RCIA Scrutinies

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cricket331:
I asked yet again today and was told they have no such papers,
and it is also required of the people “converting” not just the one person being baptised,
I am on medication for my problem but its of little help.
I dropped out of the RCIA class after mass this morning…

thanks for your replies
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this is your excuse, not the reason. please make an apointment with the priest and discuss with him the real reasons you are having difficulty with the process. bear in mind this is not a straight smooth road for everyone culminating in Easter, with everybody on the same schedule. that is one very good reason baptized Christians are often asked to participate in class with the catechumens, because most of them come upon some area of difficulty, whether the Real Presence, Mary, Confession, priesthood–whatever. It sometimes takes a while to get over the hump, but dropping out is never the solution. Take your time, work on whatever your roadblock is, you have plenty of help from your pastor, RCIA director, catechists and sponsors, not to mention here on the forums. No law says everybody has to be on the same page at the same time. It takes as long as it takes.
 
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cricket331:
I asked yet again today and was told they have no such papers,
and it is also required of the people “converting” not just the one person being baptised,
I am on medication for my problem but its of little help.
I dropped out of the RCIA class after mass this morning…

thanks for your replies
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Cricket, we did the scrutinies today at mass with my group and all we had to do was stand there. We weren’t even facing the people, we faced the altar where Fr. was standing. He read a blessing and then were dismissed. It is not a big deal.

Plus, at this point you are so close. Why would you come this far just to leave?
 
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Celia:
Cricket, we did the scrutinies today at mass with my group and all we had to do was stand there. We weren’t even facing the people, we faced the altar where Fr. was standing. He read a blessing and then were dismissed. It is not a big deal.

Plus, at this point you are so close. Why would you come this far just to leave?
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well if its not a big deal then why should we have to do it is how i feel.
yes i have put in a lot of time on this.

But I wont change my mind,and besides I already dropped from the class even if i did decide to be “scrutinized” in front of all them people.The church I was leaving would never do this to people,put them on “public display” for having Faith.
So I will just stay with it.
Being Catholic is not worth the sickness I went thru last night or what I would face if i tried to go thru with it.People remember when they see someone puking in a place such as this…
or passing out.
call me a failure, or even a quitter,would rather be known as these then “the person who puked all over the church and passed out”.
 
Cricket,

I’m so sorry you feel that the Church has any desire to Humiliate you through this process. I understand you’re concerned that you might embarrass yourself (puking in public would NOT be any fun, I agree). Please know that it is not the intent to place you in a position that would elicit such a response, nor would those in attendance have the callous response you seem to expect.

I was once at a Mass where the young girl in the row ahead of me had a Grand Mal seizure. Know that the response of those around was to support the family in dealing with the situation and to pray for them all. But I don’t believe a single person present had any bad feelings towards the girl or her family.

Please, follow the suggestion of previous posters. Talk to the Pastor at the parish where you have been participating in the RCIA program. I don’t know what options he has, but you owe it to him and yourself to talk things through.

The Church wants to welcome you and pray for you in the process.

God Bless,

CARose
 
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cricket331:
well if its not a big deal then why should we have to do it is how i feel.
yes i have put in a lot of time on this.

But I wont change my mind,and besides I already dropped from the class even if i did decide to be “scrutinized” in front of all them people.The church I was leaving would never do this to people,put them on “public display” for having Faith.
So I will just stay with it.
Being Catholic is not worth the sickness I went thru last night or what I would face if i tried to go thru with it.People remember when they see someone puking in a place such as this…
or passing out.
call me a failure, or even a quitter,would rather be known as these then “the person who puked all over the church and passed out”.
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Well, scrutinies is part of the process so, it is a big deal in itself, but what I mean is that you don’t need to be worried because it’s nothing to get worked up over. And when it gets tough- think of it as suffering for the Lord. It’s Lent, after all. 😉 Think of what he did for you…

You dropping out of the class is probably not a problem. People have left and come back in my church. Talk to your priest about your issues privately and maybe you guys can work something out. Good luck to you.
 
I was a nervous wreck for the Rites my class has been through so far, but I still went through with it. I still get the jitters when our RCIA class is called up and dismissed after the homily every week. This, too shall pass, or so I kept telling myself. I missed class yesterday due to a panic attack; I attended Mass in the afternoon. However, I definitely understand what Cricket is going through, especially since I have been joyously and anxiously counting down the days until my Confirmation. But even though I’m so close to getting there, I still wanted to just stop going and forget the whole thing! Then, I calmed down and regretted missing RCIA this week. I didn’t think that this would be such an arduous journey, but it has been an eventful and exhausting eight months. Yet as bad as I feel now, I would feel immeasureably worse if I quit, and I am NOT a quitter.

However, please feel free to include me in your prayers!
 
Sorry Folks I do not have the same convictions to join a church that you do.

I do not believe Jesus wants us humiliated,demeaned,and treated like Trash to be able to join a Church,
I am glad you are able to let yourselves be treated this way, however i cannot.I am sure its this attitude that they want within the church anyways someone whom will follow all given commands,and not question or go against them no matter what they are. I can not do this, I appreciate all the replies though.

Its just not in me to subject myself to total humiliation,or be put in front of everyone so maybe they will get to see some lightening come down and strike the “sinner” whom is trying to “infiltrate” the church. kind of reminds me of people going to a auto race to see car crashes. I could possibly understand it more if it was a one time thing but they keep doing it over and over again,I guess they have to make you totally submissive to them though, kind of how things work in a cult as well. and no i am not saying this is a cult just uses same things to control its people…

anyways I am staying with my previous religion and will drive the extra 45 mins to get to that Church instead of staying in my own neighborhood…

thanks again everyone and bless you all
 
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puzzleannie:
A public welcome, having people pray for you, wish you well and express their joy is not humiliation.
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Its is exactly a humiliation and demeaning thing when you do not want it.

Kind of like saying that because someone is raped its not humiliating if someone dont want something and its forced how can it be anything but humiliating and demeaning??

Would you want your confessions made public to the church?
how could that be humiliating? these are the same people who welcomed you into the church remember,they can pray for you after they know all your darkest confessions and you have no reason to be humiliated, thats basically what you stated above as well, there is no room for saying well thats different, because it is in fact NO DIFFERENT, its something you do not want done…
now that being said would you be so eager to go to the next confession if you knew the whole church was going to be watching and listening or even told of everything said?
Code: 
see how when you dont want something forcing it is humiliating?
thats why I just dropped out and wont go back just like you wouldnt go to a confession that was public,
 
Cricket,

Scrutinies does NOT expose your confessions to ANYONE! The Confessional is sealed, the priest CANNOT share what you’ve confessed with anyone, for any reason, ever. I don’t know where you got that idea.

If joining the Catholic Church has been motivated by avoiding a 45 minute drive to church, perhaps you’re looking in the wrong place. But please know that if you’re serious about wanting to partake of the Lord’s supper, where you can receive the real presence of Our Lord, Jesus Christ, then this is where you want to be.

I understand you have anxiety issues and concerns that standing up in front of the congregation is an extreme challenge for you. DO NOT therefore assume that this aspect of the process is designed to intentionally humiliate you. DO NOT assume that there is no way of working around this in your case, if you are sincere about wanting to join the church for Christ.

Talk calmly to your pastor. Explain your concerns. See if something can be done that would allow you to NOT stand in front of everyone.
If you don’t want to become Catholic, then by all means DON’T, but don’t suggest that the Church is looking to belittle you and seeks only to bring together those who won’t question what we’re asked to do. Catholicism is strongly based on balancing Faith and Reason.

CARose
 
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CARose:
Cricket,

Scrutinies does NOT expose your confessions to ANYONE! The Confessional is sealed, the priest CANNOT share what you’ve confessed with anyone, for any reason, ever. I don’t know where you got that idea.

If joining the Catholic Church has been motivated by avoiding a 45 minute drive to church, perhaps you’re looking in the wrong place. But please know that if you’re serious about wanting to partake of the Lord’s supper, where you can receive the real presence of Our Lord, Jesus Christ, then this is where you want to be.

I understand you have anxiety issues and concerns that standing up in front of the congregation is an extreme challenge for you. DO NOT therefore assume that this aspect of the process is designed to intentionally humiliate you. DO NOT assume that there is no way of working around this in your case, if you are sincere about wanting to join the church for Christ.

Talk calmly to your pastor. Explain your concerns. See if something can be done that would allow you to NOT stand in front of everyone.
If you don’t want to become Catholic, then by all means DON’T, but don’t suggest that the Church is looking to belittle you and seeks only to bring together those who won’t question what we’re asked to do. Catholicism is strongly based on balancing Faith and Reason.

CARose
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I believe that we are being lead down a blind alley here. The original poster is set on expressing how demeaning the Catholic Church is instead of really addressing their own issue. Maybe it is satan leading them away. But I get this feeling that it is something else.
 
Cricket, I am reading directly from the Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults, Catholic Book Publishing Company, 1988. Here is what is specified for the 3rd week of Lent.

There will be the Liturgy of the word, and then a homily. Then the elect will be called forward. Here are the rubrics for the rite.

160 After the homily, a deacon or other assisting minister says

Let the elect now come forward to recieve the Creed from the Church

Before beginning the Apostles’ Creed (option A) or the Nicene Creed (option B) the celebrant addresses the elect in these or similar words.

My dear friends listen carefully to the words of that faith by which you will be justified. The words are few, but the mysteries they contain are great. Receive them with a sincere heart and be faithful to them.

The celebrant alone begins:

I believe in God, the Father almighty (Apostle’s Creed)
OR
We believe in one God, (Nicene Creed)

As the elect listen, he continues with the assembly of the faithful

(Rest of the creed is recited by EVERYONE, but the elect, the elect are required to listen only)

After the creed is recited there is a prayer over the elect.

161 Using the following or similar words, the celebrant invites the faithful to pray.

Let us pray for these elect, that God in his mercy may make them responsive to his love, so that through the waters of rebirth they may receive pardon for their sins and have life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

All pray in silence.

Then the celebrant, with hands outstretched over the elect says:

Lord,
eternal source of light, justice and truth, take under your tender care, your servants N. and N. Purify them and make them holy; give them true knowledge, sure hope, and sound understanding, and make them worthy to receive the grace of baptism.

We ask this through Christ our Lord.

R. Amen

After that the elect are dimissed back to their seat or to their RCIA class and the Liturgy of the Eucharist will then begin.

As you can see, there is no 3rd degree, no inquisition, and you are not required to say a word. If you would like I will post the rubrics for the 4th and 5th weeks as well. Please do not quit, please go speak to your pastor, and please persevere with entering into the Church.
 
Br. Rich SFO:
I believe that we are being lead down a blind alley here. The original poster is set on expressing how demeaning the Catholic Church is instead of really addressing their own issue. Maybe it is satan leading them away. But I get this feeling that it is something else.
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My post about the confessional was merely an example as to what that person had said to me about something public not being humiliating,
for me my confession made public would not be humiliating but for most if would be,
that person didnt see standing in front of a bunch of people being put on display as a here is a sinner get a good look as humiliating. to me its very humiliating.
my reply to her post was to show that what one person considers humiliating may not be to another,
to me being put on public display is one of the most humiliating
things that can be done to me, I flunked college and high school courses over that issue. yes its a problem i understand that and its one that affects one out of every 3 people. thats over 33% of the people cannot do this.Because of utter embarrassment,
the church is well aware of these statistics as that is where I got them from my priest. So do I think its a deliberate attempt to embarrass someone? absolutly
did he? he wouldnt comment.

So yes I have talked to him about MY problem,

But In no way dd i say that the confessional was not sealed had that person read the whole reply instead of picking and choosing words they would have relized that as well…

anyways whats done is done.I have no hidden agendas.
its real easy to say someone has a hidden agenda when they dont have the same resolves that you do, saves trying to rationalize why something is done the way its done,
 
Cricket,

When you are called forward it is not to put “sinners on display” because there’s plenty of sinners in the pews as well. We are ALL sinners.

When you are brought up, it is a welcoming of future family members to the Church that Christ established. It is a chance for the entire Church to pray for you as you go down the path of entering into the Church.

With that I am going to leave you with a couple of verses.

Matthew 5:verses 4, 6 & 10 (NAB)
4 Blessed are they who mourn, for they will be comforted.
6 Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for righteousness, 7 for they will be satisfied.
10 Blessed are they who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness, 9 for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

and finally

John 14:26-27 (NAB )
26 The Advocate, the holy Spirit that the Father will send in my name–he will teach you everything and remind you of all that (I) told you.
27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give to you. Not as the world gives do I give it to you. Do not let your hearts be troubled or afraid.
 
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gelsbern:
Cricket,

When you are called forward it is not to put “sinners on display” because there’s plenty of sinners in the pews as well. We are ALL sinners…
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I agree with the first staement but it seems because we “are not full members” of the church that we go on display…

.
When you are brought up, it is a welcoming of future family members to the Church that Christ established. It is a chance for the entire Church to pray for you as you go down the path of entering into the Church…
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Ok when someone comes to visit you do you make them do something that they wouldnt want to do before being “allowed into your house”

or if you had a son that was getting married and he brought his future bride home would you say welcome to the “family” now i have say you need to go on a diet, or tell her her clothes need to be changed,cleaned etc, of course you wouldnt insult her or “belittle” her. so in my way of thinking this is definatly not a “Welcoming” at all

when you “welcome” someone its without insult,belittleing, or anything else that makes them feel totally “Unwelcome”
being welcome is supposed to be put at ease not into anxiety attacks…
 
There is no belittling going on, I am not sure where you are getting that from. You are brough forth, you stand there, on the fifth week, you will recite the creed along with everyone else there. There is no one on one interview, (well they do ask your name). It’s not like an AA meeting where you say hi, my name is Cricket and I am a sinner with the people responding “Hi Cricket”. It’s not like that, the entire thing is meant to be a time of inner reflection, and the joyous anticipation of your entering into the family of God. You will be asked questions, but the Church in her Wisdom has made it very simple. All you have to answes is “I do”

Here is a snippet of the questions you will be asked. They go like this:

Do you reject sin as to live in the freedom of God’s children?

you respond

I do.

Do you reject the glamor of evil, and refuse to be mastered by sin?

again you respond

I do.

The Church has been doing this for a very long time, there is no desire to humiliate, they make the rite as easy as possible, when you do have to recite the creed it is with everyone else who is there too, they don’t make each of the elect do it individually. There’s no spotlight, there’s no Simon Cowell telling you you suck. There’s no mean lady saying “You are the weakest link”, you are up front being presented the creeds of the church, your renunciation of Satan, and then presented to your new family.

Let me get to work of posting the 4th and 5th weeks. Please keep with it. My prayers are with you.
 
Br. Rich SFO:
I believe that we are being lead down a blind alley here. The original poster is set on expressing how demeaning the Catholic Church is instead of really addressing their own issue. ** Maybe it is satan leading them away**. But I get this feeling that it is something else.
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What can be humiliating about have the entire parish pray for you? I was warned that during Lent, satan would be trying to pull me away from the Church at every turn. After one minor temptation, I have successfully resisted.

After my first Scrutiny at Sunday Mass, amazing things happened for me Sunday night. I found a priceless diamond given to my great grandmother by her father that had been missing for almost twenty years. In my life, that was a miracle. It was God’s answer to my prayers.

Cricket…you are cheating yourself. You will never know how much happiness the love of God can bring you. I feel very sorry for you and will pray for you.
 
Cricket, before you talk to the priest, I think you should talk to your doctor (or whoever perscribed the medication) and a good counselor. It sounds to me that you are really suffering from anxiety and panic attacks, and that they’re really affecting your daily life. That must be very hard for you. I just want you to know that you don’t have to live like this. There are people who can help you. I’m not saying this to humiliate you, I have suffered from depression and anxiety myself. It was the hardest thing I’ve ever dealt with in my life. It took time to recover, and a lot of work. But it is possible. Please, take care of yourself. I’m worried about you.
 
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LeahInancsi:
I was warned that during Lent, satan would be trying to pull me away from the Church at every turn. After one minor temptation, I have successfully resisted.
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Ain’t that the truth! That must explain my “waking up on the wrong side of the bed” this past Sunday when I, for no explainable reason, suddenly wanted “out” amid my panic attack. However, this Candidate will be at Mass this Sunday and the rest to follow, God willing.

P.S.: Sorry for continually bringing up my past week’s (miserable) experience, but I understand what Cricket is going through.
 
I have read this thread through in one sitting and I have come to two conclusions.

One, Cricket331 is not really joining the Catholic church. Maybe one of her friends is and she is trying to get information to turn her away from the Church. :mad:

Two, Cricket331 is part of an RCIA program, but has not told anyone of her fear of being in front of a group. 😦

Now is the time Cricket. If it is the second one, let us know. We will pray for you. Tell you RCIA leader and your priest about your fear. No one wants you to be afraid. No one wants you to toss your cookies at Mass. We love to see our Church grow every Easter. We want you to be part of the Church. But, again, no one wants you to be afraid. There is a solution. And it does not involve you being humiliated.

Now, if it is the first. Good job. You have everyone here trying to help you. But on the other hand, you don’t have anything to go back with, that is negative about the Church. See we really are nice people.
 
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