Really turned off by Roman Catholic mass attended

[kimon]

(this forum seemed the most appropriate; mods, please move if I was wrong)

Since I have been thinking about coming into communion with Rome for a while now, I’ve been going to mass regularly at a Catholic church in my local parish. Being Greek Orthodox, I’m was really surprised with the girl altar servers, choir, modern music (I really can’t stand the “Our Father” sung like a Top 40s hit on the radio), etc. etc. However, I’ve been dealing with it.

Yesterday, I go to a mass at a different parish and boy was that a shocker! Not only did they have all the above (and their own version of the “Our Father” tune) they were even applauding!

The priest said “Let’s give a round of applause for the presence of the Lord”.

I felt like I was in a televangelist’s mega church.

As a Greek Orthodox contemplating communion with Rome, is this the kind of Mass I should expect? Or have I just been exposed to so called “liberal” parishes?

 

[Lancer]

I hear you…but remember…Its just a “test”…not for the faint of heart or spirit!

Pax Christi

 

[TheRealJuliane]

(this forum seemed the most appropriate; mods, please move if I was wrong)

Since I have been thinking about coming into communion with Rome for a while now, I’ve been going to mass regularly at a Catholic church in my local parish. Being Greek Orthodox, I’m was really surprised with the girl altar servers, choir, modern music (I really can’t stand the “Our Father” sung like a Top 40s hit on the radio), etc. etc. However, I’ve been dealing with it.

Yesterday, I go to a mass at a different parish and boy was that a shocker! Not only did they have all the above (and their own version of the “Our Father” tune) they were even applauding!

The priest said “Let’s give a round of applause for the presence of the Lord”.

I felt like I was in a televangelist’s mega church.

As a Greek Orthodox contemplating communion with Rome, is this the kind of Mass I should expect? Or have I just been exposed to so called “liberal” parishes?

I think it is termed “heterodox” not “liberal,” but whatever the label…

NO you should NOT expect this. You need to find a more orthodox church, more traditional, they do exist. The atmosphere is completely different. Try another parish.

Unfortunately, it seems the female altar servers are nearly universal, except, from what I have read here, in FSSP parishes. Even the more orthodox parish I attend includes female altar servers, which is a pity.

 

[PatriceA]

You probably are going to find girl altar servers at most churches. The other stuff, not typical in my regular small town Roman Catholic parish. Anytime the priest invites applauding as a regular part of the Mass, run!

 

[number2wilkins]

we have run from our lutheran synod wherein these heterodox practices are becoming the norm…anyone holding to a more traditional worship style and practice are labeled “inwardly focused” and not caring about evangelization…

in my naivete i thought the roman catholic church would be holding firm to the historic traditions and liturgy…

so far, outside of female altar servers, the parish we are attending seems to be holding its own…

 

[kimon]

Thanks for the comments so far. I get the girl altar server thing and though it’s really different to what I’m accustomed to, I can accept it.

But the almost show-tune like “Our Father” and applause? That, I cannot get over. Especially the latter.

Coincidentally, I found several others threads talking about applause at Mass: forums.catholic-questions.org/search.php?searchid=10839645

Yesterday’s Mass was really off putting. There were several other instances that felt very much Evangelical.

 

[Farsight001]

(this forum seemed the most appropriate; mods, please move if I was wrong)

Since I have been thinking about coming into communion with Rome for a while now, I’ve been going to mass regularly at a Catholic church in my local parish. Being Greek Orthodox, I’m was really surprised with the girl altar servers, choir, modern music (I really can’t stand the “Our Father” sung like a Top 40s hit on the radio), etc. etc. However, I’ve been dealing with it.

Yesterday, I go to a mass at a different parish and boy was that a shocker! Not only did they have all the above (and their own version of the “Our Father” tune) they were even applauding!

The priest said “Let’s give a round of applause for the presence of the Lord”.

I felt like I was in a televangelist’s mega church.

As a Greek Orthodox contemplating communion with Rome, is this the kind of Mass I should expect? Or have I just been exposed to so called “liberal” parishes?

Not only should you not expect that, you should report it to the local bishop so he can put a stop to it. Such behavior is quite forbidden in mass.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Thanks for the comments so far. I get the girl altar server thing and though it’s really different to what I’m accustomed to, I can accept it.

But the almost show-tune like “Our Father” and applause? That, I cannot get over. Especially the latter.

Coincidentally, I found several others threads talking about applause at Mass: forums.catholic-questions.org/search.php?searchid=10839645

Yesterday’s Mass was really off putting. There were several other instances that felt very much Evangelical.

If I’m on that thread, it’s because sometimes, the congregation will clap AFTER THE HOMILY!

But the link doesn’t work.

Drives me absolutely NUTS and I really want to strangle the ones who start it. The priest likes it. You can tell he does.

 

[kimon]

Not only should you not expect that, you should report it to the local bishop so he can put a stop to it. Such behavior is quite forbidden in mass.

Since I’m not Roman Catholic, I don’t think what I say would hold much weight with the Bishop.

 

[Fone_Bone_2001]

Thanks for the comments so far. I get the girl altar server thing and though it’s really different to what I’m accustomed to, I can accept it.

But the almost show-tune like “Our Father” and applause? That, I cannot get over. Especially the latter.

I agree with what others have said:

Female altar servers are very common in a typical Latin Catholic parish in North America. It would be unrealistic of someone not to expect them, although there are Latin Catholic parishes here and there that do not have them.

But a showtune-like Lord’s Prayer, and applause? No, not common. I’m sorry you encountered that.

 

[JRKH]

I’m just wondering here…
Are there any Eastern rite Churches in your area?

I’m not familiar with how these things work, but if there is an Eastern Rite church in the area this might allow you to come into communion with Rome while worshiping with liturgical practices more comfortable to you.

Peace
James

 

[Farsight001]

Since I’m not Roman Catholic, I don’t think what I say would hold much weight with the Bishop.

Call or write a letter about it. You simply don’t have to mention that you’re not Catholic and they’d never ask anyway. And even if they did, being an Orthodox contemplating conversion, I have little doubt you’d still be taken seriously.

 

[The_Idiot]

I second JRKH’s suggestion - and Eastern Catholic Church will allow you to worship in the way you have been accustomed.

 

[kimon]

I’m just wondering here…
Are there any Eastern rite Churches in your area?

I’m not familiar with how these things work, but if there is an Eastern Rite church in the area this might allow you to come into communion with Rome while worshiping with liturgical practices more comfortable to you.

Peace
James

There is one about a 45’ drive from me. However, my wife is Latin Rite Catholic and then it will be a matter of educated her that the Easter Rite church is also part of the Catholic Communion and not an Orthodox church (a whole other struggle there…)

However, and based on what others have said, the parts that truly made me uncomfortable are those that apparently have no place even in the Latin Rite: showtune-like Lord’s Prayer and applause.

 

[kimon]

Call or write a letter about it. You simply don’t have to mention that you’re not Catholic and they’d never ask anyway. And even if they did, being an Orthodox contemplating conversion, I have little doubt you’d still be taken seriously.

Good to know, thanks - I just might do that!

 

[jbarbaretta]

Since I’m not Roman Catholic, I don’t think what I say would hold much weight with the Bishop.

I think, if you are polite, the bishop would be happy to hear your concerns. Whether or not he does something about it would have nothing to do with whether you are in communion with the church. I think it would have more to do with the seriousness of the offenses. If they are minor, he may ignore them or send a note to the pastor. Depending on the pastor’s reaction to the note (if he gets one) you may or may not see any change at the mass. My guess is that you may be able to find a more traditional Catholic church around. I hate to suggest church shopping as that should not be a practice among Catholics as mass should essentially be the same from church to church. However, sometimes, it is difficult to worship in a church that has adopted several heterodox practices. You feel like a fish out of water.

Since you are Orthodox, you may also want to look around for an Eastern rite church near you rather than Roman. I’m not sure if that would help. Although, as I remember, Greek Orthodox is it is amazingly similar to Roman Catholic liturgy (ok, it’s been a couple decades since I’ve been in a Greek Orthodox church, but it felt pretty comfortable, although I didn’t know the language)

BTW, we have several parishes that only have altar boys (girl altar servers are not allowed by the pastor - the reasoning being that boys often get their first inkling of a vocation to the priesthood while serving as altar boys).

 

[ByzCathCantor]

You should also try attending an Eastern Catholic parish, if there is one nearby. You may find this to be a more natural setting for you, especially given that you are coming from the Greek Orthodox Church.

BTW (as I recently researched this out of curiousity) - the Latin Catholic Church holds that the station of altar server is a lay ministry, therefore open to both young men and women. In the Orthodox traditions (including the Eastern Churches), it is commonly held to be a substitute position for minor orders, and therefore reserved to males only.

Of course, in a Eastern Catholic setting, you will find the familiar Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom, of very similar form to that used in the Greek Orthodox Church, and the chant tradition will be consistent, reflecting the unique tradition of the particular church you may be attending.

Christos anesti!

 

[JRKH]

There is one about a 45’ drive from me. However, my wife is Latin Rite Catholic and then it will be a matter of educated her that the Easter Rite church is also part of the Catholic Communion and not an Orthodox church (a whole other struggle there…)

Sounds like you both have a wonderful opportunity to grow in your knowledge and appreciation of the different Rites within the Church. I’m sure some of teh Eatern Rite Catholics around here could help with that.

However, and based on what others have said, the parts that truly made me uncomfortable are those that apparently have no place even in the Latin Rite: showtune-like Lord’s Prayer and applause.

Hard to say what might be licit or not…since there seems to be some real concern probably best to contact the bishop’s office and ask…

Peace
James

 

[Fone_Bone_2001]

My wife is Latin Rite Catholic and then it will be a matter of educated her that the Easter Rite church is also part of the Catholic Communion and not an Orthodox church (a whole other struggle there…)

I do hope she comes to understand this. It’s very important, and all Catholics should know it. When Latin Catholics don’t know this, the unfortunate end result is often that Eastern and Oriental Catholics feel like second-class citizens, which is very sad.

BTW (as I recently researched this out of curiousity) - the Latin Catholic Church holds that the station of altar server is a lay ministry, therefore open to both young men and women. In the Orthodox traditions (including the Eastern Churches), it is commonly held to be a substitute position for minor orders, and therefore reserved to males only.

Exactly. The Latin Church no longer has the minor orders, so whereas before, lectors and acolytes were by definition young men preparing for the priesthood, now they are positions for laypeople to fill.

 

[Khalid]

(this forum seemed the most appropriate; mods, please move if I was wrong)

Since I have been thinking about coming into communion with Rome for a while now, I’ve been going to mass regularly at a Catholic church in my local parish. Being Greek Orthodox, I’m was really surprised with the girl altar servers, choir, modern music (I really can’t stand the “Our Father” sung like a Top 40s hit on the radio), etc. etc. However, I’ve been dealing with it.

Yesterday, I go to a mass at a different parish and boy was that a shocker! Not only did they have all the above (and their own version of the “Our Father” tune) they were even applauding!

The priest said “Let’s give a round of applause for the presence of the Lord”.

I felt like I was in a televangelist’s mega church.

As a Greek Orthodox contemplating communion with Rome, is this the kind of Mass I should expect? Or have I just been exposed to so called “liberal” parishes?

That’s one of the greatest stumbling blocks for me, who, as a Coptic Orthodox and then a Muslim and then a Greek Orthodox, that nature of completely irreverential, pop-psychology televangelist style Protestant service, which turns my stomach: I can not comprehend how such is pleasing to the Thrice-Holy God. (That’s what happens when you attempt to conform the Word and the Church to the people, instead of the people to the Word and the Church: you lose relevance to both the people, and to the Word.) Some parishes are like that - including all liberal ones - and some are not (although, sadly, many are).

Look for one that celebrates the “Extraordinary Form”, generally with a member of the FSSP as priest. One can find a more conservative parish that celebrates the Novus Ordo/Ordinary Form of the Mass in English as well.

However, as an Orthodox, you may have the best of both worlds in the Melkite Greek Catholic Church, or, as they call themselves, “Orthodox in Communion with Rome”, one of the 22 Eastern Rite Catholic Churches. They are, in my experience, without exception reverential and conservative, without any of the trash that you describe above that is present in all too many OF parishes. As an Orthodox, if you were to convert to Catholicism, you’d automatically become a Melkite in any case - so definitely go to your local Melkite church. (The Melkites, being Byzantine rite, celebrate the Divine Liturgy of St John Chrysostom, etc. just as they do in a Greek Orthodox [GOA] Church, and are much closer to what you’re used to: they are Orthodox in many ways, but they are within the Church as they acknowledge the supremacy of St Peter - I attend either a Melkite parish or one that offers the Tridentine Mass.)