Shooting, Explosion Reported in Paris

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mafh said:
Wow, that is a really, really ugly thing to say.

Don’t you think that your experience has been distorted – I mean, after all there is no need for military intervention with peaceful people – so your experiences would naturally be biased towards encounters with violent extremists?

All the Muslims I know are decent, kind, family-oriented people. In fact, I think a lot of Catholics could learn something from them, since they have integrated prayer and religious devotion into their lives to a level that I suspect in rare in Catholicism, apart from people with religious vocations.
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pewresearch.org/files/old-assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Great Britain 24%
France 35%
Germany 13%
Spain 25%

That is the percentage of Muslims in those countries who believe suicide bombings are ALWAYS justified.

Just like me and you!
 
It takes more than idiocy to go against human nature by killing yourself!
 
Really??? So a religion that has at its core a prophet that went about conquering and enslaving peoples into submission has nothing to do with what we’re seeing today (only with more advanced weaponry)?
 
SHANTARAM said:
pewresearch.org/files/old-assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Great Britain 24%
France 35%
Germany 13%
Spain 25%

That is the percentage of Muslims in those countries who believe suicide bombings are ALWAYS justified.

Just like me and you!
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No, it is not. Those numbers reflect the percentage of Muslims in those countries who think suicide bombings are rarely or sometimes/often justified. There isn’t a category for “always justified” in the linked report.
 
I know earlier you said we don’t know who the attackers were, but like most of us we all knew it was the “refugees”:

news.yahoo.com/two-men-linked-paris-attacks-registered-migrants-greece-195255102.html

What religion is top notch at brainwashing? Islam!

We must eliminate the Wahabi/Salafi influence of intolerance. They out stubborn us and we give in, time and time again, we give in to this radical minority of our populations! It is ridiculous, we must stand strong!
 
josie_L said:
Really??? So a religion that has at its core a prophet that went about conquering and enslaving peoples into submission has nothing to do with what we’re seeing today (only with more advanced weaponry)?
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How exactly did the Jews gain control of the Holy Land?
 
josie_L said:
And how does one answer a question with a question?
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By using the question one asks to force the other person to realize the criteria being used (religious leader conquering and enslaving) against one faith (Islam) is also being used against the other (Judaism).
 
I agree, as popular as the stereotype about the French being surrender happy/unwilling to fight, their history indicates the opposite.
 
oldcatholicguy said:
By using the question one asks to force the other person to realize the criteria being used (religious leader conquering and enslaving) against one faith (Islam) is also being used against the other (Judaism).
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Absolutely not the same, i.e., Judaism DID NOT CONQUER nor CONVERT by way of the SWORD because they were not interested in expansionism and/or converting peoples of the known world by way of violence and submission. You’re comparing apples and oranges.

Now, I’m going to ask my question again, is anyone really surprised that a religion which has at its core a prophet that Muslims call the ideal man, who conquered and enslaved (and killed) in the name of ALLAH, see some adherents of said religion doing the same???

Can we really not see that there is a link between Mohammed and the followers of Mohammadanism, aka, Islam?
 
meltzerboy said:
The several American Muslim friends and acquaintances I know have taught me this by telling me about their religion and showing me their Holy Books. Besides, your own faith implicitly believes this according to passages in the Catholic Church Catechism, while my faith also regards Islam as a religion of ethical monotheism whose members worship the same G-d as Jews. The latter, according to Jewish law, have always been permitted to enter a mosque and even pray with Muslims.
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What does the Catholic faith implicitly believe?

The CCC states:
841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”

It says nothing of Islam being a religion of peace or ethical monotheism. Worship the same God, yes.

I never judge a religion from the behavior of the people. I look to their teachings, writings and history. Otherwise, I would have a very skewed view of their beliefs.

What writings of Islam are you referring that show it to be a religion of peace? I would like to believe it myself and would be interested in what you have read.
 
SHANTARAM said:
pewresearch.org/files/old-assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Great Britain 24%
France 35%
Germany 13%
Spain 25%

That is the percentage of Muslims in those countries who believe suicide bombings are ALWAYS justified.

Just like me and you!
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If this is pages 54 and 54 in the book,then this may require further explanation.
The chart was divided into “often ,sometimes,rarely,never.”
The percentages posted are an addition of the first three.
The “often /sometimes” was the smallest percentage by far. Also it explains that population more prone to respond this way was between 18 and 29 .and there is another chart for this
Nowhere does it say "always,“unless I am reading in a different place. …so you can check for yourself.
" Can suicide bombing of civilian targets to defend Islam be justified ?” The question presupposes an attack that has to be defended. It is not wonderful news,yet not exactly as portrait for me.
 
josie_L said:
Absolutely not the same, i.e., Judaism DID NOT CONQUER nor CONVERT by way of the SWORD because they were not interested in expansionism and/or converting peoples of the known world by way of violence and submission. You’re comparing apples and oranges.

Now, I’m going to ask my question again, is anyone really surprised that a religion which has at its core a prophet that Muslims call the ideal man, who conquered and enslaved (and killed) in the name of ALLAH, see adherents of said religion doing the same???
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Then how did the Jews gain control of the Holy Land after leaving Egypt? By asking the locals nicely to give up their land?
 
oldcatholicguy said:
Then how did the Jews gain control of the Holy Land after leaving Egypt? By asking the locals nicely to give up their land?
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It was the locals who were the aggressors (they initiated attacks and conspired against the Jews with the intent of wiping them out), i.e., the Jews were to settle in the land of Milk and Honey, not judiciously kill people in the name of religion because they wished to expand their faith by way of conquering and/or submission?

I still can’t fathom how people don’t see that some followers of Mohammedanism, aka, Islam, are not actually following Mohammed when they commit acts of violence/terror in the name of their religion, when he himself did so?
 
josie_L said:
It was the locals who were the aggressors (they initiated attacks and conspired against the Jews with the intent of wiping them out), i.e., the Jews were to settle in the land of Milk and Honey, not judiciously kill people in the name of religion because they wished to expand their faith by way of conquering and/or submission?
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I suppose its true that the victors can rewrite history once they’ve tossed the last body into the mass grave.
 
josie_L said:
It was the locals who were the aggressors (they initiated attacks and conspired against the Jews with the intent of wiping them out), i.e., the Jews were to settle in the land of Milk and Honey, not judiciously kill people in the name of religion because they wished to expand their faith by way of conquering and/or submission?

I still can’t fathom how people don’t see that some followers of Mohammedanism, aka, Islam, are not actually following Mohammed when they commit acts of violence/terror in the name of their religion, when he himself did so?
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The book of Joshua disagrees with your first paragraph.
 
oldcatholicguy said:
The book of Joshua disagrees with your first paragraph.
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Please quote the book of Joshua, then. Because trying to settle into the Israel is not the same as trying to conquer the known World as Muslims under Mohammed and there after were doing for centuries.
 
josie_L said:
So you would prefer to be annihilated by your enemies instead of annihilating them?
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I would prefer not to go wandering into a foreign country and murder every man, pregnant woman, and child while leaving the virgins for sport. I certainly would not then claim that a man in the sky made me do it.
 
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