Scotland Weighs Forcing Catholic Schools to Teach Same-Sex Marriage, Contraception

[mdgspencer]

see www.cardinalnewmansociety.org/CatholicEducationDaily/DetailsPage/tabid/102/ArticleID/2870/Scotland-Weighs-Forcing-Catholic-Schools-to-Teach-Same-Sex-Marriage-Contraception.aspx
This article provides a link to an article in the “Scottish Express” newspaper that reports more fully that government leaders in Scotland intend requiring Catholic schools in their country, like all other schools there, to give explicit lessons about gay sex and contraception, learning about local sex clinics where they can get contraception and tests for venereal diseases…

 

[Linusthe2nd]

see www.cardinalnewmansociety.org/CatholicEducationDaily/DetailsPage/tabid/102/ArticleID/2870/Scotland-Weighs-Forcing-Catholic-Schools-to-Teach-Same-Sex-Marriage-Contraception.aspx
This article provides a link to an article in the “Scottish Express” newspaper that reports more fully that government leaders in Scotland intend requiring Catholic schools in their country, like all other schools there, to give explicit lessons about gay sex and contraception, learning about local sex clinics where they can get contraception and tests for venereal diseases…

Well, that will never happen. I guess a lot of Catholics will wind up in jail. Coming to the U.S. soon. The Reformation is back.

Linus2nd

 

[ServusHumilis]

The first article you mentioned said:

Government ministers of Scotland are demanding that Catholic schools must be forced to teach students about same-sex marriage and about sex clinics which provide contraception, according to The Scottish Express.

If this were the case, I’d imagine the issue would be tied up in court for years; likely longer than these ministers will be in power.

Here’s another article: Scottish official rejects sex ed guidelines for Catholic schools

 

[kate_jackson]

If this happens this would do more to alienate the 1percent of ssc from society .

 

[kate_jackson]

Abortion is legal but not taught as right in catholic schools so if gay marriage becomes legal the catholic school is right to teach that they dont agree with it. People have different opinions and should be able to express them not be prosecuted for them. I think this just highlights how ridiculous their arguments are and how aggressive this gay campaign is.

 

[Monkey1976]

St. John Ogilvie, pray for your homeland.

 

[Viewer]

I actually don’t see the problem with this, and I wouldn’t mind if either of my children were to be told about these things. (Somewhat redundant perhaps since I already have explained them and why we don’t get involved).

As well as we might try the odds suggests that our children will come into contact with SSM couples, contraception on sale in shops or (hopefully not) might even contract some sort of disease from their partners once married.

I think not knowing will do more harm than knowledge of it, as a teacher I know I can only explain to a child what something is, I can’t promote or encourage it.

Odds are we will already be heavily discouraging it at home so I doubt one teacher with 45-60 minutes a week teaching citizenship can really do much “harm”. As kate mentions we already explain what an abortion is in science lessons, but at my school we certainly don’t suggest anyone gets one.

 

[SuperLuigi]

If this happens this would do more to alienate the 1percent of ssc from society .

Unfortunately, the gay “marriage” movement is loaded with straights trying to make a name for themselves, and in the global sense not every GLBTQ person is on board with so-called gay “marriage”.

 

[SuperLuigi]

=Viewer;11605222]I actually don’t see the problem with this, and I wouldn’t mind if either of my children were to be told about these things. (Somewhat redundant perhaps since I already have explained them and why we don’t get involved).

As well as we might try the odds suggests that our children will come into contact with SSM couples, contraception on sale in shops or (hopefully not) might even contract some sort of disease from their partners once married.

I think not knowing will do more harm than knowledge of it, as a teacher I know I can only explain to a child what something is, I can’t promote or encourage it.

Odds are we will already be heavily discouraging it at home so I doubt one teacher with 45-60 minutes a week teaching citizenship can really do much “harm”. As kate mentions we already explain what an abortion is in science lessons, but at my school we certainly don’t suggest anyone gets one.

I think you need to be really careful here, because having the government intervene like this is a dangerous precedent.

Don’t expect them to stop here----if they force it but gay “marriage” activists complain it doesn’t go far enough, the sky’s the limit.

Also, notice how it said Catholic schools----not Muslim ones.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Abortion is legal but not taught as right in catholic schools so if gay marriage becomes legal the catholic school is right to teach that they dont agree with it. People have different opinions and should be able to express them not be prosecuted for them. I think this just highlights how ridiculous their arguments are and how aggressive this gay campaign is.

They SHOULD, but remember, you’re talking about a state that is part of an entity that has banned American commentators Robert Spencer and Michael Savage for comments on Islam.

The “gay campaign” that you refer to will persecute Catholics to no end but if they are so principled, why do they avoid or back down from Islam?

 

[Viewer]

The “gay campaign” that you refer to will persecute Catholics to no end but if they are so principled, why do they avoid or back down from Islam?

Fairly obvious why, it’s because the Catholic Church doesn’t routinely proclaim fatwas or send out nuns with backpacks full of explosives every time someone ruffles its feathers. His name escapes me but one Muslim MP who voted for SSM was recently condemned to death as an apostate by a preacher.

I think you need to be really careful here, because having the government intervene like this is a dangerous precedent.

Don’t expect them to stop here----if they force it but gay “marriage” activists complain it doesn’t go far enough, the sky’s the limit.

Also, notice how it said Catholic schools----not Muslim ones.

I did notice that, but within the UK most Muslim schools are privately run (that is, they don’t take government funds as some of the many more Catholic schools do and as such have free reign on their curriculum).

On that line I’m not even sure it is that much of a precedent. It’s not quite like the USA where the thought of teaching evolution sends people into spasms of rage. There is a set curriculum and anyone that takes money from the government as part of the arrangement agrees to follow it. They can add whatever else they want but there is a core that by taking funding cannot be deviated from.

Worst comes to worst the Catholic Schools will turn private, damaging for Catholics who can’t fund a private education but not the end of the system.

 

[Mark121359]

This isn’t very surprising. This is what happens when you accept public funding…you also accept public regulations. Same thing much closer to home in Canada, which has been going on for years up there. As one of the links provided below warns…let this situation in Canada serve as a warning to religious schools in America: beware governments bearing gifts!!! Sadly enough, how so very, very true. If you think for one moment that this could never happen in the good ole’ U.S.A…think again! Accept public funding…and things will change here for the worst faster then you can flip a switch. Progressive (Liberal) governments mean business, and the RCC is in their way.

catholicexchange.com/christians-persecuted-through-a-tyranny-of-nice/
catholiceducation.org/articles/persecution/pch0080.html
au.org/blogs/wall-of-separation/lesson-from-the-north-canadian-catholic-schools-get-public-funds-and-public
chalcedon.edu/research/articles/canadian-human-rights-commissions-bear-down-on-christian-clergymen/
aipnews.com/talk/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=23966&posts=1
remnantnewspaper.com/Archives/archive-2008-0630-vree-free_speech_in_canada.htm

I actually don’t see the problem with this, and I wouldn’t mind if either of my children were to be told about these things. (Somewhat redundant perhaps since I already have explained them and why we don’t get involved).

As SuperLuigi warned, be careful with this. The governments of Scotland and Canada don’t really care so much about your child’s ***education ***on the subject of so-called same-sex marriage and contraception …but rather about their indoctrination into these subjects.

Peace, Mark

 

[Nordar]

I think not knowing will do more harm than knowledge of it, as a teacher I know I can only explain to a child what something is, I can’t promote or encourage it.

Coming from Scotland and going to Catholic Schools, not being taught about same sex marriage, contraception and abortion did not harm me in any way. I did not need to have it a point of my education, Catholicism teaches us that all three go against the teachings of The Church. that’s all we need to know!

 

[Coatimundi]

Also, notice how it said Catholic schools----not Muslim ones.

There are no state-funded Muslim schools in Scotland.
scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Education/Schools/FAQs

As others have mentioned, the proposed regulations can be avoided by attending a privately funded school.

 

[Viewer]

Coming from Scotland and going to Catholic Schools, not being taught about same sex marriage, contraception and abortion did not harm me in any way. I did not need to have it a point of my education, Catholicism teaches us that all three go against the teachings of The Church. that’s all we need to know!

I see. But may I put it this way Nordar? I don’t know how old you are, but it’s only in the past 10-15 years SSM has really become a frontline issue within the UK. Abortion remains a dark subject while marriage…Well, I don’t think that’s been taken as seriously as it should be for centuries.

Eitherway. I can only go by what I have seen, my daughters know perfectly well that they are forbidden to endorse or take part in SSM or abortions but they will encounter daily people who do. And these individuals will view my children as bigots, and try to convert them to another line of thought.

It’s not enough to know something is “bad” now, they need to know what it is, and how to justify their obligations to the rest of the world.

“Because God said so” stopped working as a reason round about the time of the reformation. Fairly or non children are having to become apologists, and knowing the nature of something is crucial to dissecting it with logic.

 

[SuperLuigi]

=(name removed by moderator);11611939]
Why shoud we support hate mongering regarding either Catholics or Muslims?

There’s a different perception in the UK of offending Muslims vs. offending Catholics. :yup: The days of the IRA are history, and my understanding their beef with the UK was Irish nationalism, not purist religious principle.

So, offending Catholics is safe and doesn’t threaten European progressive power as much as say tolerating offending Islam would.

Being Muslim in the UK basically means you can rule the day without much social opposition. Sure, there’s commentators like Pat Condell and Douglas Murray, but really, those in power falter and listen whenever the Muslim Council of Britain complains.

Robert Spencer and Savage are largely dealing with American concerns and most people in the UK would not know who they were or care less.

Really? that’s a legitimate reasons for banning someone into the country? Because people might not “care”?

Do the British really consider themselves to be a free people?

First of all, unless you have some shocking evidence I don’t know about, Robert Spencer is an academic who has not said anything anywhere close to being “hatred”. The problem is anything that too many among the Western left doesn’t think is cool or hip or politically correct or in agreement with their agenda is “hate”.

He is banned undoubtedly because of his affiliation with the jihadwatch website.

Savage is a successful radio host who doesn’t pull punches, but while he has been critical of Islam, I haven’t heard him say anything vile, like radical European Muslims say about the countries they live in or some of the American left’s comments on conservative women and minor children of prominent GOP candidates.

But I guess if you tow the progressive line, it doesn’t matter. Free passes for all!

Scotland may well end up independent in a few years and if that is the case those likely to be in power are not overly fond of some of the social outlooks of the Church. They would be more likely to enforce such rulings than is the case at the present time.

Having lived in Scotland for a time, I’m not sure how I feel about them going solo. I’d have to look into it, but I hope it doesn’t become an excuse to turn the place into a Scandinavian socialist state on steroids, because then they’ll bleed business abroad, mostly likely to Ireland or England.

 

[RC_Sojourner]

I see. But may I put it this way Nordar? I don’t know how old you are, but it’s only in the past 10-15 years SSM has really become a frontline issue within the UK. Abortion remains a dark subject while marriage…Well, I don’t think that’s been taken as seriously as it should be for centuries.

Eitherway. I can only go by what I have seen, my daughters know perfectly well that they are forbidden to endorse or take part in SSM or abortions but they will encounter daily people who do. And these individuals will view my children as bigots, and try to convert them to another line of thought.

It’s not enough to know something is “bad” now, they need to know what it is, and how to justify their obligations to the rest of the world.

“Because God said so” stopped working as a reason round about the time of the reformation. Fairly or non children are having to become apologists, and knowing the nature of something is crucial to dissecting it with logic.

Roma Locuta, Causa Finita!

and also… "We should always be prepared so as never to err to believe that what I see as white is black, if the hierarchic Church defines it thus. "- St. Ignatius of Loyola.

I agree with Nordar.

Sure, being educated and being apologists is great. But, the Catholic Church survived centuries with the vast majority of its members being completely illiterate. The point being, would it kill us to have some obedient Catholics who don’t have to also be apologists?

Let me put it a different way, as well: You don’t have to be educated to be Holy. Look at St. John Vianney.

Also, why will your daughters encounter people who think they’re bigots on a daily basis? Just wondering… I know I certainly don’t “encounter” these people, sometimes for months at a time…
What do you mean by “encounter”? If you mean walk past them in a street… well you hardly need to be an apologist for that. I merely pray Hail Mary’s in that case.

If you mean defend the doctrine of the Church… well, how often are your daughters forced to do that?

I don’t mean to be contrarian. But, I firmly believe that Catholics have to stop obsessing about “defending doctrine”. How many times in the past month have any of us defended doctrine and used apologetics? How many times in the past month could we have instead simply behaved in a Holy way towards someone?

That’s my point. Holiness > Apologetics.

The two are not mutually exclusive, I admit. But, I think we should focus on Holiness, and not apologetics.

 

[Nordar]

How old I am is immaterial, as is the fact that all that this has been a forefront issue in the UK for only 10-15 years. Apologetics is

 

[Nordar]

I see. But may I put it this way Nordar? I don’t know how old you are, but it’s only in the past 10-15 years SSM has really become a frontline issue within the UK. Abortion remains a dark subject while marriage…Well, I don’t think that’s been taken as seriously as it should be for centuries.

Eitherway. I can only go by what I have seen, my daughters know perfectly well that they are forbidden to endorse or take part in SSM or abortions but they will encounter daily people who do. And these individuals will view my children as bigots, and try to convert them to another line of thought.

It’s not enough to know something is “bad” now, they need to know what it is, and how to justify their obligations to the rest of the world.

“Because God said so” stopped working as a reason round about the time of the reformation. Fairly or non children are having to become apologists, and knowing the nature of something is crucial to dissecting it with logic.

How old I am is immaterial, as is the fact that all this has been a forefront issue in the UK for only 10-15 years.

The main reason The Government wants these issues introduced into Catholic schools is to undermine The teachings of The Church. They want Abortion to be taught as a woman’s choice, Pro Life is not an option, the same as contraception is an ok choice, Gay marrige is AOK, Homosexuality is also AOK, Being that all the above are contradictory to Our religion it most definately should not be taught in school.

Because God said so is perfectly fine by me, Catholic school children through their Religious Education are taught about Jesus, the life of Jesus and the words and teachings of Jesus. They know that a baby is God’s will, that killing the baby in the womb, is a very grave sin, as is contraception. Homosexuality ( not the person but the act} is a grave sin. There is absolutely no reason why they should be taught differently. They know how bad it is they also know what it is. All they need to defend their beliefs, is taught to them through said religion, and knowing God said so.

 

[pnewton]

This is just a consideration, at this point. I find the title somewhat ridiculous. No secular government can force the Catholic Church do behave immorally. They can imprison Catholics, and have. They can execute Catholics, and have. They cannot force anyone into apostasy.