Raping non-muslim... Legal in Islam?

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Dale_M said:
I wouldn’t blame Meedo at all if he or she never returned to this site. Of course, raping non-Muslims is not justified! What’s the next wild accusation? That Muslims cook and eat babies?

For a Christian site, this place is strangely lacking in charity. Perhaps if we are going to ask a question about Islam we should consider how we would react if the same question was asked about Christianity. Remember that Muslims here are guests. We should make them feel welcome and not feel if they are being baited by a hostile group of strangers. This isn’t the forum to be trying to score points against an opponent.
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You’re right, it’s not about scoring points. It’s about Truth. It’s rather like the papal address in Germany. Does Islam permit and encourage the spread of the faith through the sword, through conquest, or not? Pretty straightforward, honest question. Of course, we can see from the immediate reaction to the papal address that any notion that Islam permitted such a thing was manifestly false, right? It really IS the religion of peace, now isn’t it?

If someone came onto the forums and asked,“Does Christianity permit the enslavement or rape of non-Christian women?,” they’d get a straightforward answer of “no, Christianity does not.” They ask us about worshiping Mary all the time and we answer.
 
Sufi said:
Rape is not legal in Islam in no way. It is a crime that can be punishable by death.
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If you look back several posts, I stipulated that Islam did not condone rape as Islam defines rape. The question still remains, however: ** “Does Islam allow for the capture of women, whose marriages are then null by virtue of the capture, the enslavement of those women, and then sexual relations between the captor/owner and those female slaves, even if that slave expresses the desire to NOT have sexual relations with her owner/captor?”**

Any Moslem care to reply?
 
meedo said:
Hitler said it was great to kill jews.
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You bring up a question in mind did nazis rape jewish women during the war, like in the camps? just curious cuz its kinda like the muslims and how they hate a non-muslim but they’ll still do that awful crime.
 
Come on Sufi and Meedo. Are you too ashamed to respond to post #42??
 
Rodrigo_Bivar said:
I know Islam is unpalatable. The truth about Islam is almost always unpalatable. But what do you expect me to do? Lie to you and tell you Islam is a great religion?

I expect you don’t know that ‘rape’ is a common method of proselytizing in places like Pakistan. Christian girls are kidnapped and raped and thereby forced to marry their rapists and convert to Islam. Their parents are heartbroken when that happens but guess what? Nothing happens to the Muslims who do this - because it’s all in accordance with sharia law.

This is happening TODAY - not in the distant past. The fact that most Muslim countries don’t condone rape of non-Muslim is not because they are acting in accordance with the Quran, but are really acting against it. The Quran permits Muslims to take non-Muslim female slaves (captives or purchased) and allows Muslims to have sex with these female slaves. This came straight from Muhammad who did the same thing - with Rayhanna and Safiya and Mariyah the Copt.

There is no justice in the world, and let us not pretend that there is. Muslims always behave very badly towards adherents of other religions when they (Muslims) are in the majority.

And before any Muslim brings up Leviticus and Deuteronomy again, may I please ask them to bring a quote from Jesus telling us it is okay for Christians (not Jews) to rape female slaves.
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Too bad you do not know Islam. 😦
 
JKirkLVNV said:
If you look back several posts, I stipulated that Islam did not condone rape as Islam defines rape. The question still remains, however: ** “Does Islam allow for the capture of women, whose marriages are then null by virtue of the capture, the enslavement of those women, and then sexual relations between the captor/owner and those female slaves, even if that slave expresses the desire to NOT have sexual relations with her owner/captor?”**

Any Moslem care to reply?
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Slaves in Islam is totally different from being a slave say perhaps in the early days of the establishment of America. You would have to understand these two differences first before I could go into details.
 
StMarkEofE said:
Rape is not legal if its Muslim against Muslim only.
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Do you have any proof of your un educated statement here? The unlawful compelling of a woman through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse is not legal in Islam in any way.
 
Sufi said:
If I was ashame of Islam. I wouldn’t left Christianity to be a Muslim.
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I’m sorry… I don’t know who you are but you left Christianity to be a Muslim? I hope you don’t mind me asking but I am curious to know why. Were you Catholic before or just Christian?
 
Scholastica15 said:
I’m sorry… I don’t know who you are but you left Christianity to be a Muslim? I hope you don’t mind me asking but I am curious to know why. Were you Catholic before or just Christian?
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Christian is Christian. I was a Christian. I left for many things. One thing is that I can not grasp the concept of God being equal to me as a human being, and I don’t understand if God is one how came about a Trinity? Also, the first Christians were not worshippers of Jesus, so I can not grasp the concept of modern day Christians. Also none of the men of God and Prophet’s in time said anything about God being three or mentioned that we should worship Jesus, the Prophet to come. Jesus himself told us to worship God. Many other things I can not grasp, but I’ll slow down and shut up, if I don’t then they are going to accuse me of taking this thread off topic.

Take care!🙂
 
Sufi said:
Christian is Christian. I was a Christian. I left for many things. One thing is that I can not grasp the concept of God being equal to me as a human being, and I don’t understand if God is one how came about a Trinity? Also, the first Christians were not worshippers of Jesus, so I can not grasp the concept of modern day Christians. Also none of the men of God and Prophet’s in time said anything about God being three or mentioned that we should worship Jesus, the Prophet to come. Jesus himself told us to worship God. Many other things I can not grasp, but I’ll slow down and shut up, if I don’t then they are going to accuse me of taking this thread off topic.

Take care!🙂
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Once again Sufi. The First Christians were worshipers of Jesus. People would justnot get martyred for the heck of it. And please show youe evidence that the First Christians were not worshipers of God. Prove it.

Thanks and God Bless,
Jonfan
 
Sufi do you understand who God is?do you have all the answers about God? the answer is no right? so why not leave the idea of God alltogether since there are things you do not grasp? very poor argument am afraid and the Bible has an answer to these reasons you mentioned but it’s my own feeling you were never Christian anyway because your reasons smell of Islamic background 🙂

Anyway and back to topic, it’d be necessary to quote from Sira Nabawiyya and Ahadith about Muhammad and his sex slaves; this will answer many questions. I do not remember the hadith, but Muhammad killed the family and husband of a certain woman, and had sex with her THE SAME DAY, breaking his OWN LAW that says the woman must wait 3 months or so.
 
Sufi said:
Slaves in Islam is totally different from being a slave say perhaps in the early days of the establishment of America. You would have to understand these two differences first before I could go into details.
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Hi Sufi,

I don’t know much about Islam, so please don’t think I’m being sarcastic; but would you please define the difference between “Slaves in Islam” and “being a slave in the early days of the establishment of America”?
(That is; if it’s not straying from the topic)

I’d really appreciate it.

Thanks and Peace
 
Since Muhammed raped one of his own wives, why would it not be legal in Islam to rape a non-Muslim?

According to Ayatollah Sistani of Iraq’s website (www.sistani.org), non-Muslims are on a list of things that are dirty which also includes feces, urine, blood, dogs and pigs. So, if Muhammed is allowed to rape his own wife, why would it be immoral to rape someone you consider “dirty”?

Further, there have been many highly publicized cases in which imams have called for rape as punishment for transgressions within the faith. For instance, a young Muslim male was seen walking with a group of young Muslim girls in Pakistan and the punishment issued by the imam was for the boy’s 15-year-old sister to be gang-raped.

You are looking at this question of the illegality of raping non-Muslims in Islam from a Christian moral foundation which Muslims do not relate to. Their prophet committed rape, so why would you expect his followers to find rape immoral?
 
Denise_Shae said:
Hi Sufi,

I don’t know much about Islam, so please don’t think I’m being sarcastic; but would you please define the difference between “Slaves in Islam” and “being a slave in the early days of the establishment of America”?
(That is; if it’s not straying from the topic)

I’d really appreciate it.

Thanks and Peace
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The issue of slavery is very easily answered.

The Christians who sold or owned human beings (slaves) were in violation of Christian teaching.

The Muslims who now or in the past have sold or owned human beings (slaves) are not in violation of Islamic teaching.

It’s that simple.
 
Christians who owned slaves were not in violation of Christian teaching. St. Paul’s letter to Philemon is about Philemon’s slave Onesimus. He does not say that Philemon should not have a slave, only that he should be charitable to his brother in faith Onesimus. And in other epistles St. Paul exhorts slaves to be obedient to their masters as they are to Christ.

BUT the difference that I can see between Christian and Islamic holy texts is in the way that slave owners are to treat their slaves. And of course, a bigger difference is in the way Christianity has grown to interpret the sanctity and respect for the human person that was taught by Christ’s example. So in the Christian religion we have been able to grow in our understanding of God’s will for each individual, male or female, Jew or gentile, slave or free and have been able to come to know that slavery is not ordained by God.
 
Sufi said:
Slaves in Islam is totally different from being a slave say perhaps in the early days of the establishment of America. You would have to understand these two differences first before I could go into details.
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I don’t see the difficulty in the question, but what if I modify it to this:

** “Does Islam allow for the capture OR forcible captivity OR the exertion of formal or informal coercive power over women or the eslavement of the same, whose marriages are then null by virtue of the capture OR forcible captivity OR the exertion of formal or informal coercive power over those women or by the enslavement of the same, and then allow sexual relations between the captor/keeper/coercer/owner and those female slaves, even if that slave expresses the desire to NOT have sexual relations with her ****captor/keeper/coercer/owner ****?”

**I’ll even sit still for an explanation of why slavery is different under Islam that it was in America, if you’ll just answer the above.
 
pro_universal said:
Hey look…a Muslim answers the question, yet the accusations and bashing go on.

Reading Rodrigo Bivar and Cestusdei to learn about Islam is like reading “The Protocols of the Elders of Zion” to learn about Judaism.
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Typical muslim response. No muslim on the thread has answered the question, yet you say ‘it is answered’. That is the way yyou love to dodge the question. The only way you will answer a question is by trying to turn it around on the questioner and making it about them. ‘Well there was once a woman stoned in the second century by a Christian.’ That is the typical approach by a muslim. I have never seen you answer a question, I have only seen you dodge them.
 
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