Question regarding Anointing of the Sick

[dfp42]

I have questions regarding who is able to receive the anointing of the sick? What conditions must apply if any for one to receive this?

Also, does it need to be requested by the person who is sick themselves? I often think of situations with an old person who could be a fallen away Catholic continues on in a nursing home and doesn’t ask for this and ends up being put on morphine etc and doesn’t know what’s going on. Who then if anyone should call in a priest? Also, if a priest can be called, shouldn’t the person want that? I’m thinking about a situation where there are divided faiths among the family members where some who are Catholic want their love ones to get last rites vs others who say no no. Does it depend on the person who is actually sick and to what extent?

The main reason I ask is because my wife’s grandmother is a Catholic and in a elderly nursing home. She needs help eating her food and getting out of bed etc. Her son who is a fallen away Catholic doesn’t practice the faith himself but is responsible for paying her bills at the nursing home and calling the shots so to say. My wife and I worry because when it may come down to getting the last rites, her grandmother in weak condition and her son might not do it or ask etc. Should anything be done in theses situations? It makes me wonder if I should write a letter now so that my family members know for a fact I want the anointing of the sick if I’m in a weak state of mind.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Technically anyone can receive anointing. Of course its purpose is for healing and the graces you receive is for healing, therefore you shouldn’t be asking for anointing if you’re fully healthy, mind, body and soul.

Anyone can ask for this for anyone else. If someone in your care is too sick or already unconcious, they can still receive anointing. Of course one must be baptized to receive this.

Since your wife’s grandmother is indeed family, you have every right to pursue this. Why not talk to her about it?

 

[dfp42]

We have talked about it, but I tend to notice that religion isn’t talked much around her dad and grandmother. I respect both of them very much. My wife says she is Catholic and it’s clear by the rosaries hanging on the wall and pictures of Jesus etc. But it’s almost as if there’s a dense silence on things with talking about religion or the faith with her grandmother or her dad since he’s not practicing anymore. I feel as if the truth is being suppressed and nothing is being said. I don’t know peoples hearts, but worry about her grandmother. I wonder, is it normal or ok to skip out on receiving the anointing of the sick? She is in a state where she can’t remember things or talk very well. She needs help going to the bathroom and eating her dinner. We visit her a few times a week. She is living in a Presbyterian care place and we are unsure if she receives the Eucharist or not. Is there an age limit where you don’t need the Eucharist anymore or to attend mass? We worry about what we should do.

 

[Oneofthewomen]

We have talked about it, but I tend to notice that religion isn’t talked much around her dad and grandmother. I respect both of them very much. My wife says she is Catholic and it’s clear by the rosaries hanging on the wall and pictures of Jesus etc. But it’s almost as if there’s a dense silence on things with talking about religion or the faith with her grandmother or her dad since he’s not practicing anymore. I feel as if the truth is being suppressed and nothing is being said. I don’t know peoples hearts, but worry about her grandmother. I wonder, is it normal or ok to skip out on receiving the anointing of the sick? She is in a state where she can’t remember things or talk very well. She needs help going to the bathroom and eating her dinner. We visit her a few times a week. She is living in a Presbyterian care place and we are unsure if she receives the Eucharist or not. Is there an age limit where you don’t need the Eucharist anymore or to attend mass? We worry about what we should do.

I work in a skilled nursing facility (nursing home). Please talk to the Social Worker or Activities Director at the facility where your wives grandmother is a resident. Most SNF’s
have relationships with many of the local churches because, even when the home is run by a particular denomination, there is often a mix of religious affiliations.

Many elderly people, especially those who have dementia related illnesses, may not want or may react badly to “anointing of the sick” as it used to be, pre-VII, “Last Rites” and something that you only did if you were at “death’s door”. There are a lot of mis-conceptions out there regarding this sacrament, and adding age & dementia to the mix can sometimes make for a volitle mix. It is best to take your cues from Grandma. Ask the SW or AD to have the preist stop by the next time he is there (may homes have a priest who comes in at least once a month) or talk to your own priest, and see if he is willing to make a trip to see her.

This is a very big issue with me. I see many elderly people not getting the pastoral care that they want/need, and many times it is because the rest of the family is “fallen away” or think that the “loved one” is too far gone to realize what they are missing.

One of the most beautiful things I ever saw was a woman, who was non-communicative,
rarely spoke other than non-sensically, and seemed to have no idea of her surroundings, light up and pray along with a small group that was doing the rosary. No one had ever brought her to the Rosary Group becasue they thought she would have no idea what was going on.

Oh, how God proved us all wrong that day!!

 

[jjbulano]

When my mother-in-law fell and broke her hip, her sons called the Rectory and had a Priest come and annoint her. She was conscious and very appreciative. She did not go to Mass at her Parish after the accident, but did watch the Mass on EWTN. When she had a massive stroke, they called their Priest right away. Annointing of the sick is a sacrament for healing, and it doesn’t really matter if she is conscious of what is happening, she will receive the same benefit from God and the Holy Spirit. You should never stop receiving Communion (unless you have committed a mortal sin that you have not confessed), but her ability to chew and swallow should be taken into consideration (don’t want her to choke on the Host). If you don’t know what Parish she might have attended, ask the administrator of the facility where she is living what provisions they have for a Catholic Priest to visit residents. They should be able to tell you what Parish they call to have a Priest come in (if one doesn’t automatically visit Catholic residents), and the administrator should be able to help you and your wife should arrange to meet and talk with him. The Priest will be able to advise you on a number of matters and answer your questions. God Bless you for your concerns for her immortal soul and for even thinking about what she might want.

 

[PJM]

=dfp42;7428695]I have questions regarding who is able to receive the anointing of the sick? What conditions must apply if any for one to receive this?

Also, does it need to be requested by the person who is sick themselves? I often think of situations with an old person who could be a fallen away Catholic continues on in a nursing home and doesn’t ask for this and ends up being put on morphine etc and doesn’t know what’s going on. Who then if anyone should call in a priest? Also, if a priest can be called, shouldn’t the person want that? I’m thinking about a situation where there are divided faiths among the family members where some who are Catholic want their love ones to get last rites vs others who say no no. Does it depend on the person who is actually sick and to what extent?

The main reason I ask is because my wife’s grandmother is a Catholic and in a elderly nursing home. She needs help eating her food and getting out of bed etc. Her son who is a fallen away Catholic doesn’t practice the faith himself but is responsible for paying her bills at the nursing home and calling the shots so to say. My wife and I worry because when it may come down to getting the last rites, her grandmother in weak condition and her son might not do it or ask etc. Should anything be done in theses situations? It makes me wonder if I should write a letter now so that my family members know for a fact I want the anointing of the sick if I’m in a weak state of mind.

Ayone can orginate the request, BUT it will have to have the assent of the person receiving the Sacrament to take effect. IF the subject is unwilling, the priest needs to be so advised BEFORE he gets to where the Sacrament is to be preformed.

As to who is eligible:

Anyone near death due to age or sickness;

Anyone facing a serious operaton that COULD possibly die from it, [even if ONLY a SLIGHT probablity of death may ensue].

These are “The Norms!”

There are other possibilites BUT they should be dicussed with the priest who must make the final call of the possibility.

Start by asking Grandma, if she would like to recive the Sacrament. The permission of the son is not, in an absolute sense required. If she say’s YES, thn I’d suggest you so inform the son. If he outs up a fuss; discuss it with he priest AND DO IT ANYWAY!

It OUGHT to Grandma’s decison SO LONG as she is mentally capable of mking such a decission.

God Bless all of you!
Pat

 

[puzzleannie]

I The main reason I ask is because my wife’s grandmother is a Catholic and in a elderly nursing home. She needs help eating her food and getting out of bed etc. Her son who is a fallen away Catholic doesn’t practice the faith himself but is responsible for paying her bills at the nursing home and calling the shots so to say. My wife and I worry because when it may come down to getting the last rites, her grandmother in weak condition and her son might not do it or ask etc. Should anything be done in theses situations? It makes me wonder if I should write a letter now so that my family members know for a fact I want the anointing of the sick if I’m in a weak state of mind.

for one thing the family should not wait until the patient is in extremis, but should ask the priest to visit when she first is diagnosed, takes a turn for the worse, enters the hospital or care facility. The patient listed a next of kind when she entered, or signed a directive on who makes decisions about her care when she cannot, and should have indicated a religion and that she wants clergy of her own faith to visit. Without that on file the priest cannot do anything as most facilities legally cannot let him visit on that basis.

Simply ask her if she would like a visit for a priest, get the son’s permission if it is required, and take care of it. If the patient becomes unconscious the rites can be performed by a priest if there is reason to suppose the patient would ask for this if able.

For yourself, convey your wishes to the person who would be making decisions for you should you become incapacitated, usually next of kin or someone you designate via healthcare power of attorney. Whenever you or a family member are admitted to a hospital make sure you indicate your religion and ask for clergy visits, as well as contacting your own parish. We get complaints every week from parishioners because nobody has visited or brought communion while they or a loved one was in the hospital, because no one notified the office, as if we can read minds. Down here the hospitals are all private and have assigned chaplains, and clergy not assigned have to have specific permission from the patient or family to visit.

 

[zab]

Ayone can orginate the request, BUT it will have to have the assent of the person receiving the Sacrament to take effect. IF the subject is unwilling, the priest needs to be so advised BEFORE he gets to where the Sacrament is to be preformed.

As to who is eligible:

Anyone near death due to age or sickness;

Anyone facing a serious operaton that COULD possibly die from it, [even if ONLY a SLIGHT probablity of death may ensue].

These are “The Norms!”

There are other possibilites BUT they should be dicussed with the priest who must make the final call of the possibility.

Start by asking Grandma, if she would like to recive the Sacrament. The permission of the son is not, in an absolute sense required. If she say’s YES, thn I’d suggest you so inform the son. If he outs up a fuss; discuss it with he priest AND DO IT ANYWAY!

It OUGHT to Grandma’s decison SO LONG as she is mentally capable of mking such a decission.

God Bless all of you!
Pat

** “The anointing of the sick is not a sacrament for those only who are at the point of death.** Hence, as soon as anyone of the faithful begins to be in danger of death from sickness or old age, the fitting time for him to receive this sacrament has certainly already arrived” (CCC 1514)."
The question for many is what age does one become in danger of death. Regulations state that anyone 65 or older may receive the sacrament simply because of their age. There are some in their 80’s who seem to be getting along better than some who haven’t reached the age of 65 yet have been diagnosed with chronic illnesses. The age of death for my maternal grandmother (58)and my mother (68) was much less than that of my paternal grandmother (late 80’s) and my father (84).

 

[Joe_Kelley]

When running the EMHC’s to the homebound, in nursing homes, etc I worked with the priests to have a priest visit each one three times a year and give them the Anointing of the Sick. It has worked out well.

A priest says mass at the retirement homes once a month, and does the anointing every fourth month at the mass.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

. . .

As to who is eligible:

Anyone near death due to age or sickness;

Anyone facing a serious operation that COULD possibly die from it, [even if ONLY a SLIGHT probability of death may ensue].

These are “The Norms!” . . .t

In our parish we interpret “serious operation” as one that requires general anesthesia.

Also, we encourage expectant mothers to be anointed shortly before the baby is due.

 

[Matthew_Holford]

The “rules” regarding the sacrament of the pastoral care of the sick permit anointing in three main areas: those who are infirm due to old age; those who have a serious illness (the word ‘serious’ was very carefully chosen by the translators); those who are to have surgery because they have a serious illness. Therefore, one cannot be anointed just because they are old; one couldn’t be anointed for a common cold; one couldn’t be anointed before having a tooth extracted. You can be anointed if you are old and your health is deteriorating significantly; you have been diagnosed with e.g. cancer; you’re having surgery e.g. for an aortic aneurysm. So, you don’t have to be at the point of death as used to be the case with “extreme unction” but the infirmity must have the possibility of precipitating death. You cannot be anointed for any illness or before any medical procedure.

I can understand your concern about it scaring grandma as she may belong to the generation when the so-called ‘last rites’ were given shortly before death.

No sacrament can be forced on any one. Adults must consent to receiving sacraments. Grandma must consent to the sacrament or if she no longer has the cognitive abilities or she becomes unconscious the priest has to be satisfied she would have wanted to receive the sacrament.

Something that is important to consider. The ritual book Pastoral Care of the Sick makes it explicitly clear that anointing is not the sacrament for the dying; that sacrament is Viaticum. It is therefore more important to receive Viaticum than to be anointed. The ideal is to be anointed, confession, and Viaticum. The rite also stresses that it is better to receive these three sacraments on separate occasions although they can be administered together in urgent need. If time is of the essence the rite is quite explicit that the most important sacrament to be received by the dying person is Viaticum.

I live in the UK so cannot comment on the legal issues around who is able to give the consent. However, if grandma still has the necessary cognitive abilities I firmly believe that any decision about receiving any sacrament must be hers.

 

[Oneofthewomen]

The “rules” regarding the sacrament of the pastoral care of the sick permit anointing in three main areas: those who are infirm due to old age; those who have a serious illness (the word ‘serious’ was very carefully chosen by the translators); those who are to have surgery because they have a serious illness. Therefore, one cannot be anointed just because they are old; one couldn’t be anointed for a common cold; one couldn’t be anointed before having a tooth extracted. You can be anointed if you are old and your health is deteriorating significantly; you have been diagnosed with e.g. cancer; you’re having surgery e.g. for an aortic aneurysm. So, you don’t have to be at the point of death as used to be the case with “extreme unction” but the infirmity must have the possibility of precipitating death. You cannot be anointed for any illness or before any medical procedure.
I can understand your concern about it scaring grandma as she may belong to the generation when the so-called ‘last rites’ were given shortly before death.

No sacrament can be forced on any one. Adults must consent to receiving sacraments. Grandma must consent to the sacrament or if she no longer has the cognitive abilities or she becomes unconscious the priest has to be satisfied she would have wanted to receive the sacrament.

Something that is important to consider. The ritual book Pastoral Care of the Sick makes it explicitly clear that anointing is not the sacrament for the dying; that sacrament is Viaticum. It is therefore more important to receive Viaticum than to be anointed. The ideal is to be anointed, confession, and Viaticum. The rite also stresses that it is better to receive these three sacraments on separate occasions although they can be administered together in urgent need. If time is of the essence the rite is quite explicit that the most important sacrament to be received by the dying person is Viaticum.

I live in the UK so cannot comment on the legal issues around who is able to give the consent. However, if grandma still has the necessary cognitive abilities I firmly believe that any decision about receiving any sacrament must be hers.

Regarding the highlighted portion. I am not entirely sure that is correct.
I had a discussion about this with my boss (a priest who is also a canon lawyer),
and he told me that the chruch makes no detemination as to what constitutes “sick”. One does not have to be “physically” ill in order to receive the sacrament. The need for spiritual and/or emotional healing can be even greater than a need for physical healing.

I would be interested in knowing where you got your information, and if there is anyone out there who knows if there is any actual reference to this.

As I said in my earlier post, I believe that there is a lot of mis-information out there, among catholics and non-catholics alike, and I think that we should really make sure that we are giving people the correct information.

 

[FrDavid96]

Regarding the highlighted portion. I am not entirely sure that is correct.
I had a discussion about this with my boss (a priest who is also a canon lawyer),
and he told me that the chruch makes no detemination as to what constitutes “sick”. One does not have to be “physically” ill in order to receive the sacrament. The need for spiritual and/or emotional healing can be even greater than a need for physical healing.

I would be interested in knowing where you got your information, and if there is anyone out there who knows if there is any actual reference to this.

As I said in my earlier post, I believe that there is a lot of mis-information out there, among catholics and non-catholics alike, and I think that we should really make sure that we are giving people the correct information.

Yes. The Church does not actually and specifically define what’s meant by “sick” because that’s just not possible.

Here’s what the General Introduction to Pastoral Care of the Sick (the GIRM for anointing, so to speak) has to say:

8…Great care and concern should be taken to see that those of the faithful whose health is seriously impaired by sickness or old age receive this sacrament. A prudent or reasonably sure judgment, without scruple, is sufficient for deciding on the seriousness of an illness.

There’s also a translator’s footnote: The word periculose has been carefully studied and rendered as “seriously” rather than as “gravely” or “dangerously” or “perilously.” Such a rendering will serve to avoid restrictions upon the celebration of the sacrament. On the one hand, the sacrament may and should be given to anyone whose health is seriously impaired; on the other hand, it may not be given indiscriminately to any person whose health is not seriously impaired.

In other words, we cannot take this to either extreme. Anointing is not limited to those whose death is imminent; but at the same time, it is not expanded so much that “any” illness makes one eligible for anointing. Unfortunately, as the Church has put emphasis on the first, too many people have ignored the later. Anointing/Unction is not appropriately administered to one who is not seriously ill. That means that age alone (no more distinction than a number of years) is not a reason for the sacrament, and that those who may indeed have some kind of illness, but that illness is not serious are likewise not appropriate recipients.

In my own experience as a priest, I have seen much more by way of inappropriate requests for anointing than I have seen attempts to delay the sacrament unduly.

I’ve had requests to anoint all the family members who are present in the hospital room, for example. I’ve had requests from people to anoint them for headaches and minor colds (people who are otherwise in good general health). I’ve had requests to anoint everyone who attends a certain Mass (“Father, will you hold a healing Mass where we can all be anointed?”)

In other words, we’ve all heard and received the message that Unction is not only for the dying. We can check that one off the list. It’s done. The problem is that too many people have taken this too far.

It isn’t merely a “need for spiritual and/or emotional healing” because we are in need of such all the time. The standard to be applied is “the faithful whose health is seriously impaired.”

 

[Oneofthewomen]

Thank you, Fr. David!

 

[Matthew_Holford]

I would be interested in knowing where you got your information.

Introduction, prænotanda and rubrics of the Roman Ritual: Pastoral Care of the Sick

 

[PJM]

=zab;7429733]** “The anointing of the sick is not a sacrament for those only who are at the point of death.** Hence, as soon as anyone of the faithful begins to be in danger of death from sickness or old age, the fitting time for him to receive this sacrament has certainly already arrived” (CCC 1514)."
The question for many is what age does one become in danger of death. Regulations state that anyone 65 or older may receive the sacrament simply because of their age. There are some in their 80’s who seem to be getting along better than some who haven’t reached the age of 65 yet have been diagnosed with chronic illnesses. The age of death for my maternal grandmother (58)and my mother (68) was much less than that of my paternal grandmother (late 80’s) and my father (84).

By golly, I thougt that is what I said

God Bless,
Pat

 

[dfp42]

Well we asked my wife’s father and I’m happy to report that he/she said she receives communion every week. Which brings me peace to my heart. Even though I personally never seen anyone there get communion myself at this home. However when we asked about it, her son said plainly that the staff members take care of everything. Which I think is good but I still wonder if anyone who visits her would actually know where to call if in need of the anointing of the sick. In my estimation, I would think she would definitely benefit from receiving the anointing as she is very weak and frail and on serious pain meds etc. I wondering if next time we go to visit her soon if we should find out from her how she feels about it and if she knows who we are to call, which parish etc if indeed she would like anointing or if things turn for a worse etc. What do you think should be done if anything?

 

[Matthew_Holford]

The Church does not actually and specifically define what’s meant by “sick” because that’s just not possible.

Obviously that does not fall within the competence of the Church but I’m fairly sure, without going to check, that the Ritual says that medical advice can be sought by the Church to aid Her in determining the seriousness of an illness.

 

[FrDavid96]

Obviously that does not fall within the competence of the Church but I’m fairly sure, without going to check, that the Ritual says that medical advice can be sought by the Church to aid Her in determining the seriousness of an illness.

Yes. In fact, we see exactly that in the continuation of #8 that I didn’t bother to type.

Although the Church is “competent” to determine what is a serious illness. Competent (in church-speak) means that the Church has the authority to do so. If we say that the Church isn’t “competent” that would mean that a priest would have to seek a doctor’s permission before administering Unction. So while the Church is competent to determine if someone is seriously ill, an individual priest might not necessarily have the specific expertise to do so, in a particular case, and needs to seek the advice of medical professionals.

 

[PattiDay]

Well we asked my wife’s father and I’m happy to report that he/she said she receives communion every week. Which brings me peace to my heart. Even though I personally never seen anyone there get communion myself at this home. However when we asked about it, her son said plainly that the staff members take care of everything. Which I think is good but I still wonder if anyone who visits her would actually know where to call if in need of the anointing of the sick. In my estimation, I would think she would definitely benefit from receiving the anointing as she is very weak and frail and on serious pain meds etc. I wondering if next time we go to visit her soon if we should find out from her how she feels about it and if she knows who we are to call, which parish etc if indeed she would like anointing or if things turn for a worse etc. What do you think should be done if anything?

I don’t think the staff at the care center are allowed to discuss or make arrangements through any directive other than the appointed care giver, but since your father in law has said that his mother is receiving communion, can’t you now discuss annointing with him and ensure that arrangments are in place for calling a priest in the event of extremis? Is the grandmother lucid enough to be part of such a discussion? I find most elderly do not fear death or talking about it. It’s we younger people who have trouble with it.