Should broke people receive health care?

[wifeandmomoftwo]

thank you for this link!

Welcome

I know someone who passed away in September. He died of cirrhosis of the liver. He literally drank himself to death. The doctors gave him a new liver (still not sure how he got it). He went home and drank some more. Drank until his blood vessels gave out and he had internal bleeding.

He spend his last two weeks in the ICU in pretty much a coma. Died when they tried to move him to another hospital.

His wife owed $350…their deductible. The actual bill was more than a million.

Meanwhile I struggle to keep the bare minimum level of insurance simply so I won’t go bankrupt completely when/if I get into a major accident or get some funky disease/cancer.

It’s such a scam.

This happens quite a bit. But I question “why” a confirmed alcoholic was given a new liver, this is usually not typical.

 

[jssaxon]

Yet some ‘good’ Christians here say “All you have to do is work hard, like me, and you will experience all that you deserve.”

One thing, for sure, it looks like Catholics have adopted the Protestant work ethic and it’s attitudes!!!

 

[consumedconvert]

The american health care system has failed me in so many ways I don’t care to even try to count them all.

I am uninsurable in my current state and indeed in most states from my research into the matter. No insurance company will provide me coverage, there is no ‘pool coverage’ in my state. I can afford health insurance, but no one will cover me. Since I make enough to buy private insurance however, medicare/medicaid won’t touch me. I am stuck in a no man’s land, the free market has absolutely no solution for me.

What has this landed me? Yearly kidney stones, appendicitis and multiple chronic congenital medical problems while uninsured. All of these are out of my control, and not due to my lifestyle.

My hospital bills have totaled over 300,000, around TEN years of my income. As a result over 70% of my paycheck goes to paying back medical bills, which of course makes me unable to pay for current medical needs, which means they’re eventually going to require me to go to the ER and rack up another unknown amount of bills. I’m almost thirty and I haven’t even been able to attempt to begin saving for retirement, because I can’t even afford to keep myself healthy, which of course inhibits my job performance.

I’ve already filed for bankruptcy once, that cleared about 150,000 of the medical debt, but I’ve got another 100,000 or so looming over my head again and you can only declare bankruptcy but so often, I have several years before it can occur again.

I’m not ‘broke’ per-say in that I have no income, but I am broke because the medical system in this country is broken.

I had a roommate in your situation in College. Frankly, I do wonder if my wife might be in this situation after we get off of medicaid, because who wants to insure a woman whose last pregnancy cost over 100 Gs? Let’s hope things get fixed in the next presidential administration.

Sheesh. I especially appreciated the new encyclical Spe Salvi for pointing out that our hope is not in this world, but in the next one. If our hope was in Congress I think we all would have jumped off a bridge by now!

Hang in there, Bro – I’ll be praying for you!

 

[pathia]

I had a roommate in your situation in College. Frankly, I do wonder if my wife might be in this situation after we get off of medicaid, because who wants to insure a woman whose last pregnancy cost over 100 Gs? Let’s hope things get fixed in the next presidential administration.

Sheesh. I especially appreciated the new encyclical Spe Salvi for pointing out that our hope is not in this world, but in the next one. If our hope was in Congress I think we all would have jumped off a bridge by now!

Hang in there, Bro – I’ll be praying for you!

Gal, but thanks for the sentiments and prayers.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I pay my health care tax ($600.00 a year), which contributes to the health care system that I use. (I get the money to pay the tax by working for a living. I’m not on any kind of welfare.)

It’s the same idea as paying insurance for health care. It’s not “free” - it’s paid for with health care taxes. (And yes, I pay my health care taxes, my income taxes, my goods and services taxes, and all my other taxes. I am not getting a “free ride.”)

If you are buying health care insurance (because of the fact that you have no health care tax in the US), then you are no more “paying your own way” than I am - just like me, you are pooling your money with other people’s money, and then someone is taking money out (from the whole amount that everyone put in; not just what you put in) for you, to pay your health care bills when you get sick.

Ah, but you miss the big point.

If I buy health insurace, it’s because I choose to buy it – no one makes me buy. And if I choose to buy, I am free to choose among many options, and tailor my coverage to fit my needs – I’m not forced to wear the same size shoes as everyone else.

 

[consumedconvert]

Gal, but thanks for the sentiments and prayers.

Pardone, Madame.

 

[pathia]

Ah, but you miss the big point.

If I buy health insurance, it’s because I choose to buy it – no one makes me buy. And if I choose to buy, I am free to choose among many options, and tailor my coverage to fit my needs – I’m not forced to wear the same size shoes as everyone else.

I’m not allowed to choose. No one will provide me coverage. Not private companies, not the government. I have no choice in this ‘free market’ what so ever.

I’d rather be forced, because then at least I’d have some coverage of some sort. As it stands my life is just going to be one long series of bankruptcies.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I’m not allowed to choose. No one will provide me coverage. Not private companies, not the government. I have no choice in this ‘free market’ what so ever.

Are you sure? Most states have special programs for people in your situation. They are sort of like the “assigned risk” programs for automobile insurance.

And, if we had true MSAs you could always have an MSA.

And if you could shop across state lines (and buy from a company not licensed in your state) you could probably find quite a few choices.

I’d rather be forced, because then at least I’d have some coverage of some sort. As it stands my life is just going to be one long series of bankruptcies.

Why not do a little more digging?

 

[consumedconvert]

Are you sure? Most states have special programs for people in your situation. They are sort of like the “assigned risk” programs for automobile insurance.

And, if we had true MSAs you could always have an MSA.

And if you could shop across state lines (and buy from a company not licensed in your state) you could probably find quite a few choices.

Why not do a little more digging?

I do hope the rules change, Vern. But I do know the situation of people like she who is quoted above is darn near impossible. Sonething has got to change, soon. I think we pretty much all agree on that.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I do hope the rules change, Vern. But I do know the situation of people like she who is quoted above is darn near impossible. Sonething has got to change, soon. I think we pretty much all agree on that.

And the way to change it is to open the system to more competition – not to eliminate all competition and turn it over to the government.

With a few simple laws and changes to existing laws, we could dramatically improve the system – and not cost the taxpayers an extra dime.

 

[consumedconvert]

And the way to change it is to open the system to more competition – not to eliminate all competition and turn it over to the government.

With a few simple laws and changes to existing laws, we could dramatically improve the system – and not cost the taxpayers an extra dime.

I agree with you, in principle. Of course, the competition would have to be somewhat regulated, because you’re dealing with people’s lives.

You and I agree? HOLY SMOKES!

 

[pathia]

And the way to change it is to open the system to more competition – not to eliminate all competition and turn it over to the government.

With a few simple laws and changes to existing laws, we could dramatically improve the system – and not cost the taxpayers an extra dime.

The free market chooses to not insure me. There are no government rules that forbid them from offering me coverage. How is anything related to competition going to help me when they by choice refuse to cover me? Ironically the costs of the condition they refuse me coverage based on have only cost me $5000 out of pocket while what has cost 300000+ everyone gets and is mostly random. If the free market has decided that I am uninsurable why would they at any point and time to decide otherwise? Simple, they won’t. If I am to be covered by insurance it is going to have to be a regulation.

 

[wifeandmomoftwo]

The free market chooses to not insure me. There are no government rules that forbid them from offering me coverage. How is anything related to competition going to help me when they by choice refuse to cover me? Ironically the costs of the condition they refuse me coverage based on have only cost me $5000 out of pocket while what has cost 300000+ everyone gets and is mostly random. If the free market has decided that I am uninsurable why would they at any point and time to decide otherwise? Simple, they won’t. If I am to be covered by insurance it is going to have to be a regulation.

Did you ever have insurance?
I find it hard to believe that you can not get insurance at all. Most companies have a pre-existing clause where they wont cover the condition for 6months but to outright refuse coverage

 

[consumedconvert]

Did you ever have insurance?
I find it hard to believe that you can not get insurance at all. Most companies have a pre-existing clause where they wont cover the condition for 6months but to outright refuse coverage

I can absolutely confirm that private (as in, non-group) insurance will often outright reject people because of past health issues. If the lady in question does not work for a large employer, or one that provides or can provide group health coverage–and many don’t–then she is correct about her chances of finding health coverage.

There is no reason to believe that she is not in earnest and well-researched on the issue.

Stinks, doesn’t it? Happened to a friend of mine, and happens to too many people!

 

[vern_humphrey]

The free market chooses to not insure me. There are no government rules that forbid them from offering me coverage. How is anything related to competition going to help me when they by choice refuse to cover me? Ironically the costs of the condition they refuse me coverage based on have only cost me $5000 out of pocket while what has cost 300000+ everyone gets and is mostly random. If the free market has decided that I am uninsurable why would they at any point and time to decide otherwise? Simple, they won’t. If I am to be covered by insurance it is going to have to be a regulation.

What state do you live in? We may be able to find coverage for you.

It would help if we knew something about the condition and the actual reasons they give for turning you down. We also would be farther along if we knew if it was a straight turndown or conditional – for example, you’d have to be in the program a year or so before your coverage kicked in.

 

[pathia]

Did you ever have insurance?
I find it hard to believe that you can not get insurance at all. Most companies have a pre-existing clause where they wont cover the condition for 6months but to outright refuse coverage

I have been a walking insurance nightmare since I was born. As soon as I was born the insurance company (Blue Cross Blue Shield) fought tooth and nail for every medical problem I had spawning from my birth defects. Every other insurance company in the state has rejected me, I have a stack of papers of outright rejection. They will not even insure me let alone get to a point where I have a six month waiting period. As soon as I was 24, BCBS dropped me and was impossible to reinsure me at a reasonable rate.

What state do you live in? We may be able to find coverage for you.

It would help if we knew something about the condition and the actual reasons they give for turning you down. We also would be farther along if we knew if it was a straight turndown or conditional – for example, you’d have to be in the program a year or so before your coverage kicked in.

I live in Virginia. The only insurance company that will insure me there is Blue Cross Blue Shield and their rates are exorbitantly high for me and they won’t cover a majority of my medical issues, even post 6month waiting period. They will not cover ANY of my prescriptions. They consider all the drugs I am on ‘experimental’ for my issues. The cost of my medicine is around $600 a month. That is with importing them from overseas and Canada. If I were to get the medicines in the US it would be well over $1000 a month to pay out of pocket for just them alone. Until I found out about importing medicines (Which is technically illegal/grey market) I was actually unable to afford rent and lived out of my car.

 

[pathia]

It would help if we knew something about the condition and the actual reasons they give for turning you down. We also would be farther along if we knew if it was a straight turndown or conditional – for example, you’d have to be in the program a year or so before your coverage kicked in.

My condition has been covered in gory details in some of the SSA threads actually. I think you may have seen those? I am intersexed(Ambiguous genitals/‘hermaphrodite’ birth for those of you that don’t know the term) and rejected the doctor’s initial ‘guess’ as to my gender. Everyone rejects me based on the fact I am according to the APA a transsexual with an intersexed medical history. That completely blackballs me from as far as I can tell from all insurance companies that aren’t mandated by the government to cover me and believe me I’ve tried and submitted to dozens of them.

Except for BCBS these are all complete utter turndowns, with no exceptions or clauses that’d allow me to be insured.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Have you tried here?
goldenrulehealth.com/unitedhealthcare/ms4/?source=google_ar&gclid=CNT4yYuLrpACFQQjPAod6Wyg7g
or called 866-870-3473?

or here
ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/Alliance?allid=Goo18810&entry=SE&ad=VA&sid=VA+old+LP

 

[jmcrae]

Ah, but you miss the big point.

If I buy health insurace, it’s because I choose to buy it – no one makes me buy. And if I choose to buy, I am free to choose among many options, and tailor my coverage to fit my needs – I’m not forced to wear the same size shoes as everyone else.

All you’d have to do to “opt out” is neglect to pay your health care tax. That way, they wouldn’t send you your identity card, and you would just pay full price, cash up front, every time you went to see a doctor or to the hospital, for any reason.

I can’t imagine anyone wanting to opt out, though.

I think the reason most Americans opt out of health care coverage is that they can’t afford it, and just hope they won’t get sick; not because they actually don’t want it at all.

 

[pathia]

Have you tried here?
goldenrulehealth.com/unitedhealthcare/ms4/?source=google_ar&gclid=CNT4yYuLrpACFQQjPAod6Wyg7g
or called 866-870-3473?

or here
ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/Alliance?allid=Goo18810&entry=SE&ad=VA&sid=VA+old+LP

I have TWO Golden Rule rejections in my pile of letters. Aetna and United Healthcare I have rejection letters from as well. Carefirst is not available in my area.

Anthem is the company that will insure me, but not actually cover much of anything to the point of making it financially worse than not having insurance.