Seeking help for my problem

[truthlovingorthodox]

On another forum I blamed this site and the q and a non forum version of Catholic answers for not having many priests to contact anyway I didn’t get a reply to my question from the q and a site so I thought they are selective. I wanted to ask them if I should post something because I wanted to request from members of this site all the books they think I should read to consider Catholicism as one who is orthodox. I didn’t want to just ask because I thought I am using people and not helping them feel they need to strive for salvation .I concluded the Catholic Church is not interested in converts and so I don’t have to convert

I am the one who made this message on
orthodoxchristianity.net

http://forums.orthodoxchristianity.net/

I feel bad that it seems I disrespected your church though it was not my intention and I am a hypocrite going to catholic orthodox unity events and I feel I harmed people more. I thought you would still reach out to me but I fear you won’t and deservedly so if I harmed the members of your church. So I am asking you to still reach out to me and maybe provide books I can read. Or I ask only the ones suitable to answer. I want to reach out to you because I fear I deserve to be rejected from knowing your view of my behaviour which I may need to repent.

I do not believe Catholics who believe in certain heresies I believe are minor that does not stop people from being saved will not go to heaven. As far as I am aware Vatican 1 beliefs are fine with me
and they may think they are as orthodox but they can not see the difference
As long as one believes jesus is the only way to heaven and you have to fully repent now according to your ability to go to heaven I know they are fine. I think purgatory assumes confession of minor sin is not enough and they must go to purgatory

 

[SacredHeartBassist]

why don’t you call into catholic answers live if you want to be convinced that you’re wrong, because you are wrong.

also a simple google search will help you find books on why the RCC is right and why you aren’t.

 

[truthlovingorthodox]

Thanks I will consider it but I think I would stand a better chance from reading books

 

[pianistclare]

Better chance of what?
A person can find anything to support their views no matter they be true or false.

Talk to a priest in real life
There are at work in their parishes.
Wander in, Make an appointment.
Sit down and talk.

 

[Vico]

On another forum I blamed this site and the q and a non forum version of Catholic answers for not having many priests to contact anyway I didn’t get a reply to my question from the q and a site so I thought they are selective. I wanted to ask them if I should post something because I wanted to request from members of this site all the books they think I should read to consider Catholicism as one who is orthodox. I didn’t want to just ask because I thought I am using people and not helping them feel they need to strive for salvation .I concluded the Catholic Church is not interested in converts and so I don’t have to convert

I am the one who made this message on
orthodoxchristianity.net

OrthodoxChristianity.net

I feel bad that it seems I disrespected your church though it was not my intention and I am a hypocrite going to catholic orthodox unity events and I feel I harmed people more. I thought you would still reach out to me but I fear you won’t and deservedly so if I harmed the members of your church. So I am asking you to still reach out to me and maybe provide books I can read. Or I ask only the ones suitable to answer. I want to reach out to you because I fear I deserve to be rejected from knowing your view of my behaviour which I may need to repent.

I do not believe Catholics who believe in certain heresies I believe are minor that does not stop people from being saved will not go to heaven. As far as I am aware Vatican 1 beliefs are fine with me
and they may think they are as orthodox but they can not see the difference
As long as one believes jesus is the only way to heaven and you have to fully repent now according to your ability to go to heaven I know they are fine. I think purgatory assumes confession of minor sin is not enough and they must go to purgatory

The Profession of Faith is the Basis of Christianity. Jesus Christ said that we should be baptized and also continue in the Holy Spirit to the time of our death. For which purpose we have the seven sacraments. The Catholic Church teaches that is has the fullness of faith and that others without the fullness of the faith can also be saved. It is best to become Catholic (Latin if a reformation Christian or eastern Catholic if an Orthodox Christian). It is best to read the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

English:
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM

Various languages:
Italian, …
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc/index_it.htm

CNEWA (Eastern Catholic):

http://www.cnewa.org/default.aspx?ID=123&pagetypeID=9&sitecode=HQ&pageno=1

 

[NeedImprovement]

If I may just augment a little in relation to what Vico has posted : I have attended several Marriages and Baptisms in the Orthodox Church because I had been invited there by my Orthodox friends. I noticed something : The Nicene Creed which Greek Orthodox members profess is practically transparent to our version of the Nicene Creed.

It could perhaps be a good starting point for your Profession of Faith if you were to compare the CCC’s Nicene Creed to your own.

The Orthodox Church also enjoys apostolic succession and all seven sacraments.

That would seem like a good place to start . . . maybe building on those pillars as a foundation.

 

[Spyridon]

@truthlovingorthodox

I recommend you immediately stop frequenting that website. It is filled to the brim with hyperdox fundamentalists who are filled with venom and poison toward the Catholic Church.

For every 1 charitable, well reasoned, wise comment on that site, there are 10 which are filled with venom and malice.

 

[Annie]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjALegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw1Kc3rl0Wb9evdvOMngtFTr

You might want to read Jesus, Peter, and the Keys, linked above, which quotes people from many different strains strains of Christianity. I don’t know of that is fthe the sort of thing you are looking for.

 

[guanophore]

I blamed this site and the q and a non forum version of Catholic answers for not having many priests to contact

Although I can appreciate your frustration, this is a lay apostolate. You may be suffering from an unrealistic expectation.

I didn’t get a reply to my question from the q and a site so I thought they are selective.

This is definitely the case. Even when we had the “Ask an Apologist” section they only answered a select few of questions. Not all of those were answered by a priest, either.

I wanted to request from members of this site all the books they think I should read to consider Catholicism as one who is orthodox.

There are very few Catholics who understand Orthodoxy.

I didn’t want to just ask because I thought I am using people and not helping them feel they need to strive for salvation .

We are all here to give “Catholic Answers”, and as laypersons, we can share our own experiences and recommendations with you. We would not come here and share if we felt “used”.

I am not sure what it means to “feel they need to strive for salvation”. This seems like something contrary to Christianity (Pelagianism)?

I concluded the Catholic Church is not interested in converts and so I don’t have to convert

It seems like a rather drastic conclusion to make because you did not get what you expected from an internet forum, but you are right, you don’t have to convert, no matter how “interested” we might be.

But it is a grave mistake to assume that the Church takes any position based on what certain members may say and do. You would be much better served to accept what the Catholic Catechism has to say about converts from Orthodoxy.

I am a hypocrite going to catholic orthodox unity events and I feel I harmed people more.

I don’t see how this makes you a hypocrite. Despite your conflicting emotions, you seem to be clearly interested in exploration and dialogue.

I fear I deserve to be rejected from knowing your view of my behaviour

This is really an absurd idea. Did not Jesus die for us while we were yet sinners? Did He not teach us to forgive our brother 70 x 7? Thankfully, we none of us get what we “deserve” as His mercy is great.

 

[guanophore]

Catholics who believe in certain heresies

What might those be?

I think purgatory assumes confession of minor sin is not enough and they must go to purgatory

The truth is that we believe confession of sins does not always pardon us from their consequences. For example, if a teenager fornicates with her boyfriend and becomes pregnant, she may confess the sin, and be absolved, but she must still deal with the consequence, which is the pregnancy.

David confessed his sin of adultery and murder with Bathsheba, and God forgave him, but he still lost the child as a consequence. Sometimes these consequences are not satisfied in this life.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Yes. I recommend two books

1. The Bible
2. Catechism of the Catholic Church.

Both available free on line.

No you don’t have to convert.
You don’t have to do anything.

If you want to contact a priest, go make an appointment with the priest of your Parish

There is absolutely nothing wrong with Vatican 11.

 

[tweedlealice]

Dear Truthloving Orthodox,
Calm down. Your question may not have seemed clear. It looks like you are an Orthodox Catholic in the Eastern right?! Is this correct?? And you are studying FAITH issues under Roman tutelage comparing to ORTHODOXY.
Books: THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CATECHISM. It is all things Catholic.
Mother Angelica has a Book about questions for the Catholic. It explains where we get our Purgatory. I can’t recall the Mother Angelica books name. You could google her site and get phone number or leave a text asking for the name of the book. It taught about Purgatory. Maybe they would be able to help you.,
Please don’t feel that you are being rejected. God loves you and we love you. Via Condios.
In Christ’s Love
Tweedlealice

 

[truthlovingorthodox]

Thankyou for all your kind support. I hope to reply to a couple of replies and take the good recommendations.

 

[truthlovingorthodox]

That is true that is why jesus said My sheep hear My voice and will not follow a stranger. Paul says I trust we are in your conscience. Also Jesus said you have to seek truth to find it not lean on your own understanding. Jesus draws all to the truth when they feel they are a bit worried about the beliefs they have accepted and their conscience bears witness it may not be of God. We can be certain of some things in the faith but it is still a mystery perhaps as Paul says we see dimly in a mirror. We can be certain of certain truths but some doubts don’t mean it is wrong for Paul says we see in a mirror dimly but later we shall see perfectly. We should believe it by faith perfectly but not reason it perfectly. Not any church may be perfect so I may never be satisfied but I try to hear what all say to make a decision and I will be satisfied with my decision if it is true by faith

@Vico
Thankyou for your advice. I must try to consider catholicism if the fullness is important to me but maybe my yearning for answers is found in the orthodox church or maybe not. I am going to see which builds up my faith and is without fault in terms of promoting unity within truth. I may never find out because only some do and must settle for imperfection.

@Spyridon
Thankyou for your concern I try to be watchful not to also be infected with venom from those who have but many I find are good there and as st john chrysostom says no one can harm one who does not harm himself. I must serve them and as St Anthony says our life and death is with our brother. I try to win them from enemy. Jesus also said love your enemy. I am also not yet catholic.

@Annie
Thankyou very much for the recommendation of that book. It seems hopeful.

@guanophore
Thankyou very much for your care and guidance. I just want to know why you had opposition to the view that we must strive for salvation? I believe catholics believe you must strive to obtain grace also to walk in the way of salvation. Also as to the consequences of our sins it is normally to chastise us in this life so we repent and christ takes the rest of the penalty.

 

[truthlovingorthodox]

@Roseeurekacross
Thankyou very much for your kind response and advice and views. However my understanding of vatican 2 is that it teaches you can be saved without faith and obedience to christ which is against the words of the Lord who said I did not come to bring peace on earth but division because of the truth and righteousness so you must believe and follow Jesus now to be prepared to leave family if you must and talk about Him when the time is right as you practice christianity and John 3:16 says whoever believes will not perish but whoever does not believe will be condemned. You can’t believe in Jesus and another teacher at the same time. Also Jesus said unless you believe that I am He you shall die in your sins and romans which says if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead you will be saved. And whoever denies Me before Men I will deny before My Father who is in heaven.
It also is against the words of the Lord who said everyone who asks receives and he who seeks finds. Therefore there is no one invincibly ignorant among places where the gospel is spread atleast.
Should a non christian grow in Love to the Lord so it becomes easy to leave family and the one who looks like the demon is the family and not them for leaving? I do not know. Jesus may require to follow Him now anyway and trust Him as He said there is nothing covered that will not be revealed therefore they shall not go to hell if they are not deserving but they should fear losing their life by lack of trust and pity for people who God knows He will not send them to hell if they do not have their chance. It is a tough cost you have to leave everyone for christ in love towards God even if you were a sinner like them. You have to choose God over others. However Paul says try to live in peace with all men if you can as much as depends on you that is as far as you can.

@tweedlealice
Thankyou very much for your great kindness. However I am not catholic but I am orthodox seeking also peace between catholics and to be open to see if I unknowingly believe some wrong things.

 

[guanophore]

I just want to know why you had opposition to the view that we must strive for salvation? I believe catholics believe you must strive to obtain grace also to walk in the way of salvation.

We must strive, of course, but scripture is clear that we are saved by grace, through faith, not of works, lest any man should boast.

We are sealed in grace through baptism and confirmation, and the all the grace we need for salvation is already within us. We clear access to this through the sacrament of confession, and remain in that grace with Eucharist. The grace pours freely like a waterfall, and all we need to do is stand under the flow. God desires all to be saved, and come to the knowledge of the truth, and it is His good pleasure to give us the Kingdom.

As the Apostle enjoins us:

Philippians 2:12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.

There is a world of difference between working “on” and working “out”. Working out our salvation is working together with His grace that is already at work in us to will and to do His good pleasure.

Our striving is against the desires of the flesh, but even that battle we cannot win without His grace. But His yoke is easy, and His burden light, so when we are walking in grace, we know that the battle is not ours, but God’s.

 

[guanophore]

Also as to the consequences of our sins it is normally to chastise us in this life so we repent and christ takes the rest of the penalty.

If this is always true, then why did He not take the thief who repented from the cross? Why did He leave him to suffer the rest of the day, and have his legs broken?

 

[guanophore]

However my understanding of vatican 2 is that it teaches you can be saved without faith and obedience to christ which is against the words of the Lord

If this is what you think, then you misunderstood. There is no salvation outside of Christ, as there is no other name under heaven by which we may be saved. Persons who do not know Christ, but follow the light God has placed in their conscience follow Him without knowing who He is.

14 When Gentiles who have not the law do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus. Rom. 2

Therefore there is no one invincibly ignorant among places where the gospel is spread atleast.

You might be surprised!

people who God knows He will not send them to hell if they do not have their chance.

This is what Vat. 2 is saying. Each person is judged in the light of what has been revealed to them.

I am …seeking…to be open to see if I unknowingly believe some wrong things.

God bless you for your efforts. This attitude in all of us is what will foster unity the most. Jesus is grieved at the separations in His Body.

 

[truthlovingorthodox]

@guanophore

Thankyou for your reply and care. I can understand where vatican 2 comes from and I have sympathised with it but it seems wrong and we can not continue in ignorance. Those who are ignorant are not saved but given less punishment.

I don’t think there is a place on earth where people have no access to the gospel.

In the past the gentiles were not the chosen people so they did not have to follow judaism. But now in the new testament the gospel is preached to every creature under heaven. Those who seek find. But Jesus means just before the end the gospel will be a strong witness to all the nations. But now it is just available to all. God will make someone know the truth in His own way to each person. He sent phillip to the ethiopian eunuch and st thomas aquinas says God will send someone to anyone seeking. People won’t find Jesus if they are happy with the darkness they have inherited from their religion and society. If they like to be ignorant.

So all can find Jesus if you want to say but it is more difficult and not fair that is up to God to decide and God sees the truth and judges correctly not for us to judge for Him

Acts 4:12
Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

John 3:3
Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

John 14:6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Jesus said the harvest is plentiful but the laborers are few. Though all can enter it is more difficult without laborers.

 

[guanophore]

Thankyou for your reply and care. I can understand where vatican 2 comes from and I have sympathised with it but it seems wrong and we can not continue in ignorance.

What is it you think is “wrong”? Do you think that God should not be allowed to save whoever He wants, however He likes? I agree we must not continue in ignorance, but people were being saved by God long before Jesus came to earth. He has always saved humans by grace, through faith. We are not in a position to limit what He wants to do, are we?

Those who are ignorant are not saved but given less punishment.

I don’t think that any of us is in a position to determine the state of any soul, including our own! Only God knows the heart, and whether that heart truly seeks Him, whether they know His name, or not. I do not mean that we should not vigorously evangelize, as the opportunity for salvation is much greater when one can come into the grace by which we have been saved revealed through His Holy Bride, the Church.

I don’t think there is a place on earth where people have no access to the gospel.

You seem to be limited in your experience of the world.

In the past the gentiles were not the chosen people so they did not have to follow judaism. But now in the new testament the gospel is preached to every creature under heaven. Those who seek find. But Jesus means just before the end the gospel will be a strong witness to all the nations. But now it is just available to all.

I strongly encourage that every Christian share the gospel with every person they meet. However, you must be very sheltered if you think every person has encountered the Gospel. Even those that have do not always realize or understand it.

God will make someone know the truth in His own way to each person.

This is all Vat. 2 is saying.

He sent phillip to the ethiopian eunuch and st thomas aquinas says God will send someone to anyone seeking.

Yes. The best thing we can do is be as open as Phillip, so that God can send us to anyone who is seeking!