Servants of the Holy Family

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I do not mean to sound rude if i do.
But what do you mean you are part of a religious community? And in what way? And pardon my disagreement, but you think i am really going to believe that the Pope himself can not override a Bishop?? In my eyes that is herrasy, and i am sure without a doubt that His Holiness CAN get involved with whatever area he wishes. He is the POPE. The ONLY ones above Him are the Heavenly beings under God and God ((Father Son and Holy Spirit)) Himself. NOT a Bishop, legally or no.
I am certain that with my Lord’s Graces, His Holiness and/or the Cardinal of Bishops WILL intervene.
I can not believe you, a Catholic, would deny His Holiness’ Authority.
I am not denying the authority of the pope in any way. In fact, our entire religious family is very faithful to the Holy Father. But that’s not the point. The point is that relations between religious and bishops work through the practice of subsidiarity. The pope does not involve himself in the local affairs of a bishop and the communities in his diocese. That’s why canon laws are written the way that they are, to allow the bishop and the major religious superiors to work things out themselves.

As I posted before, I explained the different status of religious, pontifical and other. I also posted the rights and duties of the bishop regarding religious, as well as his limits.

You did not see me taking sides, so why attack me? If you want to know more about the activity of the pope within religious communities, walk up to a religious superior and ask him or her how it works. They will explain it more clearly than I can; because face to face you can ask more questions.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
, so why attack me?
who’s attacking you JR? where are they? why, I’ll give 'em what-for, I will!!!:p:p:p

(I don’t think GC meant his questions as an attack on you JR. It’s difficult to attack you, even when someone disagrees with you–you’re just so darn, well, nice!!!~!!! and I mean that sincerely. )

JR, do you wear a Habit? Could you describe it for us, if you do? (My mental image of you is definitely one in which you are Habited, knotted Rosary cinching in the waist!)
 
Good grief.

Schismatic this, schismatic that. Yada Yada Yada.

Look at this…
rickross.com/reference/general/general692.html

Ok, I’m reading along, and come to this…

Well, Ok. Not a good idea I suppose, but what of the Bishops who deny the faithful a right to the TLM via the SP ? Are they in full communion with the pope ?

How about the Bishops who lashed out publicly at H.H. BXVI after he lifted the excommunications of the SSPX Bishops ? Or the ones that banded together as a group and called for our Holy Father to step down ? How about the Cardinal who said that the most precious treasure of Holy Mother Church, the TLM, “does not instill he Spirit of Christ in those who attend it” ? And said the Tridentine Mass was invented for those who couldn’t make the transition to the Novus Ordo Missae ? Who also consecrated the Precious Blood in a glass chalice ? Who also used 3 or 4 flavors of Kool Aid in place of wine ? Who also, via his spokesman, denied the indelible mark of Baptism when speaking of Mel Gibson ?

What label can we use to describe them ? Schismatics, Dissidents, Renegades ?

What category do THEY fall under ?

Sorry, I’ll cover the back of a “schismatic” priest fighting for Tradition rather than accept a disobedient dissident, or in two of the examples above, heretic, as being in full communion with the Bishop of Rome.

Tradition trumps all. The saddest day in church history was the day Pope Paul VI discarded the Tiara in the spirit of the “c” word.

Tradition ? Modernism ? Rationalism ?

It’s a no brainer to a Catholic.
Actually, Obedience is listed as one of the Three Evangelical Counsels. The other two are Voluntary Charity and Chastity.

I’ve just looked back at a couple of sources I have here, and nowhere do I find obedience listed under precepts or the various groups of virtues.

I do see that one of The Nine Ways Of Being Accessory To Another’s Sin, and actually the first listed, as “By Counsel”. Another is “By Silence”.

I do refer to Saints when trying to sort out things.

One of the Twelve Fruits Of The Holy Ghost is Patience. This can be applied to support your stand on the issue. And the point you made about Christ being obedient unto death is one of my favorite things I’ve embraced from the writings of St Alphonsus. I can’t recall the exact quote, but it’s there in the context you speak of.

Thing is JR, the situation we find ourselves in today is unprecedented. After the French Revolution, our popes saw this coming. Sure the Church has been fighting errors and so forth throughout Her history, but today, the laity is involved in the division.

If a priest says or does something contrary to Church teaching, there is a good chance it will wind up on the internet. And as long as there are catholic forums, folks are going to take a stand on the internet. In the past, before VII, the Hierarchy dealt with these matters. But the internet and media throw it all in our laps.

Trads won’t shut up about it. How can they, when they have all of those quotes they like to post to support their defense of Tradition ? We even have clergy in the Vatican the share the same concerns. We have, again, the The Nine Ways Of Being Accessory To Another’s Sin to cinsider.

We probably should shut up about it and let the Holy See sort things out. Cardinal Hoyos was fairly blunt about this when speaking of what he has seen on these forums. But, like I mentioned, we have Bishops attacking our Holy Father publicly.

We didn’t ask for this crisis, but the media is going to make sure it’s shoved in our face day in and day out.
I don’t know anything about the Servants of the Holy Family, but I do know this: great posts, I Believe!!!
 
I’ve just been skimming this. but …

With the Motu Proprio, a bishop cannot now force any priest to say an O.F or TLM against his wishes.
 
I’ve just been skimming this. but …

With the Motu Proprio, a bishop cannot now force any priest to say an O.F or TLM against his wishes.
Only secular priests, Layman. The Motu Proprio says that clerics in religious institutes must follow the norms of their institute.

There is something that the MP does not go into. Actually, there is much that the MP does not go into.
  1. There are religious of Diocesan Right. These religious communities must obey the local bishops even in internal matters. They are not what is called “exempt religious”.
  2. There are priests who belong to Secular Institutes, such as Maryknoll, Vicentians, Piarists, Opus Dei, Secular Franciscans, Secular Dominicans, Secular Carmelites. These priests must follow the rules set down by the local bishop.
  3. There is also one more exception regarding priests who belong to religious orders of Pontifical Right. The bishop cannot mandate that they celebrate the EF on their property. But he can mandate it on his property. If a religious order of Pontifical Right or a religious congregation of Pontifical Right runs a ministry for the bishop, sucha as a parish, they must follow the bishop’s rules, but only in the parish, not in their chapel, their school, college, hospital or any other institution that is not the property of the diocese.
To cover all of this thoroughly, the Motu Proprio would have had to go into an entire discourse on Religious Canon Law and that would have been a distraction. That is why it simply says, “according to their norms”. Every priest who is a religious kows the norms of his community.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
who’s attacking you JR? where are they? why, I’ll give 'em what-for, I will!!!:p:p:p

(I don’t think GC meant his questions as an attack on you JR. It’s difficult to attack you, even when someone disagrees with you–you’re just so darn, well, nice!!!~!!! and I mean that sincerely. )
Thank you. I think very highly of you too. I was reading the line that asks how as a Catholic I would question the authority of the pope and I was taken aback by that. I guess I failed to make it clear that I was simply explaining two points: canon law regarding the authority of the bishop and the custom regarding the pope’s personal involvement in the affairs between bishops and religious in their dioceses. They just do not get involved at that level.

If we look at an example such as the Legionaries of Christ (I think I got the name correct). The Holy See did not get involved until the community was involved in an international scandal. Even there, there is a team being sent to visit them and looking into the situation. The Holy Father himself does not get involved.

Usually one of two Congregations deal with issues between bishops and religious, if the bishops and religious cannot reconcile. It is usually either the Congregation for the Faith or the Congregation for Instittutes of Consecrated Life and Apostolic Societies. That’s one of their many jobs. We have not seen a pope involve himself in the internal affairs of a diocese or a religious commuinity in a very long time, other than to transfer a bishop.
JR, do you wear a Habit? Could you describe it for us, if you do? (My mental image of you is definitely one in which you are Habited, knotted Rosary cinching in the waist!)
Our habit is grey, with a white chord. It is the same habit that is worn by the Franciscans of the Renewal and the Franciscan Brothers of Peace. In warmer climates, we wear a tunic shirt down to the thighs, with grey slacks. The tunic shirt has a capuche, just like the long habit does.
The way that you tell us apart from the CFRs is because they wear a rosary and we do not. We wear a wooden Tau, which is the coat of arms of the Franciscan Order. It’s a very simple habit.

We also have a scapular, but that is only worn for liturgy and other formal situations, because it is very difficult to work with it on. It is also very dangerous for those of us who work with the disabled.

And yes, I do wear it all the time, on buses, trains, planes, cars, go carts, horses, bikes, and pony express. The only time that I wear the tunic shirt is for doing manual labor or when I go visit you people in FL in the summer. The last time I was there in a full habit I thought I was having a stroke. It turned out to be heat stroke, not the real thing. Thank God. 😃

You people need to turn down the heat in South FL.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Our habit is grey, with a white chord. It is the same habit that is worn by the Franciscans of the Renewal and the Franciscan Brothers of Peace. In warmer climates, we wear a tunic shirt down to the thighs, with grey slacks. The tunic shirt has a capuche, just like the long habit does.
The way that you tell us apart from the CFRs is because they wear a rosary and we do not. We wear a wooden Tau, which is the coat of arms of the Franciscan Order. It’s a very simple habit.

We also have a scapular, but that is only worn for liturgy and other formal situations, because it is very difficult to work with it on. It is also very dangerous for those of us who work with the disabled.

And yes, I do wear it all the time, on buses, trains, planes, cars, go carts, horses, bikes, and pony express. The only time that I wear the tunic shirt is for doing manual labor…
Our Priests wear their Cassocks all the time also. And because many many of them travel hundreds if not a thousand miles in a weekend to celebrate the Holy Mass for us, we are treated to some pretty funny stories about different reactions they get, or conversations they get into in airports or on the planes.
… or when I go visit you people in FL in the summer. The last time I was there in a full habit I thought I was having a stroke. It turned out to be heat stroke, not the real thing. Thank God. 😃
You people need to turn down the heat in South FL.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, OSF 🙂
I thought the Religious Life wasn’t for weaklings and cry-babies? I guess I was wrong. Toughen up, set an example–sacrifice it all, man! (:p:p:p) (I’m just paying you back for that series of pm’s we had last week…that, and I didn’t have a glass of water to lob your way!!!) But the heat is a constant reminder of how uncomfortable an eternity of hell-fire would be.
 
Our Priests wear their Cassocks all the time also. And because many many of them travel hundreds if not a thousand miles in a weekend to celebrate the Holy Mass for us, we are treated to some pretty funny stories about different reactions they get, or conversations they get into in airports or on the planes.

I thought the Religious Life wasn’t for weaklings and cry-babies? I guess I was wrong. Toughen up, set an example–sacrifice it all, man! (:p:p:p) (I’m just paying you back for that series of pm’s we had last week…that, and I didn’t have a glass of water to lob your way!!!) But the heat is a constant reminder of how uncomfortable an eternity of hell-fire would be.
Is that why so many people retire to Florida, my parents included . . . to work on a last minute conversion? 😃

I can tough out a lot of things, trust me. I was in the Amazon for several years as a missionary. But your heat and humidity has been my greatest challenge.

However, I am in habit in that heat. I just wear a modified version. You’ll see it when I come and you’ll like it. It’s very austere and very . . . what’s the word I’m looking for . . . attractive, but in the sense that it attracts attention. People often ask me about it. Just imagine Fr. Groeschel with his habit cut just below his hips. That’s what the tunic shirt looks like. Everything else is the same.

Anyway, I like our habit. It’s simple and it’s sloppy. I could not be a secular priest. The cassock has to be prestine, almost military clean and pressed. The grey Franciscan habit is like a bathrobe. Throw it onver your head and keep going. :eek:

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Is that why so many people retire to Florida, my parents included . . . to work on a last minute conversion? 😃

I can tough out a lot of things, trust me. I was in the Amazon for several years as a missionary. But your heat and humidity has been my greatest challenge.

However, I am in habit in that heat. I just wear a modified version. You’ll see it when I come and you’ll like it. It’s very austere and very . . . what’s the word I’m looking for . . . attractive, but in the sense that it attracts attention. People often ask me about it. Just imagine Fr. Groeschel with his habit cut just below his hips. That’s what the tunic shirt looks like. Everything else is the same.

Anyway, I like our habit. It’s simple and it’s sloppy. I could not be a secular priest. The cassock has to be prestine, almost military clean and pressed. The grey Franciscan habit is like a bathrobe. Throw it onver your head and keep going. :eek:

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
Are you a Priest or a Brother, JR? And is “onver” a new word, or are you from NY? djeet jet?

(and for future reference, I can do without the mental image of Fr. Groeschel with his habit cut just below his hips, thank you very much!:eek::eek::D)
 
Are you a Priest or a Brother, JR? And is “onver” a new word, or are you from NY? djeet jet?

(and for future reference, I can do without the mental image of Fr. Groeschel with his habit cut just below his hips, thank you very much!:eek::eek::D)
I’m a theology professor. I’m not ordained. We have ordained brothers. All of us use the title Brother. The only time we use Father is when speaking to a non Franciscan priest or when speaking about St. Francis of Assisi. He is always called Father Francis, though he was not a priest. The laity tends to call our ordained brothers, Father. You’ll find that Franciscans don’t really like it, but we live with it. We understand that the laity does not always know the difference between a diocesan priest and a friar or a monk. Among ourselves, friars use either Br. or Fra. (Frater).

“onver” is not a new word, just lousy typing. LOL Actually, I’m a plain little boy from Virginia. I was stationed in NY for three years and visited afterward, several times. We had part of our formation in NY, but not in the city.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I’m a theology professor. I’m not ordained. We have ordained brothers. All of us use the title Brother. The only time we use Father is when speaking to a non Franciscan priest or when speaking about St. Francis of Assisi. He is always called Father Francis, though he was not a priest. The laity tends to call our ordained brothers, Father. You’ll find that Franciscans don’t really like it, but we live with it. We understand that the laity does not always know the difference between a diocesan priest and a friar or a monk. Among ourselves, friars use either Br. or Fra. (Frater).

“onver” is not a new word, just lousy typing. LOL Actually, I’m a plain little boy from Virginia. I was stationed in NY for three years and visited afterward, several times. We had part of our formation in NY, but not in the city.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
hadn’t pictured you with a southern drawl…where in NY were you (let’s see if I get this right?) “in the novitiate?”
 
hadn’t pictured you with a southern drawl…where in NY were you (let’s see if I get this right?) “in the novitiate?”
Nope. 😃 After novitiate went to St. Bonaventure’s to study philosophy and mathematics for three years. Had done one year of colleger as a postulant prior to entering novitiate.

JR 🙂
 
Yeeeah… off subject now.
Anyway, i havenever been one to verbally oppose a religious, nor go against a bishop, and i do appo;ogize if it seemed as though i were attacking you. but i will not let people freely bash the Servants. not a religious, not a priest, not a bishop. They don’t deserve it and they have my vocation. i will stand up for them. Give me proof of their wrong doing, whatver it is, and i shall “recant”.
 
This group is clearly not an Institute of “Pontifical Right” and apparently, according to what the local bishop said (and he should know), it is not of “diocesan right” either. Which means that the local Ordinary has the final say. The matter could, I suppose, be appealed to Rome, but so far there’s no evidence that it has been. Absent “Pontifical Right” and absent an appeal, while the group may be appealing to some, it does not appear to be recognized by the Church.
 
I do not know this group, so it would be uncharitable and unfair on my part to say that they are wrong or they are heretics or call them any other name. It is uncharitable to call anyone a name, period.

That being said, there are very specific ways that a priest can have a place in the Church. This is found in canon law. He must be in one of these situations:
  1. Incardinated into a diocese as a secular priest
  2. A professed religious in a religious community that is publicly accepted by either the local bishop or the Sacred Congregation for Religious Institutes and Societies of Apostolic Life.
  3. A professed religious in a religious community of diocesan right where the bishop is the major superior
  4. A secular priest in a secular institute or a member of one of the approved secular orders
  5. A priest beloging to a priestly fraternity that is approved by Rome, such as the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter
  6. A priest who is a member of a prelature, such as Opus Dei
  7. A priest who is a member of any of the above, while serving the Church outside of his jurisdiction with the permission of the Holy See AND the local bishop where he is serving
Any priest who is not in one of these situations is not in communion with the Church, even if he does good. While the good that he does cannot be denied, the Church will not acknoledge the validity of certain sacraments: marriage and absolution. All other sacraments that such a priest celebrates are valid, but illicit (illegal). Therefore the priest who celebrates them and those who knowingly receive them are in a state of disobedience, except in cases where there is reason to believe that the person is in danger of immediate death and cannot wait for another priest.

We go back to the same question. Which of the above situations apply to the Servants of the Holy Family?

I have read that they are a congregation. But I have not read from where they get their communion, the bishop or the Congregation for Religious? They do not say in their literature. In addition, I have heard that the founder of the congregation celebrates mass in a private chapel belonging either to him or to the congregation.

It is Church law that religious may have private chapels and that bishops may not interfere in the celebration of the sacraments in those chapels. However, the permission of the local bishop is needed before the religious open a house in any diocese. Once the house is open, it is outside of the jurisdiction of the bishop. In addition, religious cannot regularly hear the confessions of the laity without permission from an Ordinary. Their Ordinary must be the local bishop or their Provincial Superior who is canonically elected and approved by the hierarchy. You cannot celebrate marriages in private chapels. Marriages must be celebrated in a parish church, unless there is grave reason to do otherwise. In that case, only the bishop can authorize it.

On the other hand, the laity is still under the jurisdiction of the bishop, even though the religious may not be, because they are of Pontifical Right. Therefore, the bishop can, for no reason at all, forbid the laity’s attendance at mass at the chapel of the religious. He continues to have full authority over the laity in his diocese.

This is not usually done, unless the bishop feels that the religious are not in communion with him. Because if the religious are not in communion with the bishop, they cannot be in communion with the pope. Communion with the pope comes through the local bishop. It’s a chain with links on it.

I’ll give you an example. My community runs Respect Life Ministry. We do not get funds from the local diocese. We run it out of our friary. However, we had to get the bishop’s permission in writing, to move into his diocese and we had to explain why we wanted to move into his diocese. He had to approve the move and the ministry. Because we use lay people and we serve lay people who come under his jurisdiction, we have to follow his rules regarding anything that we do with the laity. We can do whatever we want in our house and our chapel. We can sing Kumbaya all day and night and he cannot intervene. The moment we come into contact with a lay person under his jurisdiction, obedience requires that we follow his rules of engagement.

It sounds, from an article that I found on the Internet, that the problem is that the bishop feels that the Servants of the Holy Family do not follow his rules of engagement.

There is nothing to appeal to the Pope if the Servants are not in one of the categories that I mentioned above. Also, as I said before, the last time that the Holy Father became directly involved in a matter between a bishop and a religious community was so long ago that no one remembers. We would have to look for it in a history book. The popes have surrendered this authority to the bishops, under canon laws regarding religious and dioceses.

The pope can stretch over the bishop’s head. Will he do so? I don’t know. Not knowing the canonical status of the Servants, it’s impossible to say if he’ll even be interested. Again, usually he sends these cases off to the Congregation for Religious or the Congregation for the Faith. Pope Benedict has already told religious that he will not become involved in their relations with the bishops, that it is not his job. He continues to tell religious to remember the principle of subsidiarity and the importance of reason and faith working together to solve a problem.

Even the case of the SSPX was handed over to the Congregation of the Faith and to Archbishop Levada. The SSPX will not have direct access to the Holy Father. I don’t think that the Servants will either, considering that their impact is much smaller than the SSPX. This last statement is just my thoughts.

Again, what is the canonical status of the Servants?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I do not know this group, so it would be uncharitable and unfair on my part to say that they are wrong or they are heretics or call them any other name. It is uncharitable to call anyone a name, period. …
Again, what is the canonical status of the Servants?
Here we go again. All of what you said is true, and as with the last go-round, I neither said, no even intimated, that it wasn’t.

I’m not at all sure what you find so uncharitable: what I have been able to find about this group says nothing beyond their “founding” and even their own website is skant in details other than to cite a small handful of now-deceast bishops who they claim supported them. Even if the claim of support from those bishops is true, it has no bearing on their status in the place they are located, since none of the bishops mentioned was ever the local Ordinary there. Further, there is no mention whatsoever of PP Benedict XVI, nor of the local Ordinary. Taken altogether, and absent anything substantive to the contrary, I can only repeat that the group does not appear to be recognized by the Church. If you can find any reference to the canonical status of the group in question which negates that, please, by all means post it.
 
Here we go again. All of what you said is true, and as with the last go-round, I neither said, no even intimated, that it wasn’t.

I’m not at all sure what you find so uncharitable: what I have been able to find about this group says nothing beyond their “founding” and even their own website is skant in details other than to cite a small handful of now-deceast bishops who they claim supported them. Even if the claim of support from those bishops is true, it has no bearing on their status in the place they are located, since none of the bishops mentioned was ever the local Ordinary there. Further, there is no mention whatsoever of PP Benedict XVI, nor of the local Ordinary. Taken altogether, and absent anything substantive to the contrary, I can only repeat that the group does not appear to be recognized by the Church. If you can find any reference to the canonical status of the group in question which negates that, please, by all means post it.
I’m not debating you. I was asking if anyone has found anything. I too have searched and can’t find anything that suggests that they are in communion with the Catholic Church.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Alas, Brother JR, i am humbled.
I was going to send this privately, but what is the point of striving for sainthood if i can not accept my imperfections and faults. Many saints say to bost of one’s faults. Scripture itself says this.
Anyway, i need to say that i can not go on going against the Bishop. I hate it with everything i am. The LAST thing i want is to go against the Church and it’s leaders. And plus, when i read that you are a religious, it obliterated my pride. I had never wanted to harshly speak to a religious. Never in eternity had i wanted that. And, i am taking steps on avoiding the Servants. If i am to be a good Catholic, i must practice obedience. As far as His Holiness is involved, i hope he never even opens my e-mail. Or even sees it.
I wrote to the Vicar general of Colorado in thanks to him for his help, since i could not contact His Exellency, Bishop Sheridan.
As for you, Brother, i want to demolish my pride by posting this appology publicly. Not privately by PMs.
I appologize greatly for saying aggresive replies to you. And i ask your forgiveness, but only if you have it to forgive me fully. I don’t deserve it, but i ask for it.
Now that that is requested, i would like to speak to you about other things. I would like seeing a PM from you if you have the time.
Thank you, Brother.
 
Alas, Brother JR, i am humbled.
I was going to send this privately, but what is the point of striving for sainthood if i can not accept my imperfections and faults. Many saints say to bost of one’s faults. Scripture itself says this.
Anyway, i need to say that i can not go on going against the Bishop. I hate it with everything i am. The LAST thing i want is to go against the Church and it’s leaders. And plus, when i read that you are a religious, it obliterated my pride. I had never wanted to harshly speak to a religious. Never in eternity had i wanted that. And, i am taking steps on avoiding the Servants. If i am to be a good Catholic, i must practice obedience. As far as His Holiness is involved, i hope he never even opens my e-mail. Or even sees it.
I wrote to the Vicar general of Colorado in thanks to him for his help, since i could not contact His Exellency, Bishop Sheridan.
As for you, Brother, i want to demolish my pride by posting this appology publicly. Not privately by PMs.
I appologize greatly for saying aggresive replies to you. And i ask your forgiveness, but only if you have it to forgive me fully. I don’t deserve it, but i ask for it.
Now that that is requested, i would like to speak to you about other things. I would like seeing a PM from you if you have the time.
Thank you, Brother.
I am humbled by your apology, because I feel that you did nothing for which to apologize. We all have to stand up for what we believe to be right. It’s interesting, because you said that you wish to be a saint. I believe that you are well on your way. A saint is not a perfect person, but a humble person. So many of us forget that, including me.

Please do not worry about having responded to me in a particular manner. You belong to a small group of people on CAF who have kept that old kind of respect for clergy and religious. It’s interesting, because those who are the hardest on religious are usually those who call themselves traditional Catholics. I always thought that it was traditional for Catholics to be kind to religious and clerics. But, I did not grow up Catholic. I’m a convert from Judaism. So I don’t really know from personal experience, just from watching at a distance when I was a child. My father was Catholic and my mother Jewish.

I don’t want you to walk away from the Servants believing that they are horrible people. I cannot say that. I don’t know anything about them. But as long as there is a doubt about their communion with the Church, it is prudent to keep a distance until there is proof that they are in full communion.

History has proven time and again that when groups begin as “reformers”, unless they do their reforming from within the Church, they rarely remain Catholic. There have been many solid Catholic reformers. They did their work from within. One who comes to mind right away is St. Ignatius. He was courageous and patient.

You may PM me at your convenience. I will always be available for any brother or sister who wants to be a friend. I love having friends and sharing our spiritual journey. Maybe we can become prayer buddies. What do you think of that idea?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂

PS. Pardon the typos. I’m tired and should go to bed now. I have not been feeling well these days and the brothers have been so kind to allow me to follow my own schedule.
 
I am so very gratefull that you are one of kindness and forgiveness.
And don’t worry about the typos, i have them all the time. And i would never say the Servants are horrible people, and i still love what they do. However, i won’t allow myself to be outside the Church, therefore, i must as i said obey. I too am a convert. I converted from the protestant faith.
As for the respect thing goes, i hold every Catholic clergyman and religous woman and man higher than the president. For me to talk back to any one of them would mean emotional disaster for me, lol.
Even though i despise modernism with my whole being and disapprove of those religious and clergy who support it, i can not speak back at them. Although i must admit, “nuns” with habits i refuse to acknowledge as nuns or sisters. If they don’t want the Tradition on religious life, which is the Heart of the Church, then they don’t belong there, and instead should be in a lay society ((third order if i am at least partially correct)).
Anyway, now i am a hyppocrite, i am off subject. I will mail you.
And for the prayer buddy thing, that would be wonderfull.
Good night, Brother ((or are you a Father?)), and God Bless.
In Christ,
Tyler+
 
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