Saudi Marriage 'Expert' Advises Men in 'Right Way' to Beat Their Wives

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Almost all Muslim countries can make people disappear. Pakistan for a start. Syria. Libya. Saudi Arabia.

They put you in detention and you will not be seen for two years. They have special ways to treat ‘dissidents’. I don’t want to end up like Theo Van Gogh.

I see you have given up defending Islam but have now taken the tactic of the ad hominem - attacking Rodrigo instead. Great - shows you have lost because you don’t know the first thing about Islam.
 
Almost all Muslim countries can make people disappear. Pakistan for a start. Syria. Libya. Saudi Arabia.

They put you in detention and you will not be seen for two years. They have special ways to treat ‘dissidents’.

I see you have given up defending Islam but have not taken the tactic of the ad hominem - attacking Rodrigo instead.

I don’t want to end up like Theo Van Gogh.
Syria has nothing against Catholics or Orthodox, the patriarchs are located there. Saudi Arabia allows Christian worship so long as it is in private. In Libya and Pakistan it depends on what areas you are in. However these countries do follow international law code on visitors, and they wont just arrest foreigners for no reason. The only reason I see them for doing things like that you described to visitors like you is if you went there to intentionally cause trouble, which is exactly what you are doing on the thread here, forum troll.
 
Nonsense - your ignorance is astounding.

Syria - read here about persecution of Christians. There is the official version and the street version.

worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53549

“For Christians, one of the core tenets is the ability to share your faith, but in Syria that can lead to arrest (and) persecution,” Jacobson said. “We list Syria as one of the top … countries where Christians are facing real persecution.”

As for the other countries
While Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Iran and other Middle East nations are well-known for persecuting Christians, Syria’s actions are of a lower profile.

You call not being able to build a church in Saudi Arabia not persecution? You call being whipped for praying in public not persecution?

Nobody knows if you pray in private, buddy.

Of course you’d think these Christians are lying.
onenewsnow.com/2007/01/christians_are_persecuted_seco.php

Keith Roderick is the Washington representative for CSI. He says most Christians in the United States do not realize that oppression and discrimination against followers of Christ is rampant in Syria, where “Christians are not equal and assume a second-class position within society.” In Syria and elsewhere in the Middle East, he says, Christians are not only being kidnapped, raped, tortured, and killed, but many are being subjected to economic oppression and religious persecution as well.

Wow - the Christians in Syria sure have it good, don’t they?
 
Of course, these Christians are also lying when they tell us that their fellow Christians are persecuted in Pakistan.

human-rights-and-christian-persecution.org/pakistan.html

One of the ways Christians are persecuted in Pakistan is through the blasphemy laws. The law has been deliberately used against minority communities, by trapping people into declaring their unbelief in Islam. Several of those accused under the law in the past have become victims of extra-judicial killings before, during or after their trials, even when they have been acquitted.



Christians and other non-Muslims suffer serious inequalities in Pakistani society. Harassment of individual Christians is not uncommon, while instances of violence against churches, Christian organisations and Christian communities occur with surprising regularity. The gradual erosion of minority rights in Pakistani law has weakened the status of non-Muslims socially, legally, and consequently, economically.
 
Nonsense - your ignorance is astounding.

Syria - read here about persecution of Christians. There is the official version and the street version.

worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53549
No wonder you are so brainwashed, you read worldnetdaily! You may as well be reading Soviet-era Pravda to get accurate info on capitalism! Here is a dose of medicine from a reliable Catholic website

al-bushra.org/syria/syria.htm
As for the other countries
While Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Iran and other Middle East nations are well-known for persecuting Christians, Syria’s actions are of a lower profile.
Dubai has churches built right in the open! They have Catholic hospitals! Just Google search and you will see them. And Iran? In Iran it is required by LAW to have a certain amount of Jews, orthodox and Catholics in the house of representatives! And the Armenian Christian community there is huge, they have Christmas and Easter celebrations every year out in the streets of Tehran and even the Muslims give Christmas presents at that time of year. Obviously Arabia is the most troublesome yet even there the worst that would happen for a foreigner is to be asked to leave the country.
 
If you want more sources you only have to google or ask. There are lots more you can get from the internet - testimonies from Christians.

Dubai - who said anything about Dubai not permitting church-building. It is only in Saudi Arabia that Christians aren’t allowed to build churches. You got your fact wrong, Jerry.

Time to fess up - you don’t know anything about Islam, do you?

Do you think Reverend Alconga was mistaken about his persecution in Dubai?

persecution.org/suffering/pressdetail.php?presscode=65

I suppose these Christians also lied about their persecution in Dubai?

Dubai.
They hate you because of me - On February 21, 72-year-old South Carolinian Vivian Gilmer was arrested for handing out Bibles on a missionary trip to Dubai, United Arab Emirates.

Vivian, under house arrest, is waiting for a higher court hearing.

The Christian Post reports:

According to the Sun [News, South Carolina], Gilmer is currently staying in Dubai with two other missionaries—one of which is Marie Bush of Waxahachie, Texas, who is also being held in the city. The missionaries, who were both working with the Tommy Cox Evangelistic Association, are under house arrest and have not been allowed to leave the country. The passports of both Bush and Gilmer were confiscated.

thegreatseparation.com/newsfront/2005/03/two_missionarie.html
 
Let’s get one thing straight, most the sources you are quoting are evangelical. Now most the countries have tolerance of orthodox and catholics, but protestantism is distrusted by many of these countries. Now I hope the day comes where they have full rights as well, but as a Catholic I have to look out for my flock first before others, and if I had to choose between a country allowing only orthodox Christianity versus not allowing any at all, I would not hesitate choosing the former.
 
Let me get this straight:

Are you saying it is okay for Muslims to persecute evangelicals?

What sort of warped logic is that?

The sources from Christians I have given say that the native Christian population of Syria and Pakistan are oppressed. So those Christians are evangelicals too, right?

I suppose the Vatican was lying about Christians being persecuted by Islamic countries.

ad2000.com.au/articles/2006/jul2006p14_2292.html
 
Let me get this straight:

Are you saying it is okay for Muslims to persecute evangelicals?

What sort of warped logic is that?

The sources from Christians I have given say that the native Christian population of Syria and Pakistan are oppressed. So those Christians are evangelicals too, right?
You are so full of it! I never said “it is okay for Muslims to persecute evangelicals”. I said “Now I hope the day comes where they have full rights as well”, genius!

And some of your sources are suspect at best. If Orthodox Christians really are being persecuted in Syria, why are the seats of Bishops in the Catholic/Orthodox church allowed there? Why did the Pope be allowed to visit there a couple years ago with a whole audience jam packed of Christians there to see and listen to him?

And here is what POPE BENEDICT HIMSELF SAID:

al-bushra.org/syria/pope.htm

“For centuries now, there have been harmonious relations between the Christian and Muslim communities in your country. Syria, then, is uniquely placed to offer to the world an example of peaceful coexistence and tolerance between the followers of different religions. In this regard, I can assure you of the support of the Holy See for the efforts your Government has made both at home and abroad to promote dialogue between religions and cultures.”

Are you saying the Pope is a liar?!
 
The Pope was perhaps being diplomatic.

Did you read my second article quoting the Vatican about Christians being persecuted in Muslim countries?

No?

Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O’Connor was lying, was he?

During a speech on 16 May at the Oxford Centre for Islamic Studies, he said the main obstacle to Christian-Muslim dialogue was “the failure, in a number of Muslim countries, to uphold the principle of religious freedom”. It was, he added, “essential that Muslims can freely worship in Oxford or London, just as it is essential that Christians can freely worship in Riyadh or Kabul”.

Cardinal Murphy-O’Connor called upon Muslims living in Britain to speak out when Christians are denied their rights in Islamic countries. “Where religious rights of minorities are disrespected in the name of Islam”, he said, “the face of Islam is tarnished elsewhere in the world.”

Perhaps Archbishop Lajolo just had too much of the holy wine that day when he said:
  • The protection of Christians in Islamic countries is particularly difficult in the area ranging from Turkey to the Middle East. Solutions must be found for the many Christians who flee their country of residence in search of safety.
Archbishop Lajolo criticised Islamic countries for ignoring the concept of reciprocity, common in relations among states, when it comes to matters of faith. Islamic countries, he pointed out, demand religious rights for their citizens who migrate to other countries, but ignore this principle for non-Muslim immigrants present in their own lands.

Oh… it is your utter unconcern for Evangelicals when they are being persecuted that tells me of your moral compass. They don’t count as human beings worthy of respect, do they, being lesser creations than Catholics and other orthodox believers, eh?
 
The Pope was perhaps being diplomatic.
So the Pope is being “diplomatic” yet worldnetdaily is infallible? You are so confused 😦

And I never implied things were all rosy over there. Yet you take an extreme and make it seem like there are gas chambers for non-Muslims in every nation.
 
I suppose the Vatican was not quite telling the truth about the persecution of Christians in Muslim countries again.

“According to Muslim law,” Civiltà Cattolica notes correctly (and courageously), “Christians, Jews, and the followers of other religions assimilated to Christianity and Judaism (the ‘Sabeans’) who live in a Muslim state belong to an inferior social order, in spite of their eventually belonging to the same race, language, and descent. . . .

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID={2F1FD7BC-427E-486F-BFC8-867154230A4A}
 
So the Pope is being “diplomatic” yet worldnetdaily is infallible? You are so confused 😦

And I never implied things were all rosy over there. Yet you take an extreme and make it seem like there are gas chambers for non-Muslims in every nation.
I know the Pope was being diplomatic because the Vatican says that Christians are being persecuted in Muslim countries. He was visiting Syria after all.

Is worldnetdaily the ONLY source I used? No. Don’t get hung up on it. I produced quite a few more and I told you I can get more if you want. Just ignore worldnetdaily, will you?

I didn’t know you would play this game of ad hominem. You sure like to use that fallacy, don’t you, when you can’t attack the evidence?

Attack me, attack my source, but never once attack the evidence. Yeah, right.
 
Is Christian Post acceptable to you? Or is it just another commie propaganda sheet?

christianpost.com/article/20070102/24735.htm

250 Million Christians Will Be Persecuted in 2007
Christian Persecution Growing Fastest in Muslim World

More reports from the Vatican - acceptable to you?

“If we tell our people they have no right to offend, we have to tell the others they have no right to destroy us,” Cardinal Angelo Sodano, the Vatican’s Secretary of State (prime minister), told journalists in Rome.

“We must always stress our demand for reciprocity in political contacts with authorities in Islamic countries and, even more, in cultural contacts,” Foreign Minister Archbishop Giovanni Lajolo told the daily Corriere della Sera.

Reciprocity – allowing Christian minorities the same rights as Muslims generally have in Western countries, such as building houses of worship or practising religion freely – is at the heart of Vatican diplomacy towards Muslim states.

Vatican diplomats argue that limits on Christians in some Islamic countries are far harsher than restrictions in the West that Muslims decry, such as France’s ban on headscarves in state schools.

Saudi Arabia bans all public expression of any non-Muslim religion and sometimes arrests Christians even for worshipping privately. Pakistan allows churches to operate but its Islamic laws effectively deprive Christians of many rights.

Both countries are often criticised at the United Nations Human Rights Commission for violating religious freedoms.

christiansofiraq.com/vaticanFeb246.html
 
Pope Benedict XVI’s view about Muslims persecuting Christians.

Pope in ‘freedom’ blast at Islam
By SIMON CALDWELL

The Pope has again risked provoking the wrath of the Islamic world, by criticising its treatment of Christians.

Benedict XVI attacked Muslim nations where Christians are either persecuted or given the status of second-class citizens under the Shariah Islamic law.

He also defended the rights of Muslims to convert to Christianity, an act which warrants the death penalty in many Islamic countries.



Yesterday, near Rome, the 80-year-old pontiff made a speech in “defence of religious liberty”, which, he said “is a fundamental, irrepressible, inalienable and inviolable right”.

In a clear reference to Islam, he said: “The exercise of this freedom also includes the right to change religion, which should be guaranteed not only legally, but also in daily practice.”

dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=483202&in_page_id=1811
 
Just so you know, the Christian post does not consider catholics “Christian” (unless is suits their purpose)

And a few of the news stories you posted I simply did not see a need to read, if something just says “USA violates human rights” without giving specific examples, it is something anyone can say. I will make sure to only critique stories where it gives me more concrete evidence.

example: “USA violates human rights” - Too broad and can be lied about

example: “Chris J. of Ohio was found to have been falsely arrested under the patriot act on July 18th this year” - better report because it gives facts, not generalizations.

Some of the posts you did were good, but it seems more so simply gave a general outlook without showing me examples I can research and look into.
 
Check up on tu quoque, jerry. You sure commit quite a few logical fallacies.

The fact that I use multiple sources to show the same thing - Muslims persecute Christians.

Regardless of whether the source is Communist, Protestants or the Vatican - the message is the same - Muslims persecute Christians.

But in your enthusiasm to whitewash Islam and Muslims you prefer to side with the persecutors, don’t you?

Why don’t you take a principled stand against persecution for a change? Side with the victims instead.

Come on - it’s not that difficult.
 
Check up on tu quoque, jerry. You sure commit quite a few logical fallacies.

The fact that I use multiple sources to show the same thing - Muslims persecute Christians.

Regardless of whether the source is Communist, Protestants or the Vatican - the message is the same - Muslims persecute Christians.

But in your enthusiasm to whitewash Islam and Muslims you prefer to side with the persecutors, don’t you?

Why don’t you take a principled stand against persecution for a change? Side with the victims instead.

Come on - it’s not that difficult.
And why can’t you accept the fact that, and I have backed myself up with plenty of evidence, that some countries are better than others? While Arabia, Pakistan, and Sudan have trouble, Christians are much better off in Syria, Iran and Lebanon. I never denied there are troubles over there, but at least show me you can accept the fact that not all those regions are painted the same color.
 
So what if some Muslim countries are more tolerant than others?

Do you mean that if a ‘secular’ country like Syria more or less tolerates Christians, it excuses the persecution of Christians in other parts of the Muslim world?

Why the straw man? Who said all Muslim countries must be equally atrocious in their persecution of Christians before we will accept that Muslims are persecutors of Christians?

Have you read verse 9:29 of the Quran? That is the verse by which Muhammad told his followers to persecute Christians.

Iran tolerant of Christians? Can an Iranian Muslim convert to Christianity without being sentenced to die?

Did you know that Lebanon was 70% Christian in the 1970s? It was the only Christian country in the Middle East.
 
So what if some Muslim countries are more tolerant than others?
So what?! You want them all to be equally bad!?
Do you mean that if a ‘secular’ country like Syria more or less tolerates Christians, it excuses the persecution of Christians in other parts of the Muslim world?
Did I say that? No
Why the straw man? Who said all Muslim countries must be equally atrocious in their persecution of Christians before we will accept that Muslims are persecutors of Christians?
“Muslims are persecutors”? Now you are saying everyone of them are?
Did you know that Lebanon was 70% Christian in the 1970s? It was the only Christian country in the Middle East.
It was 50% and still is
 
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