Oh My Goodness.
Maybe, my dear, you misread what I wrote originally. I said “I am continually amazed at how many people quote wikipedia as an authority on everything. Not too long agl one of its editors was outed for being a phony.”
Not true. While I am just as much a Catholic as any other Catholic on this forum, I am not a Roman Catholic… nor are the members of any of the 22 Eastern Catholic Churches who, in communion with the Latin (Roman) Church, make up Catholicism today . To say that the Roman Catholic Church is the Catholic Church is to do a disservice to Eastern Catholics everywhere. Yes, we are in full communion with the See of Peter and yes, Benedict XVI is our pope as well and yes, Roman Catholics are absolutely free to partake of the sacraments in my Church, and I in theirs… that’s what being “in communion with” is all about. We are fully Catholic in every sense of the word… but we are not Roman Catholics.
I live in the United States and I am a Catholic. You can ask any number of people what their understanding of the terms Roman Catholic and Catholic are and they would give you the same answer and that in their minds the names are interchangeable. Now, in the Ukraine or some other Eastern country the understanding might be different and more than likely is.
I say again - your statement is simply not true, no matter how loudly you proclaim it or how often you repeat it. I, too, live in the United States (born and raised) and I, too, am a Catholic. I am, however, a Byzantine Catholic and not a Roman Catholic. Despite the differing adjectives we place in front of the word “Catholic” when describing ourselves, we are each every bit as Catholic as the other. And we share full communion with each other through our membership in the Catholic Church, not the Roman Catholic Church.
And in “our country,” Catholicism does not automatically imply Roman Catholicism, no matter how many people, fellow Catholics included, would like you to believe that it does.Thank you for putting me in my place without making me feel too stupidI say again - your statement is simply not true, no matter how loudly you proclaim it or how often you repeat it. I, too, live in the United States (born and raised) and I, too, am a Catholic. I am, however, a Byzantine Catholic and not a Roman Catholic. Despite the differing adjectives we place in front of the word “Catholic” when describing ourselves, we are each every bit as Catholic as the other. And we share full communion with each other through our membership in the Catholic Church, not the Roman Catholic Church.
It matters not what “any number of people” think the Catholic Church is - what matters is what Rome says it is. And it matters not that we live in a country where, admittedly, people continue to incorrectly interchange the terms Catholic Church and Roman Catholic Church - their (your) ongoing error, no matter how oft repeated, does not make it true. As I said earlier, this continual use of improper terminology when describing our Catholic Church is somewhat understandable given our society’s overall lack of factual understanding of the true nature and make-up of our Catholic Church. What is sadly distressing to me as a Catholic, however, is to see this error in terminology not only ignored by fellow Catholics, but even perpetuated by some, as is evident in your posts. If we Catholics cannot count on fellow Catholics to correct this sort of misinformation, who then can we count on?
Again, I stress to you that I type this from my desk just outside of Chicago… nowhere near “the Ukraine or some other Eastern country.”
While I agree with you when you say that “…in our country Roman Catholic IS Catholic…,” I must strongly disagreee with the “vice versa” part that immediately follows this statement.
I have a lot to learn and you just taught me a thing or three today. I will have to think on this a bit more, but I can truly understand what you are saying. As a struggling ‘neophyte’ (not really, in the strict definition of the term, but in knowledge) I guess I really haven’t looked outside the walls of my own Church (and church.) ). The fact is, we Byzantine Catholics share a common faith with our Roman Catholic brethren, despite the fact that how we liturgically express that faith may be very different from what you and most Roman Catholics may be used to.I’m not “shooting” anyone, I just want people to use the correct names for things, because words have real meanings and meanings have consequences for what people think and do in real life. So you might consider correcting your profile description of yourself as “Roman Catholic” not to mention “Lay Eucharistic Minister”. Neither thing exists.I gotta tell ya - I’m glad youse guys left me out of the shooting match.
Subrosa
Now, I learned early today that there are Roman Catholics who are Catholic but that not all Catholics are Roman Catholic
No it doesn’t. The term does not appear anywhere on that page.Now, I learned early today that there are Roman Catholics who are Catholic but that not all Catholics are Roman Catholic
The term Roman Catholic does exist. Here is one link:
ewtn.com/expert/answers/catholic_rites_and_churches.htm
Okay, I went back and re-read it and I think I see where you are headed. Before I mis-understand, could you explain?
Yes, you repeatedly offend me when you continuly use RCC to refer to my church. Apology accepted.
Oops, knew there was a catch to that apology. Sounds more like I’m sorry but… and anytime you add the but, it really just is trying to justify your own actions and really isn’t an apology.
I disagree.
And history and documents show that we have always done so.
Again, another attempt to place your beliefs in the name of my church.Perhaps we could call yours the Catholic Church HQed in Rome or the Catholic church founded in 1054??WHat is preferable if the Orthodox IS the Church founded by Christ. How should we differentiate to everyones satisfaction and in order to offend no one including frnate and the numerous other groups who call themselves the Catholic Church?
Rev North
Thank you. I do feel insulted when people continue to use that term, RCC, even when told that it is insulting and a name placed on our church by the reformers in order for them to continue to use the term catholic, but divorce themselves from the authority of the Catholic Church. Last time I read, when someone divorces another, they are not allowed to change the other parties name only their own.
Yes, it is an insult to our Catholic brethren united with the pope to say that Roman Catholic and Catholic means the same thing.I say again - your statement is simply not true, no matter how loudly you proclaim it or how often you repeat it. I, too, live in the United States (born and raised) and I, too, am a Catholic. I am, however, a Byzantine Catholic and not a Roman Catholic. Despite the differing adjectives we place in front of the word “Catholic” when describing ourselves, we are each every bit as Catholic as the other. And we share full communion with each other through our membership in the Catholic Church, not the Roman Catholic Church.
It matters not what “any number of people” think the Catholic Church is - what matters is what Rome says it is. And it matters not that we live in a country where, admittedly, people continue to incorrectly interchange the terms Catholic Church and Roman Catholic Church - their (your) ongoing error, no matter how oft repeated, does not make it true. As I said earlier, this continual use of improper terminology when describing our Catholic Church is somewhat understandable given our society’s overall lack of factual understanding of the true nature and make-up of our Catholic Church. What is sadly distressing to me as a Catholic, however, is to see this error in terminology not only ignored by fellow Catholics, but even perpetuated by some, as is evident in your posts. If we Catholics cannot count on fellow Catholics to correct this sort of misinformation, who then can we count on?
Again, I stress to you that I type this from my desk just outside of Chicago… nowhere near “the Ukraine or some other Eastern country.”
While I agree with you when you say that “…in our country Roman Catholic IS Catholic…,” I must strongly disagreee with the “vice versa” part that immediately follows this statement.
I belong to the Catholic Church.God Bless,Thank you for putting me in my place without making me feel too stupid
So much to learn. I’m getting old - so little time.
Last I checked, I was a devout NON-reformer so your counter-reformation complaint against their intent doesn’t apply to me. I am not guilty of that particular sin. To lay it on me and those like me is irrational.
Nor can they be required to change their own name. That is kind of the point is it not? For the Patriarchate of Rome seems to (mistakenly) think that she has exclusive right to the term “Catholic.” For those who know better, referring to her as “Roman” is simply a way of distinguishing between jurisdictions. I am personally willing to consider alternatives to actually using the phrase “Roman Catholic,” do you have any suggestions for a better way to distinguish between jurisdictions?
I thought these were Catholic forums. Therein lies the rub, I must also refrain from referring to the Church who is united with the Pope as the Catholic Church, since that is also insulting and inaccurate. So now what?
Right back atcha.
I tell you what, why don’t you go and tell all the other churches that they’re not allowed to use the name “Orthodox” (because every Christian thinks his own church is orthodox i.e. has the correct belief), nor “Episcopal” (because many other churches believe they have valid bishops), nor “Presbyterian” (because many other churches believe they have valid priests/presbyters/elders); nor “Baptist” because all other Christian groups practise baptism; and of course “Church of Christ” and “Church of the Nazarene” are out too, because we all claim to be that. And “Full Gospel Church” is a no-no because we all claim to follow the full gospel.
)The term Roman Catholic, Roman church, Roman etc, is use throughout the documents of the western church. They didnt feel that the term was wrong. And if this term is wrong there are a lot of local ROMAN Cathollic church signs in our area which need changing.