Sacrament of Reconcilliation (validity)

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catholic03

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Pax Christi:

I have an interesting question that may apply to many Catholics. any Catholic parents who are ‘cultural Catholics’ (we must pray for their return) initiate their children into the Church through the sacraments of baptism, confirmation, holy communion and reconciliation for purposes of heritage etc even though they don’t believe and encourage their children not to as well. Obviously, the baptisms, first communions and confirmations for such children are valid. However, if the family does not practice the faith, then the child will likely not confess relevant sins or may make up sins just for the purpose of completing the sacrament. Obviously such a confession is invalid. However, if this child wants to return to the Church again, then will they need to undergo extra classes so that they can make a valid first confession. Or, due to the nature of the sacrament, can they just go to confession, or do they need to worry about the fact that when they first attended the sacrament it was invalid. If a confirmation was invalid it would need to be done again. If first confession is invalid then do they need to undergo training for the sacraments all over again, or can they just show up to confession if baptism, confirmation and holy communion was valid?

God Bless.
 
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You have a tangle of questions here. Baptism and Confirmation are one-time sacraments. There are no do-overs.

There are not classes for everything, so returning to confession might involve the person asking the priest to help them make a good confession of sins. There are some guides online for doing an examination of conscience. Not sure how old the child is, and if their is a child’s guide to examination of conscience.

We all need to make a sincere confession, not omitting any sins or making up things to confess. Hope this helps somewhat.
 
I have a TAN Books guide to confession. I suppose what I am asking is this: If your first confession was invalid, then is it okay to simply come along to confession and confess all mortal sins (including the fact that first confession was invalid). I think I over complicated what I was asking.
 
I know that baptism and confirmation and one time sacraments. I am asking this question purely out of interest. I said in another reply: “suppose what I am asking is this: If your first confession was invalid, then is it okay to simply come along to confession and confess all mortal sins (including the fact that first confession was invalid), or is there some other formality you would need to go through?”. I completely overcomplicated my question. Many apologies.

God Bless.
 
catholic03 said:
If your first confession was invalid, then is it okay to simply come along to confession and confess all mortal sins (including the fact that first confession was invalid), or is there some other formality you would need to go through?
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Well, I don’t think an invalid confession is grounds for excommunication or that it needs a Papal or episcopal absolution, but it is a mortal sin.
 
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I first typed out something to the effect of I needed a wall chart to follow along. 😉

What fixes your “hypothetical” is to mention at the next confession any and all sins that were forgotten during prior confessions (naming any that were mortal by type and number, if known - even after the fact). To make a clean breast of things, it is good to mention sins that you did not know at the time were sins*. Father will acknowledge that and put your mind at ease.

*The qualifier here is that for mortal sin to attach to a soul, it must be grave matter, the person must know that it is grave matter, and then with full free consent of the will, knowingly turn away from God and commit the sin. It is not easy to mortally sin. You cannot “accidentally” mortally sin. Impossible.

Know this: God does not make it impossible, or even difficult to be reconciled with Him. His mercy is like rain from an overcast sky. He greatly desires to forgive your sins and that you should live in peace.
 
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catholic03 said:
However, if the family does not practice the faith, then the child will likely not confess relevant sins or may make up sins just for the purpose of completing the sacrament.
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The family is not the primary organisation responsible for the preparation of the Sacrament of Reconciliation. Your argument is a false premise.
 
Does that mean that if, for any reason, one’s first confession was invalid, then they can just come to confession, make a valid confession (mentioning that their first confession was invalid) and be absolved.
 
As far as it is concerned to the church, as long as you are baptized, Baptism opens up all the other sacraments. Obviously, you need some formation before going to confession. It’s not like a 1 year old can figure that out, but if the intentions are there in the confession, anyone mature enough to discern his or her sins can receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation. Maturity meaning they actually feel guilt and understand their sins, not the age of the person.

I don’t think such a person, going back to the church, needs to be reformed into understanding the Sacraments, but it does help. Moreover, it is extremely helpful for a person to be in full understanding of the Sacraments in order to help them appreciate and cooperate with God in receiving His graces. Too many Catholics don’t even know what the Eucharist represents when receiving it. You can’t be a good chef is you can’t appreciate cuisine. Truly understand the Sacraments in full context of Jesus’s teachings gives us the spiritual eyes to see their effects in our lives.
 
You can mention it in confession. Just say Father “I made my first confession when I was ??? and I am not sure it was valid.” He’ll ask you any questions if he thinks things need to be clarified. If there is a particular sin that you now know is grave matter you can say exactly that but also say if you not sure at that time you knew it was grave matter.

I once remembered something that I now know is definitely grave matter, that occurred when I was 15, and so I mentioned it in confession with brief details - “when I was 15 …” Then you’ve included it in your confession. Let the priest guide you. He might ask you some questions so just be honest. You can mention past mortal sins already confessed and forgiven, since this first confession which I assume occurred when you were a child, as these too are valid matter for confession.
 
Considering most children make their first confession around age 7, it’s highly unlikely that they’re going to have an invalid one, as their consciences are just beginning to develop a capacity/sense for what a mortal sin is. Thus, whatever they confess is likely to be exhaustive to the best of their ability.
catholic03 said:
Does that mean that if, for any reason, one’s first confession was invalid, then they can just come to confession, make a valid confession (mentioning that their first confession was invalid) and be absolved.
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Yes - that’s always how it works, regardless of whatever real or perceived defect in a prior confession.
 
catholic03 said:
Does that mean that if, for any reason, one’s first confession was invalid, then they can just come to confession, make a valid confession (mentioning that their first confession was invalid) and be absolved.
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Yes.
Once you’ve made a first confession, then you can just show up whenever and confess again.
If you really don’t know what you are doing in there, the priest will tell you to go do a better examination of conscience and come back.
But if you give any sign of being able to come up with at least one sin, the priest will walk you through it. You don’t get sent to remedial confession training class.

I too would question your premise about children’s first confessions not being valid. Since the kids are being catechized and guided through that confession, and it’s not just left to the parents to handle, the kids are more likely to have that confession be a valid one. But in the rare circumstance that it somehow wasn’t, then the kid would just have to show up and confess again.
 
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catholic03 said:
Pax Christi:

I have an interesting question that may apply to many Catholics. any Catholic parents who are ‘cultural Catholics’ (we must pray for their return) initiate their children into the Church through the sacraments of baptism, confirmation, holy communion and reconciliation for purposes of heritage etc even though they don’t believe and encourage their children not to as well. Obviously, the baptisms, first communions and confirmations for such children are valid. However, if the family does not practice the faith, then the child will likely not confess relevant sins or may make up sins just for the purpose of completing the sacrament. Obviously such a confession is invalid. However, if this child wants to return to the Church again, then will they need to undergo extra classes so that they can make a valid first confession. Or, due to the nature of the sacrament, can they just go to confession, or do they need to worry about the fact that when they first attended the sacrament it was invalid. If a confirmation was invalid it would need to be done again. If first confession is invalid then do they need to undergo training for the sacraments all over again, or can they just show up to confession if baptism, confirmation and holy communion was valid?

God Bless.
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Who are you to say their first Communion was invalid! Please stop judging. You have no idea what the intent was/is of any penitent going to Confession.
 
Cor_ad_Cor said:
Considering most children make their first confession around age 7, it’s highly unlikely that they’re going to have an invalid one, as their consciences are just beginning to develop a capacity/sense for what a mortal sin is. Thus, whatever they confess is likely to be exhaustive to the best of their ability.
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This.

Children’s confessions don’t tend to be particularly exciting or original - they confess pretty much what you’d expect: fighting with siblings, disobedient to parents, lying and the occasional petty theft (a priest friend of mine once likened hearing children’s confessions to be being beaten to death with a feather!). So, regardless, of the level of faith involvement / knowledge of their parents (these notably being two different things) children generally have a reasonable idea of right and wrong and certainly enough for a valid confession. If anything, it’s a very low bar to get over - it would take a lot to invalidate a confession (something along the lines of intention deception) and certainly more than most children are capable of.
 
Dear Thistle,

I greet you in the peace of Christ. I am not judging and I specifically stated that the baptism, confirmation and first communion were not invalid. Unless the rubrics are not followed, these sacraments will always be valid. Even if you receive communion when in mortal sin, although you are committing a mortal sin in doing so, the communion is still valid because it is the body and blood of Christ.

I said that the first confession, not communion might be valid. Communion cannot be invalid unless it was blessed by someone who is not a priest.

Please forgive me for my miswording. May God Bless you.
 
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