Sedevacantist... serious or without any merit?

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litllulu said:
I think I was misunderstood here. I acknowleged that although this may be literal, not ever single passage is. Remember, that the Church teaches it is possible for Jews and other non-Christians to reach heaven. If we have the truth about Christ we must accept it. If you took this completely literally, one could argue that only Christians have the opportunity for heaven.
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St Jn 8:24…For if you believe not that I AM he, you shall die in your sin.
St Jn 10:30 I and the Father+ are One
St Jn 11:25 Jesus said to her: I AM the RESURRECTION and the life. He that believeth in me, although he be Dead, shall live…
St Jn 14:6 …I AM the way, and the truth, and the life. No Man Cometh to the Father+ but by ME.

So which of these to be taken literal and which are not. See, the problem is Jesus+ the Christ+ was God+, and as GOD+ he was clear. I do not think he was mistaken when he spoke nor did he want 10 people to interpret 10 different versions from one passage. It is precisely this logic that has caused 1000’s of versions of the bible with translations of a translation, of a translation of a translation …and hundreds of denominations within denominations within denominations…
If you or anyone else has a different interpretation of the above passages I would very much like to know what they are.

My point for thread was that if a pontiff denies Christ than one may be justified to hold an SV position. Think about it, if the head of your Church is in denial of what it is he is the head of, this is a Paradox or Oxymoronic.
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
St Jn 8:24…For if you believe not that I AM he, you shall die in your sin.
St Jn 10:30 I and the Father+ are One
St Jn 11:25 Jesus said to her: I AM the RESURRECTION and the life. He that believeth in me, although he be Dead, shall live…
St Jn 14:6 …I AM the way, and the truth, and the life. No Man Cometh to the Father+ but by ME.

So which of these to be taken literal and which are not. See, the problem is Jesus+ the Christ+ was God+, and as GOD+ he was clear. I do not think he was mistaken when he spoke nor did he want 10 people to interpret 10 different versions from one passage. It is precisely this logic that has caused 1000’s of versions of the bible with translations of a translation, of a translation of a translation …and hundreds of denominations within denominations within denominations…
If you or anyone else has a different interpretation of the above passages I would very much like to know what they are.
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The interpretation I believe is the one of the Magisterium. If you want to know what that is go look in a Chatecism!👍
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
Respect of the Islamic Faith and High Esteem for Muslim Belief. Indebted to the Qur’an. I do not think it is any clearer than that. Please try not to elude the question as it is crystal clear.
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Don’t worry; I wasn’t trying to elude the question.

No, a Catholic cannot respect the Islamic Faith, nor highly esteem Muslim belief, nor claim to be indebted to the Qur’an in the sense of regarding it as a true religion.

Now I have a question for you: what is heresy?

Maria
 
MTD said:
Don’t worry; I wasn’t trying to elude the question.

No, a Catholic cannot respect the Islamic Faith, nor highly esteem Muslim belief, nor claim to be indebted to the Qur’an in the sense of regarding it as a true religion.

Now I have a question for you: what is heresy?

Maria
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Opinion in contradiction to religious belief.
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
St Jn 8:24…For if you believe not that I AM he, you shall die in your sin.
St Jn 10:30 I and the Father+ are One
St Jn 11:25 Jesus said to her: I AM the RESURRECTION and the life. He that believeth in me, although he be Dead, shall live…
St Jn 14:6 …I AM the way, and the truth, and the life. No Man Cometh to the Father+ but by ME.

So which of these to be taken literal and which are not. See, the problem is Jesus+ the Christ+ was God+, and as GOD+ he was clear. I do not think he was mistaken when he spoke nor did he want 10 people to interpret 10 different versions from one passage. It is precisely this logic that has caused 1000’s of versions of the bible with translations of a translation, of a translation of a translation …and hundreds of denominations within denominations within denominations…
If you or anyone else has a different interpretation of the above passages I would very much like to know what they are.

My point for thread was that if a pontiff denies Christ than one may be justified to hold an SV position. Think about it, if the head of your Church is in denial of what it is he is the head of, this is a Paradox or Oxymoronic.
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No pontiff has denied Christ.
 
litllulu said:
The interpretation I believe is the one of the Magisterium. If you want to know what that is go look in a Chatecism!👍
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I hope you are referring to the Catechism of the Council of Trent. Otherwise I can see your dilemma.🤷
 
litllulu said:
I think that the True Traditionalists should take back the name! No wonder so many protestants think Catholics are crazy. I find this crazy myself. I did not realize there were so many differenct sects in the ONE Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.
I always thought TLM stood for Tridentine Latin Mass!
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Well, you know, at the risk of being regarded weird, I personally think the term traditionalist should be applied only the SSPX and sedevacantists, conservative to true traditionalists, and liberal to conservatives. Those we normally call liberals are really disobedient or unorthodox. If you think about it, conservative and liberal of themselves do not indicate truth or untruth, but yet that is what we use them to denote all the time. We call a Catholic who believes in contraception a liberal; in reality he is not liberal but unorthodox.
paramedicgirl said:
MTD, those two statements are inflammatory and seem to be designed to create friction between traditional Catholics and non traditional Catholics.
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I’m truly sorry that my statements came across as inflammatory and designed to create friction, paramedicgirl. I really didn’t mean them that way; I have a very unfortunate tendency to be unnecessarily blunt.

Maria
 
JKirkLVNV said:
I’ve seen your proofs. Those are NOT a denial of Christ. No pontiff has denied Christ.
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So do you participate in the distribution of the Qur’an and hold in high esteem and have great respect for, a belief that Denies Christ+ and Blasphemes the Holy Trinity+?

The apostate a fide abandons wholly the faith of Christ either by embracing Judaism, Islamism, Paganism, or simply by falling into naturalism and complete neglect of religion; the heretic always retains faith in Christ.(catholic encylclopedia)

Is this merit for SV?
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
So do you participate in the distribution of the Qur’an and hold in high esteem and have great respect for, a belief that Denies Christ+ and Blasphemes the Holy Trinity+?
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No, I don’t. But the pope did not deny Christ in saying that there was something in Islam to esteem (it IS a monotheistic religion, if nothing else).
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
So do you participate in the distribution of the Qur’an and hold in high esteem and have great respect for, a belief that Denies Christ+ and Blasphemes the Holy Trinity+?

Is this merit for SV?
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Who does this? Who participates in the distribution of the Qur’an?
 
paramedicgirl said:
MTD, those two statements are inflammatory and seem to be designed to create friction between traditional Catholics and non traditional Catholics.
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Medic,

You probably have many more NO’s who either don’t think much of the Pope because he’s German, (or Polish or whatever), or he’s there just for show (like the Queen of England). Which is worse?
 
JKirkLVNV said:
No, I don’t. But the pope did not deny Christ in saying that there was something in Islam to esteem (it IS a monotheistic religion, if nothing else).
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They certainly hold Mary in high regard. [Edited by Moderator] Anything that is good about them though is found in the One, True Church.
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
The pope benedict. It Includes the Bible and Qur’an in a volume set. I will get the reference for you if you like.
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Please do! And find references that say that he also distributes them. I am very curious what you will find.
As a sidenote: If he has the Qua’ran, it may be to better understand other religions, not to use it in place of the Bible.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
No, I don’t. But the pope did not deny Christ in saying that there was something in Islam to esteem (it IS a monotheistic religion, if nothing else).
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Well, you cannot Have a deep respect for Islamic Faith, hold in High Esteem Muslim religion, and say we are indebted to the Qur’an, (of which Deny The Most Holy trinity and The Christ), and not deny Christ as well.
 
ThereCanBeOnly1 said:
Well, you cannot Have a deep respect for Islamic Faith, hold in High Esteem Muslim religion, and say we are indebted to the Qur’an, (of which Deny The Most Holy trinity and The Christ), and not deny Christ as well.
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Do you believe there is a way for non-Christians to go to Heaven?
 
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