Richard Rohr and CAC

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Thomas, I don’t think the Church has a specific title of “dissident,” so it is open for debate. It does not require Vatican pronouncement to see Fr. Rohr has wandered off the reservation. His writings and statements and alliances speak for themselves.

Tskrobacz, you speak of a “Source” and “someone Else.” Do you mean “God”?
 
And this corrupted euphemism really means what?
Well if you Google the expression you will see it is commonly used. In this case, what it means simply is that Fr. Rohr is saying and doing things a Roman Catholic priest should not be saying and doing.
 
Well if you Google the expression you will see it is commonly used. In this case, what it means simply is that Fr. Rohr is saying and doing things a Roman Catholic priest should not be saying and doing.
Amen to that…plain simple English that doesn’t dance around the truth.

:yup:
 
Slow down here folks. You may disagree with Father. You can say that this or that position is wrong or feels wrong, because . . . Do not paste labels on the man that the Church has not assigned to him. That is not allowed.

Thank You

Thomas Casey
Moderator
I have recently joined a church group and Fr Rohrs’ name has come up. He is popular with some members and I wanted to see what was it that caused all the excitement. So far on what little I have read about him on and off this forum I question why the church hasn’t in fact said anything, is this because his teachings are in line with the Church? I personally haven’t been drawn to him so is it a question of just ignore him? I would be grateful for some concise answers so I know where I can stand on this issue. Thanks.
 
I have recently joined a church group and Fr Rohrs’ name has come up. He is popular with some members and I wanted to see what was it that caused all the excitement. So far on what little I have read about him on and off this forum I question why the church hasn’t in fact said anything, is this because his teachings are in line with the Church? I personally haven’t been drawn to him so is it a question of just ignore him? I would be grateful for some concise answers so I know where I can stand on this issue. Thanks.
While not exactly concise, this article addresses the problems with Fr. Rohr’s teaching:

catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=6819&repos=1&subrepos=0&searchid=721509
 
I have read a number of Rohr’s books and in my personal experience they have strengthened my Catholic faith; however, I am a critical reader and do not blindly accept anything I read without careful consideration. Unfortunately I feel that some websites finger pointing Rohr as a “dissenter” include phrases that I don’t think are supported by the church either. For example, one of the websites I found states “Father Rohr has been a dissenter of Humanae Vitae since its infallible promulgation by Pope Paul VI in l968.” Why the word “infallible” here? Forgive me if I am mistaken, but I understand that under its strictest interpretation infallibility has only been invoked twice by the Papacy and both of those had to do with Mary.
 
Why the word “infallible” here? Forgive me if I am mistaken, but I understand that under its strictest interpretation infallibility has only been invoked twice by the Papacy and both of those had to do with Mary.
You are mistaken. Infallibility has been used many more times than twice. You are confusing infallibilty with ex cathedra statements. Ex cathedra statements are infallible but not the only kind of infallible teaching. Humanae Vitae would fall under the umbrella of infallible teaching as part of the ordinary infallibility of the Magesterium when teaching on faith and morals. HV did not include any new teaching; it was a summary of existing teaching.

Besides, you are presenting a false dichotomy. It is entirely possible that you found his books to be spiritually beneficial but that Father Rohr has also written or spoken in a dissident manner. The linked article highlighted some of those ideas that are explicitly or implicitly out of step with Church teaching. Then again, it’s also *possible *that Fr. Rohr has been misquoted or that he mispoke or that his ideas have evolved to be more in line with Church teaching than the quotes in the article seem to indicate.
 
While not exactly concise, this article addresses the problems with Fr. Rohr’s teaching:

catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=6819&repos=1&subrepos=0&searchid=721509
Thanks appreciate your help, after reading the article I have no doubt, in my mind at least, that I wont be joining in the praise given to him by the other members of the group. This does make me uncomfortable however, I can see myself pulling out rather then getting into a discussion about him, I don’t debate well, slow on my feet.
 
Thanks appreciate your help, after reading the article I have no doubt, in my mind at least, that I wont be joining in the praise given to him by the other members of the group. This does make me uncomfortable however, I can see myself pulling out rather then getting into a discussion about him, I don’t debate well, slow on my feet.
I understand perfectly, Jacky - slow-footed here, too. “Let me put it in writing and I’ll get back to you. . .” 😉
 
After walking the labyrinth of my inner enneagram and intuiting the wisdom hidden within the song of Sophia eco-justice, I’ve come to the firm conclusion that, for me, my personal reading library should be rid of Richard Rohr, for sure.
lol! 😉 👍
 
To my knowledge, nobody in the hierarchy has excommunicated him, interdicted him, muzzled him, or otherwise punished him.

So either they think he’s harmless, or that he isn’t a heretic or apostate.

I have a couple of his books on inner transformation. While some of his views appear to be heterodox and can safely be ignored, on the whole I find his notions of “transformation” (that is, maturation in faith) spot-on, and entirely consistent with the Benedictine tradition of transformation as growth in humility, and conversatio morum. I also like his rejection of dualistic black-or-white thinking, which makes it easier in fact to read him, and discern between the good bits and the not-so-good bits. I don’t get the notion where if someone wrote something that’s off, it means that everything they say is worthless 🤷

I know that as I have aged and become more secure in my faith, I’ve mellowed out and become more serene and welcoming towards people of a different mindset than mine (most of the time… still much work to do though).

I’d have to say that the books of his that I read, particularly “On the Threshold of Transformation”, which I read at a particularly tough time in my faith, was helpful and contributed to my staying and growing in the faith.

Therefore I cannot write him off as easily as many of you here are doing.
 
Just listen to a number of his talks which are available on-line.

I listened to one last night at our Light of the World meeting. And he addressed God the Father and added ‘or Mother’.

He certainly seemed to deny Purgatory and Hell. There was an allusion that even Satan would be forgiven and welcomed back by the archangels… and all would go to Heaven, nobody would be condemned to Hell.

This hour long talk certainly resulted in some lively conversation and I had a bad night’s sleep thinking about it all.

Rove
 
Just listen to a number of his talks which are available on-line.

I listened to one last night at our Light of the World meeting. And he addressed God the Father and added ‘or Mother’.

He certainly seemed to deny Purgatory and Hell. There was an allusion that even Satan would be forgiven and welcomed back by the archangels… and all would go to Heaven, nobody would be condemned to Hell.

This hour long talk certainly resulted in some lively conversation and I had a bad night’s sleep thinking about it all.

Rove
I can’t recall how long ago I heard comments about “mother” in relation to God, but I am guessing in may be 40 years ago give or take some. It was something which came up in scripture scholarship, but was not long after that co-opted by radical feminists, which was not its original purpose. It comes up in Old Testament study, and one can probably start with Genesis, wherein it states “God created man in his image, in the divine image he created him, male and female he created them.”

The scholarship went on to point out that the image of God was one that, among other things, was nurturing, nursing, and the list went on for some other images that are (generally) seen as female. None of that was done or said to contradict how Christ revealed the Father; but it is easy to get stuck with the image in the back of the mind that God is a male. God is pure spirit, something that we mortals can’t really wrap our minds around. And the primary image of Scripture as a whole is God as Father.

So when someone gets into some of the language and images of something other than male in reference to God, it tends to raise hackles. It may not be healthy - nay, it may be unhealthy - for many people to get off down this path. Something may be true and yet not edifying for many.

I find Rohr to be lucidly conveying Catholic truth some times, and other times, to be using language that, for lack of any other word coming to mind, comes across to many as psychobabble. It may not be that; there may be more to what he says than some can take a way from his musings, but as another poster said he has not been censured as near as we can tell by those with the authority to censure.

He is clearly edgy. Being edgy can merely mean that one is in the forefront of a way of conveying truth which is not widely understood, and therefore, not accepted.

It can also mean that one has gone off the rails. Again, no known censure.

it can also mean that one is prone to using terms and constructs which are “in”, as in, playing to a certain crowd. That does not necessarily mean that one is in heresy or dissent, but rather, that one may be part of a group of (again, other terms escape me) of navel gazers. A lot of fluff and not necessarily a lot of substance.

I am not particularly taken with someone’s list (and granted, I am familiar with most of the names as they have been in dissent for decades) when at the end of the list, Bayside is brought up, given that was squashed by the local bishop in the 1980’s. The only thing that struck me was that the list was so old, along with many listed (I was actually wondering how many of the radicals were still alive…).

Rohr is clearly too edgy for many. That is nothing new under the sun; but one should be a bit leary of some of the comments which seem to take positions the Church has not taken. The best advice might be to say little, other than that he (Rohr) leaves one not sure of what he (Rohr) has said, or how that might further the reader’s spiritual life; and then propose someone else as worthy of reading.
 
[SIGN][/SIGN]
To my knowledge, nobody in the hierarchy has excommunicated him, interdicted him, muzzled him, or otherwise punished him.

So either they think he’s harmless, or that he isn’t a heretic or apostate.

I have a couple of his books on inner transformation. While some of his views appear to be heterodox and can safely be ignored, on the whole I find his notions of “transformation” (that is, maturation in faith) spot-on, and entirely consistent with the Benedictine tradition of transformation as growth in humility, and conversatio morum. I also like his rejection of dualistic black-or-white thinking, which makes it easier in fact to read him, and discern between the good bits and the not-so-good bits. I don’t get the notion where if someone wrote something that’s off, it means that everything they say is worthless 🤷

I know that as I have aged and become more secure in my faith, I’ve mellowed out and become more serene and welcoming towards people of a different mindset than mine (most of the time… still much work to do though).

I’d have to say that the books of his that I read, particularly “On the Threshold of Transformation”, which I read at a particularly tough time in my faith, was helpful and contributed to my staying and growing in the faith.

Therefore I cannot write him off as easily as many of you here are doing.
Thank you for this post and its rational perspective. I can’t speak to his entire catalog, but I read Falling Upward when I was really struggling with some things on the recommendation of a friend. If found this book extremely insightful and helpful to me as I was working through that period of my life.

Matt
 
Thanks appreciate your help, after reading the article I have no doubt, in my mind at least, that I wont be joining in the praise given to him by the other members of the group. This does make me uncomfortable however, I can see myself pulling out rather then getting into a discussion about him, I don’t debate well, slow on my feet.
I haven’t fully read the article myself yet, but I am thankful for it. It’s been awhile since I’ve really known what his errors are, and am needing to re-familiarize due to a friend who unfortunately seems to have fallen deeply into his errors and I need some ammo in addition to prayer to plant seeds to get him back on the right path.
 
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