'Sexuality, like priesthood, is a gift from God. Nobody would choose to be gay'

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JimG said:
Is pedophilia a sexual orientation? I suspect many pedophiles would claim that their orientation is as equally deep seated as anyone’s. So would they be protected from discrimination by laws which prohibit discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation? I’m not asking about whether their actions might be criminal, but whether their orientation is a protected status.
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Publisher said:
Human sexuality is very complex…as new understanding and psychological research is employed…our understanding will continue to change.
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sedonaman said:
There’s something wrong when the story keeps changing.
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I would not say that the story keeps changing, but rather there is a more accurate term ( orientation) and a more common, but less accurate term ( preference)
 
JimG said:
Is pedophilia a sexual orientation? I suspect many pedophiles would claim that their orientation is as equally deep seated as anyone’s. So would they be protected from discrimination by laws which prohibit discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation? I’m not asking about whether their actions might be criminal, but whether their orientation is a protected status.
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I can’t see how that could be considered a sexual orientation. Pedophilia appears to be mere sexual attraction. Orientation involves more than just sexual attraction, orientation involves all the emotional and intimacies of relationships. A child can never reciprocate in any meaningful manner the components of a real relationship. If you can’t have a real relationship with someone then its nothing more than a physical sexual attraction and even though homosexual sexual activity is gravely disordered they do have real emotional and intellectual relationships.
 
Brendan said:
I would not say that the story keeps changing, but rather there is a more accurate term ( orientation) and a more common, but less accurate term ( preference)
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But these are the terms that the homosexual movement came up with for itself. It looks like we have another case of semantic gymnastics: when one term didn’t work for political reasons as well as they wanted, they found another. I doubt seriously that there was a scholarly research that justified it.
What started as a demand for basic civil rights has mutated into a liberal demand to overturn the whole society, along with its traditions and norms, its standards and laws, its history and heroes.
 
NewEnglandPriest said:
I can’t see how that could be considered a sexual orientation. Pedophilia appears to be mere sexual attraction. Orientation involves more than just sexual attraction, orientation involves all the emotional and intimacies of relationships. A child can never reciprocate in any meaningful manner the components of a real relationship. If you can’t have a real relationship with someone then its nothing more than a physical sexual attraction and even though homosexual sexual activity is gravely disordered they do have real emotional and intellectual relationships.
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There have been several instances in the news lately about adult school teachers sexual involvement with underage students, sometimes a female teacher with a male student. They have claimed that there was a real relationship involving moore than just sex. So those couples might claim the same status that is claimed for homosexual relationships.
 
JimG said:
There have been several instances in the news lately about adult school teachers sexual involvement with underage students, sometimes a female teacher with a male student. They have claimed that there was a real relationship involving moore than just sex. So those couples might claim the same status that is claimed for homosexual relationships.
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Well, you’re talking about different things here. Pedophilia involves children. High school aged teenagers aren’t really children. However, even in such cases the reason such “relationships” are rejected by society is because even though its not the heinous act of child abuse the teenager still does not posses the maturity to truly enter into a relationship with an adult much older than they. The chance of manipulation/exploitation is so high that such relationships are rejected by society. Even though its not the heinous act of child abuse, “relationships” between adults and teenagers still have a predatory aspect to them.

Just because several things are wrong and disordered does not mean they are equally depraved and disordered. Homosexuality in and of itself is wrongly ordered, but it is not an inherently predatory relationship.
 
NewEnglandPriest said:
Well, you’re talking about different things here. Pedophilia involves children. High school aged teenagers aren’t really children. However, even in such cases the reason such “relationships” are rejected by society is because even though its not the heinous act of child abuse the teenager still does not posses the maturity to truly enter into a relationship with an adult much older than they. The chance of manipulation/exploitation is so high that such relationships are rejected by society. Even though its not the heinous act of child abuse, “relationships” between adults and teenagers still have a predatory aspect to them.

Just because several things are wrong and disordered does not mean they are equally depraved and disordered. Homosexuality in and of itself is wrongly ordered, but it is not an inherently predatory relationship.
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Yes, I agree. But I was wondering how far laws prohibiting discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation might be stretched. There are a lot of types of sexual predilections, a great many of them disordered, and many of them fairly common. We don’t call them all “orientations,” but a person who has had a particular sexual fetish since puberty might consider his sexual orientation every bit as deep seated as a homosexual’s, and seek protection from discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
 
JimG said:
… a person who has had a particular sexual fetish since puberty might consider his sexual orientation every bit as deep seated as a homosexual’s, and seek protection from discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
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And before you know it, the government is funding free sandals for gay ex-nuns with a foot fetish. 😛
What started as a demand for basic civil rights has mutated into a liberal demand to overturn the whole society, along with its traditions and norms, its standards and laws, its history and heroes.
 
sedonaman said:
And before you know it, the government is funding free sandals for gay ex-nuns with a foot fetish. 😛
What started as a demand for basic civil rights has mutated into a liberal demand to overturn the whole society, along with its traditions and norms, its standards and laws, its history and heroes.
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Well, everybody has their own thing, and who’s to judge which person’s sexual preferences are better than others? 😉
 
JimG said:
Yes, I agree. But I was wondering how far laws prohibiting discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation might be stretched. There are a lot of types of sexual predilections, a great many of them disordered, and many of them fairly common. We don’t call them all “orientations,” but a person who has had a particular sexual fetish since puberty might consider his sexual orientation every bit as deep seated as a homosexual’s, and seek protection from discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
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Well, law is written by human beings so over time it will expand and contract what it views as legally acceptable and unacceptable. However “orientation” has been universally been understood (in America at least) to refer to what gender someone is attracted to. Race, ethnicity, shape, body parts, etc. as objects of attraction are, as you pointed out, normally referred to as “fetishes.” Orientation involves a person, fetishes involve a trait. I guess…
 
NewEnglandPriest said:
I can’t see how that could be considered a sexual orientation. Pedophilia appears to be mere sexual attraction. Orientation involves more than just sexual attraction, orientation involves all the emotional and intimacies of relationships. A child can never reciprocate in any meaningful manner the components of a real relationship. If you can’t have a real relationship with someone then its nothing more than a physical sexual attraction and even though homosexual sexual activity is gravely disordered they do have real emotional and intellectual relationships.
Click to expand...
Publisher said:
Human sexuality is very complex…as new understanding and psychological research is employed…our understanding will continue to change.
Click to expand...
 
NewEnglandPriest said:
I can’t see how that could be considered a sexual orientation. Pedophilia appears to be mere sexual attraction. Orientation involves more than just sexual attraction, orientation involves all the emotional and intimacies of relationships. A child can never reciprocate in any meaningful manner the components of a real relationship. If you can’t have a real relationship with someone then its nothing more than a physical sexual attraction and even though homosexual sexual activity is gravely disordered they do have real emotional and intellectual relationships.
Click to expand...
.
Publisher said:
Human sexuality is very complex…as new understanding and psychological research is employed…our understanding will continue to change.
Click to expand...
 
JimG said:
Yes, I agree. But I was wondering how far laws prohibiting discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation might be stretched. There are a lot of types of sexual predilections, a great many of them disordered, and many of them fairly common. We don’t call them all “orientations,” but a person who has had a particular sexual fetish since puberty might consider his sexual orientation every bit as deep seated as a homosexual’s, and seek protection from discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
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Actually some people knew what sex they were attracted to before they hit puberty.
 
I believe demonic influence is at the heart at a lot of these problems.
That people’s faith has really been weakened, and that we need some how to
regain that faith like the disciples had with Jesus.
 
Wow… ok … that priest needs to be excommunicated. Seriously.
pepipop said:
irishtimes.com/newspaper/weekend/2012/0512/1224315958228.html

Why is this man still a priest?

*Fr Bernárd Lynch, a gay Irish Catholic priest living in London, overcame prejudice and accusations of child abuse to find happiness in marriage, writes PATSY McGARRY , Religious Affairs Correspondent

FR BERNÁRD LYNCH seems taken aback by my question. “How can you believe in a loving God, considering the plague you have witnessed and experienced at such close quarters and what you have been through personally at the hands of so-called men of God?”

He reflects for a bit. “I suppose if I didn’t believe I would have killed myself a long time ago. It’s nothing to do with proof. It’s very fundamental.”

But he has had to separate his faith from the institutional church. He recalls how, in New York very early in “the Aids holocaust”, a Daughter of Charity nun he worked with, Sr Patrice Murphy, said, “The gay community will have to transcend the church in order to find God.”

The eldest of six, Bernard Lynch was born in Ennis, in Co Clare, in 1947, joined the Society of African Missions in 1965 and was ordained in 1971. He is best known for his work with Aids victims in New York and for coming out as a gay priest.*
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Ok… this priest needs to be excommunicated. Seriously. He is misleading people away from God.
pepipop said:
irishtimes.com/newspaper/weekend/2012/0512/1224315958228.html

Why is this man still a priest?

*Fr Bernárd Lynch, a gay Irish Catholic priest living in London, overcame prejudice and accusations of child abuse to find happiness in marriage, writes PATSY McGARRY , Religious Affairs Correspondent

FR BERNÁRD LYNCH seems taken aback by my question. “How can you believe in a loving God, considering the plague you have witnessed and experienced at such close quarters and what you have been through personally at the hands of so-called men of God?”

He reflects for a bit. “I suppose if I didn’t believe I would have killed myself a long time ago. It’s nothing to do with proof. It’s very fundamental.”

But he has had to separate his faith from the institutional church. He recalls how, in New York very early in “the Aids holocaust”, a Daughter of Charity nun he worked with, Sr Patrice Murphy, said, “The gay community will have to transcend the church in order to find God.”

The eldest of six, Bernard Lynch was born in Ennis, in Co Clare, in 1947, joined the Society of African Missions in 1965 and was ordained in 1971. He is best known for his work with Aids victims in New York and for coming out as a gay priest.*
Click to expand...
 
I dunno… but he needs to be excommunicated… seriously.
pepipop said:
irishtimes.com/newspaper/weekend/2012/0512/1224315958228.html

Why is this man still a priest?

*Fr Bernárd Lynch, a gay Irish Catholic priest living in London, overcame prejudice and accusations of child abuse to find happiness in marriage, writes PATSY McGARRY , Religious Affairs Correspondent

FR BERNÁRD LYNCH seems taken aback by my question. “How can you believe in a loving God, considering the plague you have witnessed and experienced at such close quarters and what you have been through personally at the hands of so-called men of God?”

He reflects for a bit. “I suppose if I didn’t believe I would have killed myself a long time ago. It’s nothing to do with proof. It’s very fundamental.”

But he has had to separate his faith from the institutional church. He recalls how, in New York very early in “the Aids holocaust”, a Daughter of Charity nun he worked with, Sr Patrice Murphy, said, “The gay community will have to transcend the church in order to find God.”

The eldest of six, Bernard Lynch was born in Ennis, in Co Clare, in 1947, joined the Society of African Missions in 1965 and was ordained in 1971. He is best known for his work with Aids victims in New York and for coming out as a gay priest.*
Click to expand...
 
sigh…

Part of the problem is, we no longer live in a society which appreciates the valuable services the priest provides… or the value of natural, normal, divine sex between a man and his wife.

IVF, surrogate motherhood, gay marriage, and all the rest are attempts to deviate from what has been relatively the pattern of Western society for the past 10,000 years or so. And that, generally speaking, is the man having a lifetime relationship with one wife and raising a family of many children with her. That’s how humanity works, even in the United States or Britain.

I hope people realise this before the work-age population is outstripped by pensioners. Not that I have anything against the elderly, but how is the salary of one man going to pay for the social security of two? And how will the country’s economy grow when there are half the men there once were who could make a circuit board, or mine a vein of ore?
 
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