Radical Environmentalism: Now Global Warming Causes Prostitution?

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Read today that there is growing decent against the man made global warming theory. The Wall Street Journal had an Op-Ed on that yesterday. From Bernie Goldberg’s article ~

“The Other Global Warming Story”

bernardgoldberg.com/the-other-global-warming-story/?utm_source=BernardGoldberg.com+Newsletter&utm_campaign=66f047787a-NEWSLETTER&utm_medium=email

excerpt:
It’s inadvisable to get your scientific facts through the WSJ (tho it is good for stock market quotes). Try reading top-tier science journals, like SCIENCE, NATURE, and PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ACADEMY OF SCIENCES (PNAS). Their articles are pretty heavy reading for the non-scientist, but their abstracts are somewhat easier to understand. I usually read the abstract, first few paragraphs, eyeball the middle, then read the conclusion. Also the IPCC is a very good source, the WGI chapters on the science, especially, which are based on 1000s of these peer-reviewed science articles, but summarized in a form non-scientists can more easily understand.

It should also be noted that the WSJ is notorious for its wrongful misrepresentation of the “science” and outright denialism. See forbes.com/sites/petergleick/2012/01/27/remarkable-editorial-bias-on-climate-science-at-the-wall-street-journal/ :

Remarkable Editorial Bias on Climate Science at the Wall Street Journal
Peter Gleick, FORBES 1/27/12

The Wall Street Journal’s editorial board has long been understood to be not only antagonistic to the facts of climate science, but hostile. But in a remarkable example of their unabashed bias, on Friday they published an opinion piece that not only repeats many of the flawed and misleading arguments about climate science, but purports to be of special significance because it was signed by 16 “scientists.”

Serious doubt has been cast on the actual expertise on climate science of the signers and on the accuracy of the content, here and elsewhere, and the strawman arguments and technical flaws of their opinion piece are evident to anyone actually versed in the scientific debate. For example, their op-ed has fundamental errors about recent actual temperatures, they use false/strawman arguments that climate scientists are saying climate change “will destroy civilization,” they launch ad hominem attack on particular climate scientists using out-of-context quotes, and so on. Formal responses are in the works, and will be available from a variety of groups in the next day or so. [Just as an example, as pointed out here previously, and at the Union of Concerned Scientists: the authors claim there has been a “lack of warming” for 10 years. The reality? 2011 was the 35th year in a row in which global temperatures were above the historical average and 2010 and 2005 were the warmest years on record.]

But the most amazing and telling evidence of the bias of the Wall Street Journal in this field is the fact that 255 members of the United States National Academy of Sciences wrote a comparable (but scientifically accurate) essay on the realities of climate change and on the need for improved and serious public debate around the issue, offered it to the Wall Street Journal, and were turned down. The National Academy of Sciences is the nation’s pre-eminent independent scientific organizations. Its members are among the most respected in the world in their fields. Yet the Journal wouldn’t publish this letter, from more than 15 times as many top scientists. Instead they chose to publish an error-filled and misleading piece on climate because some so-called experts aligned with their bias signed it. This may be good politics for them, but it is bad science and it is bad for the nation.

Science magazine – perhaps the nation’s most important journal on scientific issues – published the letter from the NAS members after the Journal turned it down [see http://www.sciencemag.org/content/328/5979/689.full.pdf].

Do you have an open mind? Read both, side by side. And understand that every national academy of sciences on the planet agrees with the reality and seriousness of human caused climate change.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lynnvinc
Right on that. We don’t like harming and killing people.

But you don’t picket Mr Gore?
I was well into mitigating climate change and trying to inspire others to do 15 years before Gore came out with AN INCONVENIENT TRUTH. I don’t need politicians and celebrities to tell me what to do. I can figure that out for myself.
Quote:
It is a passion with us.
A person of passion has an open mind aways ready to learn more about their subject of interest, no matter what they learn along the way.
Sorry, but I have not idea about your credentials. I get my science from real scientists. I don’t believe what you have to say about AGW. It seems you just don’t know the science, and you really don’t want to know the science.

Some people have all sorts of motives for not knowing the science. Maybe they work for the oil or coal companies (or some related companies), or have some fear that the economy will collapse if people start turning off lights not in use, or buying Chevy Volts (as we just did). Or maybe they are afraid of totalitarian world takeover if people start buying solar panels and getting off the grid. I think those are the main motives why people are so entrenched in their denial of anthropogenic global warming. It’s really sad they would risk the life of the world, and their own progeny if they have children. Truly sad and bad.

I suggest that people read the science journals with open minds and open hearts.

I can guarantee it, if you seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, all things will be added unto you. Be not afraid to mitigate climate change, the Lord is with you always.
 
It’s inadvisable to get your scientific facts through the WSJ (tho it is good for stock market quotes).
So much for your scientific / research credibility.

She didn’t link to Wall Street 😛
Try reading top-tier science journals, like SCIENCE, NATURE, and PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ACADEMY OF SCIENCES (PNAS). Their articles are pretty heavy reading for the non-scientist, but their abstracts are somewhat easier to understand. I usually read the abstract, first few paragraphs, eyeball the middle, then read the conclusion.
Soooooo…you have no idea if the “science” supports their abstract? 😃

Here’s an idea: Try reading the actual paper…AND then wait for rebuttal to the paper.
Also the IPCC is a very good source, the WGI chapters on the science, especially, which are based on 1000s of these peer-reviewed science articles, but summarized in a form non-scientists can more easily understand.
One of the inks to PDF’s I just gave…
landshape.org/news/documents/us-senate-climategate-report.pdf

Doesn’t support your claim.
On page 26 in the above PDF you can see the **small cadre ** responsible throughout IPCC
It should also be noted that the WSJ is notorious for its wrongful misrepresentation of the “science” and outright denialism. See forbes.com/sites/petergleick/2012/01/27/remarkable-editorial-bias-on-climate-science-at-the-wall-street-journal/ :
You quote Mr Peter Gleick - as evidence?

“Gleick’s Pacific Institute receive a great deal more funding than the free-market, sound-science groups that he claims are “well-funded” and overly concerned with the role of the federal government.”

forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2012/01/12/please-global-warming-alarmists-stop-denying-climate-change-and-science/

Did you actually read the letter of Science 7 May 2010:
Vol. 328 no. 5979 pp. 689-690
DOI: 10.1126/science.328.5979.689?

sciencemag.org/content/328/5979/689.full.pdf

Can you defend any of the 5 ] five claims?

Who was the author of said letter? Why it’s Mr Gleick First name on list ]
Science Magazine > 7 May 2010 > Gleick et al., 328 (5979): 689-690
Do a little research …here are the signers of this letter
sciencemag.org/content/suppl/2010/05/04/328.5979.689.DC1/Gleick.SOM.pdf

Note: The signatories are all members of the U.S. National Academy of Sciences but are not speaking on its behalf.

Getting back to the FORBES / Gleick article… A FINE JOB AT AD HOMINEM…ATTACK THE MAN NOT THE CLAIMS 🙂
 
I was well into mitigating climate change and trying to inspire others to do 15 years before Gore came out with AN INCONVENIENT TRUTH. I don’t need politicians and celebrities to tell me what to do. I can figure that out for myself.
Ahhh sooooo you’ve stopped?

REPEATING
Sorry, I don’t believe that statement.
If you thought that strongly, why not cut back your energy footprint another 50% to offset a small fraction of Mr Gores energy footprint - and then picket him? Surely, it is no secret to you that Mr Gore has one of the largest personal energy footprints of any single person on Earth?
His energy footprint is ongoing.
Sorry, but I have not idea about your credentials.
Ahhh I have a dictionary 🙂
A compulsive, often unreasonable idea or emotion.
dictionary.reference.com/browse/obsession
I get my science from real scientists.
Like Mr Gavin Schmidts answer to what I stated about 1 ] mol of CO2 gravity and inertia needed? :rotfl::rotfl:
I don’t believe what you have to say about AGW.
Yet, you can’t / won’t backup any of your claims made by “real scientists”…who practice post-normal science?
It seems you just don’t know the science, and you really don’t want to know the science.
Actually , I have and continue to debate Normal Science WITH scientists. I do NOT sit in echo-chambers.
Some people have all sorts of motives for not knowing the science. Maybe they
Maybe they want the ACTUAL SCIENCE OF EMPIRICAL OBSERVATIONAL EVIDENCE to VALIDATE the claims?
I suggest that people read the science journals with open minds and open hearts.
Yet… you admit you only read the abstracts…NOT THE SCIENCE:)
 
Read today that there is growing decent against the man made global warming theory. The Wall Street Journal had an Op-Ed on that yesterday. From Bernie Goldberg’s article ~

“The Other Global Warming Story”

bernardgoldberg.com/the-other-global-warming-story/?utm_source=BernardGoldberg.com+Newsletter&utm_campaign=66f047787a-NEWSLETTER&utm_medium=email

excerpt:
Hiyas Roselle 🙂

I have a feeling even more will follow 😃

Especially after this - A MUST READ

dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-warming–Cycle-25-need-worry-NASA-scientists-right-Thames-freezing-again.html

I have been saying this on CAF for a number of years. Seems I might be justified 🙂
 
Sunspot cycle # 25.

GLOBAL COOLING.

It’s here.

dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-warming–Cycle-25-need-worry-NASA-scientists-right-Thames-freezing-again.html

[kinda snuck up on us]

[oh, for goodness sake, … we both posted the same article!]

👍:rolleyes::cool:😊🤷
I read it. A lot more to worry about in this than there is with MMGW. If GW is a reality, and I guess it has been, (whether man made or not) what does it really mean? That they can grow wheat farther north in Canada than before? Seems that’s about it.

But global cooling. That’s another thing altogether. So, will the Great Plains become like the Baltic Coast where all they can grow is potatoes and cabbage, and sometimes not even those?

The Little Ice Age sure cleared out farmers from New England.

Do we get to vote on MMGW? If so, I vote “aye”. 🙂
 
Hiyas Roselle 🙂

I have a feeling even more will follow 😃

Especially after this - A MUST READ

dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-warming–Cycle-25-need-worry-NASA-scientists-right-Thames-freezing-again.html

I have been saying this on CAF for a number of years. Seems I might be justified 🙂
So here are your “scientists” on whicy you rely – hot dates and mail order brides 🙂

A person on a listserve sent this in response to the Daily Mail article:

And here’s a fun story about the dubious credibility of some major UK newspapers including the Daily Mail- about a weather forecasting company they were using which was confabulating avatars to serve as forecasters (some of whom were actually mail-order brides!), and which promptly closed down when Monbiot confronted the owner-manager with his deceit: monbiot.com/2012/01/26/imaginary-friends/ The record of this newspaper on getting its science right is appalling. As a Brit, I can’t help but remember this was a newspaper that used to be pro-Hitler and anti-semitic - and it’s still a disgrace.
 
Yet, you can’t / won’t backup any of your claims made by “real scientists”…who practice post-normal science?
Why should I. I trust them and what they say. They are the ones backing it up with hard study based on empirical evidence and good theories. Their accounts are straight-forward, even though AGW is a very complicated issue with many factors impacting climate (that’s why it took them so long in teasing out the signal from the noise)…and even more so considering the plethora of harms it is and is expected to be causing.

The denialist pseudo-science is very convoluted and contradictory…like a circular firing squad.

Again, I say, read the journals. Even though I only have time to read the abstracts and skim them (occasionally asking the scientists themselves to clarify points), it really seems you have not read them or you misunderstand them altogether.

This is a Catholic site. We should be promoting the truth, even if that is unpleasant, not some convoluted twisting and turning so it turn out the way we want it. No one wants global warming and its harmful repercussions. I’d really be glad if the scientists were to find out it really wasn’t happening. I’d still be doing all the EC (environmentally correct) things I could, since these measures also help reduce a many other problems, but I’d be very very happy to know AGW was not happening. That would make my day, and my decade, and the rest of my life!

I would like to believe all the denialists, but their arguments have all be very successfully refuted by top climate scientists, and many of them have been shown to be quite purposely distorted. I have absolutely no confidence in anything the denialist and their supposed “scientists” have to say. God is Truth. I cannot be made to accept blatant lies.
 
So here are your “scientists” on whicy you rely – hot dates and mail order brides 🙂
Ohh my my my…:rotfl::rotfl:

I must say, you bring much entertainment with your posts… No facts - lotsa unsupported claims…but entertaining.🙂

Had you READ the article …you would have read this -
Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was issued last week without fanfare by the ** Met Office and the University of East Anglia Climatic Research Unit**
Now, I must confess…I kinda baited using the Daily Mail Link.:rolleyes: But I didn’t think you would take it - I had thought you actually did Climate research.

My point in using the Daily Mail… Met Office CRU announcement…was the fact that MET OFFICE and CRU finally admitted what NASA Scientists and others, have been saying for years.

HERE IS PROOF

From May 2006
science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2006/10may_longrange/

From 2010
probeinternational.org/Livingston-penn-2010.pdf

news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/06/110614-sun-hibernation-solar-cycle-sunspots-space-science/

Dr Svalgaard has updated of the progression of that decline on his research page at:

leif.org/research/Livingston%20and%20Penn.png
A person on a listserve sent this in response to the Daily Mail article:
And here’s a fun story about the dubious credibility of some major UK newspapers including the Daily Mail- about a weather forecasting company they were using which was confabulating avatars to serve as forecasters (some of whom were actually mail-order brides!), and which promptly closed down when Monbiot confronted the owner-manager with his deceit: monbiot.com/2012/01/26/imaginary-friends/ The record of this newspaper on getting its science right is appalling. As a Brit, I can’t help but remember this was a newspaper that used to be pro-Hitler and anti-semitic - and it’s still a disgrace.
Remember what I said about obsession?
A person of obsession hangs to a narrow set of beliefs. They ignore evidence contrary to their established obsessions, plodding along with self imposed blinders. Some will decide to swim… when the water finally reaches their neck…but most persons obsessed will , even then, continue holding their beliefs above empirical evidence.
You quote a listserve person as rebuttal.

A listserve person who is talking about** Daily Mails weather-casters**.BUT DOES IT APPLY to the MET Office and CRU report ABOUT Solar Cycle 25?

Solar Cycles are Climatic events - not weather.

Albeit I wouldn’t use either The MET Office OR Daily Mail for my weather forecast
canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/42873

The BRIDES MAIDS at Daily Mail DID a better job at forecasting weather in 2010-2011 😃

IMO your listserve friend led you astray …and you followed willingly.
 
Why should I. I trust them and what they say. They are the ones backing it up with hard study** based on empirical evidence** and good theories.
Actually, once again wrong! 🙂

Anyone who accepts proxies over real World REPEATABLE Observational evidence - Who think MODELS are empirical evidence / validate unproven hypothesis…Are not teaching you Norma Science.
Their accounts are straight-forward, even though AGW is a very complicated issue with many factors impacting climate (that’s why it took them so long in teasing out the signal from the noise)…
Did they?

Care to provide us the evidence for your above statement.

HERE’S A THOUGHT.
If the hypothesis was supported by the data - there is no need to “adjust” the data.

Without sensitivities and data "adjustments " 0.08 C per 100 years doesn’t show-up.

A GOOD READ ABOUT CHARTS

wmbriggs.com/blog/?p=5107
and even more so considering the plethora of harms it is and is expected to be causing.
Support you claim, please - with Empirical repeatable observational evidence.
I’ll support my claim that COLD holds more harm than warmth- Here is just a few:

U.S. death rates from extreme cold weather 1979-2006 were 50.1% of all extreme weather event deaths;
U.S. death rates from extreme heat weather 1979-2006 were 27.1% of all extreme weather event deaths;
U.S. extreme cold weather death rates averaged 2.7% between 1979-2006 for all causes of death;
U.S. extreme heat weather death rates averaged 1.5% between 1979-2006 for all causes of death (ibid.);
Four times more people die from excessive cold weather than die from excessive hot weather according to National Center for Health Statistics Compressed Mortality Database 2005.

AND

omniclimate.wordpress.com/2008/01/14/cooling-kills-more-than-warming/

bmj.com/cgi/content/full/321/7262/670

.
The denialist pseudo-science is very convoluted and contradictory…like a circular firing squad.
ABSOLUTELY TRUE…😃

IGNORING Natural Climatic Cycles ** IS ** POST NORMAL SCIENCE!!!

Didn’t work out as you intended - Did it?
Again, I say, read the journals. Even though I only have time to read the abstracts and skim them (occasionally asking the scientists themselves to clarify points), it really seems you have not read them or you misunderstand them altogether.
I have been VERY charitable to your statements of this nature - in the past.

EITHER SUPPORT YOUR CLAIM…😦
This is a Catholic site. We should be promoting the truth,
AS a Catholic, do you think making unsupported claims IS the Truth?

Name one claim made by you that is backed with empirical observational evidence.
I would like to believe all the denialists,
I’ll ask you ONE last time to show some civility.
but their arguments have all be very successfully refuted by top climate scientists,
Point to them! MODELS are not validation of an unproven hypothesis.
I have absolutely no confidence in anything the denialist and their supposed “scientists” have to say. God is Truth. I cannot be made to accept blatant lies.
Are you calling me a liar? 😦

All you have to do is provide evidence for your claims - Your claims are unsupportable.
 
Dear heavens, talk about going off the deep end…

Pathos reasoning at its finest. You just can’t pay for entertainment like this.
 
Actually, once again wrong!
You are the one who is wrong. Not only wrong, but wrong on a very serious issue that we should be busy addressing, not arguing about.

I’ve tried to point out that mitigating climate change is for the most part very cost-effective and mitigates many other serious problems. That you would spend so much time trying to prevent people from doing what is moral and right, is an abomination.

Shame on all of you who reject climate science. May the Lord have mercy on your souls.

Good bye and may God be with you.
 
You are the one who is wrong. Not only wrong, but wrong on a very serious issue that we should be busy addressing, not arguing about.

I’ve tried to point out that mitigating climate change is for the most part very cost-effective and mitigates many other serious problems. That you would spend so much time trying to prevent people from doing what is moral and right, is an abomination.

Shame on all of you who reject climate science. May the Lord have mercy on your souls.

Good bye and may God be with you.
Shame on you for not looking at all the science. Are not good scientists supposed to look at the opposing studies and data and explain it? You have not done this at all.

And FYI, you are not mitigating climate change. The only thing you are mitigating is your output of a specific gas which some people have told you is dangerous. All the while polluting the planet and local habitats with your alternatives (like mercury from CFL bulbs, killing protected birds and bats from your wind energy, and polluting from lithium battery production).
 
You are the one who is wrong. Not only wrong, but wrong on a very serious issue that we should be busy addressing, not arguing about.
Then, it should be easy for you to produce their “empirical evidence”.

You stated:
Originally Posted by lynnvinc
Why should I. I trust them and what they say. They are the ones backing it up with hard study based on empirical evidence and good theories.
Let’s see who was wrong. 🙂
I’ve tried to point out that mitigating climate change is for the most part very cost-effective and mitigates many other serious problems.
With hundreds of Millions of Dollars - and thirty plus years… already spent, can you show 1C of Temperature “mitigated” ?

If you can’t - then it is obvious:
1: It isn’t cost effective.
2: Your conservation efforts… does not "mitigate’ Climate.

This is logic.
That you would spend so much time trying to prevent people from doing what is moral and right, is an abomination.
Your statements get nastier in nature as you go along IMO.

There is nothing “moral” about reproducing / repeating unsupportable claims.
There is nothing “moral” about supporting those who make such claims…be it in post-normal science…radical activism…political.
There is nothing “moral” in a person making a “moral” statement who refuses to investigate ALL of normal science… but sit within echo-chambers.

To do so, is NOT presenting truth.
If it’s not truth being represented…it’s…???
Shame on all of you who reject climate science.
Once again, wrong!

ANY reader of these threads who seeks evidence of how wrong your above statement is…need only click on my links and reference citations within these threads.

I reject post-normal science attempts at being passed off as Normal science.
 
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