sexual abuse by protestant ministers

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BrianH said:
If I could interject
One of the reasons I believe this thread was started and the website for sure was to essentially state…this is not just a Catholic problem.
I would encourage anyone to see one of the FRUITS of this particular website though please.
Take a random sentence out of the website and then google it. You will find out where this list appears on the web.
What you will find out is one of the fruits of this website is it is mostly used as foder for nonchristian sites as an example of how bad Christianity is.
So while the point is valid, the Catholic Church and Protestants both have sexual absuse and the media IS overly focused on Catholicism, the FRUITS of this turn out to give aid and ammunition to…well quite frankly…the enemies of Christ.
🤷
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Amen to that, Brian.

The agenda of the secular world with stories like this is to destroy the kingdom of God and of His Christ. It so happens that the Roman communion is the largest, visible image of that kingdom. While there is no question that the sexual abuse is bad, regardless of whether it occurred in Catholic or Protestant churches… the ultimate aim of Satan, through the secular world is NOT to protect children from harm - lest we forget, these secular sources have no problem whatsoever with destroying children in the womb - it is to tarnish the name of Jesus.
 
BrianH said:
If I could interject
One of the reasons I believe this thread was started and the website for sure was to essentially state…this is not just a Catholic problem…
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That was probably a `front.’

The real reason of creating this thread was more likely `They have people who do it too.’

Of course, the way it is handled makes the two incomparable:
Protestant circles: perpetrators generally end up in handcuffs,
Catholic Church: perpetrators generally do not end up in handcuffs, but handled, or not handled, internally and covered up.

Further, when and where I was raised, `They do it too’ was not a valid excuse. That was a deflection, and many times, one got in even more trouble for trying it.
 
Darron_Steele said:
That was probably a `front.’

The real reason of creating this thread was more likely `They have people who do it too.’

Of course, the way it is handled makes the two incomparable:
Protestant circles: perpetrators generally end up in handcuffs,
Catholic Church: perpetrators generally do not end up in handcuffs, but handled, or not handled, internally and covered up.

Further, when and where I was raised, `They do it too’ was not a valid excuse. That was a deflection, and many times, one got in even more trouble for trying it.
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Every reasoning being offered is not a deflection, as some accuse seemingly only to persist in their own agenda to stay focused ONLY on the sinful people within the Catholic Church. That is what I see as capitalizing on the victims of these crimes/sins for ‘other reasons’. 😦

As Brian stated, it is an issue used by those who would end Christianity and not necessarily for the good of the victims.

No one here is saying, ‘two wrongs make a right’.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Every reasoning being offered is not a deflection, …
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However, some are. From where I sit, this was such. Me, I would have to be motivated to see it any other way.

If you do not see the opening post this way, fine. We will have to disagree.
…‘two wrongs make a right’.
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This is something we agree on.
 
Darron_Steele said:
However, some are. From where I sit, this was such. Me, I would have to be motivated to see it any other way.

If you do not see the opening post this way, fine. We will have to disagree.
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Personally, I think this thread was more of a ‘remove the log from your own eye before trying to help me with the splinter in my eye’ response to those who started threads, capitalizing on the innocent victims, seeking a ‘victory’ over the Catholic Church.

I feel many argue the issue as if to somehow prove a superiority of theology, which seems more like those have no theological debate to offer other than they simply disagree with a stated theology. The actions of sinful people, in any Church organization, does not prove a theology one way or the other. There are no Churches with a sinless membership.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Personally, I think this thread was more of a ‘remove the log from your own eye before trying to help me with the splinter in my eye’
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Sometimes, however, Party A with the log in the eye' which is telling Party B with a splinter in the eye’ that `Our log in the eye is not a big problem because you have a splinter in yours.’
capitalizing on the innocent victims, seeking a ‘victory’ over the Catholic Church.
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I agree that there are those who celebrate the existence of this problem because it provides fodder' or ammo.’

Those who celebrate the existence of this problem for any reason have a serious defect of moral character.
The actions of sinful people, in any Church organization, does not prove a theology one way or the other.
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Agreed.

More to a church group’s credit is its people. The many practicing Catholics who live out their lives daily seeking to do that which is right far outweigh the actions of a minority population of delinquents.
There are no Churches with a sinless membership.
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Agreed. That is why we need Jesus Christ.
 
Darron_Steele said:
Sometimes, however, Party A with the log in the eye' which is telling Party B with a splinter in the eye’ that `Our log in the eye is not a big problem because you have a splinter in yours.
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I was not trying to measure either side. I was using a teaching from Christ, in the order He delivered it. He referred to those looking at the ‘mote/straw’ in their brothers eye with a ‘beam/timber’ in their own eye.

Is a person with 9 sins more righteous than a person with 10 sins?
 
Loboto-Me said:
I just read the abuse site that contains all the protestants charges. The one thing I noticed is that these are modern charges! One has to wonder how long this type of stuff has been happening within the protestant sector and how well this type of stuff was buried under the carpet.

I’m amazed because these churches are their own “popes” so it’s often the “protestant pope” himself that commits these crimes.
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I wouldn’t say Protestant Churches have a Pope. In the end each individual Christian will decide what is right or wrong and what he believes about scripture. That local Pastor who serves at the pleasure of the local church council, the non denominational church Senior Pastor and the leaders of denominations are more like an Eastern Church Patriarch then a central authority out of Rome that Pope represents
 
4Squarebaby said:
I wouldn’t say Protestant Churches have a Pope. In the end each individual Christian will decide what is right or wrong and what he believes about scripture. That local Pastor who serves at the pleasure of the local church council, the non denominational church Senior Pastor and the leaders of denominations are more like an Eastern Church Patriarch then a central authority out of Rome that Pope represents
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Your argument is a matter of semantics. In each instance, that you’ve listed, there is a superior.
Because there is a superior does not stop the ‘flock’ from straying, whether it’s the Catholic Church, or a single Church with only one pastor.
 
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TriuneUnity said:
Amen to that, Brian.

The agenda of the secular world with stories like this is to destroy the kingdom of God and of His Christ. It so happens that the Roman communion is the largest, visible image of that kingdom. While there is no question that the sexual abuse is bad, regardless of whether it occurred in Catholic or Protestant churches… the ultimate aim of Satan, through the secular world is NOT to protect children from harm - lest we forget, these secular sources have no problem whatsoever with destroying children in the womb - it is to tarnish the name of Jesus.
Click to expand...
I concur, and, let’s pretend that we lived in an alternate fictional universe where what has been said could bring down the Catholic Church, what would happen then? There’d be no great big bad Church in the west and they’d start going after all the other smaller churches and faiths to drive the point home and tarnish the name of Jesus and His followers, and religion in general.
 
WOW! some of these responses show you haven’t read or understood the point i was making.

i am very aware of the tu quoque, fallacy but that is used as a defense! can any one of you show where i defended a guilty Catholic priest! :mad:

i have made it very clear that this crime is atrocious no matter WHO does it. seriously, did you not even read everything i wrote. sometimes i am guilty of skipping over comments, but i would never make accusations against the OP without taking the time to really read what they wrote.

let me spell it out again.

the point of this was to show bias in the media. do i think the media has a right and should report this news? yes i do! however, seeing that we all agree on how important it is to protect children, teenagers and adults from sexual abuse i thought it was important to have all the facts.

right now, i bet if you polled most parents and asked them where they feared most for their child’s safety:…in a Catholic environment, protestant church or public school system, the majority would say Catholic!

and you know what those parents would be wrong! so go ahead and accuse me of smoke and mirrors and defending this sick behavior, but you are wrong. i think most parent’s have concern no matter where their children are, but to ignore how this problem is far worse in the secular school system and slightly worse in protestant churches could be dangerous. do you all not agree with that? geez. please be honest and ask yourselves if you knew that fact. if the answer is no, then consider yourself a bit more armed with facts which we need in order to do the best job of protecting everyone.

again, we are all in agreement this is sick and must be stopped no matter who does it. the article i posted about the priest that was falsely accused showed how the CC did not try to cover it up.

i would be glad to discuss the issue of how some feel the CC is the worst because we are the ones that cover it up while the protestant churches do not. if that could be proven which i don’t think it can, then let me tell you, the Catholic community will be the first to raise our voices and see a stop put to it. we don’t condone this behavior, you know!

i like facts and i love truth. truth is good for all of us Christians and non-Christians alike.
 
BrianH said:
If I could interject
One of the reasons I believe this thread was started and the website for sure was to essentially state…this is not just a Catholic problem.
I would encourage anyone to see one of the FRUITS of this particular website though please.
Take a random sentence out of the website and then google it. You will find out where this list appears on the web.
What you will find out is one of the fruits of this website is it is mostly used as foder for nonchristian sites as an example of how bad Christianity is.
So while the point is valid, the Catholic Church and Protestants both have sexual absuse and the media IS overly focused on Catholicism, the FRUITS of this turn out to give aid and ammunition to…well quite frankly…the enemies of Christ.
🤷
Click to expand...
i agree with most of that, but hopefully those that want to use this thread to show how bad Christianity is, will read the reports showing that the problem in our secular school systems is far worse than in any Christian community!

that fact seems to have been ignored in this entire thread. and it is why i wanted to change the title to this thread as well.

peace.
 
adstrinity said:
I was going to delete all but your first black paragraph, but, I’m quoting again because nobody seems to be responding to any of this.

But, anyway, I haven’t. I know a few cases were dropped, but, the media always made it seem like because there was a pay-off. I think there was a case against Cardinal George Bernadine that the accusers eventually rescinded but, this is why, it’s dawned on me, the “Thou shalt not bear false witness,” is important even in this day & age; yeah the chargers said they were lying but, there is an asterisk next to that father’s name until Jesus comes back.
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is is a good reminder that not everyone accused is actually guilty, but i was really posting it to see how many people had actually heard of that story. if the media is going to explode about ireland (and i’m not saying it shouldn’t), it should also report on this too. what’s fair is fair.

peace.
 
TriuneUnity said:
Amen to that, Brian.

The agenda of the secular world with stories like this is to destroy the kingdom of God and of His Christ. It so happens that the Roman communion is the largest, visible image of that kingdom. While there is no question that the sexual abuse is bad, regardless of whether it occurred in Catholic or Protestant churches… the ultimate aim of Satan, through the secular world is NOT to protect children from harm - lest we forget, these secular sources have no problem whatsoever with destroying children in the womb - it is to tarnish the name of Jesus.
Click to expand...
amen, brother! :hug1: i thank you, prodigal son 1 and everyone else that understood where i was coming from.

perhaps i should start another thread about the issue being far worse in the secular world as i said before, that significant fact is being ignored here.

peace.
 
i hope as we are all brothers and sisters in Christ we can stick to facts and not name calling which i was accused of. where did i do that? show me.

and for the last time the “he did it too” argument is meant when one is trying to DEFEND certain behavior which i have repeatedly said i do not. don’t put words in my mouth.

ok, i got a phone call i have to return and then am going to watch lost. i’ll be back later on to get beat up some more. :stretcher:

please pray for everyone involved in this nightmare.

peace and safety to us all.
 
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