Seventh Day Adventist question

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The Bible, and specially the New Testament, is a recompilation of Books that TESTIFY of the Life of Jesus, and the lives and experiences of the first believers!!! The Foudation of the early Church
We, Catholics, (and all Christians) believe that it is the Word of God, Inspired by the Holy Spirit.
All this books where found, kept and put together by the first Centuries church! Which is no other than the Catholic Church!!
It was the Church the one that had to discern what books , from all the ones found, where in line with the true teachings of Jesus!!

So , if all this is true, and if we truly believe that Jesus rose and is Alive Today, working on us through the Holy Spirit… Why must we think that all that Divine inspiration stopped or ended with the apostles?
What about the next generations of disciples?
Those, that we Catholics, know as Fathers of the Church?
What about all their writings, letters, encyclicals, etc,

This is why I do not agree with Bible Fundamentalists:
If they don’t find Biblical proof, then they do not believe.
Thinking like that is as accepting that the Holy Spirit is “done with His work” and not recognizing that He lives in the Church, ispiring, EVEN TODAY, God’s message to HIS CHURCH!!!
I don’t know that any of us said the Holy Spirit isn’t living within God’s Church and still inspiring his people. Which by the way, its not a name (i.e. Catholic, Protestants), but those who “hear the word of God and do it.”

But the Bible says “try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world” therefore its my responsibility to question everything and try everything.
And “Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. Abstain from all appearance of evil.”
And that “To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”

Why am I or anyone who seeks God in his Word both the written and the Word made flesh called fundamentalists?
If I seek the Word of God and uphold it above the words of men, am I transgressing against the church or against God? No.

“Thy word [is] a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.” Psalm 119:105

“… thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.” Psalm 138:2

Why is this considered wrong, when it opposes the traditions of the RCC. RCCs assume that they cannot err, but history proves it wrong. I love Catholics, if I didn’t, then I could careless what you guys believe and practice and are held captive by obeying traditions of men, rather than the Word of God.
 
A quick question? Does God follow mans time? or should we worship everyday and keep all days holy? Good thing the Catholic Church holds Mass everyday:thumbsup:Even though we cant all go to Mass everyday, at least we know we worship everyday(we as in all Catholics because we are all One,Holy,Catholic and Apostolic Church)
No. Man follows God’s time, which he gave us as a weekly cycle.

To keep a different day holy, rather than the one God made holy, is to impose upon the Creator our will. This is unacceptable to God. Even if its the tradition of a 2000 year old church to meet on the First day to break bread, worship, etc.

You may live a holy life, you may worship God every second of your life, you may go to mass every and any day, but only one day has God set aside, and ‘blessed’, ‘rested in’, made ‘holy’, and that is the Seventh Day Sabbath. Which he tells us in his Law, “Remember it to keep it”

Why do people have a problem with God telling them to take a break from the week and relax and be refreshed in his presence? I don’t know. God gives us a holiday and we say no to him.

Jesus said that man was not made for the Sabbath, but that the Sabbath was made for man. God is giving you a holiday, take it! 🙂
 
I am wondering how you arrived at the conclusion that God told them to kill a lamb for the remission of sins in that verse. It says that God made the coats of skin, and He clothed them. God provided for them at the time. Later God instituted the sacrificial system for His followers. That’s some fancy interpreting that you are doing to conclude from the future sacrificial system that it was in place at this point in time. So if not the Bible, what authority do you use for this interpretation?
The sacrificial system was given to Adam and Eve. How else would Abel know what to bring God? It is assumed in the context of the story. Pretty much all the patriarchs from Adam down to Abraham did it. The only people to receive a more complex system was Israel at Sinai.
God’s Rest at Creation was the conclusion of His creating and His proclamation that all He had created was good. God rested from all His work. The seventh day of creation was eternity with God for Adam and Eve. That is why there is no mention of the evening and the morning being the 7th day, as in the other six days of creation.
And I’m interpreting? The statement “The seventh day of creation was eternity with God for Adam and Eve.” is an oxymoron. If its a day, then that means the day ends, if it doesn’t end, then its not a day. It being a day means that the evening and the morning were in fact "the seventh day’. God was not creating anything else after the Seventh day, so he didn’t need to add an eight day to the weekly cycle, that’s why there’s no mention of the evening and the morning for the last day.
Although I can see the line of thoughts toward that conclusion, its line of reasoning is not correct.
This is the first place in the Bible where “sabbath” is mentioned, and where God begins to teach the freed Hebrew slaves to trust and follow Him. If you go back and read the entire chapter from verse 1, you should clearly see the context of the verses you quote. The Israelites were grumbling about wanting to go back to Egypt and actually say they preferred death to freedom, verse 1-3.

4 Then the LORD said to Moses, “I will rain down bread from heaven for you. The people are to go out each day and gather enough for that day. In this way I will test them and see whether they will follow my instructions. 5 On the sixth day they are to prepare what they bring in, and that is to be twice as much as they gather on the other days.”

God was beginning to teach and prepare His people for salvation…which was to trust God and follow His intructions. And in response to the grumblings God promises to provide meat from the earth and bread from heaven (a type of Jesus who is the Bread of Life sent from heaven). And God sent them this food why?

11 The LORD said to Moses, 12 "I have heard the grumbling of the Israelites. Tell them, ‘At twilight you will eat meat, and in the morning you will be filled with bread. Then you will know that I am the LORD your God.’ "

So they would know that He was the Lord their God.

And this is where God begins to institute a weekly, 24 hour day sabbath, to teach the Israelites about HIS REST, His initial plan for mankind at creation.
The sabbath was new here…at least according to the Bible. God’s Rest is from Creation. The sabbath was given to the Israelites, freed from Egypt, to teach them about God’s Rest.
This is a wonderful subject to study!!! Just read these verses in context and pray for light to understand!!
God bless all!!!
The Bible said that God rested, and sanctified and made holy the 7th day (which has to end before the 1st day starts again). The week existed from creation, or else God wouldn’t number the days. He would have just made everything in one shot, he could have said: “World in the way I’m thinking of it, EXIST”. And puff the world would have been. LOL, but he didn’t.

God restored through Israel pretty much all the Truth about God. Which is contained in the Moral Law (the 10 commandments) and the Levitical Law (in statutes and ordinances that were symbols and prophesies, which also contain additional Sabbaths, that don’t necessarily fall on the 7th day, that are in types awaiting for the anti-type, which is the Rest in God that Paul spoke of in Hebrews).

If the Sabbath keeping was only restricted to the Israelites, then the other 9 commandments should also be restricted to the Israelites, so that you and me don’t need to do what God commanded, since this is the first time God says: “Thou shalt not have other gods before me, thou shalt not carve images…, thou shalt not take the name of the Lord in vain, remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy, honor your parents, don’t murder, no adultery, no coveting, no lying, no stealing.”

It is understood that God didn’t want us to do any of the other evils, and he added the Sabbath to that list, because the Sabbath, just like the other 9, is part of the Moral Law, and its eternal.

Only one day is holy, The Sabbath, and it was given to the human family.
Why then would God after destroying sin, have us keep the Sabbath in the new heavens and earth?
Isaiah 66:23 - “And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.”
 
No. Man follows God’s time, which he gave us as a weekly cycle.

To keep a different day holy, rather than the one God made holy, is to impose upon the Creator our will. This is unacceptable to God. Even if its the tradition of a 2000 year old church to meet on the First day to break bread, worship, etc.

You may live a holy life, you may worship God every second of your life, you may go to mass every and any day, but only one day has God set aside, and ‘blessed’, ‘rested in’, made ‘holy’, and that is the Seventh Day Sabbath. Which he tells us in his Law, “Remember it to keep it”

Why do people have a problem with God telling them to take a break from the week and relax and be refreshed in his presence? I don’t know. God gives us a holiday and we say no to him.

Jesus said that man was not made for the Sabbath, but that the Sabbath was made for man. God is giving you a holiday, take it! 🙂
Tell me exactly how you tell which Island in the south pacific is really experiencing “Saturday” when one a few miles west is experiencing “Sunday” depending where you are… at the very same moment in time… Biblically.

Tell me exactly what authority the Kiribati legislature had to move the International Dateline from one side of the island to the other, thereby “changing” the sabbath (which Adventists in Kiribati follow!) — biblically. NOTE - this change most certainly did cause a disruption in the 7 day cycle for some people! Not just a change of dates.

Tell me exactly what authority the British commonwealth had in the first place to create the international dateline and move that arbitrary slice of time called “saturday” around? – biblically

Tell me exactly how you find “sabbath” on the international space station, biblically.

Then, maybe we can talk.

The logical problem is this. Adventists teach that during the end times, the sabbath will become a matter of salvation. (some teach that it already is, but I’m trying to be charitable). Adventists cannot agree on exactly “how” to keep the sabbath. Some go out to eat, some won’t. Some warm food up… some don’t. Some will cook simple foods, some will only re heat. Some will go to the grocery store for necessities, some won’t.
All they can agree on is that whatever you do to keep “sabbath” holy, is that mostly, it involves going to church and even more importantly, that it has to happen on Saturday. Sunday will not do. To keep Sunday is to disobey God. “knowingly” keeping Sunday instead of Saturday if you have been given the “light” on the sabbath, will cost you your salvation.

Problem is, Saturday is an arbitrary, human designation.

Adventists will argue the Jews have never lost sabbath… that is not quite correct. For most of the planet west of Jerusalem, that our “saturday” is congruent with the NT sabbath is fairly certain. East of Jerusalem to the international dateline, that is more tricky. In the polar regions where you may go days without a sunset… trickier still. And we now have the technology to live in space, where there is no sunrise/sunset at all. Even the Jewish scholars disagree on exactly how to keep the biblical sabbath on the International space station, in the arctic where there is no sunrise/sundown some times during the year. There are rabbis that argue, that because of the international dateline ( a totally man made, imaginary line), Jews living EAST of Jerusalem and WEST of the dateline should not keep sabbath before it begins in Jerusalem, even if that means they keep sabbath on the day recognized by civil government as Sunday. Adventists follow the dateline, not the beginning of the sabbath in Jerusalem (which is biblical? who has the authority to say?)

The 10 commandments are binding as an expression of Natural, moral law. The old covenant and its shadows have been fulfilled. There is nothing natural about keeping “saturday” over any other day of the week. It doesn’t exist in nature. There is a moral precept in having time set aside for regular rest. (If you actually read the commandment, worship and assembly are not in there)

There is nothing morally superior about Saturday over Sunday for rest.

Adventists will argue that there is nothing natural about a 7 day week, and therefore, it only exists because of the sabbath, a Proof. Again… that is not correct. That is putting the cart before the horse. The natural origin of the week is apparent to anyone who has watched a mother cut up fruit or a sandwich for her child. You cut it in half… if the pieces aren’t quite small enough, you cut it in half again. The lunar cycle is 28 days… a little too much for humans to order their lives around… half of that is 14… still a bit too much… half again is 7. And there is the week, a perfectly natural, logical division of the lunar month. What mother wastes time cutting an apple into fifths?

Within the cycle though, no day stands out as having any quality different from another.

Even in the commandment, the word seventh is not the name of a particular day, but an ordinal number… as in the third planet, the fourth apple, or the seventh day. If you mix up a plate of apples and recount them, a different one might be the “seventh” one each time you order them.

The church recognizes this moral precept of setting aside regular time for rest, and also the NT precept of not neglecting to assemble ourselves together… and applies these to the first day of the week… Sunday. The day of the resurrection. The first day, which is also the Eighth… which cannot be found in the natural weekly cycle. It stands outside time. God’s rest stands outside time… Eternity. The Jewish people looked at sabbath and remembered creation .(Exodus 20:8). Christians look at Sunday and remember the NEW creation. (2 Cor 5:17) The Jewish people looked at sabbath and remembered their deliverance from slavery in Egypt. (Deut. 5:15) Christians look at Sunday and remember their deliverance from slavery to the law. (Romans 8:2) The Jewish people looked at sabbath and carefully guarded its edges, looking forward to entering into God’s eternal rest. Christians experience Sunday as a joyful feast, a weekly Easter, a celebration of their rest in Christ, who is the fulfillment of the old covenant sabbath, and in whom Christians find their sabbath, their rest. (Hebrews 4:10)

One of the old covenant shadows, was the offering of the first fruits. Jesus is referred to in the New Testament, as the first fruits of those who are raised from the dead. On what day was the offering of the first fruits made? (Leviticus 23:39) The Eighth day!

Jesus is our sabbath rest.

Sunday is the feast of the Church, a celebration of what Jesus has done for us. Sunday is not the sabbath on another day.
There is no explicit biblical command for Christians to worship on Sunday, this is not a matter of old covenant law. It fulfills the moral precept of regular rest and worship, “keeping” the commandment, as Christians should keep the commandments. As moral law. In spirit and truth, not in letter and shadows.

Adventists love to trot out statements that the Church “changed” the sabbath to Sunday. You can find them. They summarize the externals (The day of the week has changed) without delving into the deeper meanings. The Church, did indeed change the day of worship. A Catholic understands “Church” to mean the one Church, which has existed from the day of Pentecost. Not something that came along after the apostles. This is indeed “the Church” and the Church did change the day of assembly. Not as an act of rebellion against God, but recognizing the need for Christians to express their new reality and what Jesus has done for us. This was done in the freedom that Jesus paid for with his life, by the apostolic authority which Jesus gave his fledgling church, to teach in His name.

MarysRoses
 
Tell me exactly how you tell which Island in the south pacific is really experiencing “Saturday” when one a few miles west is experiencing “Sunday” depending where you are… at the very same moment in time… Biblically.

Tell me exactly what authority the Kiribati legislature had to move the International Dateline from one side of the island to the other, thereby “changing” the sabbath (which Adventists in Kiribati follow!) — biblically. NOTE - this change most certainly did cause a disruption in the 7 day cycle for some people! Not just a change of dates.

Tell me exactly what authority the British commonwealth had in the first place to create the international dateline and move that arbitrary slice of time called “saturday” around? – biblically

Tell me exactly how you find “sabbath” on the international space station, biblically.

Then, maybe we can talk.

The logical problem is this. Adventists teach that during the end times, the sabbath will become a matter of salvation. (some teach that it already is, but I’m trying to be charitable). Adventists cannot agree on exactly “how” to keep the sabbath. Some go out to eat, some won’t. Some warm food up… some don’t. Some will cook simple foods, some will only re heat. Some will go to the grocery store for necessities, some won’t.
All they can agree on is that whatever you do to keep “sabbath” holy, is that mostly, it involves going to church and even more importantly, that it has to happen on Saturday. Sunday will not do. To keep Sunday is to disobey God. “knowingly” keeping Sunday instead of Saturday if you have been given the “light” on the sabbath, will cost you your salvation.

Problem is, Saturday is an arbitrary, human designation.

Adventists will argue the Jews have never lost sabbath… that is not quite correct. For most of the planet west of Jerusalem, that our “saturday” is congruent with the NT sabbath is fairly certain. East of Jerusalem to the international dateline, that is more tricky. In the polar regions where you may go days without a sunset… trickier still. And we now have the technology to live in space, where there is no sunrise/sunset at all. Even the Jewish scholars disagree on exactly how to keep the biblical sabbath on the International space station, in the arctic where there is no sunrise/sundown some times during the year. There are rabbis that argue, that because of the international dateline ( a totally man made, imaginary line), Jews living EAST of Jerusalem and WEST of the dateline should not keep sabbath before it begins in Jerusalem, even if that means they keep sabbath on the day recognized by civil government as Sunday. Adventists follow the dateline, not the beginning of the sabbath in Jerusalem (which is biblical? who has the authority to say?)

The 10 commandments are binding as an expression of Natural, moral law. The old covenant and its shadows have been fulfilled. There is nothing natural about keeping “saturday” over any other day of the week. It doesn’t exist in nature. There is a moral precept in having time set aside for regular rest. (If you actually read the commandment, worship and assembly are not in there)

There is nothing morally superior about Saturday over Sunday for rest.

Adventists will argue that there is nothing natural about a 7 day week, and therefore, it only exists because of the sabbath, a Proof. Again… that is not correct. That is putting the cart before the horse. The natural origin of the week is apparent to anyone who has watched a mother cut up fruit or a sandwich for her child. You cut it in half… if the pieces aren’t quite small enough, you cut it in half again. The lunar cycle is 28 days… a little too much for humans to order their lives around… half of that is 14… still a bit too much… half again is 7. And there is the week, a perfectly natural, logical division of the lunar month. What mother wastes time cutting an apple into fifths?

Within the cycle though, no day stands out as having any quality different from another.

Even in the commandment, the word seventh is not the name of a particular day, but an ordinal number… as in the third planet, the fourth apple, or the seventh day. If you mix up a plate of apples and recount them, a different one might be the “seventh” one each time you order them.

The church recognizes this moral precept of setting aside regular time for rest, and also the NT precept of not neglecting to assemble ourselves together… and applies these to the first day of the week… Sunday. The day of the resurrection. The first day, which is also the Eighth… which cannot be found in the natural weekly cycle. It stands outside time. God’s rest stands outside time… Eternity. The Jewish people looked at sabbath and remembered creation .(Exodus 20:8). Christians look at Sunday and remember the NEW creation. (2 Cor 5:17) The Jewish people looked at sabbath and remembered their deliverance from slavery in Egypt. (Deut. 5:15) Christians look at Sunday and remember their deliverance from slavery to the law. (Romans 8:2) The Jewish people looked at sabbath and carefully guarded its edges, looking forward to entering into God’s eternal rest. Christians experience Sunday as a joyful feast, a weekly Easter, a celebration of their rest in Christ, who is the fulfillment of the old covenant sabbath, and in whom Christians find their sabbath, their rest. (Hebrews 4:10)

One of the old covenant shadows, was the offering of the first fruits. Jesus is referred to in the New Testament, as the first fruits of those who are raised from the dead. On what day was the offering of the first fruits made? (Leviticus 23:39) The Eighth day!

Jesus is our sabbath rest.

Sunday is the feast of the Church, a celebration of what Jesus has done for us. Sunday is not the sabbath on another day.
There is no explicit biblical command for Christians to worship on Sunday, this is not a matter of old covenant law. It fulfills the moral precept of regular rest and worship, “keeping” the commandment, as Christians should keep the commandments. As moral law. In spirit and truth, not in letter and shadows.

Adventists love to trot out statements that the Church “changed” the sabbath to Sunday. You can find them. They summarize the externals (The day of the week has changed) without delving into the deeper meanings. The Church, did indeed change the day of worship. A Catholic understands “Church” to mean the one Church, which has existed from the day of Pentecost. Not something that came along after the apostles. This is indeed “the Church” and the Church did change the day of assembly. Not as an act of rebellion against God, but recognizing the need for Christians to express their new reality and what Jesus has done for us. This was done in the freedom that Jesus paid for with his life, by the apostolic authority which Jesus gave his fledgling church, to teach in His name.

MarysRoses
So after all that secular/Christian fabrication, we still ignore that God has the Sabbath after all sin is destroyed according to Isaiah.
So we tell God that in the New Heavens and New Earth we’re confused as to how the Sabbath will work for those in the north and south pole etc.

No matter what the simple word of God says, its right in saying that “men have sought many inventions”. Going to technicalities like this allows the type of reasoning that gives an excuse for just about every sin to be committed.

The Sabbath is part of the Decalogue, if we don’t want to keep it, then we are not subject to the other 9 commands by God’s standards, since if you break one, you break them all.
Why do we cherry pick what to do and what not to do?
 
So after all that secular/Christian fabrication, we still ignore that God has the Sabbath after all sin is destroyed according to Isaiah.
Hi Arglaze,

Just to let you know that I did not “conveniently” skip your other issues in my reply to you above. It is just that I have encountered problems previously in discussions with some who make lots of points, never respond to mine, and then we have made no progress. I should have told you that I would address Isaiah and Exodus later (and should have apologized for not doing so), but I wanted to come to a conclusion regarding the 7th day of creation, and the gathering of manna in Exodus.
  1. As for the creation story. We disagree about why there is no mention of morning and evening to designate the 7th day. I think the interpretation I embrace makes more sense with what Paul writes in Hebrews.
  2. I’m not sure what you think about Exodus 16 taken in context, but I believe God was beginning to instruct the Israelites to trust in Him and follow His instructions and commands, which were later written on the tables of stone for them in the covenant they made with Moses and God.
  3. Exodus 20 and the tables of stone, I will address later, so the only outstanding point of discussion we have now is your quote from Isaiah.
Isaiah 66: 22 “As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me,” declares the LORD, “so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me,” says the LORD. 24 “And they will go out and look upon the dead bodies of those who rebelled against me; their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind.”

Once again if you take that verse in context it brings out some other interesting things that will be done in heaven, according to your reasoning. According to your reasoning, as specified in verse 24, in addition to bowing down before God on New Moons and Sabbaths, they will go out and look on the dead bodies of those who rebelled and see their fire that will not be quenched. Imagine that, seeing the dead who rebelled burn forever…according to these verses you quote.

And if the 7th day Sabbath, Saturday (and I won’t accuse you of worshipping Saturn) is binding on Christians here on this earth and in heaven based on Isaiah 66:23, then it would follow suit that New Moons are binding on all Christians here on this earth as well as in heaven. May I ask you what New Moons you observe and keep?

Perhaps we should think about why Isaiah wrote what he did, and for what purpose…that may help to understand the context as well.

Go back and do a word search for New Moon in the Bible and read the verses, and chapters, that talk about New Moon festivals, sabbaths, and other feast days. These are all special times when God’s people came to celebrate with God.

I’m sorry that you left out verse 24 in your original quote, but I think it is important for putting verse 23 in context!

God bless all!!!
 
I love Catholics, if I didn’t, then I could careless what you guys believe and practice and are **held captive **by obeying traditions of men, rather than the Word of God.
So are you here in these forums to understand Catholicism, or to just point out the errors that are holding us captive? Does your love and care for what we believe and practice compel you to work to free us from our captivity?

I would never go to a SDA website and put down their beliefs, even the ones I believe to be errant.

God bless all!!!
 
I love Catholics, if I didn’t, then I could careless what you guys believe and practice and are held captive by obeying traditions of men, rather than the Word of God.

My own observations and study lead me to the conclusion that SDAs are held captive by the writings of Ellen G. White.
 
I love Catholics, if I didn’t, then I could careless what you guys believe and practice and are held captive by obeying traditions of men, rather than the Word of God.

**My own observations and study lead me to the conclusion that SDAs are held captive by the writings of Ellen G. White.

Arglaze, how would you like it were I to ask, “You don’t really think you’re following the Word of God, do you?”

Your statement is every bit as offensive and unfair.**
 
We conveniently didn’t address the last points in Exodus 20 & Isaiah 66:23 that states in heaven we’ll still keep it. Why would God re-institute in Heaven after sin is undone, the Sabbath observance? God’s Law doesn’t change, and yet a human does change it. Cutting the 2nd commandment to allow the making of graven images, and take away the explanation of the 4th to eliminate how God wanted it to be kept for something that leaves it open for anyone’s interpretation.

What Jesus wrote on the tables:
2nd commandment
“Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness [of any thing] that is in heaven above,” (that includes God or Jesus), … Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them…"
4th commandment
“Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy, six days shalt thou… me”

Man made changes:
2nd commandment
“Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain…”
4th commandment
“Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.” (Period)
Since I have addressed Isaiah 66:23 and verse 24, I will now add a point about what God wrote on the tables of stone.

Exodus 31: 12 Then the LORD said to Moses, 13 "Say to the Israelites, 'You must observe my Sabbaths. This will be a sign between me and you for the generations to come, so you may know that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. 14 " ‘Observe the Sabbath, because it is holy to you. Anyone who desecrates it must be put to death; whoever does any work on that day must be cut off from his people. 15 For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death. 16 The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. 17 It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.’ " 18 When the LORD finished speaking to Moses on Mount Sinai, he gave him the two tablets of the Testimony, the tablets of stone inscribed by the finger of God.

Should we follow this command inscribed by the finger of God, or should we “cherry pick” parts of this so we don’t have to put anyone to death?

Or could this be an area of study that also requires that it be studied in context?

I’d still like to hear about the keeping of New Moons on this earth as well as in heaven, and watching the rebellious burn with unquenchable fire…if it is convnient for you.

Other than that I think I have at least made a first pass at addressing your points…and it wasn’t inconenient at all.

God bless all!!!
 
Jesus and the Apostles practiced the sabbath observance because they already knew about it, and** it is a commandment of the Decalogue which Catholics conveniently changed in their Scriptures**. And that is what I call, putting words in the mouth of God.
Oh by the way, what you said above and that I highlighted is absolutely, without a doubt, completely WRONG.

Are you sure that is what you meant?

If that is what you believe I would love a citation to any Catholic translation of the Bible that changed the Decalogue in the scriptures of that translation, because I am completely unaware of any such thing. You just might have made a very important discovery if that is the case.

Also, my response to your last point that you thought I was ignoring is on the previous page in Post # 90.

God bless all!!!
 
Jesus and the Apostles practiced the sabbath observance because they already knew about it, and it is a commandment of the Decalogue which Catholics conveniently changed in their Scriptures. And that is what I call, putting words in the mouth of God.

**The numbering of the commandments is akin to the chapter and verse divisions of the Bible.

In other words, there is no doctrinal significance.

BTW–did you know that it was Roman Catholic scholars who came up with the chapter and verse divisions of the Bible used by SDA polemicists?**
 
  1. Most Catholics don’t know, but the Sunday was to be kept just like the Jewish Sabbath was by orders of the Pope and Emperor Constantine (not gonna go too much into the history).
You act like we don’t see anything at all in scripture that shows the Christians gathered on Sunday. See below … and it’s for a mass, no less.

Acts 20:7
[7] And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

Jesus was accused more than once of breaking the Sabbath. Isn’t Jesus who we follow?

Colossians 2:17–19
“Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—things which are a mere shadow of what is to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.”

The gentile Christians didn’t need to be circumsized. Why is that?
Do you think the view of the sabbath was the same for Jewish and gentile Christians.

Also, history disagrees with you about your statement above.
There is circumstantial evidence as early as around the year 60 that the Christians worshiped on a different day than the Jews.

I shouldn’t completely discount your statement above *just *yet.
Please give the reference(s) for the statement that Sunday as the Sabbath was order of the pope and Emperor Constantine.

If you are unwilling to give this reference, then please, in the future, refrain from such wild, spurious claims.

michel
 
Note the following:

One of the forbidden works on the Sabbath, according to the Bible, is the lighting of fires.

Now, just how does your SDA friend’s car run, except by lighting hundreds of fires a minute?

If he drives his car on the Sabbath, he is actually VIOLATING the commandment!
Good question! Here is the answer: Lighting a fire at a time when there were no matches, was a hard task. Have you ever attempted to light a fire with sticks and rocks?

Nic
 
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