Scruples, Sin, and Such on CAF

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Wow. I’ve been seeing a lot of posts regarding scruples, mortal sin, and then those threads about sexual sins. It makes me wonder if something just isn’t being addressed in the Church.
I’ve dealt with scruples a bit and I know how hard it is. As a teen who was trying to find my way in my faith, it was hard because everything seemed to be bad in the world around me. That made me question my decisions in a way that was not healthy. Every little thing tore at me until I was so anxious about having fun.

However, scruples isn’t something I’ve heard much about in church. I think that in the churches I’ve gone to, theology and morals aren’t even gone near and people certainly don’t seem to know about the realities of sin and Hell. So perhaps if the equal balance of God’s Love and Mercy as well as the Judgement and 4 Last Things is not being preached, it presents a problem.
Those who do not know much about sin, especially as teens, fall into sin more blindly and then when they find out it’s bad and want to amend their ways, it’s harder and they can fall into scruples. Of course, already existing anxiety and OCD can cause it too.

Regarding the sexual sins that come up so often from mostly youth, I can vouch for the fact that in this over-sexualized world, Catholic youth are not being taught about the Church’s view on sex, virtue, love, etc. When I was in religious education, someone had asked about homosexuality and the teachers completely dodged the question. One section in my Confirmation program was about chastity and some of the questions that were in the book in front of us were avoided and not answered even though they were about masturbation, pre-marital sex, etc. That’s probably why there are so many questions.
People honestly don’t know and while I’m not condoning finding loopholes for that stuff, teens are curious and need real answers.

So, how can we fix this problem in the Church? Have you noticed or encountered it? Is it even a problem throughout the Church or just in personal lives?

I think that better religious ed. and parenting prep/advice/resources (from a Catholic point of view) would be good not only for the youth but for parents. I, from my own experience, know that parents are not always open to answering questions and some do not know how to answer questions. When I had questions, I went to the internet and got into big trouble, all because I didn’t reel comfortable talking to my parents regarding this stuff.
Perhaps more certified teachers for religious ed. who know their stuff and don’t want to shy away from questions that people are dealing with in their lives. This stuff isn’t even confessional worthy. Just simple questions that need answers.
 
In your opinion, what makes a teacher certified to teach religious education? Many parishes are happy with anyone who attends Keeping Children and Vulnerable People Safe and volunteers to teach.
 
I have a few thoughts on this,
  1. People need to trust their confessor.
  2. People need to educate themselves by doing research. There are so many more resources out there besides asking random people online. Catholic.com, Catholics come home, catholic radio, and books about any subject you want to explore.
    But most important prayer. I realize some people can’t help themselves and slip up and I pray for those people everyday, and I will continue to give them the same advice. We all should all pray for help with our sins.
 
That is true.
Maybe special instruction from the priest for all those who are going to do religious education. A program from the diocese that talks about more than just child abuse. (that stuff should be included but shouldn’t be the only thing that is covered for religious ed. teachers.
I feel like people who are educating others, especially youth, on the Faith should be tested to make sure they know the basics of their Faith as well as answers for commonly asked questions regarding whatever group they teach. Volunteers are great but if they don’t know their Faith, why should they be teaching?
 
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vallancec said:
I have a few thoughts on this,
  1. People need to trust their confessor.
  2. People need to educate themselves by doing research. There are so many more resources out there besides asking random people online. Catholic.com, Catholics come home, catholic radio, and books about any subject you want to explore.
    But most important prayer. I realize some people can’t help themselves and slip up and I pray for those people everyday, and I will continue to give them the same advice. We all should all pray for help with our sins.
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#1 is especially true. For everybody.
#2 is iffy for the scrupulous. Only recently, we’ve seen how “research” caused an inordinate amount of distress for one of the posters here who suffers from this affliction. Research on Moral Theology should not be conducted by the scrupulous by themselves. Apologetics and others, perhaps. The Catechism is, IMO, fairly safe for the scrupulous as well, as it does not delve into the nittygritty of moral theology.
 
As estimated 1 in 5 Americans suffers from some form of anxiety. That is 64 MILLION. Scruples, OCD, anxiety/health anxiety and other conditions all reside within that huge umbrella. Since it is perceived as far less risky to address problems to strangers who cannot betray your confidence, there is an expected uptick in such activity on the web. Why do we ask a stranger on the bus about personal problems? Safety. Anonymity.

From whence comes all of this anxiety? The mis-information age. The information glut. We can see horror, disaster, pathos, every cardinal sin there is 24/7/365 via the web or other media.

I don’t think that we were intended to be exposed to all of this on a daily basis. Saint Paul wrote that everything was lawful to him, but everything did not edify. Massive (name removed by moderator)ut with limited outlet creates doubt and fear which erodes our foundation of faith. Who would be behind that?

The Lord’s day is a good choice to “divorce” ourselves from this onslaught.
 
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My main concern here is that people who are scrupulous are not getting the answers they want or the help they need from CAF.
 
Since you have no direct control over that, simply offer prayer, as God well knows what they need, when and where.
 
vallancec said:
My main concern here is that people who are scrupulous are not getting the answers they want or the help they need from CAF.
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They are not, and they will not. CAF, or any public Internet forum consists of a whole spectrum of people, most of whom are not equipped to help the scrupulous. CAF is especially harmful for those whose scrupulosity is out of control, which is why a solid, firm answer of “get off the forums and talk to your confessor” is pretty much the standard answer for them.

But one problem I see with many of the scrupulous is hardheadedness. They keep coming back with variations of the same themes despite being told to trust only their confessor. As a result, their condition does not get better, and in fact, they can get worse.

One particularly hard-hit poster has stayed away from Communion, for example, because of an extreme case; his logic has become so twisted he has stayed away from the Lord in Communion even through he could have received him worthily. And he has ignored repeated advice to just trust a confessor. As a result, he is in terrible shape, and CAF has undoubtedly contributed to this state. And now, as a result, he is panicking that he can’t fulfill the Easter duty. Imagine the kind of torment that would cause the scrupulous! Had he only listened to the standard advice, he would likely be at peace.
 
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They are not and they can not. They should avoid this forum.

The proper place for them to seek answers is at their Parish, or from their Confessor. Here they will often get bad advice and conflicting opinions, some more informed than others.

It is like someone in legal trouble trying to get opinions on how to handle their case on the internet. They shouldn’t do that. they should talk to a lawyer.

If you have a problem with spirituality or with sin or an issue related to Catholicism, you should ask someone trained and experienced in the field—A Priest, a Deacon, a well prepared Catechist.
 
LiliesofMaria said:
So, how can we fix this problem in the Church? Have you noticed or encountered it? Is it even a problem throughout the Church or just in personal lives?
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I think the problem is multifaceted. Some parish Religious Ed programs are better than others. Some teachers feel more comfortable freely talking to teens about the issue and others do not.

Then you might have parents op-out of any kind of sex ed talk even in Rel. Ed. either because they want to be the primary teacher and aren’t sure what their kids are going to be told (worry about more liberal minded-teachers) and then you might have some cafeteria Catholic type parents who don’t agree with all the Church’s teachings on sexuality and prefer their kids aren’t taught about it.

Our secular culture makes this so difficult as well with sexuality bombarding the senses through social media, tv, billboards, magazine ads, immodest dress etc. Teens who are trying to navigate their own raging hormones, the cultural messages, Church teachings etc can become confused and torn between passions and conscience and therefore that sets them up with an internal struggle that can be quite painful and distressing.

Those who come here for advice may be looking for loopholes or justification for sin and other’s are having trouble discerning the nuances of moral culpability, force of habit, and specific situations that cause them to not have clarity. Combine that with human nature that would rather be told they don’t have to confess something rather than just working up the nerve to admit any wrong-doing and you will always see these types of questions. Most of them really do need to be brought to spiritual direction or to a priest but I think some are looking for the easier route of asking anonymously on the internet rather than ask such sensitive or embarrassing questions in person.

This problem isn’t going to lessen without the support of the wider culture. Catholics can teach the truth not only about sexuality but also by fostering opportunity and encouragement to have that real relationship with God especially in the Eucharist which will give strength to the interior disposition of individuals in avoiding sin and seeing things with more clarity. People have to desire to avoid sin because of their love for Christ rather than just struggle to follow rules because the Church says so.
 
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The thing that’s hard for the rest of us to remember is that they’re not just being “hardheaded” — their brains are lying to them and twisting everything around. Expecting them to recover through pure will is like expecting a paralyzed individual to get up and walk by an act of will.
 
Usagi said:
The thing that’s hard for the rest of us to remember is that they’re not just being “hardheaded” — their brains are lying to them and twisting everything around. Expecting them to recover through pure will is like expecting a paralyzed individual to get up and walk by an act of will.
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That’s right. However, it’s probably not unreasonable to assume they have some willpower to see a trusted confessor, just as someone with OCD probably has some willpower to see a doctor.

The hardheadedness becomes trouble when it prevents them from seeing the people who CAN help them, and instead they decide to take the easy route and come here.
 
I agree 1 is definitely true.

2 is more dubious. The scrupulous should be very careful doing their own research. Even if they do, they should make sure they truly understand what they have read…a lot of people misunderstand or don’t grasp the full meaning of Church teaching. Another problem is the language the Church uses. Sometimes certain words have very specific meanings in Church documents while they have multiple uses in regular English. A person has to be familiar with the way the Catholic Church talks.
 
If people are scrupulous I agree they should seek help and learn ways to help deal with it. If we are talking about a person who is not scrupulous reading about or researching your faith is something we can all do.
 
I would caution against looking at CAF as any kind of representative for the Church. These people of course exist in the Church, but Internet fora, especially popular ones, attract people with some very big problems, that are much less obvious for most people going about their day to day lives.
 
Canvas said:
I agree 1 is definitely true.

2 is more dubious. The scrupulous should be very careful doing their own research. Even if they do, they should make sure they truly understand what they have read…a lot of people misunderstand or don’t grasp the full meaning of Church teaching. Another problem is the language the Church uses. Sometimes certain words have very specific meanings in Church documents while they have multiple uses in regular English. A person has to be familiar with the way the Catholic Church talks.
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Case in point. I once “researched” in the old Catholic Encyclopedia about occasions of sin, and how in some cases, a refusal to remove a continuous, voluntary, proximate occasion of sin can be cause for the confessor to exercise his duty of withholding absolution. Without delving into details, I thought I was in that situation and I panicked.

However, rather than bringing it here, I asked a trusted confessor, and he explained that while it is true what the Encyclopedia said, it isn’t always what it seems. For example, you might think so, but a situation isn’t always continuous. It isn’t always voluntary. It isn’t even always proximate. Often, there are nuances that are not known to the layman. He just said something that effectively says, trust in God and rely on the power of prayer, such that if the situation is proximate, it may become remote.

The struggle remains, but I don’t worry about it anymore. I just trust that my absolutions as I fight this sin are all valid, and I don’t review my confessions, and keep my examinations of conscience short. That way, my scruples are under some sort of control.
 
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I’m not so much asking about CAF fixing the problems of those who seek answers here. I’m asking those on CAF what their opinion is for a fix in these problems in the greater population of the Church.
It seems like there has been a recent surge in not only the scruples but also the other topics I mentioned and I was asking CAF members if they thought there is a problem not being addressed by the Church.
 
I must be misunderstanding your question. I think the solution is appropriate psychological care for disturbed individuals, who are attracted to websites like this. Scrupulosity is a problem, but CAF magnifies it like crazy.

Like with many things, people have to actually be willing to seek help to get help. IME, the help is available for those who actually seek it.
 
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