Ray of hope for Catholic schools?

[Beau_Ouiville]

Its a strange time when we celebrate the lack of a school closing.

"The Archdiocese of Chicago is fighting an uphill battle to persuade parents to do what was once a given for many of the area’s Catholic families - send their children to parochial schools.

Years of shrinking populations and school closures have well - documented the steady march of Catholic students to the public schools. In November, Chicago Catholic News reported the archdiocese lost more than 4,000 students in the past year alone, or roughly 4.5 percent of the student population. But this summer, the archdiocese had only good news to report: Not one of the system’s 255 schools will be closed this school year.

The announcement was in stark contrast to 2005, when the archdiocese closed 17 schools. The next year brought the closing of two additional schools, both in the Southland. "

southtownstar.com/news/2652034,083010parochial.article

 

[Gift_from_God]

I hated being in the Catholic school system. When I left and went to the public system, I had better Catholic treatment there than I did in the Catholic system

 

[Dale_M]

Its a strange time when we celebrate the lack of a school closing.

The article mentions the demographic changes which led to the closing of many schools, but it didn’t mention another factor which may also be important.

The cost of attending a Catholic school used to be heavily subsidized by religious orders, which provided a large number of sisters to work in the schools for a stipend far below market wages. That, of course, has changed. And the higher wages which now need to be paid has boosted tuition significantly compared to what it might have been 50 or more years ago.

So changing affordability, as well as changing demographics, have played a role in the closings of schools. Perhaps the news you posted indicates that the situation is finally stabilizing.

Or maybe not. But let’s be optimistic.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

I hated being in the Catholic school system. When I left and went to the public system, I had better Catholic treatment there than I did in the Catholic system

I didn’t like it either. However, I thank God everyday that I was able to attend parochial school. All sorts of folks in my hometown couldn’t get their kids into the system. My high school cost $30 per month, which many of the students paid through jobs after school. I’m blessed to have graduated from there. I graduated just before Sonia Sotomayor.

The cost of attending a Catholic school used to be heavily subsidized by religious orders, which provided a large number of sisters to work in the schools for a stipend far below market wages. That, of course, has changed. And the higher wages which now need to be paid has boosted tuition significantly compared to what it might have been 50 or more years ago.

So changing affordability, as well as changing demographics, have played a role in the closings of schools. Perhaps the news you posted indicates that the situation is finally stabilizing.

Or maybe not. But let’s be optimistic.

Now the schools are heavily subsidized by the archdiocese.

 

[manualman]

Cardinal George really need not look too far for the recipe for saving catholic schools. He just has to look to the past for the reason they were initially so popular and look to the thriving catholic schools today and ask what is different there.

The Past:
How is it that penniless immigrants could afford to build the largest private educational system in history and their FAR richer grandchildren can’t even afford to staff and occasionally re-roof those structures? Easy - motivation. 100 years ago, US culture overtly hated catholicism. Public schools were openly protestant in character and didn’t pretend to be otherwise. Catholics perceived the threat to their children and made the sacrifices necessary to protect them. These schools were built by people without air conditioning, many without cars, some without even houses (renters). They most certainly did not have cable TV, Netflix, computers, cell phones and annual fly away vacations. They saw a threat to their children, saw a means to protect their children and simply made the sacrifices necessary to do so.

The Present:
The typical public school today has purged itself of the militantly protestant influences so much that God himself is simply a taboo topic. The unintended consequence is that by omission the de facto message sent to children is that God is optional, at best, irrelevant most likely. Believe what you want, but keep it to yourself. Today’s catholic parents have NOT perceived this “agnosticism by default” philosophy to be a threat to their children. Second, the government now seizes SO much wealth for the benefit of the bloated public school system that it is harder than ever to give up those paid for benefits in favor of the typically shoestring operation that characterizes the average catholic school. And the nail in the coffin is that the average catholic school really ISN’T much different than a public school except that the facility is shabbier, the teachers are paid less, there is a crucifix on the wall, they have a feeble religion class once a week and have an all-school mass once a month. No wonder so many parents place a higher value on a two week family vacation to Cancun than they do on a catholic education.

The Solution:
We CAN restore the catholic educational system to its previous glory and the path is clear.

1. Priests need to point out the mortal danger of secularization and encourage people to re-adopt catholic devotional practices, regular Scripture study, small faith groups, and regular sacramental participation. Parents need to recognize the danger of the secular message that God is either dead or irrelevant and recognize the value of participating in a culture of faith throughout life, not just for an hour on Sundays.
2. Catholic Schools need to get over their inferiority complex and be CATHOLIC schools! Stop using purely secular curricula for everything except Religion class. Catholicism is a faith that has spawned an entire CULTURE. Teach it! Art, history, music, logic/rhetoric, Latin. These things are BEST taught in their original context of the catholic faith that shaped Western civilization. Stop being merely a low budget version of the agnostic public schools with a religion class tacked on like an afterthought. Establish a school culture oriented to the priorities of the catholic faith: daily mass, regular confession, class devotionals, lives of the saints, holy day celebrations. This CAN be done and is being done not so far away from Chicago: holycross-batavia.org/hccs/index.php/curriculum (A 2 year old school that is already bursting at the seams because it works on these principles)
3. Do 1 and 2 above and you will start a revolution. Catholic schools will be WORTH giving up luxuries for again (worked on me: no cable/satellite, no frequent flier miles and our 2 cars have a combined 278k miles on 'em). And doing so will create a new generation more willing to listen for and say YES to God’s call to religious vocations. Once that happens again, costs will come down as religious sisters and brothers give of themselves to make the cost affordable to ALL catholic children.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

Cardinal George really need not look too far for the recipe for saving catholic schools. He just has to look to the past for the reason they were initially so popular and look to the thriving catholic schools today and ask what is different there.

You ignore the fact that now at least 75% of the children in parochial school in the diocese are not Catholic. Plus, the era of neighborhood ethnic enclaves has passed. So you have Catholics widely spread in the suburbs and an education ministry in the city.

Things have changed dramatically.

 

[Dale_M]

You ignore the fact that now at least 75% of the children in parochial school in the diocese are not Catholic…

That is a surprisingly high percentage. Are you sure it is accurate for the entire archdiocese?

I understand your point, though. Making the schools more Catholic-focused might lead to the loss of students, which could jeopardize a school’s financial condition, leading to more school closings.

Manualman may be correct that in the long run, a more fully authentic Catholic school system might attract students (or at least their parents.) Heck, it might even lead to some conversions. Are there any studies about the impact that a more Catholic-focused approach might have on a school’s (or school system’s) enrollment and financial viability?

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

That is a surprisingly high percentage. Are you sure it is accurate for the entire archdiocese?

On second thought, its lower than that. I think its about 36%.

"Some parishes maintain schools where more than two thirds of the students are non-Catholic and where large percentages of their students’ families are having a tough time affording tuition. That combination can be a disaster because it can lead to a parish school with both a declining enrollment and a weakening commitment from its parish community. "

webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:JTASkb14hLgJ:www.uscatholic.org/culture/social-justice/2008/07/why-we-cant-afford-close-catholic-schools+chicago+catholic+schools+%2Bnon-catholic+percentage&cd=11&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

 

[manualman]

Beau yours is the logic that has been pursued for the last 40 years. It has been a non-stop loser of an argument the entire time. If we have our catholic schools stop being catholic in order to have a wider appeal, then what is the point any more? Might just as well close them now and lease them to secular charter school operators until/unless the numbers of the faithful can support real catholic schools again.

Why should the catholic faithful pay massive taxes AND have much of their Church giving siphoned off to educate non-catholic children in a secular manner? That’s simply squandering resources that were given to advance the gospel, not just to duplicate and subsidize public services.

You have a great point about changing demographics. But the reason we can’t build catholic schools where the catholics ARE today is because we are still spending our resources trying to keep open nominally catholic schools where the catholics AREN’T. Where the population of catholics isn’t enough to support a catholic school, CLOSE it and lease it to a charter school operator who can get government money. That is a win-win in that the poor students of the old neighborhood still benefit from a school with actual disciplinary options AND it frees up money resources to operate and open CATHOLIC schools where there ARE adequate catholic student populations to make them thrive.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

Beau yours is the logic that has been pursued for the last 40 years. It has been a non-stop loser of an argument the entire time. If we have our catholic schools stop being catholic in order to have a wider appeal, then what is the point any more?

I don’t think I expressed that as any ‘logic’.

Why should the catholic faithful pay massive taxes AND have much of their Church giving siphoned off to educate non-catholic children in a secular manner? That’s simply squandering resources that were given to advance the gospel, not just to duplicate and subsidize public services.

Well, just like hospitals have a healing ministry, I think the schools have an education ministry. It should be one of those corporal works of mercy: “Educate the ignorant.”

You have a great point about changing demographics. But the reason we can’t build catholic schools where the catholics ARE today is because we are still spending our resources trying to keep open nominally catholic schools where the catholics AREN’T.

We can’t move those schools or give them away or sell them. We may as well use them for their prupose.

Where the population of catholics isn’t enough to support a catholic school, CLOSE it and lease it to a charter school operator who can get government money. That is a win-win in that the poor students of the old neighborhood still benefit from a school with actual disciplinary options AND it frees up money resources to operate and open CATHOLIC schools where there ARE adequate catholic student populations to make them thrive.

I prefer Catholics educating and converting the non-Catholics. That’s where my money goes. Others may differ.

 

[jamanne]

Hello to everyone as a Scots born Canadian I have always had access to Catholic Ed .Please bear with me as i ask ,does the American Catholic schools get any public funding? If not does that mean all your tax dollars go into the public system,doesn,t seem fair …in Canada you can direct your taxes to either system and in the Uk Catholic and public are covered equally,just wanted to know

 

[Dale_M]

does the American Catholic schools get any public funding?

I don’t think so, at least not under most state and federal programs.

If not does that mean all your tax dollars go into the public system,doesn,t seem fair …in Canada you can direct your taxes to either system and in the Uk Catholic and public are covered equally,just wanted to know

A few cities issue vouchers which parents can apply to school tuition at private schools. But generally speaking, such vouchers are not available. So parents pay taxes to support public schools even if their children do not attend.

Of course, most adults in the US don’t have children in public schools (or private schools) and they pay the same taxes.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I pay for the FAA even if I don’t fly, the police department even if I never call them, the fire department even if I never have a fire, the post office even if I never mail a letter, the state board of health, county supervisors, medical, and a whole lot of other stuff I’ll never use. I wonder why anti public education folks always point out how people pay for schools they don’t use but don’t list the hundreds of other things we never use yet pay for?

A few cities issue vouchers which parents can apply to school tuition at private schools. But generally speaking, such vouchers are not available. So parents pay taxes to support public schools even if their children do not attend.

Of course, most adults in the US don’t have children in public schools (or private schools) and they pay the same taxes.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Why should my taxes go to restaurant inspectors if I never eat out? Why should my $$$ go to the CHP if I never use the highways? Why should my $$$ go to Medical if I don’t use it? Or to Homeland Security? Maybe I disagree with how Bush or Obama are conducting Homeland Security and don’t think I should pay into it? Or I hate the FBI. Maybe my $$$ shouldn’t go to them.

Vouchers…some parents don’t have kids in school, unfair to make them pay? Or as a Catholic, my $$$ goes to some Mormon parents to pay for their kids to go to an LDS school teaching their kids about gold plates and Joseph Smith? Or to a Buddhist school or, God forbid, a Muslim madrasa? You see where I’m going with this…

Why should the catholic faithful pay massive taxes AND have much of their Church giving siphoned off to educate non-catholic children in a secular manner? That’s simply squandering resources that were given to advance the gospel, not just to duplicate and subsidize public services.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

Vouchers…some parents don’t have kids in school, unfair to make them pay? Or as a Catholic, my $$$ goes to some Mormon parents to pay for their kids to go to an LDS school teaching their kids about gold plates and Joseph Smith? Or to a Buddhist school or, God forbid, a Muslim madrasa? You see where I’m going with this…

You forgot the famous southern ‘segregation academies’.

 

[manualman]

Vouchers…some parents don’t have kids in school, unfair to make them pay? Or as a Catholic, my $$$ goes to some Mormon parents to pay for their kids to go to an LDS school teaching their kids about gold plates and Joseph Smith? Or to a Buddhist school or, God forbid, a Muslim madrasa? You see where I’m going with this…

Argued like a public school teacher.

The reason taxes fund education is that society as a whole has agreed (via their votes) that education is important enough that it must be publicly funded. The single businessman benefits from an educated populace as does the father of 10.

Your argument here exposes your distrust of parents as the primary decision makers for their children and de facto seizes some of that responsibility and gives it to the government. (Oh NO! Can’t let parents decide where the money allocated for their kids education goes. THEY might make the WRONG choice). But I’m not getting drawn into a tangent about vouchers. That’s a whole different animal.

MY point in this thread is that the Catholic Church for the last 50 years has done a HORRIBLE job of evangelizing and catechizing its children. A major cause of that has been the derailing of the mission of catholic schools by watering down their catholic identity to “appeal to a wider audience.” Get back on mission and you will be able to cut off the gangrene and save the patient (the catholic school system).

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

MY point in this thread is that the Catholic Church for the last 50 years has done a HORRIBLE job of evangelizing and catechizing its children.

Perhaps. Ok so far …

A major cause of that has been the derailing of the mission of catholic schools by watering down their catholic identity to “appeal to a wider audience.”

There’s where I disagree. Catholic schools have not done a good job in making sure their graduates continue as faithful Catholics and also have not done a good job converting the non-Catholic students.

There are many reasons for this, including the dearth of teachers who are members of religious orders. I don’t think that the message was ‘watered down’ or that the message affected affected anything. There never was a stress on evangelization.

Can you imagine Catholics going door to door like Jehovah Witnesses?

 

[manualman]

There are many reasons for this, including the dearth of teachers who are members of religious orders. I don’t think that the message was ‘watered down’ or that the message affected affected anything. There never was a stress on evangelization.

You DON’T think the message has been watered down???! You must have gone through school earlier than the 1970’s. There was a big crackdown on horrible religion curricula after the catechism was printed. Today’s are MUCH improved since then. But that doesn’t say much because of how bad they were before. I have in my possession a second grade copy of the “Blest are We” text and the “Faith and Life”.

The difference is AMAZING. The former is large, thick has lots of fuzzy bunny type pictures and generally gives a VERY dumbed down explanation of the faith with heavy emphasis on feelings and absolutely minimal doctrinal content. It is the most common curricula in my region (and standard in the Joliet Diocese).

The latter is smaller in page size and much thinner. But it actually explains the faith! It doesn’t seem embarassed to explain it or to undermine teaching with vagueness. It is used very few places around here in spite of being cheaper. Why??

If you don’t think catechesis has been dumbed down from what it was in the 1950’s you haven’t been paying attention. I’ve done confirmation retreats for thousands of high school kids in Wisconsin, Minnesota, North Dakota, Illinois, New Jersy and New York. Most of the kids I meet who will be confirmed that year can’t define Grace. They don’t know what original sin is. They can’t say what happend at Pentecost. They can’t recite either creed. They haven’t been to confession in YEARS. This is true of BOTH CCD and catholic school students.

Evangelization is absolutely the job of catholic schools. It is not about knocking on doors, it is about living your faith on your sleeve infectiously. When teachers and parish school priests do it, people catch it.

 

[Beau_Ouiville]

Evangelization includes missionary work in converting non-believers. Catholics in general get low marks in this area.

I am not so self-absorbed as to believe that the problem of Catholic schools is that they don’t follow my particular suggestions or viewpoints. For some reason, I believe it is more complicated than that. There is also the greater influx of Catholics in the general population. Once they got out of the ghettos, Catholics really starting intermarrying with other religious folks.

And I attended parochial school up until 1970, during the civil rights period. It was an interesting time.

 

[AnotherVoice]

Evangelization is absolutely the job of catholic schools. It is not about knocking on doors, it is about living your faith on your sleeve infectiously. When teachers and parish school priests do it, people catch it.

Please let us not forget about the role of the family in all of this. I see people blaming the schools and the priests and other religious for not doing what my Mom and Dad did while raising me.

I don’t intend to defend the watering down which has taken place but we can’t push all of the snow to the school’s side of the parking lot.