sex abuse

[Jestocost]

You do highlight the major problem in Catholicism today in regards to this issue:*** if you mention this at all with any critical aspect against the behavior of priests or bishops involved, then you are automatically an “anti-Catholic.”***

Like you said, only those who are anti-Catholics bring this up. This is the “don’t ask, don’t tell” mindset in too much of the Catholic world today, IMO.

If actual criticism of evil makes someone a bigot, what kind of world exactly is it that you seek?

What utter nonsense! Is there anyone anywhere who is not critical of the priests and bishops who did this? It becomes anti-catholic when you start insinuating that this is something that is inheretly part of Catholicism or a natural consequence of the Church’s doctrines, rather than what it is; the sins of individuals.

 

[Church_Militant]

Just about every post addressed the topic head on.

No… they didn’t. But that’s moot now and good riddance.

How Catholics should respond to these scandals is definitely not with finger pointing and excuses (which are the most poular retorts). If you want to continue to feed the flames of this issue, then you can keep on responding in that fashion if you like.

As you said in another post today…“a little perspective”.

The problem here is that the only “perspective” you want to put forth is any one that casts the Catholic Church in the worst possible light. I have no doubt that I’m not the only one who knows you for the a-C agenda that you post here.

And why every idea that does not agree with your worldview is a “screed” is beyond me. You need to get over looking for “anti-Catholics” around every corner and in every bush. People do disagree with you, Michael, and when they say so, it does not automatically qualify as “screed.”

That’s not my definition, mine is anyone who willfully will not display the integrity of a factual and balanced “perspective” in their posts discussing the issue.

If someone wants to talk about this, they need to discuss it as it factually is… a social issue that spans far far more than just the Catholic Church. Your posts were nothing more than a bash fest of the Church. Something that you are well known for around here.

What is interesting is that I said nothing else other than what many wise Catholics have told me themselves. It seems that when a Protestant repeats Catholic sentiments it magically becomes “screed.”

Irrelevant since there is no way to verify that these people even exist. Moreover, if you offer the opinions of ignorant people (calling them “wise”) that does not make them in any way valid points in the discussion.

Including those victims who keep coming out to report the abuse?

So long as you bring out the ones that are coming forward to report the same offenses by n-C clergy and educators, knock yourself out. You won’t do it because it doesn’t suit your agenda.

You do highlight the major problem in Catholicism today in regards to this issue:*** if you mention this at all with any critical aspect against the behavior of priests or bishops involved, then you are automatically an “anti-Catholic.”***

No Atemi…you’re an anti-Catholic and have been long before any of us ever read the first word of your posts or even before this issue ever came to the fore. Clean up your own community before badmouthing anyone else’s.

Like you said, only those who are anti-Catholics

bring this up. This is the “don’t ask, don’t tell” mindset in too much of the Catholic world today, IMO.Operative term: YOUR opinion.

No one here has ever espoused a “don’t ask, don’t tell” mindset, but you wish we would. Reading the reports of SBP and other n-C and secular organizations would make it appear that what you allege against the Catholic Church is far more active outside it. But you won’t deal with that, because it doesn’t fit your agenda to portray Catholics and our Church in the worst possible light. IMO that’s dishonest.

If actual criticism

of evil makes someone a bigot, what kind of world exactly is it that you seek?Now this is a really good line. You have couched this comment in a way that is meant to make you look like someone with a higher moral ground and those who take issue with it as someone who is not.

Yet the fact is that what you are really saying is that you want Catholics to offer you a carte blanche to say anything you please against the Catholic Church while standing mute. I for one will never allow that. So many faithful Catholics here at CAF and other forums go so far out of our way to deal equitably with every issue raised by n-Cs/a-Cs that it is idiotic of us to accept remonstrance from agenda pushers like you while you :crying: when I call you on it.

You have not been appointed the conscience of the Catholic Church Atemi. You have proved yourself unqualified for that many many times here at CAF.

Save it for your posts at the a-C forums that you frequent.

 

[Atemi]

The problem here is that the only “perspective” you want to put forth is any one that casts the Catholic Church in the worst possible light.

Wrong.

The only perspective that needs to be put forth is the truth. I have no interest in casting your church in any light other than what is…not what I wish or hope it was.

I have no doubt that I’m not the only one who knows you for the a-C agenda that you post here.That’s not my definition, mine is anyone who willfully will not display the integrity of a factual and balanced “perspective” in their posts discussing the issue.

What “balanced” perspective do you seek?

We cannot discuss matters within Catholicism without discussing matters totally outside it at the same time?

No. I do not finger point and excuse the behavior of some because others have done the same.

The OP is not about how we are to respond about scandals in Protestant churches or public schools. The OP is about how we are to respond about the scandals specifically in the Catholic Church. I am one of the few that is actually addressing this.

Bobbing and weaving is definitely NOT the way to respond.

And BTW, even I must respond to outsiders and unbelievers for scandals in your church. In case you were unaware, this has affected the entire face of Christendom to the outside world.

If someone wants to talk about this, they need to discuss it as it factually is… a social issue that spans far far more than just the Catholic Church.

But that is not what this thread is about.

That is the whole point.

You do not address such abhorrent scandals within the Catholic Church by simply responding to such behavior everywhere all over the world.

That’s like if there is a scandal of embezzlement amongst numerous of my church leaders and in repsonse to outsiders I insist that we do not actually talk about my church leaders and my church but about embezzlement as a whole.

No way. That is avoidance. More bobbing and weaving.

This is not how you address such serious issues.

Your posts were nothing more than a bash fest of the Church.

I bashed no one. What a false charge.

I merely pointed out what everyone already knows…but the code of silence is deafening.

Something that you are well known for around here.

I am fully aware, that among many Catholics, saying their church is wrong about this or that is “bashing.”

No Atemi…you’re an anti-Catholic and have been long before any of us ever read the first word of your posts or even before this issue ever came to the fore.

Now the name calling.

What else is new from our charitable RC brethren?

You just detest that anybody could disagree with you and actually tell you so.

The horror.

Clean up your own community before badmouthing anyone else’s.

Huh?

The elders in my church have never molested numerous children.

No other elders in my church ignored such crimes and empowered the perpetrators to do it again.

There is no such scandal in my church, Michael…and there never was.

And PS: speaking about actual happenings out in the open where they should be discussed by rational human beings does not constitute “badmouthing.”

This is yet another problem plaguing much of the RC world. Vilifying and demonizing anyone that would say anything critical about these crimes or how they were handled will not make these issues up and disappear.

Sorry, Michael, but the world does not work that way.

No one here has ever espoused a “don’t ask, don’t tell” mindset, but you wish we would.

Claiming that only anti-Catholics would every bring this subject up with a critical eye is doing just that.

Demonize anyone who dares find fault about anything with this horrible scandal. Only a bigot would think this is an issue worth addressing, right?

Reading the reports of SBP and other n-C and secular organizations would make it appear that what you allege against the Catholic Church is far more active outside it.

What did I “allege” against the Catholic Church?

Please post my allegations that were not true.

Save it for your posts at the a-C forums that you frequent.

And what of the a-P forums I frequent?

…