SFO Terminology and Form I

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Luigi_Daniele said:
True, but I am afraid that the “you have to attend meetings” restriction still stands, as far as I know.
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Yes, because part of the charism is fraternity, which is brotherhood and sisterhood. One can’t be a Franciscan alone. It doesn’t make any sense with the rest of the charism.

Even when people can no longer make it to the meetings, the fraternity should to make accommodations to visit and share with them, or at least call them frequently. Our fraternity has a number of “stops” including an assisted living home for our meetings. We don’t forget people just because are disabled or they get old and can no longer drive themselves around.

In fact, I was professed at mass in the chapel of an assisted living facility many miles from my own home. That’s where we were scheduled to be on that day, so that’s how it was set up with the priest and all. We get around. 😃
 
Very cool. I am glad that you all are that numerous and that active.👍
 
iloveangels said:
Actually, we’re not numerous. We’re a pretty sorry looking little bunch but we’re Franciscan anyway. 😛
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Well, considering how Francis went around, the fact that you’re sorry looking is proof that you are Franciscans 😃
 
iloveangels said:
Yes, because part of the charism is fraternity, which is brotherhood and sisterhood. One can’t be a Franciscan alone. It doesn’t make any sense with the rest of the charism.
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I will have to disagree on this point. The Franciscan Family is huge, diverse and far flung. The above statement is to broad even for OFS. A Franciscan is Franciscan whether he is in Fraternity or alone. I agree with the assessment that ‘fraternity’ is important, but I think it has been to narrowly defined.
 
Kevin812 said:
I will have to disagree on this point. The Franciscan Family is huge, diverse and far flung. The above statement is to broad even for OFS. A Franciscan is Franciscan whether he is in Fraternity or alone. I agree with the assessment that ‘fraternity’ is important, but I think it has been to narrowly defined.
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Once a Franciscan is professed, he remains a Franciscan forever. This is true and always has been true, yes.

The Franciscan family is indeed huge and far-flung, but the charism is universal. It belongs to the whole Order.

The universal Franciscan charism emphasizes fraternity as one of its most important properties. It is best for a Franciscan to engage in community with other Franciscans as often as possible, for his own sake and for the sake of the order. It’s part of the Franciscan way of life.

“the Lord gave me brothers” etc.
 
iloveangels said:
Once a Franciscan is professed, he remains a Franciscan forever. This is true and always has been true, yes.

However, the charism emphasizes fraternity as one of its most important properties. It is best for a Franciscan to engage in community with other Franciscans as often as possible, for his own sake and for the sake of the order. It’s part of the Franciscan way of life.

“the Lord gave me brothers” etc.
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I agree with you especially on the emphasizes. And that is what it is, an emphasizes.
 
Kevin812 said:
I agree with you especially on the emphasizes. And that is what it is, an emphasizes.
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Well, yes. We don’t live in a juridical frame of mind, for the most part, as Franciscans. It’s not the Franciscan way. Franciscans, however, are supposed to be interested in the rule and the charism. One kind of has to wonder what’s going on if they aren’t.

I mean, suppose one meets a Franciscan who wants to live outside the charism. What is that, exactly?
 
iloveangels said:
Well, yes. We don’t live in a juridical frame of mind, for the most part, as Franciscans. It’s not the Franciscan way. Franciscans, however, are supposed to be interested in the rule and the charism. One kind of has to wonder what’s going on it they aren’t.
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I assume you are speaking in the general and not the specific of me?

If anything this and its companion thread has been filled with an enthusiasm for the Rule and charism. I haven’t seen anyone argue that. What we need to be careful of is the tyranny of imposing our definitions on the Order.
 
re: fraternity, I think it is one thing to be professed and get older or move and not be able to attend as frequently. It is totally another to want to move through initial formation and inquiry, etc, but not be able or willing to attend gatherings. I really believe that if one’s life cannot be arranged to allow for gathering, then this isn’t the right season for pursuing the vocation.

I think I’ve seen three people in initial formation in just the last couple years, who practically never show up at gatherings and yet want to continue toward profession. Even the most discerning council can’t make a decision about somebody they hardly see. . .
 
Kevin812 said:
I assume you are speaking in the general and not the specific of me?

If anything this and its companion thread has been filled with an enthusiasm for the Rule and charism. I haven’t seen anyone argue that. What we need to be careful of is the tyranny of imposing our definitions on the Order.
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Kevin, the Order has been very clear on what it expects. I don’t want to go out to the rule, constitutions and statutes to argue with you.

I’m not speaking of you personally. I don’t even know you. You seem, from the few posts I’m seeing, to have trouble with the concept of fraternity, but I could be wrong. I don’t know what this is about suddenly. :confused:
 
EvelynEVF said:
re: fraternity, I think it is one thing to be professed and get older or move and not be able to attend as frequently. It is totally another to want to move through initial formation and inquiry, etc, but not be able or willing to attend gatherings. I really believe that if one’s life cannot be arranged to allow for gathering, then this isn’t the right season for pursuing the vocation.

I think I’ve seen three people in initial formation in just the last couple years, who practically never show up at gatherings and yet want to continue toward profession. Even the most discerning council can’t make a decision about somebody they hardly see. . .
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Correct. Actually there are information, recommendation sections etc along these lines in the new formation materials.
 
iloveangels said:
Kevin, the Order has been very clear on what it expects. I don’t want to go out to the rule, constitutions and statutes to argue with you.

I’m not speaking of you personally. I don’t even know you. You seem, from the few posts I’m seeing, to have trouble with the concept of fraternity, but I could be wrong. I don’t know what this is about suddenly. :confused:
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I believe we wonder from the topic. Sorry for not keeping on topic.

Please feel to inbox me any time.
To the OP, my interpretation of what you are saying is that OFS is it’s own biggest enemy, I would agree. This is a very common problem.
 
Kevin812 said:
I believe we wonder from the topic. Sorry for not keeping on topic.

Please feel to inbox me any time.
To the OP, my interpretation of what you are saying is that OFS is it’s own biggest enemy, I would agree. This is a very common problem.
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I’m sorry that you’re also apparently having some kind of trouble with the SFO, but it’s not my place to “inbox” you about it. 😛

Your fraternity council is who you probably should talk to if you are not happy with this sort of thing.
 
iloveangels said:
I’m sorry that you’re also apparently having some kind of trouble with formation in the SFO, but it’s not my place to “inbox” you about it. 😛

Your fraternity council is who you probably should talk to if you are not happy with this sort of thing.
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You have me confused. I do not know what you are speaking of.
 
Kevin812 said:
And yet, I fear we have proved one of the OP’s points. 😦
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And what would that be, Kevin?

BTW, don’t PM me again about this matter. The formation of the OP and your troubles with the SFO are not mine to arbitrate. Both of you have fraternity councils involved in whatever you’re talking about, and they are the ones to speak to on these matters.
 
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