M
Manfred
Guest
Yes, I observed this when I tried to look at a few key passages (I own a hardcopy of both the JB and NJB, and, of course, the RSV-CE); wonder what the KofC was thinking?
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M
Manfred
Guest
jpy,
OK, so far, so good!
Now - those other passages marked “2N”, which are in the TEXT of the RSV-CE but only in the NOTES in the 1971 NT - how did they fare?
And are the Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur those of the 1965-66 RSV-CE?
J
jpy15026
Guest
2N - indicates rendering in 1965 RSV-CE that is in the footNotes of the RSV 2nd ed. NT
These are all in compact:
Matthew
2N - 19.9 and he who marries a divorced woman commits adultery
2N - 21.44 and he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but when it falls on any one, it will crush him
2N - 27.24 this righteous man’s blood
Mark
2N - 9.29 and fasting
2N - 10.24 for those who trust in riches
2N - 13.33 and pray
Luke
2N - 8.43 and had spent all her living upon physicians
2N - 24.5 He is not here, but has risen
2N - 24.12 But Peter rose and ran to the tomb; stooping and looking in, he saw the linen cloths by themselves; and he went home wondering at what had happened
2N - 24.36 and said to them, "Peace to you
2N - 24.40 And when he had said this, he showed them his hands and his feet
2N - 24.52 worshiped him, and
Romans
2N - 9.5 Christ, who is God over all, blessed for ever. Amen.
1 Thessalonians
2N - 4.4 control his own body
These are the only ones that are not in compact text ,they are referenced in footnote:
2N - 22.43 And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him.
***2N -Luke 22.44 And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly; and his sweat became like great drops of blood falling down upon the ground. ***
And are the Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur those of the 1965-66 RSV-CE?
Compact:
Nihil Obstat**……Thomas Hanlon S.T.L.,L.S.S.,PH.L.**
Imprimatur …….Gordon Joseph
**Archbishop of Saint Andrews and **Edinburgh
.
These are all in compact:
Matthew
2N - 19.9 and he who marries a divorced woman commits adultery
2N - 21.44 and he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but when it falls on any one, it will crush him
2N - 27.24 this righteous man’s blood
Mark
2N - 9.29 and fasting
2N - 10.24 for those who trust in riches
2N - 13.33 and pray
Luke
2N - 8.43 and had spent all her living upon physicians
2N - 24.5 He is not here, but has risen
2N - 24.12 But Peter rose and ran to the tomb; stooping and looking in, he saw the linen cloths by themselves; and he went home wondering at what had happened
2N - 24.36 and said to them, "Peace to you
2N - 24.40 And when he had said this, he showed them his hands and his feet
2N - 24.52 worshiped him, and
Romans
2N - 9.5 Christ, who is God over all, blessed for ever. Amen.
1 Thessalonians
2N - 4.4 control his own body
These are the only ones that are not in compact text ,they are referenced in footnote:
2N - 22.43 And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him.
***2N -Luke 22.44 And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly; and his sweat became like great drops of blood falling down upon the ground. ***
And are the Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur those of the 1965-66 RSV-CE?
Compact:
Nihil Obstat**……Thomas Hanlon S.T.L.,L.S.S.,PH.L.**
Imprimatur …….Gordon Joseph
**Archbishop of Saint Andrews and **Edinburgh
.
M
Manfred
Guest
jpy,
Sorry for beating this to a pulp, but WHERE are they in the Compact Edition: in the Text or in the footNotes? I’m almost certain you meant to say the Text proper, given that Luke 22:43-44 is only in the footnotes.
And the ecclesiastical approbation is from the 1965-66 RSV-CE; in my view, that’s not kosher. Reminds me of the Canadian bishops who went ahead and just used the NRSV Lectionary without securing Rome’s approval, since, according to them, the NRSV was merely a revision of a translation for which they already had approval. Wrong!!
M
mmortal03
Guest
Just for everyone’s knowledge, Gordon Joseph Gray was the former Bishop’s name, but Oxford accidentally left off his surname in all their Imprimaturs. I have contacted them about it, and they said that it will be fixed in the Reader’s Version.
M
mmortal03
Guest
They are all in the text, otherwise they would match the 1971 and not the 1965.
M
Manfred
Guest
jpy, mmortal,
As usual, you guys have shown tremendous patience with, and have been a great help to, me.
Many sincere thanks!
Aside: I’d STILL like to see an RSV-3CE, from the 1971 NT, with all the changes of the 1965-66 CE AND those from the Ratio Translationis per Liturgiam Authenticam. Ignatius will probably cease publishing the 1965-66 RSV-CE; I hope Oxford and Scepter do not.
Manfred
M
mmortal03
Guest
Just for completeness, I just checked my list from the concordance, and everything lines up with what jpy and I said above.
jpy: Can you confirm that your compact has Mark 10.24 as the following?:
Mark 10.24 (not 10.23) “how hard it is for those who trust in riches”
jpy: Can you confirm that your compact has Mark 10.24 as the following?:
Mark 10.24 (not 10.23) “how hard it is for those who trust in riches”
J
jpy15026
Guest
jpy: Can you confirm that your compact has Mark 10.24 as the following?:
Mark 10.24 :
Yes,that’s how its rendered in the main text “how hard it is for those who trust in riches”, with the footnote: other ancient authorities omit for those who trust in riches.
.
Mark 10.24 :
Yes,that’s how its rendered in the main text “how hard it is for those who trust in riches”, with the footnote: other ancient authorities omit for those who trust in riches.
.
M
mmortal03
Guest
Just as an update, I pre-ordered the Oxford Press RSV-CE Reader’s Version from Overstock.com, and disappointingly they are listing the shipping date to be December 28th. So much for getting it before Christmas. 
Elsewhere I have seen February 2007 as the publication date, so who knows which is right. Oxford Press themselves list December 2006 as the publication date, which happens to correspond with the Overstock.com shipping date nicely, but right now, this thing has been delayed so much that there is just no way to tell.
However, I did order one of the compact editions to hold me over!
Elsewhere I have seen February 2007 as the publication date, so who knows which is right. Oxford Press themselves list December 2006 as the publication date, which happens to correspond with the Overstock.com shipping date nicely, but right now, this thing has been delayed so much that there is just no way to tell.
However, I did order one of the compact editions to hold me over!
J
Jerry-Jet
Guest
Is there any chance that because of this thread that Oxford Press is facing copyright difficulties?
M
mmortal03
Guest
I hope not. They have been delaying it over the last year or so in chunks of 3 to 5 months. It could be, however, I don’t know how visible this thread really is. The only correction that I know of that they needed to make was in the Imprimatur (they cut off the Bishop’s last name), and I was told that it would be corrected. Any other ideas as to why they have been delaying it I’d really like to know myself.
J
Jerry-Jet
Guest
Is it legal and OK under the copyright laws to mix the changes in the 1971 RSV with the changes in the 1966 RSV-CE without telling anyone that was done?
I don’t know if it is or not–I’m just glad they did it.
I don’t know if it is or not–I’m just glad they did it.
M
Manfred
Guest
mmortal and Jerry-Jet,
Please have a look at dalcent’s post in the thread “RSV-CE Online?”
More interesting stuff on a Catholic RSV with the 1971 NT.
Et tu, EWTN?
Manfred
Please have a look at dalcent’s post in the thread “RSV-CE Online?”
More interesting stuff on a Catholic RSV with the 1971 NT.
Et tu, EWTN?
Manfred
M
Manfred
Guest
I’m not totally sure about this, but the so-called “copyright” for the Catholic editorial changes to the RSV (whatever THAT may indicate) is in the hands of the National Council of the Churches of Christ in the USA (NCCCUSA), and not some Catholic group like the Catholic Biblical Association of Great Britain. Go figure.
Assuming the above IS true, it is conceivable that when the NCCCUSA aithorized a printing of the RSV-CE for Oxford/Scepter/Ignatius in recent times (what, since 2005?), they let the 1971 NT stand as the textual basis, but without due regard for Imprimatur, since, after all, the NCCCUSA is not Catholic.
J
Jerry-Jet
Guest
Sometimes God works good without them knowing in the non Catholics!
M
mmortal03
Guest
Usually these publishers allow fair use of quoting their bibles, as long as you aren’t making available full books or full chapters at a time. Yes, you could hack the EWTN page to show more, but only up to 50 verses at a time. And for what they are using it for, I think is completely fair.
M
Manfred
Guest
mmortal,
Actually, my point was - and, admittedly, I WAS being cryptic - that even the RSV-CE used by EWTN is not the original Ignatius. I didn’t hack at it enough to see if it’s the Ignatius 2nd Catholic ed. or the Oxford/Scepter with 1971 NT.
M
mmortal03
Guest
Are you sure it isn’t the original Ignatius?
It is definitely NOT the latter two. No one but the publishers have a digital copy of those.
M
Manfred
Guest
mmortal,
Here, check this out!
ewtn.com/vbible/search.asp?abbr=Gal&ch=4&bv1=26&ev1=27
It’s not the Ignatius RSV-CE or RSV-2CE, but looks like the Oxford/Scepter edition.
As another poster suggested, you can hack into their virtual bible by guessing the correct abbreviation for a particular book (where necessary), and then typing in a bv1 and an ev1 (beginning and ending verse, respectively).
My thanks to that poster! And, of course, to you, for your chart which put all three side-by-side!
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