Saint Paul and Islam

[FaithofAbraham]

Will FaithOfAbraham answer THIS question?

“The question still remains unanswered by you- what explains those reactions when Jesus says ‘I AM’”

I have before here.

John 8:53 Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?

Hebrews 7:4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.

John 8:54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:

Hebrews 5:4-6 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron. So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

John 8:55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.

Hebrews 5:7-9 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

Hebrews 7:1-2 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him; To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;

John 8:57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Hebrews 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

Jesus was made like Adam a son of God without mother or father, because he was resurrected into Mary without need for mother or father. Although his real mother and father were David and Bathsheba.

So in none of this Jesus is saying he is God, he is saying he is like Melchizedek, the High Priest who makes atonement for the House of Abraham, Jew and Gentile heirs of the promise, and thus greater than Abraham.

So it is because he said he was greater than Abraham that Jews wanted to kill him even more, it is like saying you are greater than Mohammed to Muslims, since Abraham is the father of the Jews.

 

[Lapell]

Of course God can do anything, but really, why with Jesus? The only good argument for why would be to see what it feels like to be a human, but can’t God feel how we all feel anytime He wants anyway? Can’t He just tap into our consciousness and experience everything each one of us experiences at any time?

But all the good arguments against it I’ve made, for me…

1. 
   *]I believe Jesus is firstborn of David and Bathsheba died for David’s sin.
   
   *]It diminishes Jesus’ faith by making him a God that knows for sure he is going to live no matter what, rather than a man who just has great faith that God will come through for him.
   
   *]The idea of a Son coming from a Father God automatically makes the Son lesser than the Father and not always existing with the Father which is not a Trinity of one God of equal parts, but a family of Gods of different natures in a pantheon called Trinity which is Arianism and polytheism, not monotheism of no other gods but God. So it is not only confusing but not credible as a monotheistic belief.
   
   *]It obscures the true role of Jesus as High Priest who makes atonement for our sins, and King like David who rules with God’s power, but only because God allows it, which is what the prophecies say Messiah is, a Suffering Servant of God – again not an equal to God.
   
   *]I believe Jesus is made God over us anyway which does not require him to be God, but just a man God trusts more than any other with all that power. So it takes nothing away from his glory, it only adds to it because he was able to accomplish all that being only human, and not a God.
   
   And anything else I’ve said about it. Trinity is just an idea I don’t believe in or find believable or agreeable to everything else said about Messiah in the Bible.
   
   And it is too easily shaken, a house built on sand for people like me who just do not see the point in devoting their hearts and minds and lives to something they don’t really have faith in, and when I see how it confuses others and keeps them away from God, especially the Jews who have grown to despise Christianity and all it represents, and sadly, their own Messiah who is the only one who can save them.
   
   I mean yeah, we can go back and forth, tit for tat, but there’s not really anything new I can add to this particular issue.

1. 
   What about how John the Baptist called Jesus: the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world? He had to be unblemished to be an acceptable sacrifice to God, hadn’t he? That is, without defect, and without sin as a man… Wouldn’t this be a good reason for God to send His only Son (His Eternal Word) in the form of a man?

 

[Lapell]

“The question still remains unanswered by you- what explains those reactions when Jesus says ‘I AM’”

I have before here.

John 8:53 Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?

Hebrews 7:4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.

John 8:54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:

Hebrews 5:4-6 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron. So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

John 8:55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.

Hebrews 5:7-9 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

Hebrews 7:1-2 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him; To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;

John 8:57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Hebrews 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

Jesus was made like Adam a son of God without mother or father, because he was resurrected into Mary without need for mother or father. Although his real mother and father were David and Bathsheba.

So in none of this Jesus is saying he is God, he is saying he is like Melchizedek, the High Priest who makes atonement for the House of Abraham, Jew and Gentile heirs of the promise, and thus greater than Abraham.

So it is because he said he was greater than Abraham that Jews wanted to kill him even more, it is like saying you are greater than Mohammed to Muslims, since Abraham is the father of the Jews.

You still haven’t answered the question about the reaction of those who took stones to throw them at him when he said that…

 

[FaithofAbraham]

Yes, like the word “almah” in Isaiah’s Immanuel-prophecy, which today Jews claim to mean only “young girl” and not “virgin”, while apparently in Isaiah’s time it probably had both meanings, just like the word “virgo” in latin!

Sure. A young woman can quite possibly be a virgin too. That main issue with Jews is that they claim it was only a prophecy for Ahaz fulfilled when Israel and Syria left Judah alone.

But look here, it’s not fulfilled yet:

Isaiah 14:29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent’s root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.

So Syria morphs in time into a Serpent. Which is the Beast, a Great Gentile Kingdom. With its buddy the Ten Tribes of Israel as the Ten Horns scattered into Gentile nations.

Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

And so the old coalition of Ahaz, Israel and Syria, appears again in different form to torment the Whore Judah, and is thus not fulfilled yet with Ahaz.

It is only fulfilled with Jesus who kills the Beast.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Isaiah 11:8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice’ den.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

You still haven’t answered the question about the reaction of those who took stones to throw them at him when he said that…

Sure I did.

So it is because he said he was greater than Abraham that Jews wanted to kill him even more, it is like saying you are greater than Mohammed to Muslims, since Abraham is the father of the Jews.

Jews: Are you greater than Abraham?

…

Jesus: I am.

 

[R_not]

Abuc wrote: i am forced to say what many Christians views are on Islam -

that is, you should worry less on the divinity of Christ and more on a fifty years old plus Muhammod saying that an angel told him in a dream he could wed a six year old girl, lie with her and rub his genitals against her and then at the age of 9 have sex with her.
Islam is not a continuation of Christianity in any way let alone a better way.

Muslims do not beleive in the bible. They say they do but anywhere there is a contradiction, like praying for you enemies (Jesus) or being told not to pray for even unbelievers (Muhammad) then the koran takes precedence and the muslim mind automatically says the bible was corrupted, without any evidence and against all historical records to the contrary.

This is not believing in the bible but taking Christians to be easily led idiots and is insulting every time it is mentioned.

No one spoke of Muhammad in the OT, Muhammad fulfilled no prophecies, took away no sin, was not resurrected, was not crowned as the new David to fulfil the promise of God.
etc…

I shortened your post Abuc, but you seem to be the only one talking why islam can’t deal with anything.

I saw a show titled ‘Most Evil’ and it talked about cult leaders. Something very interesting came about that and I used to say that mohammed had epiliepsy. Well, it seems I might have been on to something - it sounds like he might have what they mention on that show as ‘temporal epilepsy with a narcissistic personality’. These types do exactly what mohammed did - see visions, and if people start laughing at him as his own tribe did and the Jews and Christians did - they will start killing.

But, everytime a change in islam is brought up it is us bringing it up - not the muslims themselves.

I find that our own ‘scholars’ a bit of a let down too. They will go along with this ‘Abrahamic’ stuff that the muslims insist on calling us all while we never used that term, and they go along with appeasing them while the muslims continue on slaughtering our Jewish, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist and other brothers and sisters. They kill their own and they are ok with that too since they figure if they got killed as colateral damage - they will got to allah. If it were something else like an ‘honor killing’ for example, they will go their hades.

So, St. Paul and islam - muslims don’t care about St. Paul. As far as Christians practicing in their lands - not openly allowed in most and not allowed at all in saudi arabia. Basically, Christians take their life in their hands if they practice, rebuild/build churches, show any signs of Christianity, etc. And I am floored everytime when we, in our own country, lay down and give in to their whims because that offends them. Their koran offends me - it says time and again to either kill me or subjugate me. That I find offensive - and our 'scholar’s just continue in their chosen ignorance of appeasement to their every need.

 

[abucs]

Yes R Not,

i often wonder why so many good Muslim people can somehow put the historical figure of Christ below that of the character of Muhammad and all that he did.

I find that many muslims have in their mind ‘Koran is true’ and seemed to be scared to go anywhere near admitting there are contradictions. Suddenly many of them become Hebrew and Roman bible scolars of the 1st century and come out with some crazy stuff, none of it supported by evidence.

The thing is that the Koran is not even a decent book. I admit that other writings like some of the Buddhist traditions that are engaging and beautiful to listen to. But the Koran is mostly rubbish. I can’t see how some Muslims get themselves into a frenzy pretending it is somehow wonderful. It is incoherant, completely different in style to the Jewish writings of the OT and NT (as you would expect not coming from God) and really doesn’t say anything decent that hasn’t been said before.

It also mentions war and its spoils often, seems to be pre-occupied with conquesting nearby tribes, curses CONSTANTLY non believers, splits the whole society as you say into us and them and doesn’t go anywhere.

It’s rubbish basically and they are at war on all of their borders with non islamic nations which says a lot about their tolerance and ‘religion of peace’ claim and like much of the world i’ve had enough of these guys trying to pick faults with other faiths and being blind to their own.

How can Muhammad compare with the Messiah ? Even the dogs breakfast of the koran calls Jesus the Messiah, the one that will take away the sins of the world and be the eternal ruler as the Jews were expecting and writing about for over a thousand years.

How can any serious person think that SOMEHOW a war mongering paedifile is more important. Why ?

 

[R_not]

They are brainwashed, and the ‘religion’ itself fit right into the tribal mentality of the Arabs. Then the Arabs spread their ‘religion’ and did one of the three I mentioned above - killed them, converted them (usually through slavery, kidnapping and torture), or subjugated them.

And if anyone does try to get out - they are jailed and usually killed. Remember that it isn’t the same there - we put murderers away - they put people who question or people who try to leave islam, mohammed or allah away and/or kill them.

There is what I call ‘ebbs and flows’ of muslim violence throughout the ages (1400 years). We are in a ‘flow’. It started around the 1920s and picked up steam during the Nazi, Jew hating, time. And we are seeing the growth of violence and hatred from that time. Before that the muslims and others lived rather peacefully - after the Ottoman Empire fell. But, before that there were violent times also and growth spirts. We are in a huge growth spirt of islam right now.

If we go into a relative peaceful time with muslims/islam - it just takes the right men and circumstances to bring out the radicals again. It is not a stable ‘religion’.

All that has to happen is for time to pass, people to feel secure again and they seem to go into ‘zombie’ mode about islam. That is what we are getting now - the effects of a long period of relative peace because all the violence has been ‘over there’ and we don’t have a clue, or chose not to have a clue because we like being lazy and thinking everything is all rosie.

We think we are almighty while they use our laws against us. Since 9/11 their demands have increased and sped up. They are even offended by the tale of the Three Little Pigs. Geez, we are not asking them to eat them - but it is a fairy tale and our children can’t even hear it due to muslim sensiblities. Well, they are putting the 5 tenets of islam, how great mohammed was, etc into our history books - and that offends me! It is taqiyya/kithman (deception to smooth over islam) at its finest!

 

[abucs]

We have to remember R Not that most muslims are decent people, but the evangelising nutters make no sense at all and seem to be in a frenzy to convert people without really examining the character of ‘God’s messenger’.

Many non Arab muslim countries look on the craziness that goes on there with horror and do not want to be associated with it.

There are many sects of Islam too but they all go back to Muhammad, and he was clearly a bad man.

That of course doesn’t make them bad but i think soon there will be a distinguishing of the goodness in their societies from Muhammad under closer scrutiny. Islam as a people have many wonderful aspects but Muhammad is not one of them.

He will not survive the liberalising of their nations, and i hope with the freedoms will come the true gospel and not the craziness of Muhammad. In many ways the jihadis have to fight against allowing too many freedoms thus the people actually seriously question Muhammad and his character. That is the real basis of Sharia law IMHO and the severe penalties you mention in many places if someone wants to leave the faith.

I just wish our western media had not to a large extent been taken over by non Christians who present a false and very bad picture of the west as an alternative.

This gives the wrong impression of Christianity and now is the time we need to show the best of the west, not the smuttiest for global consumption IMHO.

Next time.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

They are brainwashed, and the ‘religion’ itself fit right into the tribal mentality of the Arabs. Then the Arabs spread their ‘religion’ and did one of the three I mentioned above - killed them, converted them (usually through slavery, kidnapping and torture), or subjugated them.

And if anyone does try to get out - they are jailed and usually killed. Remember that it isn’t the same there - we put murderers away - they put people who question or people who try to leave islam, mohammed or allah away and/or kill them.

There is what I call ‘ebbs and flows’ of muslim violence throughout the ages (1400 years). We are in a ‘flow’. It started around the 1920s and picked up steam during the Nazi, Jew hating, time. And we are seeing the growth of violence and hatred from that time. Before that the muslims and others lived rather peacefully - after the Ottoman Empire fell. But, before that there were violent times also and growth spirts. We are in a huge growth spirt of islam right now.

If we go into a relative peaceful time with muslims/islam - it just takes the right men and circumstances to bring out the radicals again. It is not a stable ‘religion’.

Seems like 600 years ago Christians were torturing Jews and people with mental problems as witches. I think it’s only fair that since Islam came along 600 years after Christianity, you give it at least that long to catch up in terms of civility.

Maybe in 550 years they will have limited themselves to burning Jews in the ovens and in a full 600, only touching little boys in the no-no spot.

Or maybe in 600 years they will be far better than the Christians have been in that time. Wouldn’t that be nice?

 

[abucs]

A priest touching little children in their no-no spots claiming to follow a religion is bad enough ;
but the founder of a religion doing the same is infinitely worse.
I hope it won’t take 600 years for muslims to realise that.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

A priest touching little children in their no-no spots claiming to follow a religion is bad enough ;
but the founder of a religion doing the same is infinitely worse.
I hope it won’t take 600 years for muslims to realise that.

Why is it infinitely worse, when the religion you follow is taught by some people who do that and were enabled to do it from the top ranks, and you depend on them for their forgiveness of sin and salvation?

Rumor about Mohammed is from Hadith, same validity as Christian apocrypha that paint Jesus as a spoiled brat who kills his playmates when he doesn’t get his way.

So let’s check those specks in our eyes, brother.

 

[abucs]

You are talking rubbish and it is obvious rubbish.
There are hundreds of thousands of priests to the Chistian religion but only one founder of the religion.
And that founder is supposed to be from God that started your religion.
It is infinitely worse as any moron can see.
If the guy that started your religion is evil you should ditch him.
If a priest or immam is evil then you should ditch them too.
I look forward to the day that Islam ditches their child molestor founder.


“…Rumours about Jesus who kills his playmates from where ?”.


Is that the best you got ?

And i should join your religion ?

Rumours about Muhammad ? Rumours ?

faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina/ayesha.htm

muhammadanism.org/Hadith/Topics/Marriage.htm

thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/025-Muhammads-sex-life.htm

au.answers.yahoo.com/answers2/frontend.php/question?qid=20071203184836AASRq7u

homa.org/Details.asp?ContentID=2137352728

And you’re worried about how to read the divinity of Christ claims in the NT ? Are you serious ?

I submit you have more important things to think over.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

You are talking rubbish and it is obvious rubbish.
There are hundreds of thousands of priests to the Chistian religion but only one founder of the religion.
And that founder is supposed to be from God that started your religion.
It is infinitely worse as any moron can see.
If the guy that started your religion is evil you should ditch him.
If a priest or immam is evil then you should ditch them too.
I look forward to the day that Islam ditches their child molestor founder.


“…Rumours about Jesus who kills his playmates from a peodophile 600 years after his time”.


Is that the best you got ?

And i should join your religion ?

I don’t follow any imams. And if you aren’t going to believe that Jesus killed his playmates from apocrypha or that Jesus is roasting in hell from the Jewish Talmud why are you people so hot to condemn Mohammed on rumor when he only had good things to say about Jesus and Mary?

Quran 19:19-21 He said: I am only a messenger of thy Lord, that I may bestow on thee a faultless son. She said: How can I have a son when no mortal hath touched me, neither have I been unchaste? He said: So (it will be). Thy Lord saith: It is easy for Me. And (it will be) that We may make of him a revelation for mankind and a mercy from Us, and it is a thing ordained.

All he did was try to untangle the horrid mess of Trinity that no one can explain or understand, that has God mating with a mortal woman to produce Himself as His own son like some kind of bizarre incestuous nightmare that belongs in Greek mythology books, not in the simplicity and grace of the story of Jesus, a mere man who rose from the bottom to be the greatest man of all.

Matthew 10:14-15 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet. Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

 

[R_not]

Well, to this comment, ‘We have to remember R Not that most muslims are decent people, but the evangelising nutters make no sense at all and seem to be in a frenzy to convert people without really examining the character of ‘God’s messenger’.’

Are they? When they think that beating, torturing and/or killing their women if they do something that the man doesn’t like is ok? When they worry more about their image than stopping the jihadists? When there is no compunction for them to do anthing since they enjoy the benefits of our society while working to make us appease them and if our country does go through turmoil - they benefit from a muslim country. You need to go back and reread some of the other posts I posted today.

Go to jihadwatch.org and on a daily basis you will see the violence committed in a name of a ‘religion’ that is done to non-muslims. And this continual comparison to Christianity past violence of bad men to a religion whose adherents have no intention of changing, who think that blowing themselves or even their children up for allah so they can get to heaven if they kill or at least try to kill infidels is a good comparison then I don’t know what sort of christianity you practice.

Take a look at the founders - Christ vs mohammed. I don’t have to tell you about Christ, but mohammed tortured, killed, raped, stole, lied, enslaved and kidnapped for ransom. This is what you compare Christ to. Everytime I hear your statement, I know you have not looked at the koran but only take the muslim’s word for it - which they never tell you about the Medina (violent) passages that have abrogated (replaced) the Meccan (peaceful) passages. They will only tell you the peaceful passages. But you, chosing ignorance, don’t look any further.

I wanted to know why so many muslims (who later blamed the Jews) danced and ulalated in the streets in our own country and around the world when so many died on 9/11. I found out why.

If you want to compare Christianity to islam - read a book called, ‘Religion of Peace? Why Christianity is and islam isn’t’. It says it better than I ever could. Start with the founders and go from there. You compare bad men to a bad religion.

If these muslims are so good, ask them why they can believe in a guy who tortured, killed, raped, stole, lied, enslaved and kidnapped for ransom and would pass people that they captured after battle as booty. Since pediphilia was an accepted thing in those days by so many men - I won’t add that to his list of transgressions. Remember that Christ stopped a stoning of a woman while mohammed taught and practiced it.

 

[abucs]

Don’t retreat into this ‘we love christianity’ rubbish FOA.

You don’t.

And there is no controversy with Muhammads actions. It is a well known fact that anyone who does a little bit of research can verify for themself.

Muhammad was an evil man by his own writings and Islamic history written by Islamic scholars.

 

[R_not]

As for our priests doing harm to children - all I can say is they need to be brought to a court of law, tried and put away. And those bishops who were turning away parents who were trying to bring the transgressions to light - they should be thrown out and their priesthood taken away from them.

But, what we have in the muslim world is the adherents following their prophet and not only practicing polygamy - not more than 4 wives if they can afford them, but they can divorce and remarry as many times as they want. And it is ok for them to marry a child of 9 years old since mohammed did the same. There is no punishment under sharia law for them. As I stated before in a previous post the only time muslims are punished/killed/jailed for things is if they try to leave, speak ill of mohammed/koran/allah, or some other minor transgressions will get their arms and legs, or tongues, removed.

If you think it is all separate from islam then you need to think again. It is all entertwined into their societies. And yes, it is a political movement that uses religion as a front. That using of it as a religion is how it gets a foothold into many countries - ours included.

 

[holdencaulfield]

A priest touching little children in their no-no spots claiming to follow a religion is bad enough ;
but the founder of a religion doing the same is infinitely worse.
I hope it won’t take 600 years for muslims to realise that.

What those priests did was terrible. I don’t exactly remember what happened to them, however they should have been excommunicated immediately. However this just says that humans are sinful NOT the Church. No man can be perfect.

 

[Reuben_J]

Hi

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim. We don’t like Paul bashing; but we are not allured into his untrue teachings. Paul does not matter to us; we only love JesusYeshuaIssa, Mary and Jesus’ true teachings, they only matter to us.

Thanks

This verse by Paul is the reason why Muslims reject him.

Gal 1:7-9

7… But there are some who are disturbing you and wish to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach [to you] a gospel other than the one that we preached to you, let that one be accursed! 9As we have said before, and now I say again, if anyone preaches a gospel other than the one that you received, let that one be accursed!

Actually in order to pave the way for Mohammad and for his teaching to be taught, Muslims need to reject Paul. Obviously Paul anticipated someone would do such perversion of the gospel later. Its purpose was to distort the truth so that followers of Christ would be swayed away from their belief. Mohammad fits the resume of that someone.

Thus the rejection of Paul actually got nothing to do with whether Paul was the apostle of Jesus or not, or about his teachings. In nay case all of Paul teachings are either in conformance to the teachings of the other apostles or are in essence subscribe to them. The actual reason of the rejection of Paul is because he disqualified Mohammad as a true prophet.

Now it is true that Mohammad perverted not only the Gospels of the NT but the entire Bible. Now go and figure why there is so much hate towards Paul. Paul used to mention about stumbling block … the stumbling block (in a reverse way) to Mohammad is definitely Paul.

Considering that Mohammad had been accursed BY DEFAULT in the teaching stated by Paul because of his activity in perverting the gospel, it is natural for Muslims to take revenge on him.

I am wondering now … was it only Paul who said that anyone who preaches a gospel other than the one that Christians received is accursed? I am pretty sure Paul does not only preach this message but others as well. I guess this is another reason why the twelve apostles of Jesus were mysteriously became anonymous in the Quran! Interesting how the Quran can be selectively forgetful in its memory.

 

[R_not]

Rueben, you give mohammed too much credit if you think he picked and chose his stories on purpose. mohammed was illiterate and a pagan. islam is a mixture of the pagan religion of his time mixed with what he heard of Judaism and Christianity, along with the fascism of communism and nazism. I am not throwing those last two in glibly either. islam is one of those ‘either you are with me or you are against me’ thinking. This along with the hatred of anyone not a muslim, as the nazis hated the Jews so did the muslims. The communists knew that letting Christians live meant they would have a lot of problems so they had to get rid of them too. And we see that in islam throughout the years. Mass slaughtering of Christians. (sound familiar with all the Christian bashing we are seeing now in Europe, Canada and the USA?)

What stories he did put in the koran were probably ones that he heard. When he was younger he didn’t totally hate the Jews. it was in his later years when he hated them because they were not going for his new religion.

Like I said in a previous post - I think mohammed had something physical happen to him between his Meccan years and Medina years. It went from a relative peaceful time to pure violence. (I said I think it was temporal epilepsy with a narcissistic personality of which we have seen in our own times brings out the killer instinct in cult leaders)

As for Paul, or any apostle, he could have cared less. Being a pagan he didn’t know or understand the parts the apostles play in Christianity. (at least this is my opinion on this)

You want to know about mohammed - read ‘The Life and Religion of mohammed’. don’t worry, any of the readings I suggest will never convert you. It will only let you ‘know your enemy’. Even reading the koran will never convert you unless you are forced from childhood to convert, or a psychopath. yes, I don’t see how any sane human being could convert to islam if they didn’t have a sword to their throats and wanted to live, hence this is where the sword plays such an important role in islam.