Recent Headlines – good or bad fruit?

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Dude, it’s a blog. It indicates blog RIGHT IN THE WEB ADDRESS.

These people are looking to cause trouble. You’re happy to follow them hook, line and sinker.
 
ok they are a fake site and made up this false interview. Discussion ended. Enjoy your evening.
 
oppositeman13 said:
ok they are a fake site and made up this false interview. Discussion ended. Enjoy your evening.
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A blog doesn’t mean fake. Far from it. It means that it is not an unbiased source. It is an opinion with its own agenda. The entire problem here is agenda. Way too much of it from all sides.

Right now, except for the Vatican itself, there is no unbiased way to get news about Pope Francis. That’s just the way it is.
 
Oppositeman,
Is reading all this stuff helping you to grow closer to God?

If not, let it go. Read holy books, hang out with holy people as much as you are able, and don’t let all these ephemeral events disturb you.
 
oppositeman13 said:
Pope Francis’ Reported Words: “I Might Go Down in History for Having Split the Catholic Church”
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I find the run up to this in the article significant. In a very small circle, "Pope Francis is said to have self-critically further explained… " We do not even have who said that he said this. It is not referenced and unsubstantiated. The proper name for this is gossip and is the bad fruit of the Pope’s critics.

As to whether there will be split in the Church, St. John Paul technically had a split. I do not foresee anything more significant than that, but who knows? Time will tell.
 
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From the speech:
The advent of Pope Francis has, in the divine order of things, proved a great and true blessing. A hidden conflict has been raging in the Church for over one hundred years: a conflict explicitly revealed to Pope Leo XIII, partially contained by St. Pius X, unleashed at Vatican II. Under Francis, the first Jesuit pope, the first pope from the Americas and the first pope whose priestly ordination was in the New Rite, it is now full blown, with the potential of rendering the Church smaller but more faithful.
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There should be no question of where the true Church is to be found, not for a Catholic. This priest understand this basic truth.
 
so I guess we all belonged to a fake church prior to francis’ papacy and by following his theology we have been admitted into the true church of Christ - is that the reasoning?
 
No. Pope Benedict was the Pope at that time. Changing the Pope has never changed the Church or nullified it.
 
so you would see those who won’t follow our popes theology and agree with let’s say communion for the remarried, at least in some situations, are a schism group who aren’t really catholic any longer - that they are in error?
 
Of course not. I have no idea where you get that from? One does not have to agree with everything the Pope does.
 
how can one church be made up of people who have different beliefs on the same topic? - this topic of communion for the remarried is covered in official teaching - do you see what our pope is allowing an a reasonable extension or clarification of official teaching? because teaching cannot change so it can’t be a new one that conflicts with what is in place.
 
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Cardinal Schönborn: “All the [Dubia] Questions Can Be Answered ‘Yes’” - the question of concern is - Can the divorced and remarried who are still engaged in a sexual relationship receive absolution and communion without a change of life? So to my mind I see this as a conflict with official teaching.

onepeterfive.com

Cardinal Schönborn: “All the [Dubia] Questions Can Be Answered ‘Yes’”

On Thursday, July 13, Cardinal Cristoph Schönborn — the pope’s chosen interpreter and advocate for his apostolic exhortation Amoris Laetitia — addressed an audience at the “Let’s Talk Family: Let’s Be…
onepeterfive.com onepeterfive.com
 
oppositeman13 said:
  • this topic of communion for the remarried is covered in official teaching
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Here is how both can exist. You may not agree, but it is logically possible. St. John Paul called this a long standing practice. It is a practice grounded in doctrine, but it is not the only possible practice. The Church has a law that prohibits those that are in this seemingly objective state from receive communion. I word it that way because one can receive with an decree of nullity for the first marriage, even though objectively, the decree changes nothing. If a marriage is invalid after the decree, then it was invalid before the decree. Furthermore, if the annulment is turned down, it is still possible the first marriage was invalid.

Also, the Church has always taught that mortal sin requires knowledge that one is sinning. So why a person may be in a state of objective mortal sin, they may also be in a state of actual grace.

Yet communion in this instance is based on one’s objective state, not whether one is in a state of grace. I can see where it is possible that the Church use a standard for receiving communion that God uses to judge us.
 
well let’s say what you say is acceptable in God’s eyes - it probably, my guess, is that it doesn’t apply to many in this situation. This seems to be a slippery slope. Pope Francis said - ‘This is bottom line result, the de facto appraisals are entrusted to the confessors, but at the end of faster or slower paths, all the divorced who ask will be admitted.’ ( NOVEMBER 1, 2015, LA REPUBBLICA)

I think this path he is speaking of is that those seeking communion will in some way have to change? Still, Cardinal Burke says the only way for those in question to receive is to live as brother and sister and abstain from sexual relations.
 
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oppositeman13 said:
well let’s say what you say is acceptable in God’s eyes - it probably, my guess, is that it doesn’t apply to many in this situation.
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I would agree with that. I only know one priest that I have discussed this with. He is a big fan of Pope Francis and I know he really liked Amoris Laetitia. Yet when it came to this idea of pastoral discernment he told me that while he had been approached, he didn’t think it applied to anyone yet. Ideally, this needs to be rare, that is surely the tone of AL, and more difficult and time consuming than and annulment, and that after an annulment was denied, or for some reason could not be sought.

Instead of worrying about those that might receive communion, I would rather look to those who will grow in spiritual understanding of what the Church teaches, perhaps coming to peace with a life as brother and sister.

I know. I am an optimist.
 
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Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
Of the media? Sure he’s the victim.
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While many headlines may lead (or mislead) their readers, let’s look at what actually is verifiable. Pope Francis and his surrogates have no problem with name-calling and being offensive to those who hold (or uphold) orthodox positions regarding Church teaching. He continually preaches against rigidity, yet governs autocratically with no toleration for dissent from his personal views. He invites dialogue, but then refuses to actually engage in discourse with those with whom he disagrees. Solidly orthodox Cardinals and bishops being ignored, passed over, removed from positions, etc. all the while, those who have openly challenged Church teaching (and are on record doing so) are praised, consulted, appointed prominent positions, etc. And this is not occasional, but rather a demonstrable trend.
 
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Now, these are smart words. People will believe what they want regardless of how irrational their thinking is and deny the obvious. Where you and I see a trend that dismantles the traditional church, which is what is alarming, they see a trend for the good of our church. What they keep skipping over I have noticed is that they cannot make an argument that these changes are an extension or a clarification of official teaching which could be allowed, and not a new teaching which of course cannot be - a pope cannot just create a new teaching contrary to previous teaching. The first question of the dubia deals with this and I believe Cardinal Burke will soon make a formal correction - he has spoken about it just this past week.
 
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Please,look up who translated this quote and from where Eugenio Scalfari takes the info of his articles if you want.
Without the least intention to disqualify Scalfari,his method has inaccuracies and given his style it is understandable.
Basically,the quote was translated by Rorate Caeli from an interview Scalfari wrote by remembering a call he didn t take notes on nor during.
 
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