Question for Muslims about the radicals who use the name

[jimmy]

Faith101:

Mohamed’s message is the same message of Abraham and Moses and Jesus…so to a growing 1.2 billion people on this earth, he was not a false prophet, but the last messenger in a line of messengers

According to Mohammed it is the same. According to the ancient documents it is not. Jesus’ teachings were the same as Christians according to the documents of the first few centuries.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

Faith101:

hey Dan

Ahhh i see. So you believe that Islam started out by killing anyone who didnt convert? And now, astonishingly, thousands of people are accepting it as their way of life without any kind of force …sounds kind of odd.

What I am trying to tell you, is that it is the message of Mohamed (not his sword) that people hundred of years ago in arabia found to be the truth, and so they followed him and submitted to God. This is the same way people in America are coming to Islam…by recognizing the truth. No force then, no force now.

Mohamed (pbuh) never forced anyone to convert…it is against the teachings of Islam…In the Quran, God says:

**Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. **((THe Holy Quran 2:256)

I know i tend to babble on so please let me know if there is somthing you dont undestand in what i wrote…

Look, I quite realize that many people over the years converted because they believed what was taught. I know that many convert today because they come to believe. But you are simply confused or are a complet liar to tell us that Muhammad never used the sword to convert people. You are confused or a liar that it isn’t happening today. When you admit these then we can talk. Until then I don’t trust you.

Dan L

 

[jimmy]

Faith101:

hey Dan

Ahhh i see. So you believe that Islam started out by killing anyone who didnt convert? And now, astonishingly, thousands of people are accepting it as their way of life without any kind of force …sounds kind of odd.

You can say that about any religion. Thousands, maybe even millions, of people are accepting Catholicism with no force.

What I am trying to tell you, is that it is the message of Mohamed (not his sword) that people hundred of years ago in arabia found to be the truth, and so they followed him and submitted to God. This is the same way people in America are coming to Islam…by recognizing the truth. No force then, no force now.

I would disagree that Mike Tyson converted to Islam because he found truth in it.

 

[fatuma]

jimmy

r.gonzales said:
anyone can quote timeline events. but unless you actually read the historical accounts of these events you’ll never truly know whether islam spread by the sword or not. and people will be able to put whatever twist or apply whatever interpretation they wish to these events. as for the assertion that islam was forced upon those the muslims conquered, this is not true and forcing people to accept islam is against what Allah mentions in the Quran, “there is no compulsion in religion.” (2:256). anyone who checks the Quranic exegisis will find that this is what this verse refers to: forcing peope to accept islam.

wa salam

 

[Faith101]

jimmy:

You can say that about any religion. Thousands, maybe even millions, of people are accepting Catholicism with no force.

I would disagree that Mike Tyson converted to Islam because he found truth in it.

I really dont know anything about Mike Tyson…lol i didnt even know he was Muslim.

In all honesty, i have met many many converts to Islam whose faith amazes me. As one girl explained to me, she said " you can truly appreciate the light when you have been living your entire life in darkness"

I wasnt aware that catholicism was growing…do you have current statistics on that (just interested!)

 

[Faith101]

GregoryPalamas:

I would very much like to believe that Islam can take its place among the great religions of the world. I would very much like to believe that Islam can confine itself to reasonable discourse and use reason and pray rather than war to gain converts. I know that most of the Muslims I’ve met seem to be peace loving pursuers of truth. Yet, as more and more of my questions are ignored I suspect they are ignored because they cannot be answered. I suspect that world-wide Islam needs to clean up its act before it can be taken seriously by serious people.

But I’ll give it another try. Please answer my questions above.

Dan L

Hey Dan

You should post your questions on whyislam.org/forum

There are a bunch of knowledgeble Muslims who know a lot more than me…who can help answer your questions God willing.

Please post it there and maybe copy and paste their answers here if you like.

Something that I do almost daily (or at least try to!) is check my intentions. If I am giving charity so people can see me and think highly of me, then its really fruitless. If i am asking questions, then my intention should be to seek the truth. I am reminded of this from time to time to check my intentions when i neglect to and it does help. I encourage you to do the same

 

[siamesecat]

jimmy:

Islam is getting people like Mike Tyson to convert. They are not getting the devout people to convert.

One reason why it is the fastest growing in the US is because it is one of the smallest. Small religions grow fast. If you have 5 people, and you get 5 people to join you, that is 100% growth.

Ummmm…Islam is the biggest religion in the world.

 

[jimmy]

siamesecat:

Ummmm…Islam is the biggest religion in the world.

No it isn’t, Christianity is. Christianity has over 800 million more people than Islam.

 

[Faith101]

jimmy:

No it isn’t, Christianity is. Christianity has over 800 million more people than Islam.

I believe there are more sunni muslims than catholic christians

In all honesty…numbers dont mean too much…i only brought up the fact that Islam is the fastest growing religion in order to bring up the fact that no one in America has anything **material ** to gain from being a Muslim (only the opposite is true, they face harrassment and isolation from their families much of the time)…so why are they converting? B/c Truth stands out clear from error…some people recognize it and some people do not

In the end, we will all know any way…thats another like what 70 years more if your lucky

 

[Faith101]

jimmy:

Islam is getting people like Mike Tyson to convert. They are not getting the devout people to convert.

One reason why it is the fastest growing in the US is because it is one of the smallest. Small religions grow fast. If you have 5 people, and you get 5 people to join you, that is 100% growth.

Read up on these men…just to name a few

famousmuslims.com/Yusuf%20Estes.htm

Or this man iiie.net/Brochures/Brochure-17.html

Jimmy, this is advice from me to you. Try not to tell a Muslim that the majority of converts to Islam are previously non-devout bad people…b/c chances are that muslim will know of several converts that are extremly pious and devout…so if you tell them this, they will not listen to anything you say. If you seek the truth, than speak only truth.

 

[r.gonzales]

greetings.

GregoryPalamas:

In other words, “convert or die”.

actually no. this is what you infer from what i wrote. fighting does not necessitate forced conversion. in fighting their opponents the aim would be to defeat them or to subdue them into surrender, not to forcibly convert them to islam. the choice to surrender doesn’t necessitate forced conversion either. if the people who the muslims came to were from the people of the Book (i.e., jews or christians) they were given the choice to stay, pay the jizyah, keep their religion, their wealth, their property. them and their families would live under muslim rule and protection. if they weren’t from the people of the Book they would be made to leave the conquered land. there is nothing in the religion that condones forcing someone to accept islam. and as i’ve mentioned above, the Quran states that one shouldn’t be forced to do so (ref. Quran, 2:256).

GregoryPalamas:

How is this not spreading Islam by the sword? There are documents upon documents showing that entire Jewish and Christian towns were wiped out or the people were systematically killed by Muslims before the people “converted” to even begin to take seriously your denial that such happened.

really? i’d like to see these documents if available online.

GregoryPalamas:

The issue is not whether Islam grew by attacking with the sword. The issue is “When will you stop?” When you will Muslims stop killing people in order to “convert” the survivors? Christians are more than willing to forgive but you also must stop.

quite amusing how you totally ignored the part of my post where i said, “the first of which was to call them to islam. to send people to them inviting them to accept Allah’s word and embrace islam.” not every peoples the muslims came to refused the call. there were also many who lived under muslim rule for many years, keeping their religion, then converting later after witnessing the daily conduct of the muslims and their way of life.

 

[manx]

Faith101:

Hello tom.wineman

Islam was spread by the sword? Please back this up.

Islam is the world’s fastest growing religion, here in the US and elsewhere. What is the reason for this? Are these people forced to convert?

Hi,

I think what the other people mean is that why do Muslims always say that your religion is peaceful but if we check the history, early muslims were involved in many battles. Maybe they did not forcefully convert (I need to find some proof for this) their fallen enemies but what are the battles for?

thanks,

manx

 

[GregoryPalamas]

r.gonzales,

I don’t know whether to bother to respond or not. You take obvious situations of brutality and pretend that they are harmless and benign. I don’t know if you are willing to read but I have suggested several titles. If you live in America you have the wonderful privilege of a vast and broad education. I pray that you avail yourself of it. If not there are still books you can read.

Whether or not you and other Muslims on this thread like to read books I will suggest a couple of website that you and anyone else might wish to explore.

www.Dhimmi.com

www.Jihadwatch.org

Dan L

 

[Lance]

Let’s not worry about what Christianity or Islam did 1000 years or more ago. Let’s look at the world trouble spots today and what religion is causing the trouble.

1.Middle East-Islam.
2.Philippines-Islam
3.Indonesia-Islam
4.Pakistan-Islam
5.Sudan-Islam
6.Chechnya-Islam
8.Afghanistan-Islam
9.Bosnia-Islam/Christianity
10.Cote d’ Ivoire-Islam
11.North Korea-Atheism

In todays world there is no way Islam is a religion of peace.

 

[Booklover]

Faith101:

Mohamed’s message is the same message of Abraham and Moses and Jesus…so to a growing 1.2 billion people on this earth, he was not a false prophet, but the last messenger in a line of messengers

---

**BALONEY! MOHAMMED’S MESSAGE IS IN NO WAY COMPARABLE TO JESUS’! SHOW US THE “PROOF” THAT HE WAS A “PROPHET”! HE CERTAINLY DIDN’T ACT LIKE ANY OF THE REAL PROPHETS. THEY DIDN’T GO AROUND KILLING PEOPLE LIKE HE DID.

---

AGAIN I ASK, SHOW US THE PROOF!

YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST AND I DON’T BELIEVE IN MOHAMMED WHOSE HIS LIFE WAS MARKED BY INNUMERABLE MARRIAGES AND GREAT LICENTIOUSNESS, DEEDS OF RAPINE, WARFARE, CONQUESTS AND UNMERCIFUL BUTCHERIES, ALL THE TIME INVOKING GOD’S HOLY NAME!

WORLDLY AMBITION GRADUALLY BLINDED MOHAMMED’S MIND AND OVERWHELMED HIS SEARCHES FOR THE TRUE GOD!

MOHAMMED AGAIN AND AGAIN JUSTIFED HIS RAPINE AND LICENTIOUSNESS WITH “NEW REVELATIONS”. HE IS NOT A TRUE PROPHET AND NEVER WAS.

**

 

[Booklover]

Lance:

Let’s not worry about what Christianity or Islam did 1000 years or more ago. Let’s look at the world trouble spots today and what religion is causing the trouble.

1.Middle East-Islam.
2.Philippines-Islam
3.Indonesia-Islam
4.Pakistan-Islam
5.Sudan-Islam
6.Chechnya-Islam
8.Afghanistan-Islam
9.Bosnia-Islam/Christianity
10.Cote d’ Ivoire-Islam
11.North Korea-Atheism

In todays world there is no way Islam is a religion of peace

AGREED!

 

[Booklover]

Faith101:

hey Dan

What I am trying to tell you, is that it is the message of Mohamed (not his sword) that people hundred of years ago in arabia found to be the truth, and so they followed him and submitted to God. This is the same way people in America are coming to Islam…by recognizing the truth. No force then, no force now.

Mohamed (pbuh) never forced anyone to convert…it is against the teachings of Islam…In the Quran, God says:

**Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. **((THe Holy Quran 2:256)

I know i tend to babble on so please let me know if there is somthing you dont undestand in what i wrote…

You don’t really expect us to believe all this nonsense do you?

 

[Munawar]

manx:

I think what the other people mean is that why do Muslims always say that your religion is peaceful but if we check the history, early muslims were involved in many battles. Maybe they did not forcefully convert (I need to find some proof for this) their fallen enemies but what are the battles for?

Hi Manx,

Every battle the Prophet Muhammad fought, was against foes who had attacked him first.

Never did the Prophet enter a land except that they had attacked him first.

Munawar

 

[Munawar]

Booklover:

You don’t really expect us to believe all this nonsense do you?

Hi Booklover,

That’s your opinion. Bring your references and facts that prove this is nonsense, and then we can discuss further.

Munawar

 

[true2one]

The truth is, Mohammed (Pbuh) was spreading Islam in peace. As people started WILLINGLY to follow him, the kings and priests were so upset and started to attack Mohammed (Pbuh) and his followers. Innocent women and children who reverted were slaughtered so there was no other way than to raise the sword to protect the innocent.
Naturally, noone could stop or kill prophet Mohammed, and the only way to stop people from reverting is to turn the facts around, that Mohammed (Pbuh) attacked first to gain followers. That’s the short version.
As for the people in the countries mentioned, let us visit one country at a time.
Middle East: Any government can be greedy of power, not just in the middle east.
Indonesia: there is no big issue there except for the corrupt government and that Christians are trying to convert Muslims in a scrupulous kind of way.
Philippines: Misguided extremists trying to “change” the world.
Bosnia: Minorities (Muslims) slaughtered/ethnical cleansing.
Pakistan: border issue and arms race with india
Afghanistan: Muslim extremists that even Islam oppose of. Naming religion for their misconducts.
ETC, ETC, ETC…