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kathmandu
Guest
Thus the original question, Should Cafeteria Catholics just become Protestant.
Judging others is indeed dangerous business, but there seems to be a lot of it going around.
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Judging others is indeed dangerous business, but there seems to be a lot of it going around.
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
People shouldn’t be putting themselves in a position of thinking who belongs in their Church and who doesn’t. It’s His Church.
I can see some non-Catholics rushing in and taking advantages in what appears to be division among Catholics. But it doesn’t change the fact that scriptures point to an authoritative Church, led by authoritative men of apostolic succession. Scriptures do not teach of an authoritative layperson, or group of laypersons. Just as. no where in scriptures does it teach anyone to utilize ‘choices’ in how they worship.
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pismopal
Guest
I consider them better than bad-faith Catholics because most protestants don’t know better. Catholics have no excuse.
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Annabelle_Marie
Guest
I think the OP’s original point had a lot to do with birth control, which is something typically not seen as a sin in Protestants…at least not in the denominations I was in.
Now…when you get into not being against gay marriage…I think that pretty much spans the entire course in Protestants, depending on the denomination.
Some denominations have at least some direction on what they believe and some structure…other denominations do not…some as long as you come to church once in a while…you are good…
Don’t mean to offend you…you are our breathen…although seperated breathen…
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ByzCath08
Guest
From the 3rd verse of St. Ephraim’s prayer:
Yea, O Lord and King,
grant that I may perceive
my own transgressions,
and judge not my brother,
for blessed art Thou
unto ages of ages.
When I stand before Christ and give an account for my life, I hope that I can say that I spoke the truth, lived the truth to the best of my ability and lived the 3rd verse of St. Ephraim’s prayer.
Quoting a very good Orthodox video, “I’m careful to not assume I have a handle on the spiritual state of others. I would do best to stay focused on my own flagrant shortcomings instead.”
Yea, O Lord and King,
grant that I may perceive
my own transgressions,
and judge not my brother,
for blessed art Thou
unto ages of ages.
When I stand before Christ and give an account for my life, I hope that I can say that I spoke the truth, lived the truth to the best of my ability and lived the 3rd verse of St. Ephraim’s prayer.
Quoting a very good Orthodox video, “I’m careful to not assume I have a handle on the spiritual state of others. I would do best to stay focused on my own flagrant shortcomings instead.”
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
What sources are you using to arrive at 98% of Catholic women using ABC?
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kathmandu
Guest
It depends on how you read the scriptures. In the Protestant tradition the authority of the Roman Church is not accepted. And did you realize that the Episcopalians also claim apostolic succession? It is not exclusive to Roman Catholics. That is where the name Episcopal comes from. We too can claim the line of bishops going back to Peter. I have the tree somewhere in my files.
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Barbkw
Guest
Isn’t the Episcopal church a member of the Church of England - created by King Henry VIII? King Henry was a “cafeteria” Catholic who wanted a divorce and the Pope said “No”.
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JohnnyReb
Guest
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Prodigal_Son1
Guest
Let’s stick with the scriptures for a moment. Please share with us where scriptures teach a ‘liberty’ in choices of how to worship Him. That sounds like serving one’s self first and Him second.
As for Apostolic succession, it’s a claim in almost every Church today, including the Koran burning minister who only succeeded the single founder of his Church.
Most don’t even have, or offer, a tree to show how it’s ‘apostolic’. Then there’s the trees that show justification in leaving the Church and ‘improving on what He built’, but still claiming the tree through what they disagree with today. Just doesn’t add up, in my opinion and according to what scriptures teach about being of one mind and judgment.
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JohnnyReb
Guest
Technically no, Henry did not start the CoE, but that is a whole other discussion. It would sidetrack things a bit. He saw himself as taking political power over the church in England from the Pope and giving it to himself (the King), and that the CoE would remain under the Catholic umbrella, religiously, but not politically.
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Holly3278
Guest
No, “cafeteria Catholics” or Catholics who willingly dissent from the Church’s teachings should not become Protestant. What they should do is work toward being in agreement with the Church.
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Barbkw
Guest
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Anthony_V
Guest
When you look at the big picture, you’ll notice how politics do play into what information the Church does publicly enforce. The reason being is not the Church is weak, but that she is careful to maintain a balance between moral and ethical prowess. When you’re dealing with such a massive audience, you deal with some problems:
You can’t set a solid pace for the advancement of morality. The world is not constant. One day it will want one thing, and one day it will want another. The Church must maintain its DOCTRINE and practice of such at a constant, but micromanage the individual at a changing way such as society itself is changing. Production of results would be based on the individual, not the group. Those who truly count shouldn’t be counted by the counting.
Inevitably you must come to the conclusion that grouping cafeteria Catholics together is not licit. Each has their own circumstance and more importantly their own being. Even if you group similar personalities together, you still remain with a difference. The clergy and religious are assigned the task of dealing with the individual and administering to them. HOWEVER, the individual must come to the clergy (or ask them to come, respectively). This mannerism is strictly isolated when in relations to the fact that Jesus did come to us, step on some toes, and ultimately become a revolutionary, but I humbly remind you that revolution is the last thing the Church needs due to the numbness of the world and deadness of society.
With that said, there is inevitable noise coming from everywhere in the world. Fortunately, the world sees EVERYTHING now. Lead by example. Pray the rosary daily. Do something! But large scale leads to McDonald’s hamburgers… yuck! Think about the aftermath of the Bubonic plague… ordaining priests and training them later. That didn’t work!
You can’t set a solid pace for the advancement of morality. The world is not constant. One day it will want one thing, and one day it will want another. The Church must maintain its DOCTRINE and practice of such at a constant, but micromanage the individual at a changing way such as society itself is changing. Production of results would be based on the individual, not the group. Those who truly count shouldn’t be counted by the counting.
Inevitably you must come to the conclusion that grouping cafeteria Catholics together is not licit. Each has their own circumstance and more importantly their own being. Even if you group similar personalities together, you still remain with a difference. The clergy and religious are assigned the task of dealing with the individual and administering to them. HOWEVER, the individual must come to the clergy (or ask them to come, respectively). This mannerism is strictly isolated when in relations to the fact that Jesus did come to us, step on some toes, and ultimately become a revolutionary, but I humbly remind you that revolution is the last thing the Church needs due to the numbness of the world and deadness of society.
With that said, there is inevitable noise coming from everywhere in the world. Fortunately, the world sees EVERYTHING now. Lead by example. Pray the rosary daily. Do something! But large scale leads to McDonald’s hamburgers… yuck! Think about the aftermath of the Bubonic plague… ordaining priests and training them later. That didn’t work!
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kathmandu
Guest
It was a little more political than that. Henry granted divorces to many other European heads of countries at that time. The pope was mad at Henry and knew the way to get to him would be to deny him a legal heir. It was a big mess, powerful men posturing. At one time Henry was called defender of the faith. You might say they had a big break in diplomacy of European power. It was always about power.
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Barbkw
Guest
Not about the King already being married, then. You say.
I believe King Henry went on to remarry, divorce, remarry then kill a wife, remarry, divorce, kill another wife, remarry.
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kathmandu
Guest
There you have the crux of why you are catholic and I am not. I do not agree with your interpretation of scripture and you do not accept mine.Let’s stick with the scriptures for a moment. Please share with us where scriptures teach a ‘liberty’ in choices of how to worship Him. That sounds like serving one’s self first and Him second.
As for Apostolic succession, it’s a claim in almost every Church today, including the Koran burning minister who only succeeded the single founder of his Church.
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kathmandu
Guest
He certainly did, not unlike many others in power in Europe over time. They were all ruthless, including many of the popes. I am reading a biography of Alexander VI right now, one of the Borgia popes. Unbelievable. Would curl your hair.
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Anthony_V
Guest
Which came first, the chicken or the egg?
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kathmandu
Guest
I don’t want this to start getting “un-nice,” not to mention we have gotten off topic.
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