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Navarre
Guest
Not necessarily. Some people are extremely slow on the uptake or they are predisposed to believe what’s not true.
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Navarre
Guest
No you won’t – and that will be your loss. God ahead and continue with the hateful slurs. Just realize how it makes you look before God and a great many people who lack your bigotry.
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Lepanto
Guest
Spiller?
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MrDickerson
Guest
No, not the architecture itself–the architecture is modernism, heresy, in stone; and heresy can invalidate the Eucharistic celebration since modernists are notorious for ad libbing the prayers of the Mass and, especially in Mahoney’s archdiocese, using invalid matter in the Eucharist.
When my friends were at the Rog Mahal, some sort of ecumenical ceremony was incorporated into the “Mass”, with Sikh women and Buddhist monks performing their own ceremonies on that table-thing they call an altar.
The entire building IS a hideous, monstrous, un-Catholic eyesore. Personally, the exterior reminds me of a gas chamber or a gigantic crematorium, complete with a chimney! It really blends in with the rest of the nightmarish architecture in L.A., apparently they were aiming for the banal, concrete-and-glass theme. The “tabernacle” where they reserve the dubiously valid Eucharist also resembles a couple of large, bronze cigarette butts. How awe-inspiring!
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Navarre
Guest
Now you’re just talking smack. I’ve been to many Masses at OLAC. I’ve seen one abuse – the confection of the Precious Blood in ewers. Your comments are baseless – and mean spirited.
Have you ever attended a Mass at the OLAC? It doesn’t appear so based on your misguided comments. Why do you focus on some sensational thing that may or may not have happened when so many gorgeous Masses have been celebrated at OLAC?
That’s “table-thing” is an 8’x10’, 8.5 ton marble altar. It’s so massive yet simple that it’s humbling to the touch. I’m not a great fan of many of the furnishings of OLAC but they got the altar right. It’s wonderful.
Now you’ve become downright nasty and crude. You should be deeply ashamed at your bigoted and hateful comments. “gas chamber?” “gigantic crematorium?” “hideous, monstrous, un-Catholic eyesore.” What is driving your anger? What’s driving your need to slur OLAC? It’s certainly not the design of OLAC. Was it your inability to defend your hateful ideas?
Your comments are not befitting of any Christan, but most importantly a Catholic Christian.
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benedictgal
Guest
The best new church building I have seen thus far, at least on TV, is the new Shrine to Our Lady of Guadalupe in Wisconsin. It was dedicated by Archbishop Raymond Burke who had the concept to build it. It is magnificent and is the ideal example of what I new church should look like. It is more beautiful than the “new” shrine in Mexico to Our Lady of Guadalupe.
I got to participate in a call-in on EWTN Live when Fr. Mitch Pacwa had the pastor of St. John Neumann in Tennessee on his program to talk about the priest’s new parish. He showed pictures and footage and I was impressed. I asked the priest about the document Built on Living Stones. Just as I suspected, the document is not authoritative and is merely suggestive. The windows are magnificent and it is built in the Romanesque style, if memory serves. There might even be a dome.
Churches, whether they are built for small parish communities or cathedrals, should not be monuments to the cleric or prelate who is doing them. These should not be about them nor should they be about us. They should be about God.
Here is an observation that the former Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger offered regarding the state of Church art today:
The buildings in question appear to me to be cold, unfeeling and devoid of the Senus Fidei. One could make the argument about St. Peter’s simply because it is huge, but, I submit to you that even viewing it on TV, I get the impression that this magnificent church tries to convey that something divine is happening within its walls and that its art and architecture moves my heart to the heavenly realities that its art is trying to convey.
I cannot say the same for the trio from California.
I got to participate in a call-in on EWTN Live when Fr. Mitch Pacwa had the pastor of St. John Neumann in Tennessee on his program to talk about the priest’s new parish. He showed pictures and footage and I was impressed. I asked the priest about the document Built on Living Stones. Just as I suspected, the document is not authoritative and is merely suggestive. The windows are magnificent and it is built in the Romanesque style, if memory serves. There might even be a dome.
Churches, whether they are built for small parish communities or cathedrals, should not be monuments to the cleric or prelate who is doing them. These should not be about them nor should they be about us. They should be about God.
Here is an observation that the former Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger offered regarding the state of Church art today:
While he directs this at sacred art in his book, the Spirit of the Liturgy, I believe that this can certainly be applied to church buildings.
The buildings in question appear to me to be cold, unfeeling and devoid of the Senus Fidei. One could make the argument about St. Peter’s simply because it is huge, but, I submit to you that even viewing it on TV, I get the impression that this magnificent church tries to convey that something divine is happening within its walls and that its art and architecture moves my heart to the heavenly realities that its art is trying to convey.
I cannot say the same for the trio from California.
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Lepanto
Guest
Be careful, BG.
Pope Benedict XVI might be labeled “hateful” and “bigoted” for his views!
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danonwaveland
Guest
What she said! I visited the shrine and it is quite beautiful. I have seen a couple “restored” churches here in Chicago, churches that had fallen into disrepair and then were refurbished. The details are quite nice in these refurbished churches, but the sharp corners on columns and detailing have been rounded by several coats of paint. The Guadalupe shrine in Wisconsin, being brand new, has sharp corners and fine detailing everywhere. It made me think what the grand old churches must have looked like when they were “young.”
That being said, the cathedral in SF, as best as I can recall from 28-30 years ago, was quite nice for a modern structure. I remember thinking that it was clean and elegant. I don’t remember if there was any statuary – if there was, it was probably the faceless, grotesque humanoid stuff – but I remember being surprised that it was superior to any of the “modern” churches to which I had become accustomed. If I were to visit it today, I might have a different opinion. However, compared to the drawings and photos of other modern structures I have seen, I think the SF cathedral comes off looking not too badly.
What I try to remember when I attend mass at a less-than-nice church is that, in spite of our human fumbling, Christ is still present and His Precious Body and Blood are there for our adoration and love. Ultimately, that is what is most significant.
God bless,
Dan
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LeroyCRHP
Guest
A building doesn’t make a church.
My family lived in Belgium for two years and thought we would attend some great cathedral, however we attended Catholic church in a small cinder block building. The people that attended were great, the Priest was great and in the end we were completely satisfied.
I think there is a verse on a building doesn’t make a church but I could not find it.
My family lived in Belgium for two years and thought we would attend some great cathedral, however we attended Catholic church in a small cinder block building. The people that attended were great, the Priest was great and in the end we were completely satisfied.
I think there is a verse on a building doesn’t make a church but I could not find it.
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benedictgal
Guest
That is true, to a certain extent. The first version of our cathedral was a jacal hut. Then, a more permanent church was built. When the city outgrew that, the present church was built. I can also understand that in missionary lands.
However, that argument doesn’t necessarily hold true for the three churches in question. These were built that way on purpose.
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Navarre
Guest
AMEN!
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MrDickerson
Guest
What can I say? I call a spade a spade. The Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels** IS** a hideous, multimillion $$ waste of glass and concrete.
Have you ever heard the story called, “The Emperor’s New Clothes” by Hans Christian Andersen? You remind me of one of the commoners in that story who said, “Ah! How fine, how beautiful are the emperor’s clothes!” when in reality he was buck naked; “The Cathedral of Our Lady of Los Angeles is a beautiful masterpiece of art and architecture! How dare you say it is anything but exquisite!!”
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mattkubes
Guest
Funny, the few who seem to be able to find beauty in OLAC’s architecture are called ‘insightful’ and told how true their posts are…while those of us who disagree are called ‘uneducated’ and ‘biased’. Ah well.
On my visit to Quebec City last year, I had a chance to visit the oldest parish church in North America - the Notre Dame de Québec Cathedral. It really is breathtaking.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3231/2747429016_4b9c047c97.jpg
How on earth does this compare?? I honestly don’t understand.
And funny you should mention that OLAC has no 90-degree angles…there’s another structure that used a similar philosophy for its architecture. It’s the new addition to the Royal Ontario Museum. It was built to highlight their new crystal exhibit…
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1314/804798811_aa1c4a3f85.jpg
The concept of beauty used to be used as evidence for the existence of God…now it’s being degraded to a merely subjective abstraction.
On my visit to Quebec City last year, I had a chance to visit the oldest parish church in North America - the Notre Dame de Québec Cathedral. It really is breathtaking.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3231/2747429016_4b9c047c97.jpg
How on earth does this compare?? I honestly don’t understand.
And funny you should mention that OLAC has no 90-degree angles…there’s another structure that used a similar philosophy for its architecture. It’s the new addition to the Royal Ontario Museum. It was built to highlight their new crystal exhibit…
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1314/804798811_aa1c4a3f85.jpg
The concept of beauty used to be used as evidence for the existence of God…now it’s being degraded to a merely subjective abstraction.
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trdchubi
Guest
We were thought that design itself revolves around philosophies and principles. Design is a tricky thing - while most people don’t realize it, it is very subjective. Everyone thinks they know what looks good, but in reality they only know what looks good to them. While there are general rules to design, for the most part people simply have a preference as to what looks best. Its the in the eye of the beholder thing that transpire here.
I think its the Church Authorities of that cathedral who are responsible for such designs. The objective of the architects is to find all the necessary wants and needs of the building, its users and of course its owners. If the church authorities ask for an out-of-the-ordinary architecture then the Architects responsibility is to design them.
I think its the Church Authorities of that cathedral who are responsible for such designs. The objective of the architects is to find all the necessary wants and needs of the building, its users and of course its owners. If the church authorities ask for an out-of-the-ordinary architecture then the Architects responsibility is to design them.
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trdchubi
Guest
Well most Catholics are accustomed to Gothic designs like this:
High French Gothic
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High Spanish Gothic
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Late Italian Gothic
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Renaissance Church Architecture like this:
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and Spanish Colonial Architecturehttp://farm3.static.flickr.com/2178/2153334783_640343d841.jpg
High French Gothic
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High Spanish Gothic
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Late Italian Gothic
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Renaissance Church Architecture like this:
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and Spanish Colonial Architecturehttp://farm3.static.flickr.com/2178/2153334783_640343d841.jpg
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trdchubi
Guest
will this also appeal to you?
modern church a newly built catholic church in Vienna Donaucity,Austria
Modern Catholic church
http://www.victor-marz.com/picture/h_614.jpg
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modern church a newly built catholic church in Vienna Donaucity,Austria
Modern Catholic church
http://www.victor-marz.com/picture/h_614.jpg
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trdchubi
Guest
The Cathedral of Christ Light
As its name suggests, the Cathedral draws on the tradition of light as a sacred phenomenon. Through its poetic introduction, indirect daylight ennobles modest materials—primarily wood, glass, and concrete. With the exception of evening activities, the Cathedral is lit entirely by daylight to create an extraordinary level of luminosity.
(Statement from the architect, Craig W. Hartman)
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MrDickerson
Guest
Eeew. That first one, from Austria, is an absolute nightmare. It reminds me of one of those modern mausoleums…you know, the ones where they have niche crypts in the walls and stack the corpses on top of eachother.
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MrDickerson
Guest
No, no, it’s not beautiful or inspiring at all; in fact it has the opposite effect. Don’t you love how these modernist architects build these eyesores, then have to explain to us common folk how beautiful they really are because, apparently, we’re too simple to recognize and appreciate beauty. Again, I’m reminded of the Emperor’s New Clothes.
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trdchubi
Guest
Well I think IMHO the architecture and design of the Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels has adapted 30’s era Art Deco style.
Some elements of the architecture have mixed modern and neo-art deco style like this piece in an Art deco gallery (not from OLAC)
http://www.antiquehotspots.com/image.asp?file=C:\server\directiques/images/inventory/1826_4752458_6_9_45@11_4_2004_1.jpg&maxWidth=530&maxHeight=390
The design itself made sure that the other elements stick with the style, including the drop lights and wall arts. Producing a light and airy feel. Not an easy feat for the architects to accomplished knowing that this kind of style is limited to commercial structures only.
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