Really it was just grape juice NOT!

[dream_wanderer]

For whatever this is worth…one of the Bible teachers at Bob Jones said yes…it WAS WINE!

I drank the grape juice as a Protestant but personally would have had no problem with wine. One of the arguments I have heard against the wine is “Jesus wouldn’t give people something that would hurt them!” Whichi s true in a sense. He wouldn’t…and He didn’t.

dream wanderer

 

[Count_Chocula]

Lourdes:

No, but this may be the answer to my question

I understand and have successfully been explaining why it had to have been true, alcholic wine (however watered down) and not grape juice; but I recently had a Baptist tell me that since “alcohol is harmful” and “Jesus wouldn’t harm His body, would He?” that the “wine” was actually unfermented grape juice made from a mixture of water and “grape paste” that was kept in a jar. I know this is wrong, but I was at a loss to explain how, since she kept insisting that in its “paste” form, the grapes would not be able to ferment.

This is flawed logic, science and doctors and other “smart” people have demonstrated with loads of Empirical evidence that wine in low amounts is indeed VERY beneficial to one’s health therefore it is reasonable to assume Christ in his total wisdom would acknowledge wine’s use and would drink a cup or two of it every now and then.

So regardless of the Bible that line of logic doesn’t hold water. I mean, the Bible promotes limited alcohol use, why fight it? I say 3 cheers for God on this one!

 

[Ham1]

If the wine was boiled and concentrated, it would not have any alcohol. It would also taste horrible.

Wine is good for you. I would not doubt that Jesus drank wine nearly everyday.

I also have a hard time believing that Jesus would actually attend a wedding reception that was alcohol-free. I mean, what kind of party would that be? I am certain that the King of Kings would have loved a good party!

If a man deliberately abstains from wine to such an extent that he does serious harm to his nature, he will not be free from blame. (St. Thomas Aquinas)

 

[Malachi4U]

DaveBj:

…Our Southern Baptist Sunday School lesson this coming Sunday is on the Lord’s Supper, and the printed materials come out and say that Jesus used grape juice. The level of ignorance sometimes boggles the mind… :banghead:

It’s going to be difficult to keep my mouth shut.

DaveBj

Dave,

Why should you keep your mouth shut? They do allow free speech don’t they?

When I go to Baptist churches I do speak out, but with very much respect and as politely as I can. I also try not to laugh at some of what they say but when my wife looks at me as she is biting her tongue and that certain snicker in her face, I loose it and have to excuse myself. Ok, its her fault I laugh I admit it. She was raised half Baptist and half Pentecostal and is still on her journey home to Rome – I hope she makes it someday.

Why I go to Baptist church I have answered elsewhere. I do go often and to BSF International too, a protestant Bible study with its own ‘opinions’ too.

I have the opportunity to ‘listen’ to what people in these groups say and believe. There is often little in common with their beliefs too. I really enjoy it when I quote a verse from Scripture and they say something like, “That’s not in the Bible, you must be using that Catholic stuff.” This is when I pull out my AKJV or NIV or KJV and quote them the verse from their Bible! You should see the look on their faces! By golly Jas 2:24-26 is in the KJV too!

What does this have to do with “grape juice?” Nothing yet. I just wanted to make a point that you can speak up and may find out that it can be beneficial. When the preacher or instructor contradicts Scripture or its out of “Context” or it’s a “man”-made tradition (like grape juice and no dancing), maybe you should speak up. I do now.

PS. I love stuf printed by SBP. Do you get this stuff too at your church? I save mine to show people what they say about Catholics and how they have become ‘Historical Revisionists’. I love to often prove SBP wrong when it comes to history and Catholicism. Its so easy now that I know the truth. Share that truth with others.

 

[Malachi4U]

Now to grape juice. I live in Utah so I am surrounded by Mormons. I was talking to one of them on this subject and they are all taught to say this, “Jesus made “grape juice” because it did not have time to ferment and become wine. Wine has to be fermented and that takes time. Since the “grape-juice” was not allowed to ferment it was impossible for it to be wine”!!!

When I first heard this ‘opinion’ I had no response either. I had never even heard this argument before. It actually made some sense. Somebody really spent some time coming up with this one and it seemed to work. I could not find a counter to it for quite some time.

So, what is the truth? Easy, when Jesus performs miracles He performs them 100% correct. When He made bread and fish to feed thousands was it yeast and grain and dough and fish eggs He served? No it was fully cooked bread and large grown fish! So when Jesus made wine He made it with the alcohole in it too! When Jesus says He is the Bread and Wine we eat and drink, He is in His Body and Blood that Catholics consume during communion. Faith!

Jesus can perform miracles. I don’t understand how but I have Faith in Him so I know its true. As a Catholic I see a miracle every Sunday during mass when the priest (good one or bad one) blesses the bread and wine and it becomes His Body and Blood just as Jesus said it would at the last supper. It may look like bread and wine but Jesus said it would be changed and who am I to ‘debate’ with Jesus?

Faith, it is powerful when we apply it as commanded by Jesus.

Praise God you can see through the ‘opinions’ of man. Whether you come home or remain Baptist just remember to have Faith, not ‘faith alone’. That’s a capital ‘F’ Faith too. Jesus loves all His children and He wants us all in His flock. I know some good Christian Baptists and you sound like one too.

Get on your knees before God and pray for the answers. Perhaps you could go to a church and kneel down and pray. He does answer prayer and I like to pray kneeling before Him. Try praying to Him in your Baptist church all alone and compare it with praying to Him in a Catholic church. Most catholic churches are open for private prayer all day long. Feel the diferance firsthand and without anyone there to influence you but God. I never knelt to Him as a protestant though, even though its in Scripture. I don’t think my wife ever kneeled in her life to pray till receantly in a Catholic Church. Boy was I shocked when she did that! Bring along your Bible too and read from it in His house.

God loves all His children, even a sinner like me.

 

[Greg54]

Why did Welch of Welch Grape Juice Co. get a patent for making juice that did not spoil if we knew how to do it 1900 years before.