Question for the Sedevacantist: stay on topic!!

  • Thread starter Thread starter terillmorris
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
T

terillmorris

Guest
ok—I have a question for the sedevacantist-----(let’s try to stay on topic here --please dont answer my question with a question just simply answer the question) Most sedevacantists believe the last Pope was Pius XII. for over 500 years the Church law has been that the Cardinals elect the Pope. The oldest Cardinals alive are appointed by Paul VI (who you do not believe is a valid Pope) so there are no cardinals alive(according to you). Who is going to elect the next Pope in your opinion and why??? also it has been over 50 years–if there are electors alive(whoever they may be) why havent they elected a Pope??? ssssssssshhhhhh let the sedevacantist answer---------ssssssshhhhhh
 
terillmorris said:
Most sedevacantists believe the last Pope was Pius XII. for over 500 years the Church law has been that the Cardinals elect the Pope. The oldest Cardinals alive are appointed by Paul VI (who you do not believe is a valid Pope) so there are no cardinals alive(according to you). Who is going to elect the next Pope in your opinion and why???
Click to expand...
You admit that this practice or discipline has only taken place for the last 500 years, leaving the previous 1500 years open to different avenues of election.
We have never seen the likes of these particular times before, i.e. an extended Papal Interregnum in which there are anti-popes (false claimants) reigning from Rome.
These are extraordinary times and it would require extraordinary measures on the part of our Lord to fix it. It does take trust in divine providence to believe that if there is another Pope, the Lord will, himself, have to provide one for us. The more likely circumstance is that the current situation will end on a more apocalyptic note (my opinion), given that we are obviously living in the age of the Great Apostasy, where people will not hear sound doctrine.
also it has been over 50 years–if there are electors alive(whoever they may be) why havent they elected a Pope???
Click to expand...
The reason why no one has elected a pope is because of the tumultuous nature of our times.
The current situation is one of Chaos. You may think that the Lord would never let that happen. Chaotic situations have happened before, and no one thought they could, nor knew how they would end.
The disarray and lack of leadership is a consequence for the sins of the world. This is hard to believe for the average Vatican II “catholic”. Given the lack of participation in the confessionals at VII church’s worldwide, it shows us that many people don’t think they really commit sins. According to the average Novus Ordo “catholic”, in today’s world, sin is very rare and God will forgive everyone, even if a person isn’t particularly sorry, because He is infinitely merciful.
God is also infinitely Just, and it seems like a just punishment for mine and your sins, to take away the Head of our Church so that there will be confusion, and the weak will be deceived and believe error. The people who adhere to sound doctrine will be proven to Him through perseverance.

Thanks
 
jim28 said:
You admit that this practice or discipline has only taken place for the last 500 years, leaving the previous 1500 years open to different avenues of election.
We have never seen the likes of these particular times before, i.e. an extended Papal Interregnum in which there are anti-popes (false claimants) reigning from Rome.
These are extraordinary times and it would require extraordinary measures on the part of our Lord to fix it. It does take trust in divine providence to believe that if there is another Pope, the Lord will, himself, have to provide one for us. The more likely circumstance is that the current situation will end on a more apocalyptic note (my opinion), given that we are obviously living in the age of the Great Apostasy, where people will not hear sound doctrine.

The reason why no one has elected a pope is because of the tumultuous nature of our times.
The current situation is one of Chaos. You may think that the Lord would never let that happen. Chaotic situations have happened before, and no one thought they could, nor knew how they would end.
The disarray and lack of leadership is a consequence for the sins of the world. This is hard to believe for the average Vatican II “catholic”. Given the lack of participation in the confessionals at VII church’s worldwide, it shows us that many people don’t think they really commit sins. According to the average Novus Ordo “catholic”, in today’s world, sin is very rare and God will forgive everyone, even if a person isn’t particularly sorry, because He is infinitely merciful.
God is also infinitely Just, and it seems like a just punishment for mine and your sins, to take away the Head of our Church so that there will be confusion, and the weak will be deceived and believe error. The people who adhere to sound doctrine will be proven to Him through perseverance.

Thanks
Click to expand...
Ok well you didnt directly answer my question but it seems(correct me if i am wrong) that you are saying that we have know way of knowing (sheer of God coming down from heaven and writing it in the sky) how/ when a Pope will be elected
 
terillmorris said:
Ok well you didnt directly answer my question but it seems(correct me if i am wrong) that you are saying that we have know way of knowing (sheer of God coming down from heaven and writing it in the sky) how/ when a Pope will be elected
Click to expand...
I did answer your question.
We do not have to elect a pope through the College of Cardinals. That’s why I pointed out that we haven’t always done it that way. There was a point in Church History where the laity help elect the Pope.

The College of Cardinals may be extinct but that does not prove anything. We do not need them to elect a pope.

Why would it be so hard to believe that God could write it in the sky or come down from heaven, as you say, and give us a new pope.
Look at all the miraculous events that have happened in the Church, beginning with Christ, then the Apostles, then the saints and apparitions (Fatima’s miracle of the sun). Why is it so hard to believe that something just as miraculous as the sun plummeting from the sky, could happen to elect the pope?
 
jim28 said:
I did answer your question.
We do not have to elect a pope through the College of Cardinals. That’s why I pointed out that we haven’t always done it that way. There was a point in Church History where the laity help elect the Pope.

The College of Cardinals may be extinct but that does not prove anything. We do not need them to elect a pope.

Why would it be so hard to believe that God could write it in the sky or come down from heaven, as you say, and give us a new pope.
Look at all the miraculous events that have happened in the Church, beginning with Christ, then the Apostles, then the saints and apparitions (Fatima’s miracle of the sun). Why is it so hard to believe that something just as miraculous as the sun plummeting from the sky, could happen to elect the pope?
Click to expand...
ok fine so basically your saying you dont know how the next Pope will be elected?
 
jim28 said:
so
are you saying that has never happened before?
Click to expand...
no I am asking you to be specific on how a next Pope would be lected–you havent answered it-- dont talk about what hapened before–how it wasnt always the Cardinals,—=how will you know when the next Pope is elected? who will do the electing? if you dont know say u dont know:eek:
 
terillmorris said:
no I am asking you to be specific on how a next Pope would be lected–you havent answered it-- dont talk about what hapened before–how it wasnt always the Cardinals,—=how will you know when the next Pope is elected? who will do the electing? if you dont know say u dont know:eek:
Click to expand...
i don’t know
what’s your point
 
terillmorris said:
what is the point in the Papacy as a doctrine if the faithful cant know how a Pope is elected?
HINT: YOUR POSITION IS WRONG!!!:confused:
Click to expand...
The fact that you won’t allow any of the facts of history in the conversation shows that you are not interested in the facts. You just want to say it’s wrong, offer no proof, and try to look smart.

HINT: YOU CAN’T PROVE MY POSITION WRONG 👍
 
terillmorris said:
what is the point in the Papacy as a doctrine if the faithful cant know how a Pope is elected?
HINT: YOUR POSITION IS WRONG!!!:confused:
Click to expand...
Oh goody, a preset mind. As if we needed another.
Look, we been through all this in the recent past. Go look it up.

Your own Catechism tells you what will happen to the Church during the end times.
The only position on which we may differ is WHEN that time will be. The Catechism gives no help on that other than when such a condition begins to develop would become evident. But since it is a “SUPREME deception” [CCC] wouldn’t it be reasonable to realize that most will NOT recognize it? Which of course may include you and yours. Otherwise SUPREME" has no practical meaning.
Would you class a pope seen as pope but not the Vicar of Christ as a “SUPREME” deception?
So making infallible statements such as “YOUR POSITION IS WRONG!!!” isn’t convincing anyone.
The Sede position is that it is now in progress, You, I suppose, on the other hand, deny it either completely or that it will be sometime in the distant future, but NOT now…even though the signs are there as many Sede’s see it.

How far down the tubes must the Church fall to convince you that something ain’t right here?

Now with that said, there will probably be no Pope forthcoming (and implied by the CCC).
That’s not infallible, just statistically probable.

And if Daniel has any say in it, we’ll probably lose the “continual sacrifice” as well.
 
TNT said:
Oh goody, a preset mind. As if we needed another.
Look, we been through all this in the recent past. Go look it up.

Your own Catechism tells you what will happen to the Church during the end times.
The only position on which we may differ is WHEN that time will be. The Catechism gives no help on that other than when such a condition begins to develop would become evident. But since it is a “SUPREME deception” [CCC] wouldn’t it be reasonable to realize that most will NOT recognize it? Which of course may include you and yours. Otherwise SUPREME" has no practical meaning.
Would you class a pope seen as pope but not the Vicar of Christ as a “SUPREME” deception?
So making infallible statements such as “YOUR POSITION IS WRONG!!!” isn’t convincing anyone.
The Sede position is that it is now in progress, You, I suppose, on the other hand, deny it either completely or that it will be sometime in the distant future, but NOT now…even though the signs are there as many Sede’s see it.

How far down the tubes must the Church fall to convince you that something ain’t right here?

Now with that said, there will probably be no Pope forthcoming (and implied by the CCC).
That’s not infallible, just statistically probable.

And if Daniel has any say in it, we’ll probably lose the “continual sacrifice” as well.
Click to expand...
LOL TNT YOUR FUNNY!!! I cant let you get away with it though!!! Your assuming we are in the “days of deception” and the catechism says nothing about the present (doesnt even hint it) sedevacantist position. matter of fact please directly quote the passage from the catechism.—still waiting on how your Pope will be elected?
 
TNT do you admit that the sedevacantist has no way of knowing how the next Pope will be elected? it is a simple yes or no question.
 
TNT said:
Oh goody, a preset mind. As if we needed another.
Look, we been through all this in the recent past. Go look it up.

Your own Catechism tells you what will happen to the Church during the end times.
The only position on which we may differ is WHEN that time will be. The Catechism gives no help on that other than when such a condition begins to develop would become evident. But since it is a “SUPREME deception” [CCC] wouldn’t it be reasonable to realize that most will NOT recognize it? Which of course may include you and yours. Otherwise SUPREME" has no practical meaning.

Would you class a pope seen as pope but not the Vicar of Christ as a “SUPREME” deception?
So making infallible statements such as “YOUR POSITION IS WRONG!!!” isn’t convincing anyone.
The Sede position is that it is now in progress, You, I suppose, on the other hand, deny it either completely or that it will be sometime in the distant future, but NOT now…even though the signs are there as many Sede’s see it.

How far down the tubes must the Church fall to convince you that something ain’t right here?

Now with that said, there will probably be no Pope forthcoming (and implied by the CCC).
That’s not infallible, just statistically probable.

And if Daniel has any say in it, we’ll probably lose the “continual sacrifice” as well.
Click to expand...
At last, the veil has dropped.

SUPREME deception - as in the American bean-counter way of life. The NUMBERS count? The teeny tiny group of sedes are “true” because there are so few of them? Sure.

A supreme deception could far more easily be defined as some of the faithful turning against the chair of Peter, the Holy Father himself - but we’re in the United States, so rely on the NUMBERS. Sure. How “American” and how “modern.”
 
Thanks Cath but i dont want mr TNT to get off the subject–I want him to answer–how is the next Pope going to be elected??? who is doing the electing? just answer who and how TNT------STICK TO THE SUBJECT----
 
terillmorris said:
Thanks Cath but i dont want mr TNT to get off the subject–I want him to answer–how is the next Pope going to be elected??? who is doing the electing? just answer who and how TNT------STICK TO THE SUBJECT----
Click to expand...
… and I’ll add: Who determined the chair is empty?
 
catharina said:
… and I’ll add: Who determined the chair is empty?
Click to expand...
NICE POINT!!! they did----but let’s not let them get confused----I want them to answer how a new Pope will be elected? and what is their basis for their answer—(dont worry I have a response for their response)
 
terillmorris said:
NICE POINT!!! they did----but let’s not let them get confused----I want them to answer how a new Pope will be elected? and what is their basis for their answer—(dont worry I have a response for their response)
Click to expand...
Either Christ Himself will have to show us or elect the Pope Himself.
Or the world will end and the last Judgement will take place.
 
terillmorris said:
NICE POINT!!! they did----but let’s not let them get confused----I want them to answer how a new Pope will be elected? and what is their basis for their answer—(dont worry I have a response for their response)
Click to expand...
Believe me, I seldom worry. There’s little pointWorry about sedes? Never.
 
jim28 said:
Either Christ Himself will have to show us or elect the Pope Himself.
Or the world will end and the last Judgement will take place.
Click to expand...
Again, I ask: Who determined the chair is (presumably) empty?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top