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MelanieAnne
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Jon, you are very gracious. 
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NonCatholic
Guest
You do have one thing correct, each true believer has THE Holy Spirit indwelling them and guiding to the truth of Scripture and of the Catholic Church. but unless you have been to all 200 of those churches you do not know what is said or done. Remember; one attribute of the Holy Spirit is omnipresence.
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NonCatholic
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Read John 6:63 and Jesus explains explicitly the context of His message. Compare that with Romans 8:9, same concept, in fact if your read Romans 8:1-9, there is a great discussion on flesh and spirit.
Romans 8:9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.
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MelanieAnne
Guest
I’m taking Jesus at His word. He won’t lead me astray!
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NonCatholic
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How are you taking Jesus at His word?
I was looking at the “The Republic of California”…any chance California might succeed from the union?
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ncgolf
Guest
Jesus’s words are efficacious … that is they are capable by His word only to have the effect intended. If Jesus says … “This is my Body” … then it is so.How are you taking Jesus at His word?
I was looking at the “The Republic of California”…any chance California might succeed from the union?
You can go back to Genesis and the creation accounts to see this … when God says, “Let there be light” … there is light … there is nothing else necessary for this to happen … His word alone allows light.
The words spoken at Consecration bring together both natures of Jesus together at once … his humanity as He offers His body … and His divinity … as He shares it with all by the power of His word.
So she, as do I, accept His word with complete confidence. You can dismiss a belief based on your own interpretation but you cannot dismiss this because Jesus cannot do it or he did not, at least say it.
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elijio
Guest
I can tell you that in those 200 different churches that the SAME thing is NOT done. Even from experience or television. Just watch the religious channels on your cable or satellite or walk into the churches. Can you tell me they are interpreting the same way?
Ask any convert from those denominations as well. Jimmy Aiken, Tim Staples, Scott Hahn. Listen to their tapes and you’ll learn that they were taught differently amongst themselves from Southern Baptists to Assemblies of God.
If they did the same thing or interpret in the same way, then explain why they are separate denominations. It’s a fair assumption is it not? I learned that from the many converts I have researched. Did you read the entire link I showed you?
I wasn’t asking if the Holy Spirit was omnipresent.
Peace.
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NonCatholic
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By your examples, there would be no figurative language or metaphors or analogies; yet many of the parables are just that. Unless you can understand how to properly interpret something, then put it to practice; you will not come to an understanding.
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ncgolf
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Properly … excuse me … Christ said, “Take this and eat” … I didn’t see Take this and understand.
Give me a break … no analogies or metaphors … grow up. Why does not the Church worship vines and trees … since Christ said those things.
We are talking Christ and His word … and the power of that Word. Address the central point on whether Christ’s words can do what He says. Can Christ do what He says in John 6 … well?
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Bill_Pick
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Ever learning yet never attaining knowledge of the truth."
2Tim 3:7
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MelanieAnne
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How are you taking Jesus at His word?
I was looking at the “The Republic of California”…any chance California might succeed from the union?
- I’m taking Jesus at His word when he says “This is my Body” and “This is my Blood”. I’ll take the word of Jesus over the “interpretations” of any man.
- There is no movement of which I am aware for California to secede from the Union but if Northern California would form its own state it wouldn’t disappoint me. Notice it says “People’s Republic” which is often the beginning of the name of a communist country.
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NonCatholic
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You take Him for His word; only when you understand His word.
- I’m taking Jesus at His word when he says “This is my Body” and “This is my Blood”. I’ll take the word of Jesus over the “interpretations” of any man.
- There is no movement of which I am aware for California to secede from the Union but if Northern California would form its own state it wouldn’t disappoint me. Notice it says “People’s Republic” which is often the beginning of the name of a communist country.
“Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.”
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NonCatholic
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2 Timothy 2:15 “Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.”
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MelanieAnne
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I do understand His word. Not everyone does unfortunately.
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Bill_Pick
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non-cathloic------If we can ever apply the principle of “by their fruits you will know them”, it is certainly here. A prime example of apologetics at work is in the defense of the Holy Eucharist. While some non-Catholic may claim to adhere to Scripture as “the word of God”, they at the same time deny the Real Presence of Jesus in the Sacrament of the altar.
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NonCatholic
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You say the truth here!
Why do you worship, oh excuse me venerate, Mary, dead saints, the Pope etc
He can’t be in both natures at the Mass? For many reasons, but based on this discussion and your post #45, humans are not omnipresent, so one nature can’t be at all those sacrifices. Oh that’s right He was at only one, never to be repeated…what does that matter it is only Jesus word’s; but nothing wrong with picking and choosing which words count and which one’s don’t.
Christ does do what He say’s, which is John 6:47 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life. 48 “I am the bread of life.”
It is beyond me, except what the Scriptures says, how anyone is blind to the fact that the flesh and blood is referring to the cross; death, burial and resurrection and the way of salvation which is by faith and not cannibalization and has zippo to do with the Lords Supper.
2 Timothy 2:15 “Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.”
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MelanieAnne
Guest
I don’t collect Bible citations/quotes but I’m pretty sure there’s one the gist of which is “There are none so blind as those who will not see”.
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NonCatholic
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Bill we agree on something “by their fruits you will know them”.
James 3:15-17 This wisdom is not that which comes down from above, but is earthly, natural, demonic. 16 For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there is disorder and every evil thing. 17 But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy.
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NonCatholic
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That is surprising.
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MelanieAnne
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I didn’t say I don’t read the Bible or understand the Bible, I do. But I don’t feel the need to go around citing chapter and verse to all and sundry. All too often such exchanges strike me not as well-meaning and helpful but more often as arrogant, uncharitable bashing.
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