. What good does it do? Do people think it makes the look smarter, can they sleep better at night knowing they really showed that dumb Mormon how wrong he was?** However you feel about your faith in God and your relationship with God is cool. **I would never do or say anything to you that would attempt to demean or diminish the special relationship you have with God. Your prayers are personal and meaningful and I would never presume to to more or question that relationship that you have. These forums are vicious, are all non-Catholics treated this way or just Mormons? Again, I find it funny that people who profess to be Christian would attack what other people believe. God made all of us, do you think that’s how he wants it, are we not all of us God’s children? There’s some haters here. I get it, some are ex-Mormons, it didn’t work out for some reason or another, but why the venom? Crazy, it makes no sense.

You did not serve as an LDS missionary then, since they first and foremost tear down other Christians beliefs.

 

[TexanKnight]

You did not serve as an LDS missionary then, since they first and foremost tear down other Christians beliefs.

Yes…we did. Especially against the Catholics…

 

[lax16]

I don’t know. There is no revelation or LDS church doctrine to answer this question. All we know concerning the law of eternal progression is that: “Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.” (D&C 93:29)

We really don’t need more than this. Our salvation is only dependent on our relationship with God our Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost.

Thank you for reviewing for me your doctrine of the Trinity and how three persons can be one God. Now here is a hypothetical question:

If three persons can be one God, could 100 persons or 1,000,000+ persons be one God?

Hi myolympus - Joseph Smith also said:

“We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see” (Teachings, pg. 345).

We do need more than this because you are hanging all of your beliefs on a quote from a man named Joseph Smith instead of the words of Jesus Christ. Jesus established a Church that He promised would never fall away and you are following a different church.

Who is right - Joseph Smith or Jesus Christ?

If God wanted there to be 100 or 1,000,000+ persons in one God then it would be possible.
He chose the Trinity and revealed it in the life of Jesus Christ as we read in scripture. Why question it?

 

[lax16]

myolympus - Here are the other questions from my post:

Quote:
“Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.” (D&C 93:29)

**Does this come from any other source other than the revelations of Joseph Smith?
**

It seems that the BoM has a more traditional view of the Trinity than current LDS teaching- why is that?
For example, Alma 11:44, Mosiah 15:5-7, and 2 Nephi 31:21.
Also, in The Testimony of Three Witnesses at the beginning of the BoM, it says: “And the honor be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Ghost, which is one God. Amen.”

thanks!

 

[lax16]

It is funny that people care so much, you say you know but you don’t know, you might have faith in your beliefs and have found something that resonates with you, but you don’t know. Did you have an angel come down and spell it all out for you? You missed the point, it’s all subjective, because you don’t know. I don’t know, I’m not going to sit and tell you who’s right and who’s wrong, it’s funny when people think that’s okay as if it makes them better somehow, faith is what it is, it’s not my place to judge, it’s not your place to judge. Why do people care so much? Why do you care? I don’t care what you believe in, I think it’s awesome that you have your faith. I don’t sit and waste time casting judgements on other faiths, I just find it interesting that people like you do and got to wonder for what purpose, how could that possibly make your life any better? It’s crazy man, it makes no sense.

hi bryce - I care about what you (and everyone else for that matter) because Jesus wants me to care!

Catholics “know” we are right because Jesus promised that the Holy Spirit would stay with His Church until the end of time and we are His Church still moving forward 2,000 years later.

My life is 110% better because of Jesus Christ and His Church.

 

[lax16]

SteveVH,

It’s funny that people care so much as to what other people believe, in a hostile way. Not one person in my circle of friends is LDS, and I find it refreshing that we can all contribute to each others’ views and deepen our perspectives on life without judging each other or having it be confrontational. Whether it be Muslim, or Buddhist, or Atheist, all of my friends respect each other and know that we have nothing to prove to each other. That’s the point I’m making, obviously it matters to me what I believe, but it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter to you. People go off in these forums like they’ve some expert on our faith, spouting off **** like it’ll make all the difference in the world. They’re hellbent on ramming their version of the truth down your throat like that’s any way to show respect to one and one’s faith. You know, I could be off praying to trees or worshiping turtles and for you it shouldn’t matter. The right thing, the human thing, the Christian thing would be to respect all people of all faiths and to not put them down to try and make yourself look better. What good does it do? Do people think it makes the look smarter, can they sleep better at night knowing they really showed that dumb Mormon how wrong he was? However you feel about your faith in God and your relationship with God is cool. I would never do or say anything to you that would attempt to demean or diminish the special relationship you have with God. Your prayers are personal and meaningful and I would never presume to to more or question that relationship that you have. These forums are vicious, are all non-Catholics treated this way or just Mormons? Again, I find it funny that people who profess to be Christian would attack what other people believe. God made all of us, do you think that’s how he wants it, are we not all of us God’s children? There’s some haters here. I get it, some are ex-Mormons, it didn’t work out for some reason or another, but why the venom? Crazy, it makes no sense.

bryce - at this time the Mormon church has tens of thousands of missionaries going all around the world claiming to be the one true church.

You have got to expect some push-back, don’t you think?

 

[KathleenGee]

When I read that Mormons say they are the greatest challenge to the Catholic Church, I just have to turn my head.

I simply do not understand how people can believe in such a religion in regards to its practices, its on going morphing, its temples going 24/7 baptizing dead people…all the truth about Jesus Christ, its complete misrepresentation of the early Church Fathers, its recruiting tactics, its history of teachings and behaviors, its abusive condemnation of Catholicism and Christianity in general.

Over and over and over again, I see Catholics and other Christians come on here and totally defeat Mormonism, and the Mormons have such an unusual thinking apparatus, they don’t even see it when it happens.

For this reason, I prefer to spend more of my time now praying for the Mormon people.

 

[Anna_Scott]

SteveVH,

It’s funny that people care so much as to what other people believe, in a hostile way. Not one person in my circle of friends is LDS, and I find it refreshing that we can all contribute to each others’ views and deepen our perspectives on life without judging each other or having it be confrontational. Whether it be Muslim, or Buddhist, or Atheist, all of my friends respect each other and know that we have nothing to prove to each other. That’s the point I’m making, obviously it matters to me what I believe, but it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter to you. People go off in these forums like they’ve some expert on our faith, spouting off **** like it’ll make all the difference in the world. They’re hellbent on ramming their version of the truth down your throat like that’s any way to show respect to one and one’s faith. You know, I could be off praying to trees or worshiping turtles and for you it shouldn’t matter. The right thing, the human thing, the Christian thing would be to respect all people of all faiths and to not put them down to try and make yourself look better. What good does it do? Do people think it makes the look smarter, can they sleep better at night knowing they really showed that dumb Mormon how wrong he was? However you feel about your faith in God and your relationship with God is cool. I would never do or say anything to you that would attempt to demean or diminish the special relationship you have with God. Your prayers are personal and meaningful and I would never presume to to more or question that relationship that you have. These forums are vicious, are all non-Catholics treated this way or just Mormons? Again, I find it funny that people who profess to be Christian would attack what other people believe. God made all of us, do you think that’s how he wants it, are we not all of us God’s children? There’s some haters here. I get it, some are ex-Mormons, it didn’t work out for some reason or another, but why the venom? Crazy, it makes no sense.

bryce,

This is a Catholic forum, in which beliefs and doctrines are discussed and debated. People will disagree with you. That is the nature of debate and discussion. Disagreement does not equal hate or hostility.

I disagree with Catholics on a number of issues and have had some very spirited debates. I have participated on threads in which no one agreed with me; but this is, after all, a Catholic forum. Catholics will provide support for their beliefs and doctrines, just as non-Catholics are expected to do. This is the nature of debate.

Beliefs will be challenged on a religious forum, and we are all the better for it. Catholics are gracious enough to allow us to disagree with their doctrine and debate in a charitable way.

Name calling and accusatory comments are not only against forum rules, but they also hurt the credibility of your arguments. Maybe, just step back for a bit, and re-enter the discussion with support for your beliefs.

Anna

 

[RebeccaJ]

If three persons can be one God, could 100 persons or 1,000,000+ persons be one God?

No.

I recommend you read “The God of Jesus Christ” by Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger.

At the heart of this error you propose, is one where you make God a mere number. God is no longer a Person in this proposal but has become a function.

Since this is, basically, the Mormon view of God anyway, I can see why you are not the first or last Mormon to propose this idea. Thinking it is a clever idea. It is not. It is one of the saddest commentaries on your thought process about God that you could possibly come up with.

 

[kimg901]

Wow Bryce33. It seems the truth hurts. You say you believe in Jesus Christ, His Father and the Holy Spirit but yet you are a mormon. To be a mormon is to believe Christ lied to all of us. You rather trust in a known con man and other things he was called but not in Christ. And dont try and say that “I do beleive in Christ”. Because if you did, we wouldnt be having this discussion. You are decieved and your soul will pay the price for it. And answer me this. Why does what your past prophets taught no longer mean anything? It seems like when a prophet dies, his teachings go with him? Im going to give you a list and if you can answer any of them with a yes, then your not a follower of Christ.

1: God was once a sinful man.
2: God came down and had intercourse with Mary.
3: Joseph did more for the church than Christ did.
4: You will become a god after death and inherit a planet
5: God is a racist.
6: We can only enter Heaven if J.S gives his okay.
7: White people were more valiant than dark skinned people in the pre-life.
8: You believe what your prophets say is true.

 

[TexanKnight]

Wow Bryce33. It seems the truth hurts. You say you believe in Jesus Christ, His Father and the Holy Spirit but yet you are a mormon. To be a mormon is to believe Christ lied to all of us. You rather trust in a known con man and other things he was called but not in Christ. And dont try and say that “I do beleive in Christ”. Because if you did, we wouldnt be having this discussion. You are decieved and your soul will pay the price for it. And answer me this. Why does what your past prophets taught no longer mean anything? It seems like when a prophet dies, his teachings go with him? Im going to give you a list and if you can answer any of them with a yes, then your not a follower of Christ.

1: God was once a sinful man.
2: God came down and had intercourse with Mary.
3: Joseph did more for the church than Christ did.
4: You will become a god after death and inherit a planet
5: God is a racist.
6: We can only enter Heaven if J.S gives his okay.
7: White people were more valiant than dark skinned people in the pre-life.
8: You believe what your prophets say is true.

if he is a true Mormon following true LDS Doctrine and teachings of his prophets, he MUST answer yes to all those questions. No to any of them means he rejects his prophets