Restoration of Papal Tiara?

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He gave up the papal apartments that have been the traditional papal residence of his nine immediate predecessors, in favor of a couple of rooms in the guesthouse over at Domus Sanctae Marthae, although he still uses the papal apartments as an office. I don’t think a Madison Avenue agent could have thought that one up.

It was in keeping with his previous habits, where he stayed in an apartment instead of the Bishop’s Palace when he was Archbishop of Buenos Aires. I don’t think he was hiring ad agencies back then, either. 😛

He has a lot of things that he can do by (little-t) tradition, and he doesn’t mind bucking (little-t) tradition in favor of what he sees as something superior. As having been involved at various levels in various bureaucracies, and each with their own (little-t) traditions, I think that takes a lot of courage, to be able to stand up to a well-entrenched bureaucracy.
 
The Byzantine mitre is modelled on the Imperial Byzantine crown.
I find it somewhat amusing that the average Eastern bishop often looks more grand than the Supreme Pontiff.
 
One thing that is often missed here is his status as a religious. +Francis is the first Pope in a very long time who is a religious. He took a vow of poverty. St JPII and Benedict took no such vow and had no such calling…they were secular priests. The media totally missed this KEY distinction when they made a big deal over the Holy Father’s choices.
 
twf said:
One thing that is often missed here is his status as a religious. +Francis is the first Pope in a very long time who is a religious. He took a vow of poverty. St JPII and Benedict took no such vow and had no such calling…they were secular priests. The media totally missed this KEY distinction when they made a big deal over the Holy Father’s choices.
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OOOOOOhhhhhh

I’m a Catholic and I never even realized that. I thought once you “got up in the ranks” IE Bishops & Cardinals you took a vow of poverty. I didn’t realize that JPII and Benedict dis not take a vow of poverty. No wonder Francis has railed against oppulance in the clergy!!! It must be infurating to him!
 
twf said:
One thing that is often missed here is his status as a religious. +Francis is the first Pope in a very long time who is a religious. He took a vow of poverty. St JPII and Benedict took no such vow and had no such calling…they were secular priests. The media totally missed this KEY distinction when they made a big deal over the Holy Father’s choices.
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I believe he formally left the Jesuits a number of years ago. He certainly is not held to a vow of poverty. Nor does it seem that most Jesuits are, given the cars many drive around here.
 
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Orthodox, who like to insist that they are eternal and unchanging while Catholics evolve and change (hehe), may hate to admit it…but that Byzantine mitre has only been used by the average Eastern bishop in recent centuries… since the fall of Constantinople. When there was still an Emperor in the New Rome, that was his crown!
 
He never left the Jesuit order. It is true that as pope he is no longer technically bound by his vow of poverty… but it’s his calling, part of who he is, and he takes it seriously.
The Jesuits are a VERY diverse bunch. Do you know that there are Jesuits who are also Byzantine monks? I’ve met one.
 
Duesenberg said:
I believe he formally left the Jesuits a number of years ago. He certainly is not held to a vow of poverty. Nor does it seem that most Jesuits are, given the cars many drive around here.
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Slightly off topic. But he left the Jesuits by becoming pope, as far as I am aware, and not beforehand.

Also I know plenty of Jesuits who take their vows seriously. You’re painting a bit of an uncharitable picture!
 
twf said:
He never left the Jesuit order. It is true that as pope he is no longer technically bound by his vow of poverty… but it’s his calling, part of who he is, and he takes it seriously.
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Francis stopped taking direction from the Jesuit Superior General when he became a bishop. There went the vow of obedience. Under canon law a bishop must own property. There went the vow of poverty.
 
No. It is no longer the case that bishops-elect leave their religious orders. That was true in the past but not now. The Pope is a Jesuit…though he is no longer subject to the Superior General’s authority.
 
You’re right that he is no longer subject to the Superior General. But he’s still a Jesuit. He is released from his vows in a technical legal sense…but his vocation hasn’t changed.
 
This assumes that wearing the papal tiara and utilizing the regalia and privileges of the papacy somehow violates the vow of poverty. I don’t think this is the case.
 
There is an old joke – a Catholic really wants a top of the line Lexus. He goes to his spiritual director (a Franciscan friar) and asks if it’s OK to pray for a Lexus? The friar says that he does not know what a Lexus is, and when he asks “what’s a Lexus?”, the man become embarrassed and goes silent. Puzzled, he tells the man to pray a novena in the coming two weeks and then go see his friend the local Jesuit priest who might be better versed at advising about such things.

He prays the novena and goes to see the Jesuit priest. He again asks if it’s OK to pray for a new Lexus? The Jesuit looks at him critically and asks what the friar advised? “Father, he said to pray a novena and then come to you.” Puzzled, the Jesuit asks “what’s a novena?” 😉
 
deprofundis89 said:
I mean unlike the other pope’s he did not have any made or gifted specially for him. Being a pope he does have all existing tiaras at his disposal
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Yes he did. It was bought/made by Hungarian Catholics. It’s now in St. Pete’s sacristy.
 
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What does it really matter if the Pope chooses to wear the cheap stuff? Why in the world is it a “bad message” or even bad for the Pope to dress a bit tacky?

All said and done, vocations, the importance of the office, the endless wealth of the Vatican. The Pope is an old man. Old men are not particularly known for their ability to be suave.

So what if previous Popes knew and wanted to pull of fancier things? That’s not Francis’ focus.

Does it really matter if he looks like an old guy who doesn’t know how to co-ordinate. What spiritual benefit do we get from a polished Pope?

I can see the arguments for lasting, beautiful Churches, statues and artwork. But for daily clothing to be ornate? That seems to be a stretch.
 
Not so much daily clothing. I would fully expect Francis, as a religious, to dress humbly and simply in his daily life. In the context of the liturgy? I would prefer him to use finer, beautiful vestments. There is a time and a place for him to be “Christ the servant” who humbled and emptied himself… but in the liturgical context he ceases to be Francis… he is, among other things, Christ the King. The glory of a bishop fully vested at Mass reflects the glory of Christ in heaven.
 
Duesenberg said:
Yes he did. It was bought/made by Hungarian Catholics. It’s now in St. Pete’s sacristy.
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People claim that.

The Vatican has never confirmed it.

Unlike the one presented to Benedict XVI, there’s no proof that the tiara of St John Paul II even exists.

It is odd to think that if such a thing did exist that the Vatican would keep it hidden. There’s no point in doing so.
 
So he gave up the residence that was already in his possession, and spent extra money to live in another house. How humble.

“Look at me! I’m so humble!”
 
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